Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

We cover anything and everything Dragon Ball in hopes of enlightening... and a little bit of entertaining. Hosted every week by the Kanzenshuu staff and regular special guests from the professional and fandom communities. Your first, best, last, and only Dragon Ball podcast!

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
VegettoEX
Kanzenshuu Co-Owner & Administrator
Posts: 16792
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:10 pm
Location: New Jersey
Contact:

Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:37 pm

Watch the Stream Archive/Replay Now!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBy8nnQ4W2c


Happy New Year!

First thing's first: no, we don't have a launch date yet. Don't bother asking! :lol:

BUT! We know you're curious. We know you're probably sick of hearing about it without being able to really see anything. We know you think it's not even real.

This evening we will be running a special live stream to show off a little more of Kanzenshuu's forthcoming wiki than just some of the preview pages.

WHAT: Kanzenshuu Wiki Sneak Peek Live Stream
WHO: Mike + (secrets!)
WHEN: Monday, January 4, 2021 @ 8:00 pm-ish (eastern)
WHERE (LIVE): http://twitch.tv/VegettoEX
WHERE (ARCHIVE): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fBy8nnQ4W2c

I'll re-open this thread when we're broadcasting and leave it open when it's done and you're able to also view the archived recording.

We're excited to show you what the heck it is we've been doing for so long! :thumbup:
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::

User avatar
Grimlock
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 6881
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 4:11 pm
Location: Conton City

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by Grimlock » Tue Jan 05, 2021 3:36 am

It's looking good, folks. Good work so far! I'm "kind of" anxious (to put it as gentle as possible) to feast my eyes upon the AGES section, so I'd like to thank VegettoEX a lot for actually showing it quite a bit on the stream already! :thumbup: I have a few questions:

Will there be an attempt to "correct" the official issues? Like in a form of a note from one of the staff members? For example, the situation with Dragon Ball Super Broly starting "forty one years ago" that contradicts everything if we go by it. I have that the movie takes place in AGE 780 (I ignore every occasion Shenlong was summoned in the anime effectively from the beginning of Universe 6 saga), but instead of that "41 years ago", it should be "46 years ago". As it is noted in the wiki, Dragon Ball Minus takes place in AGE 739, subtracting five from that, it should place the events of the beginning of Dragon Ball Super Broly in AGE 734. As a side note, this date is convenient for the guidebooks, which state that Vegeta was born in AGE 732, so by the time the movie begins, he's two years old.

It is an assumption/"headcanon" from the fans part but still, it is the only way to make sense out of it. Then again, as also stated in the wiki, all those occasions Shenlong was summoned didn't happen in the manga continuity, so... Could that be counted?

Reading the page also reminded me why I don't take into consideration months. Damn that would complicate things even more. I prefer to stick with just the years so that I can push an event to a different month to accommodate future events or to avoid unnecessary contradictions. I never realized that Trunks should be seven years old during Majin Buu saga if I were to take every detail into consideration. How painful is that?

Anyway, I think I had a lot to say just from this preview, imagine when the full thing comes out. :lol: Like I said, it's looking really good, can't wait to sink my teeth into the AGES and games sections! Keep it up the amazing work, all of you.

User avatar
TrunksTrevelyan0064
Regular
Posts: 686
Joined: Sat May 20, 2006 9:55 am
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by TrunksTrevelyan0064 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 11:24 am

Couldn't make it to the live broadcast due to time zones, but just caught up via the YouTube version.

Whew! That sure was a thing. About another thing.

Some random thoughts first:
- Way to make me drool within half a second by starting off with that banner of manga panels.
- I love that Appule was at the top of the list of henchmen on the Freeza's Organization page. Not Zarbon or Captain Ginyu, no, Appule.
- My favorite new character name is G'prae and the award for best technique name goes to "Greatest Technique".

This sneak peek took a great dive into the history of Dragon Ball, hitting me with many blasts from the past. It's wonderful to have been there for a large chunk of that history and to remember a lot of it firsthand.

