Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming...

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Pokewhiz7 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:15 am

I don't think most of us have the time or software to do our own placement,

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by dbboxkaifan » Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:48 am

Pokewhiz7 wrote:I don't think most of us have the time or software to do our own placement,
Say you have an AVI file, load it to VirtualDubMod, then extract the track, load to Audacity then mix.

It's easier with CRED to mix, though, I think.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by oXdanXo » Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:40 pm

Has there been any news recently about any dub hitting UK tv? I'm getting soo sad to think that we might not see kai at all, I've got the first four blu rays from the US, but to see it on tv would be amazing, might even be the start of a revival in the UK.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Sat Feb 04, 2012 2:07 pm

Well, seeing the discussion here, I can't help but jump in. . .

penguintruth wrote:I think many of you are really exaggerating how bad the use of Kikuchi music in Kai has been. Sometimes it doesn't work, sure, but it often does. I'd rather have Kikuchi's score than some crappy Canadian-produced English dub replacement score. The very idea that they might do that kind of puts me off this whole thing.
I'm sorry, but to me, it rarely ever works. 9/10 it sounds like background noise slapped on because there was a Yamamoto track placed there previously. Using Kikuchi's music in Kai could have been decently done, even with their limited selections, but they should have rescored it from scratch instead of just plugging a Kikuchi piece(or oftentimes, plugging in 2-3 in one go) where there was a Yamamoto. Add to it that Kikuchi music works within a certain philosophy. It requires a decent amount of silence, so when a piece is actually used, it enhances the drama or action(which is actually the greatest strength to Kikuchi's music--enhancing the action), but otherwise, leaves it up to the va's to tell the story.

I know a lot of Kikuchi purest might not like what I'm fixing to say(but I used to be one, so I think I'm qualified), but Kikuchi's music is damn freaking annoying if its constantly used. The constant barrage of the equivilant of high-screeching trumpets and "tubas" in your face turns Kai into almost a comedy at somepoints, but mostly just kills the mood or any drama the story itself has to offer. It amounts to them basically taking a big paint bucket full of randomized(formulaic?) Kikuchi pieces and splattering it all over an episode, clapping there hands, and calling it a day. It's just such a disservice to Kikuchi's pieces at the end of the day.

And again, if Toei hadn't pushed for a rushjob, and let Nasagi rescore the show with he had to work with properly, the replacement score would've been much better off, but alas, it is not.
Akumaito Beam wrote: I don't know when the Kai Kikuchi score stops sucking (and it does) but as far as the the earliest stuff I've heard (Saiyan and early Namek) it has to be some of the worst placement I've ever heard. The vast majority of the time the music starts WAY too early and ends WAY too late to absurdly laughable extents. I realize it gets better because I know the first DVD set they used Kikuchi's music on was fine by me but I wouldn't fault someone for wanting to take anything else before the point where the OST gets its stuff together. I'm going by the Toonzai airings so if the placement is different on the DVDs ignore my big dumb post.
No, actually you're pretty much right. It doesn't stop sucking donkey nuts. I've had to sit through Parts 5 and 6 about twice(once to initially watch them, and second when I was making my own unscored tracks for my kai mrs project), and the music does nothing but suck the life outta the dub. I cannot enjoy the dub, even as superbly awesome and kick-ass as it is, because of this garbage.
dbboxkaifan wrote: People on Daizex complain too much about it, when actually it's really good.

If you don't like it, go do your own music placements. Period.
It honestly baffles me how there are any legitimate Nasagki Kai fans, but I've seen a few on youtube who make their own custom placements in the style of Kai, and those are just as vomit inducing as Kai itself. I can see maybe newer fans, ones who have never been exposed to the Original Kikuchi placement, might not have a problem, or even like it(because it's all new to them), but if your famliar with the Original placement in Z, it all feels so terribly wrong. But even saying that, the placement still pretty shit on its own. But I can't really say any casual fans of Z or Kai in general even care about the music, as others have suggested here.

