Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai?

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saiyanprimalforce
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Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai?

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:47 am

I was curious if anyone had any idea if News of the Cell Games was written specifically for the scene of Cell announcing the Cell games in episode 83 of Kai. I had always assumed that was the scene it was used/placed for, but after watching ImmaKrillen's News of the Cell Games Vid, I was totally surprised to see it used in the cell vs military scene in episode 85. What the hell, Nasagki? The song's called "News of the Cell Games!" Where else would you use it? Anyways I checked my Dragonball Kai raw's, and see that A Mighty Foe was used in the newsroom scene(totally not surprised. Nasagki overuses that song a lot).

Anyways, I was just wondering if anyone knew anything possibly. It just strikes me as a waste. i actually just finished scoring the song to the newsroom scene myself. I suppose I'll upload it soon so you guys can see. Again, I'm just blown it wasn't used for the newsroom scene. The more I dig into Yamamoto Kai, the more I see how how incompetent Nasagki can be at times. I mean, I think he scored Kai with Yamamoto's score mostly well(let's not even get into the replacement score), but there are quite a few off moments sprinkled throughout.
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by kei17 » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:29 am

I think it was written just for the merchandising and there's no plan to use it in the actual anime. In the Japanese TV anime industry, they barely compose any pieces of music for specific scenes. But I do understand what you think, since the lyrics are written specifically about the Cell Games.
I mean, I think he scored Kai with Yamamoto's score mostly well
I disagree, completely. :roll: Almost everything he did, including his musical direction and the casting, simply sucks. I believe he is one of the most incompetent staff members who've been involved in the series.

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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:06 pm

kei17 wrote:I think it was written just for the merchandising and there's no plan to use it in the actual anime. In the Japanese TV anime industry, they barely compose any pieces of music for specific scenes. But I do understand what you think, since the lyrics are written specifically about the Cell Games.
I mean, I think he scored Kai with Yamamoto's score mostly well
I disagree, completely. :roll: Almost everything he did, including his musical direction and the casting, simply sucks. I believe he is one of the most incompetent staff members who've been involved in the series.

Yeah, along with the title, the beginning of the song sort of has a news-esque beat to it, which further made me think it was composed specifically with the scene in mind, or so I guessed. It makes me wonder if Yamamoto had envisioned the song being used in that manner, anyways.

As far as Nasagki is concerned, I'm no fan of his, certainly (Kikuchi replacement score is complete garbage), but I think you're over exaggerating a bit(not much though). I suppose I should rephrase his Yamamoto work as decently competent. The foundation of most the placements work, but it's Nasagki's little quirks that sort of unravel it more. Since I'm restoring Kai's Yamamoto score myself, I've really come to notice some really odd things about Nasagki's style.

He seems obsessed with having music pieces play in one scene, and one scene only, with no overlap. In my Yamamoto version, there are several themes I've extended compared to his original placement that have left me baffled as to why he edited them down in the first place. Certain pieces that come to my mind are Symphonic Transformation when 18 breaks Vegeta's other arm with her foot, Playing out the Formidable Warrior out during the first scenes of the Goku-Android 19 fight. Those are two off the top of my head. There are definitely more I"ve extended(however small or long).

Which then leaves his really odd and misplaced pieces. Like say, in episode 55, that funky track that plays when Trunks is revealed to Freeza and his father. I just let A Mighty Foe play out to the end. In episode 53, used Hisan na Joukei for Goku and Freeza's final conversation, and left out A Mighty Foe(leaving it silent, since Chris Ayres carried the scene so well where A Mighty Foe was used).

More recently, I scored episode 68(or is it 69?) where Piccolo merged with Kami. His odd choice of silence for the conversation with Popo, along with his silly choice of An Outcome Switching Recovery. I edited in A Grim Fate instead for that scene, since the tone should be more emotional and bittersweet tone since Kami is gone. Also I used A New Foe Rears its head for the end when Cell first appears instead of what was used since it sounded really odd for such a dramatic reveal. I also extended a couple of the themes in that episode as well, going back to what I said earlier.

Another one is when A Mighty Foe is used in episode 76 where Cell is about to kill Tenshinhan. I felt A Mighty Foe was too overplayed for that scene, and used A Grim Fate instead(didn't even have to edit it either. It just worked).

One last example is the start of episode 77, when the recap is Cell blowing up the islands. They used the regular recap music, but it sounded so awkward mixed in with the dialouge between 18 and 16, I subbed An Ominous Silence instead, since the situation should be much more dreadful and serious.