What an incredible project. I keep saying Kanzenshuu feels too good to be true... except it actually is a real thing. It is something that, if it didn't exist, I would crave its existence. Thank you from the bottom of my heart, for the billionth time, for everything you all do.

P.S.: I have no idea if I possess enough skills or knowledge to contribute in any significant way, but if you ever need an extra spell-checker (my area of expertise), I'd be happy to look things over. Heck, I'll be doing that anyway in 2024 whenever the wiki goes live. Already spotted a "B-a-b-a-d-i" (written with hyphens here because the forum auto-corrects it to Babidi :lol: ) on the Nyoi-Bô page, for example (unless that spelling is intentional for whatever reason).

User avatar
VegettoEX
Kanzenshuu Co-Owner & Administrator
Posts: 16792
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:10 pm
Location: New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by VegettoEX » Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:01 am

Thanks so much for checking it out! The other editors may chime in as well, but some of my own thoughts/responses:
Grimlock wrote:Will there be an attempt to "correct" the official issues? Like in a form of a note from one of the staff members?
We're not looking to "correct" or reconcile anything. We're telling you who said what, when, where, and how, and we're telling you if it doesn't reconcile. It's not our job to make sense of it; it's our job to tell you about it. If Caramel Mama goes on to later draft something up attempting to reconcile it, we'll tell you about THAT, too! We are making extensive use of footnotes in addition to citations, so everything's extremely clear about an official word of god versus our own Kanzenshuu description/explanation.
TrunksTrevelyan0064 wrote:This sneak peek took a great dive into the history of Dragon Ball, hitting me with many blasts from the past. It's wonderful to have been there for a large chunk of that history and to remember a lot of it firsthand.

What an incredible project. I keep saying Kanzenshuu feels too good to be true... except it actually is a real thing. It is something that, if it didn't exist, I would crave its existence. Thank you from the bottom of my heart, for the billionth time, for everything you all do.
I'm totally with you on being hit with many past-blasts. I'm writing about a ton of stuff I was actually around for, but there are always little details I had forgotten that get jogged up as I re-read things, dig up citations, etc. It's definitely close to what people might call "nostalgia"...

You're extremely welcome, though. I can't imagine doing anything else. This is such a natural extension of what I've always envisioned, and it really both warms my heart and lights a fire under my ass to keep going!

More than happy to answer any other questions, and would love to hear from anyone and everyone else who took the time to check out our humble little presentation!
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::

User avatar
MetaMoss
Regular
Posts: 556
Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2010 7:14 pm
Location: Oregon

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by MetaMoss » Wed Jan 06, 2021 5:01 pm

Watched it yesterday, and I'm really liking what I'm seeing. Mad respect to everyone involved, with a particular note of how in absolute awe I am of Terez's music cataloging. I've been anticipating this ever since the website fusion-dance happened and that non-functioning wiki button appeared, and what was shown exceeded all my expectations. Waiting 9 years for even this peek was well worth it for the level of quality you all are bringing.

As for how this stream took me down memory lane, the main one for me was learning that the tape I had of the driving episode was actually a Burger King mail-order. I remember going to BK quite a bit around that time for the toys they had, so it tracks. I expect to have more of my history with Dragon Ball re-contextualized in this way. On another note, the fact that there will be a page not only for Abridged, but Alternate Reality DBZ really hits the nostalgia bone in the right way. And even though I wasn't around for the earlier days of the online fandom, I absolutely appreciate that I'll have a chance to read about the old fansites and communities.

This stream also had me looking back in an entirely different way, which was me reflecting on how I got started in this community. I actually found Daizenshuu EX because of the DB Wiki's page on AF, funnily enough. The sources on that page led me to the Rumor Guide, the Rumor Guide led me to clicking around on the other parts of the site, and soon enough I was hooked. Not much later I learned enough to know to never go to the DB Wiki ever again, so I'm glad to see that the "wiki about Dragon Ball"-shaped hole in my heart will be filled in due time.

