Which games are the most "shovelware?"

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by WittyUsername » Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:54 pm

I don’t see how the first Budokai game qualifies as “shovelware.” It was the first in a new era of Dragon Ball games, and in that sense, it delivered on what people were expecting at the time. This is most apparent with its story mode, which, while hardly impressive today, was clearly something that Dimps put some actual effort into at the time. The fighting system definitely leaves a lot to be desired, but that can be excused on the count of how new Dimps was to the whole thing.

Also, I’m just going to say it: it’s baffling that Battle of Z turned out the way it did. That game had at least two years of development going for it, and came out at a point when Dragon Ball was starting to experience a resurgence, yet it feels like a pretty good example of a shovelware game. Even the graphics are pretty bad.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Matches Malone » Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:58 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:54 pm
I’m just going to say it: it’s baffling that Battle of Z turned out the way it did. That game had at least two years of development going for it, and came out at a point when Dragon Ball was starting to experience a resurgence, yet it feels like a pretty good example of a shovelware game. Even the graphics are pretty bad.
The game had 2 things going against it, the first being its developer, as they didn't have that much experience making games. The second is when it entered development, which was at least a year before BOG was released, meaning it didn't have a high budget to work with.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Yuli Ban » Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:04 pm

Thinking about it a bit more, while the original Budokai series wasn't shovelware, I'd be willing to include the Dragon Ball Z: Budokai HD Collection as absolute shovelware. Mainly because it reminds me so much of the Tony Hawk Pro Skater HD collection in many ways as well as because it did virtually nothing to actually improve those games; it was just a straight port with minor tweaks here and there. I wasn't at all into the Budokai games at the time (though I eventually got them as aforementioned)— even then, I thought it was underwhelming. If it's an HD Collection, why not actually upscale everything to HD? Why not create new character models and vastly enhance the game engines? You know, make it the games they were always trying to be? But they didn't. It was the laziest possible rush job, saved only because Budokai 3 is still a pretty damn fun game.

I've seen no one talk about it in years, no advertisements for it, and no reason to even get it unless online play is really THAT important. I could probably find a copy for 49¢ in some thrift store bin right under a copy of Anubis II and Ninjabread Man.
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Quebaz » Tue Jul 28, 2020 3:34 am

Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:04 pm

I've seen no one talk about it in years, no advertisements for it, and no reason to even get it unless online play is really THAT important. I could probably find a copy for 49¢ in some thrift store bin right under a copy of Anubis II and Ninjabread Man.
The collection doesn't have online play for either of the games included, which is why there's literally no reason to get it you already have te PS2 versions.
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Thanos » Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:07 am

The one game that I still scratch my head on is Ultimate Tenkaichi. Mainly because of the name--while it should be a minor thing, the name, to me, is strongly suggesting to a less informed person that this is some form of "ultimate" version of the BT games (or RB games in the case of the Japanese version with Ultimate Blast as its title), despite the fact that it has less content and a joke of a battle system. What in the name of fuck were they thinking in not just making Raging Blast 3, or, ya know, an actual interactive video game rather than an interactive cutscene!? The story mode doesn't make sense, the character creation is shallow and lazy, and I think around here is where the geniuses at Bandai Namco solidified the "generic guitar wankery" type of soundtrack that has persisted with Dragon Ball games to this day. YAWN. We are a far cry from the likes of Yamamoto's work or the localized Budokai Tenkaichi soundtracks... but I digress.

The weirdest thing about this game's battle system is how ranged battles seem to take place with the length of several football stadiums between you and your opponent. It takes about five minutes for a single ki blast to reach them and there's an entire cutscene just to watch a beam attack travel from Texas to Wyoming. I couldn't even begin to guess what they were going for with this but it doesn't work on any level in any way, shape, or form.
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Jord » Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:23 am

Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:04 pm
Thinking about it a bit more, while the original Budokai series wasn't shovelware, I'd be willing to include the Dragon Ball Z: Budokai HD Collection as absolute shovelware. Mainly because it reminds me so much of the Tony Hawk Pro Skater HD collection in many ways as well as because it did virtually nothing to actually improve those games; it was just a straight port with minor tweaks here and there. I wasn't at all into the Budokai games at the time (though I eventually got them as aforementioned)— even then, I thought it was underwhelming. If it's an HD Collection, why not actually upscale everything to HD? Why not create new character models and vastly enhance the game engines? You know, make it the games they were always trying to be? But they didn't. It was the laziest possible rush job, saved only because Budokai 3 is still a pretty damn fun game.