So, since I "don't like it", I am making my own custom scores(for me, and anyone else who loathes the replacement score like me) thank you very much.
Pokewhiz7 wrote:I don't think most of us have the time or software to do our own placement,
I'm almost ashamed to say I've probably spent over 100 hours easily(maybe 150--I don't keep track) on my project , so this is true. Though I'm doing 3 different ones, so that's a big contributing factor. But even doing one is time-consuming process, the say the least.
Hades wrote:Replacement scores are more a "dark age of anime" (Concurrent with the "Dark Age" of comics) thing, and only a minority of dubbing companies do that nowadays. And if Ocean are trying to compete with funimation on grounds of faithfulness to the original, then a replacement score would be a very bad idea, regardless of how the yamamoto scandal was handled.
I would normally agree that Funi or Ocean only objective with a show is to "just dub it", but considering that the parent company in this case completely fucked up the show with their lazy and rushjob replacement score, I really don't have the slightest objection to a different score. As long as hopefully, it's not constant music for background noise, but even THAT is better than what we got, honestly speaking.
Aoi wrote:At first I liked it but now I feel that I actually need to re-implement the Yamamoto score myself to get the feeling Kai was meant to produce.
Hey, that's my job!!!! Who do you think you are?? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Nah, I feel exactly the way you do. Yamamoto's music really was great.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Aoi » Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:56 pm

saiyanprimalforce wrote:Well, seeing the discussion here, I can't help but jump in. . .

penguintruth wrote:I think many of you are really exaggerating how bad the use of Kikuchi music in Kai has been. Sometimes it doesn't work, sure, but it often does. I'd rather have Kikuchi's score than some crappy Canadian-produced English dub replacement score. The very idea that they might do that kind of puts me off this whole thing.
I'm sorry, but to me, it rarely ever works. 9/10 it sounds like background noise slapped on because there was a Yamamoto track placed there previously. Using Kikuchi's music in Kai could have been decently done, even with their limited selections, but they should have rescored it from scratch instead of just plugging a Kikuchi piece(or oftentimes, plugging in 2-3 in one go) where there was a Yamamoto. Add to it that Kikuchi music works within a certain philosophy. It requires a decent amount of silence, so when a piece is actually used, it enhances the drama or action(which is actually the greatest strength to Kikuchi's music--enhancing the action), but otherwise, leaves it up to the va's to tell the story.

I know a lot of Kikuchi purest might not like what I'm fixing to say(but I used to be one, so I think I'm qualified), but Kikuchi's music is damn freaking annoying if its constantly used. The constant barrage of the equivilant of high-screeching trumpets and "tubas" in your face turns Kai into almost a comedy at somepoints, but mostly just kills the mood or any drama the story itself has to offer. It amounts to them basically taking a big paint bucket full of randomized(formulaic?) Kikuchi pieces and splattering it all over an episode, clapping there hands, and calling it a day. It's just such a disservice to Kikuchi's pieces at the end of the day.

And again, if Toei hadn't pushed for a rushjob, and let Nasagi rescore the show with he had to work with properly, the replacement score would've been much better off, but alas, it is not.
Akumaito Beam wrote: I don't know when the Kai Kikuchi score stops sucking (and it does) but as far as the the earliest stuff I've heard (Saiyan and early Namek) it has to be some of the worst placement I've ever heard. The vast majority of the time the music starts WAY too early and ends WAY too late to absurdly laughable extents. I realize it gets better because I know the first DVD set they used Kikuchi's music on was fine by me but I wouldn't fault someone for wanting to take anything else before the point where the OST gets its stuff together. I'm going by the Toonzai airings so if the placement is different on the DVDs ignore my big dumb post.
No, actually you're pretty much right. It doesn't stop sucking donkey nuts. I've had to sit through Parts 5 and 6 about twice(once to initially watch them, and second when I was making my own unscored tracks for my kai mrs project), and the music does nothing but suck the life outta the dub. I cannot enjoy the dub, even as superbly awesome and kick-ass as it is, because of this garbage.
dbboxkaifan wrote: People on Daizex complain too much about it, when actually it's really good.