After seeing that there will even be articles on stuff like Alex Kidd, the only question I can think to ask is this: what aren't you going to cover? :lol:

To echo what TrunksTrevelyan0064 said, this website really is too good to be true. The level of quality and care has been so beyond not only what I've seen in the Dragon Ball fandom, but almost any other fandom out there, and this wiki absolutely lives up to that. If Terez says it won't be ready until 2024, then I'm marking my calendar for 2024 and waiting patiently, because I know this project is in truly great hands. I can't say I'd be confident in my ability to contribute content for the wiki when the time comes, but I do (as of the last few months) have a little bit of professional experience with MediaWiki backend stuff, so if that ever gives you folks trouble and you'd appreciate an additional set of eyes on it, I'd be willing. Either way, you can bet I'll be an avid reader when this goes live.

User avatar
pepd
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 274
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2020 6:52 pm

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by pepd » Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:03 pm

I'm more than pleased to see the manga images, Debuts and extensive citation. I don't know if it would be significant work or if anyone would be even interested in such feature, but would you consider adding something to identify the nature of the source immediately? Maybe something like (Description)M [23] (Manga, Toriyama, Guide, Anime, Videogame). The date listing and Kikuchi pages are also amazing.

User avatar
KBABZ
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5078
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2017 9:38 pm
Location: The tallest tower in West City

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by KBABZ » Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:27 am

I'm excited to just be able to look up Dragon Ball facts that are actually true rather than made-up BS. Can't wait!

I asked this in the chat, but how much overlap will there be between the wiki and the main site? Editorial will obviously live on the main site, but how about things like the manga/anime pages? Will those become redirects to the wiki?

User avatar
VegettoEX
Kanzenshuu Co-Owner & Administrator
Posts: 16792
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:10 pm
Location: New Jersey
Contact:

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:42 pm

MetaMoss wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 5:01 pm
After seeing that there will even be articles on stuff like Alex Kidd, the only question I can think to ask is this: what aren't you going to cover? :lol:
It's certainly one thing I really appreciate about it being such an extensive, all-inclusive kind of project not necessarily tied to a specific "guide" for the main website: I can write about whatever the goddamn hell I want to write about, and I don't have to make sure the other 90 pages related to it are "done", because maybe they never will be! :lol:

But yeah, just like the main website, first priority is DRAGON BALL, second priority is ORIGINAL JAPANESE, and third priority is EVERYTHING ELSE RELATED TO THOSE. That gives us plenty of leeway to cover things like alternate music scores and other Toriyama works, and to do so when we're ready to do them at a quality level and scope we're comfortable with.

I recently answered this on Twitter (and I know I showed it off briefly on the stream), but at least for me personally, I've done pages for things like "The World of Dragon Ball Z" because I needed a break from some larger project, and it was a singular/individual thing that could be covered in its entirety all in one shot. That's... an attractive project prospect! Stuff like that is a great palate cleanser in between working on other things, whether I'm wrapping one up and before moving on to another one, or just needing a break within a big project.
pepd wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:03 pm
I'm more than pleased to see the manga images, Debuts and extensive citation. I don't know if it would be significant work or if anyone would be even interested in such feature, but would you consider adding something to identify the nature of the source immediately? Maybe something like (Description)M [23] (Manga, Toriyama, Guide, Anime, Videogame). The date listing and Kikuchi pages are also amazing.
We've talked a lot about citations, and we're still adjusting formatting for things like footnotes, and footnotes even within citations. I know this functionality didn't seem to work well while I was streaming, but you can hover over a superscript citation note to actually view/read the full source without having to click down to an anchor at the bottom of the page. This lets you clarify exactly what it is without losing your spot on the page.