I've seen no one talk about it in years, no advertisements for it, and no reason to even get it unless online play is really THAT important. I could probably find a copy for 49¢ in some thrift store bin right under a copy of Anubis II and Ninjabread Man.
Not too mentions that word Collection is used pretty randomly since it omits Budokai 2, which is extra sad when you remember that the Budokai series only had 3 entries. (4 if you count Infinite world)

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by WittyUsername » Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm

On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Yuli Ban » Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:33 am

WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm
On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.
That is singlehandedly the most idiotic thing I've heard this month, actually— and I just listened to a full album by Skinlab while also listening to people mourn President Trump's illness by refusing to wear masks.

Executive 1: "There's a mechanical problem where players cheat in the online mode of our game!"

Executive 2: "I have a solution: let's cripple the game!"

Executive 1: "...What?"
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Matches Malone » Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:37 am

Thanos wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:07 am
What in the name of fuck were they thinking in not just making Raging Blast 3 ?
They were going to, going as far as saying GT would be the focus of it during an interview while marketing RB2, but the plug was pulled on it most likely due to RB2's terrible sales.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by WittyUsername » Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:27 pm

Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:33 am
WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm
On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.
That is singlehandedly the most idiotic thing I've heard this month, actually— and I just listened to a full album by Skinlab while also listening to people mourn President Trump's illness by refusing to wear masks.

Executive 1: "There's a mechanical problem where players cheat in the online mode of our game!"

Executive 2: "I have a solution: let's cripple the game!"

Executive 1: "...What?"
Not my words. That was just something I remember being used as a justification for how the game played. I can’t remember if Spike themselves said it, though.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Xeogran » Mon Oct 05, 2020 4:50 pm

Thanos wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:07 am
The one game that I still scratch my head on is Ultimate Tenkaichi. Mainly because of the name--while it should be a minor thing, the name, to me, is strongly suggesting to a less informed person that this is some form of "ultimate" version of the BT games (or RB games in the case of the Japanese version with Ultimate Blast as its title), despite the fact that it has less content and a joke of a battle system.
The name Ultimate Tenkaichi was voted in an online poll, back when it was called Project Age.
Ironically it turned to be opposite of that :lol:

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by WittyUsername » Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:29 pm

Ultimate Tenkaichi was clearly a rush job that was put together in a desperate attempt to keep the video game side of Dragon Ball relevant. From what I understand, the game only had roughly a year of development, so it’s not surprising that it ended up being as half-assed as it was.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:02 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:27 pm
Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:33 am
WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm
On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.
That is singlehandedly the most idiotic thing I've heard this month, actually— and I just listened to a full album by Skinlab while also listening to people mourn President Trump's illness by refusing to wear masks.

Executive 1: "There's a mechanical problem where players cheat in the online mode of our game!"

Executive 2: "I have a solution: let's cripple the game!"

Executive 1: "...What?"
Not my words. That was just something I remember being used as a justification for how the game played. I can’t remember if Spike themselves said it, though.
I believe it was a combination of Raging Blast 2 tanking in sales and Spike ultimately running out of ideas.
WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm
On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.

That's why the spirit gauge system exists.
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DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
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I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by Yuli Ban » Tue Oct 06, 2020 12:36 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:27 pm
Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:33 am
WittyUsername wrote:
Mon Sep 28, 2020 6:12 pm
On the subject of the battle system of Ultimate Tenkaichi, I believe it was stated back in the day that Spike came up with it as a way of combatting the issue of people spamming the same attacks over and over again online, which was supposedly a big complaint when it came to the RB games.
That is singlehandedly the most idiotic thing I've heard this month, actually— and I just listened to a full album by Skinlab while also listening to people mourn President Trump's illness by refusing to wear masks.

Executive 1: "There's a mechanical problem where players cheat in the online mode of our game!"

Executive 2: "I have a solution: let's cripple the game!"

Executive 1: "...What?"
Not my words. That was just something I remember being used as a justification for how the game played. I can’t remember if Spike themselves said it, though.
It just makes too much sense, though. That sounds exactly like what would happen for a DB game in the HD era.