If you don't like it, go do your own music placements. Period.
It honestly baffles me how there are any legitimate Nasagki Kai fans, but I've seen a few on youtube who make their own custom placements in the style of Kai, and those are just as vomit inducing as Kai itself. I can see maybe newer fans, ones who have never been exposed to the Original Kikuchi placement, might not have a problem, or even like it(because it's all new to them), but if your famliar with the Original placement in Z, it all feels so terribly wrong. But even saying that, the placement still pretty shit on its own. But I can't really say any casual fans of Z or Kai in general even care about the music, as others have suggested here.

So, since I "don't like it", I am making my own custom scores(for me, and anyone else who loathes the replacement score like me) thank you very much.
Pokewhiz7 wrote:I don't think most of us have the time or software to do our own placement,
I'm almost ashamed to say I've probably spent over 100 hours easily(maybe 150--I don't keep track) on my project , so this is true. Though I'm doing 3 different ones, so that's a big contributing factor. But even doing one is time-consuming process, the say the least.
Hades wrote:Replacement scores are more a "dark age of anime" (Concurrent with the "Dark Age" of comics) thing, and only a minority of dubbing companies do that nowadays. And if Ocean are trying to compete with funimation on grounds of faithfulness to the original, then a replacement score would be a very bad idea, regardless of how the yamamoto scandal was handled.
I would normally agree that Funi or Ocean only objective with a show is to "just dub it", but considering that the parent company in this case completely fucked up the show with their lazy and rushjob replacement score, I really don't have the slightest objection to a different score. As long as hopefully, it's not constant music for background noise, but even THAT is better than what we got, honestly speaking.
Aoi wrote:At first I liked it but now I feel that I actually need to re-implement the Yamamoto score myself to get the feeling Kai was meant to produce.
Hey, that's my job!!!! Who do you think you are?? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Nah, I feel exactly the way you do. Yamamoto's music really was great.
Man, I agree 100% with everything you posted. I mean THIS : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKyY7-DWpNo
... is a masterpiece. Just that. It made an already great scene better.

About the Kikuchi comments. I never really could put my finger on what was "wrong" with its placement in Kai. I think you hit the nail on the head by saying how Kikuchi's tracks work best when they're not being constantly played. It's almost distracting to be honest with you. It has nothing to do with the fact that its different from the original placement in "Z". 90% of the time , I can't remember what a scene originally sounded like unless it's one of those key moments.

This is mainly why I'm extremely happy that Ocean is producing their own music. I'm a big fan of their original dub (Saiyan/Namek) and score. They weren't rushed and IMO produced a heart pounding show that also reflected the show's innocent/comedic nature: http://daizex.fanboyreview.net/posting. ... 6&p=528004

When I was a kid, I fell in love with this music and didn't really care that it didn't sound just like the DBZ that I had seen in South America or Japan. It just works. Plus , I think Ocean needs to differentiate their release from FUNI's with a new track.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by dbboxkaifan » Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:38 pm

saiyanprimalforce wrote:It honestly baffles me how there are any legitimate Nasagki Kai fans, but I've seen a few on youtube who make their own custom placements in the style of Kai, and those are just as vomit inducing as Kai itself. I can see maybe newer fans, ones who have never been exposed to the Original Kikuchi placement, might not have a problem, or even like it(because it's all new to them), but if your famliar with the Original placement in Z, it all feels so terribly wrong. But even saying that, the placement still pretty shit on its own. But I can't really say any casual fans of Z or Kai in general even care about the music, as others have suggested here.
Just because you dislike or detest it doesn't mean the majority does too.