To your point about clarifying with a notation letter if it's manga vs TV vs book etc., I personally feel that really gets too much into editorializing on the hierarchy of "canonicity", so to speak. We'll clarify with notes, and we'll sure tell you if something is "wrong", but the source is the source is the source, and where it comes from -- so long as it's a real thing and fits our criteria for BEING a source -- doesn't/shouldn't matter. And again, you can hover and find out if you want, and make your own call from there.
KBABZ wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:27 am
I asked this in the chat, but how much overlap will there be between the wiki and the main site? Editorial will obviously live on the main site, but how about things like the manga/anime pages? Will those become redirects to the wiki?
TBD on some of that. Even for "just" things like episode pages, we think there's still a lot of value in having a curated, designed experience with a real website layout for a lot of stuff, with fine control over how and where things are placed.

For things that the main website guides don't yet have pages for, we might just have the non-existent inner page just redirect to a wiki page if one exists. We'll probably also link respective wiki pages on main website pages.

I dunno. It'll grow, change, and evolve as it all gets built. I always have been and still am in it for the long haul here, so I'm just as excited as you to see how it all shakes out over time!

Thanks, folks! Your enthusiasm and excitement is deeply appreciated.
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::

User avatar
KBABZ
Born 'n Bred Here
Posts: 5078
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2017 9:38 pm
Location: The tallest tower in West City

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by KBABZ » Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:08 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:42 pm
KBABZ wrote:
Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:27 am
I asked this in the chat, but how much overlap will there be between the wiki and the main site? Editorial will obviously live on the main site, but how about things like the manga/anime pages? Will those become redirects to the wiki?
TBD on some of that. Even for "just" things like episode pages, we think there's still a lot of value in having a curated, designed experience with a real website layout for a lot of stuff, with fine control over how and where things are placed.

For things that the main website guides don't yet have pages for, we might just have the non-existent inner page just redirect to a wiki page if one exists. We'll probably also link respective wiki pages on main website pages.

I dunno. It'll grow, change, and evolve as it all gets built. I always have been and still am in it for the long haul here, so I'm just as excited as you to see how it all shakes out over time!

Thanks, folks! Your enthusiasm and excitement is deeply appreciated.
Mm. The redirect would be appreciated because several of the movie pages don't have links starting with the first Broly movie, and that kinda crimps on doing Trivia for the rewatch threads, haha! I think it'd be a good idea to be able to build main site pages based on their wiki pages, and maybe include a link to the wiki page somewhere on it.

User avatar
Javaki
Not-So-Newbie
Posts: 72
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:05 am
Location: Austria
Contact:

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by Javaki » Fri Jan 22, 2021 7:06 pm

Watching the preview stream got me really excited for the wiki! :D

*quoting from decade-old posts*
Greenman wrote:
Sun Apr 18, 2010 5:42 pm
Would this wiki use the Creative Commons license that Wikipedia uses?
VegettoEX wrote:
Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:32 pm
- RE: Creative Commons -- Yeah, I understand the importance of that in today's Internetz world and would be on board for it. I'd wanna look at very specific alterations of the license to see which would work best in this case (something along the lines of a non-commercial, share-alike, some rights reserved), but yes.
Are there any news regarding the wiki's license?

Big Boss
Regular
Posts: 625
Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 11:07 pm

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by Big Boss » Thu Jan 28, 2021 11:34 am

Damn, big kudos to Mike and all the other team members working on this. I know this has been in the works for a while now (nearly a decade?) and understandably has been no easy task given the scope of the project, but I appreciate the "it's done when it's done" philosophy you have adopted. It is honestly quite astounding just how much misinformation is present on the other wikis, and the community is in dire need of a neat and tidy source of information that is free of ridiculous fan theories or dubisms from 20 years ago. Good luck with the eventual rollout, I can't wait!

User avatar
Hulk10
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1319
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:55 pm
Location: New Sadala

Re: Wiki Preview Live Stream (04 January 2021)

Post by Hulk10 » Tue May 25, 2021 2:55 pm

So far so good. I like the english names better but the pages are good. They are crisp and concise.

Post Reply