I speak no hyperbole when I say Data Design, LJN, or Phoenix Games could have made something more interesting than what we got from Spike around that time.
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by goku the krump dancer » Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:27 pm

Wouldn't Xenoverse 1 be a waste of space at this point? I mean XV2 is all of that game plus a bunch of other stuff ( still mediocre imo but still).
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by precita » Tue Nov 10, 2020 3:55 pm

The entire PS3/360 era is the shovelware of Dragonball games.

After the franchise had a revival during the PS2/Gamecube/XBox era in the early 2000's due to the franchises popularity in the west, it obviously dropped off after that since the dubs were done and the whole PS3/360 era from about 2007-2013 came out when the Dragonball franchise was at its lowest point since the late 90's.

The PS4/One era started off meh too with just Xenoverse 1, but picked up when Xenoverse 2 came out and improved and of course Fighter Z. DBZ Kakarot is pretty decent for what it is too.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by TobyS » Tue Nov 10, 2020 4:21 pm

goku the krump dancer wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:27 pm
Wouldn't Xenoverse 1 be a waste of space at this point? I mean XV2 is all of that game plus a bunch of other stuff ( still mediocre imo but still).
If they'd just roll out legends patrol to all platforms then yes, there'd be no reason for it.
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by CuppaKofe » Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:41 pm

Yuli Ban wrote:
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:04 pm
Thinking about it a bit more, while the original Budokai series wasn't shovelware, I'd be willing to include the Dragon Ball Z: Budokai HD Collection as absolute shovelware. Mainly because it reminds me so much of the Tony Hawk Pro Skater HD collection in many ways as well as because it did virtually nothing to actually improve those games; it was just a straight port with minor tweaks here and there. I wasn't at all into the Budokai games at the time (though I eventually got them as aforementioned)— even then, I thought it was underwhelming. If it's an HD Collection, why not actually upscale everything to HD? Why not create new character models and vastly enhance the game engines? You know, make it the games they were always trying to be? But they didn't. It was the laziest possible rush job, saved only because Budokai 3 is still a pretty damn fun game.

I've seen no one talk about it in years, no advertisements for it, and no reason to even get it unless online play is really THAT important. I could probably find a copy for 49¢ in some thrift store bin right under a copy of Anubis II and Ninjabread Man.
From what I remember, the biggest reason people lost interest in this collection was the Yamamoto scores being replaced by the more generic butt-rock sounding RB2 soundtrack. This wouldn't be a problem for newcomers, but I imagine 99% of the people interested grew up with those games. Despite the plagerism, those OSTs are a huge part of those games identities. The lack of online was pretty frustrating too.

I also remember being disappointed about the exclusion of Budokai 2 and Infinite World. B2 was my first Budokai game, and at that point I preferred IWs gameplay over B3 due to them taking out that garbage Dragon Rush system that slowed fights down to a grinding hault.
(I honestly find it funny how much people will defend Dragon Rush, but trash on Ultimate Tenkaichi's QTEs dispite them both being so shallow)
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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:05 pm

CuppaKofe wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:41 pm
(I honestly find it funny how much people will defend Dragon Rush, but trash on Ultimate Tenkaichi's QTEs dispite them both being so shallow)
Hardly anyone defends Dragon Rush in fact, everyone agrees it's a terrible mechanic. The difference is Budokai 3's gameplay didn't revolve around it unlike Ultimate Tenkaichi and the clash system.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am
I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Which games are the most "shovelware?"

Post by CuppaKofe » Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:33 pm

DBZAOTA482 wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:05 pm
CuppaKofe wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:41 pm
(I honestly find it funny how much people will defend Dragon Rush, but trash on Ultimate Tenkaichi's QTEs dispite them both being so shallow)
Hardly anyone defends Dragon Rush in fact, everyone agrees it's a terrible mechanic. The difference is Budokai 3's gameplay didn't revolve around it unlike Ultimate Tenkaichi and the clash system.
I suppose I'm just remembering people complaining about its exclusion back in the day, people really liked those cinematic animations. I've also seen the opinion that IWs dumbed down story mode negates whatever gameplay improvements it made, which is fair if you only played those games single player.

Honestly, with the frequency the AI spams Dragon Rush on the higher difficulty settings, it can get just as annoying as UT's QTEs.
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