Anyways, I'm just trying to say the basic layout of the episodes themselves aren't bad. But it's Nasagki's quirks that really drill the nails in the coffin most the time.
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by dbboxkaifan » Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:55 pm

kei17 wrote:I disagree, completely. :roll: Almost everything he did, including his musical direction and the casting, simply sucks. I believe he is one of the most incompetent staff members who've been involved in the series.
Why the hell did Toei Animation hire Yukio Nagasaki?

Was he the cheapest person around with no clue about music placements?
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:39 pm

So here's my placement of News of the Cell Games in episode 83. I think it fits really well. Again, totally seems like it would be common sense to use the song for the scene it was more or less named after.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8J8vATWN ... e=youtu.be
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by Gonstead » Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:43 am

saiyanprimalforce wrote:So here's my placement of News of the Cell Games in episode 83. I think it fits really well. Again, totally seems like it would be common sense to use the song for the scene it was more or less named after.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8J8vATWN ... e=youtu.be
I actually prefer this placement.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3FgOW1udn8
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:54 am

Oh, so ImmaKrillen actually made a version for 83 as well? Completely missed that, lol.

Eh, starting the song on the shot of Cell on the television makes sense(though that leaves that odd panning shot of silence for the Z-gang), but because of that, there's a real sloppy edit to the ending of the song that's pretty noticeable.

Course, I suppose I'm automatically biased towards myself. :lol:
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by kei17 » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:24 pm

I prefer ImmaKrillin's version except for the sloppy edit in the end. In my opinion, the panning shot without music ins't that bad. As for saiyanprimalforce's version, I think leaving the calm-sounding part with guitar solo sounds little off, and the song should stop earlier than that (the same goes for ImmaKrillin's one). In addition, there's a sloppy edit in your version, too; the Japanese lyrics get nonsensical at 3:11 because of being cut short.

Anyway, if I were in charge of the music placement, I simply would've ended up not using the song in the actual show at all.

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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:29 pm

kei17 wrote:I prefer ImmaKrillin's version except for the sloppy edit in the end. In my opinion, the panning shot without music ins't that bad. As for saiyanprimalforce's version, I think leaving the calm-sounding part with guitar solo sounds little off, and the song should stop earlier than that (the same goes for ImmaKrillin's one). In addition, there's a sloppy edit in your version, too; the Japanese lyrics get nonsensical at 3:11 because of being cut short.

Anyway, if I were in charge of the music placement, I simply would've ended up not using the song in the actual show at all.

I think the guitar solo fits though. It's right about where Cell tells them if everyone losses at the Cell games, he's going to kill everyone on Earth. It's a bit of a dramatic revelation, which helps emphasize Cell's words, plus, starting with the Trunks "You bastard" shot, builds back up to Cell's blast. Not saying I'm right, but it's what I would argue. I could see what you mean about the song ending before he actually blast the buildings(though, not sure if that's practically possible).

And while my end idiot is certainly sloppy in context to the lyrics, you have to remember that I'm not japanese. I don't know what the hell the lyrics are. :lol: The only words I recognize are CELLU, CELLU, CELLU, GAMEU! But joking aside, yeah that's a very valid point. If the song were in English, it would most likely ring on my ears like yours, and I'd obviously adjust it, but since the vocals are more or less musical to me, I don't think any poor English speaking folk like me are going to pick up on that, haha.

Btw, how did you watch the video? Just curious, since youtube list it as banned in Japan(a lot of my videos have been getting banned in Japan lately). Also, if you scored the scene yourself, which Kai piece would you think you would use if not the song? I love A Mighty Foe, but Nasagki uses that so much, I jumped at the chance to use something else to create a little bit more variety and uniqueness with the score.

I think what I really wish is that Toei would've paid Yamamoto for more songs for Kai, when it all comes down to it. But I guess Kai was a budgeted show right from the beginning.
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by Gonstead » Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:51 pm

Maybe Ominous Silence might of worked? (No Harmonica)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3DuhjR8_4A

Man I really wish I had a clear rip of this theme since the harmonica in the released version really ruins the song for me.

As for NOTCG, my personal placement would be the song starts as the first panning shot is shown before the TV so that the main guitar beat at the beginning plays as Cell appears on TV.

If I had the clip without music I could showcase this.
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Re: Was News of the Cell Games written for Episode 83 of Kai

Post by SRB2Unleashed » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:35 am

Yeah, I was rushing when editing that video. The sloppy ending is noticable, I admit. Hell, if Yamamoto wasn't fire someone could probably asked if what his vision was for that song.
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