I love Kikuchi's music and despite how limited it is in Kai, I'd rather listen to the limited soundtrack than songs from Tenkaichi 3.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Aoi » Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:16 pm

dbboxkaifan wrote:
saiyanprimalforce wrote:It honestly baffles me how there are any legitimate Nasagki Kai fans, but I've seen a few on youtube who make their own custom placements in the style of Kai, and those are just as vomit inducing as Kai itself. I can see maybe newer fans, ones who have never been exposed to the Original Kikuchi placement, might not have a problem, or even like it(because it's all new to them), but if your famliar with the Original placement in Z, it all feels so terribly wrong. But even saying that, the placement still pretty shit on its own. But I can't really say any casual fans of Z or Kai in general even care about the music, as others have suggested here.
Just because you dislike or detest it doesn't mean the majority does too.

I love Kikuchi's music and despite how limited it is in Kai, I'd rather listen to the limited soundtrack than songs from Tenkaichi 3.

Stop thinking your all high and mighty telling what's right and what's wrong. --"
At no point was he ever rude or imposing. He just explained, in detail, why he felt the way he felt. Nothing "High and mighty" about it.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by saiyanprimalforce » Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:11 pm

dbboxkaifan wrote: Just because you dislike or detest it doesn't mean the majority does too.

I love Kikuchi's music and despite how limited it is in Kai, I'd rather listen to the limited soundtrack than songs from Tenkaichi 3.

Stop thinking your all high and mighty telling what's right and what's wrong. --"
I think you completely missed the part where I said "I can't really say causal fans of Z or Kai really care about the music change."Only the hardcore fan, Faulconer or Kikuchi, are really going to be bothered, and even that, most either will accept it, or quit watching. Which the latter is what happened with me until I realized I could replace the music.

But like Aoi said, I don't get where you think I'm being all "high and mighty" at. Am I making an argument that the placing of the replacement score is crappy? Yes. But no where am I condemning anyone who doesn't mind it, or even enjoys it(though it makes me question a person's musical taste). In fact, more power to ya if you can enjoy crappy and repetitive placement of Kikuchi's music. I honestly cannot. I tried to like it, but pretty much everything about it feels so wrong and off. It's simply nothing more than huge barrier from preventing me from enjoying the dub. That's all that's really to it.

But to add a bit more to the argument, some people do seem to just accept or like it just because "hey, it's Kikuchi!" And I suppose there's not really anything wrong with that, but if there's one thing I've realized from what has happened, it's that music and placement can honestly make or break a show. It's not a question of Kikuchi or Faulconer or Yamamoto, but the placement of their respective themes. I used to think that Kikuchi is the only "real" dragonball score. Heck, I even remember when Kai first started airing in Japan, I watched a few of the episodes off youtube and really disliked Yamamoto's music because it basically wasn't Kikuchi, so it wasn't "dragonball" to me.

However, when Funimation released Part 1 of Kai, instead of being so narrow-minded, I actually found myself immensely enjoying Yamamoto's score, and developed a pretty strong attachment to it. It was the perfect synergy between Yamamoto's awesome music and Funimation's kick-ass dub. Which brings me back to my point--you can't have a good show without both those things. Even though Funi's dub is still great, the replacement score pretty much soils any good it does.

The exact opposite of this is when Funimation released the Orange bricks, and added the 5.1 Kikuchi mix. It was really a pretty pointless move, as even though you had Kikuchi's music now, it just made the crappy voice acting stand out any more(nevermind how awful the dub was to begin with). The serious tone of Kikuchi's music clashed completely with the obnoxious tone of the dub, which honestly only made the funi dub even harder to stomach since the dub couldn't carry itself without constant BGM.

And I think the same also applies to Scott Morgan and Mike Smith. I've really grown to love the Faulconer score since I've been able to place it like a real score, as opposed to how the episodes were mixed. There's a lot of great themes, but even if Scott Morgan and Mike Smith had been able to score it the way they wanted too(and not cartoon background noise), the Original Z dub still would have blew chunks because of the dub, despite their best efforts.

So getting off the soapbox, my main point is that both need to be on-the-dime to be enjoyable. . .or at least, that's the way I see it.
Aoi wrote: Man, I agree 100% with everything you posted. I mean THIS : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKyY7-DWpNo
... is a masterpiece. Just that. It made an already great scene better.
Wow, that's an awesome use of Heroic Face-Off. I haven't actually gotten to that episode yet. . .but I may have to bump it up on my list! Lol.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by dbboxkaifan » Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:06 pm

Fair enough.

I have to say Yamamoto's the true intended music, Shunsuke Kikuchi's DBZ is the official replacement, so either way I'm perfectly happy, more with Kikuchi than Yamamoto's now.

Same goes for Raging Blast 2, since my copy came with BT2's music I barely remember any of the original RB2 soundtrack (other than "Battle of Omega") so I prefer the replacement and it's quite fittingly nice.

For Kai episodes 96, 97, 98 there's no official Yamamoto music placement, so I guess someone will do a custom to complete the remaining Yamamoto Kai episodes.

Edit: Tbh, I wouldn't mind Megaman's music being used again on DBZ, now Kai, but I suppose Ocean Kai will have something better and original.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by KingofWisdom » Sat Feb 04, 2012 9:02 pm

The Kikuchi placement hasn't bothered me yet, granted I've only heard it from around Frieza's defeat on Namek forward (since that's when the switch affected the Blu-rays / DVDs). It only stuck out to me at first because Kickuchi's score clearly sounds very different than Yamamoto's. But I never watched and thought, "Wow, the music placement here is awful."
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Aoi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 4:08 pm

Guys, has there been any official press release on this dub?
What we know,
1. A few actors have mentioned a month ago that they already dubbed up to the Ginyu Force stuff.
2. FUNI actors recognized that this is in production.

Other than this, it seems to me like we're in the dark for now. Has nothing been said? Is there a tentative release date planned?

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by VegettoEX » Tue Feb 14, 2012 5:09 pm

If there was anything new to say or hear, you'd have already read it in this forum thread and on various news websites :).
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by KingofWisdom » Tue Feb 14, 2012 5:42 pm

Unfortunately, we may not hear much else until it's ready for release. Unless we get more news from the actors at conventions.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Hades » Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:34 pm

So we're going to assume that it'll be released "when it's done". :D
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Aoi » Tue Feb 14, 2012 6:38 pm

Hades wrote:So we're going to assume that it'll be released "when it's done". :D
Haha thanks. That's reassuring in a way. This means we'll have to wait less between releases if this is true.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:15 pm

I will say, though, I theorized a while back that perhaps one of the reasons it's taking as long as it is...is because they're waiting to release it until the whole dang show is dubbed, rather than go through the hectic recording schedule that Nicktoons demanded from FUNimation. I'm more inclined to believe this if they've gotten all the way up to the Ginyu Force saga (at least).

Still, no way to know for sure. However, it would be cool if they got the whole thing dubbed, that way they'd be able to release five episodes a week if they wanted.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by RazorX » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:34 pm

Personally, I would want them to release a batch of episodes, then wait a few weeks or 2-3 months (with reruns of the first batch) before releasing the next batch of episodes, and so on. Much like how Cartoon Network broadcast DBZ episodes.

That way, they don't exhaust the episodes too quickly. And it leaves fans wanting more.

This is going to be an amazing ride, I want to stretch the ride as long as possible.

Having said that, once the Ocean dub starts getting released, I'll be eagerly awaiting the start of the Ginyu saga, among other things. I don't think many people expected they'd hear McNeil's Piccolo (and quite possibly Drummond's Vegeta) fighting against Frieza. A highly competent dub of the Frieza saga seemed like a distant dream, until now.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Attitudefan » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:37 pm

Stop making me excited!
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:38 pm

RazorX wrote:A highly competent dub of the Freeza saga seemed like a distant dream, until now.
That's pretty much what we got with FUNimation's dub of Kai, as far as I'm concerned. Not that I'd object to hearing yet another highly competent dub with yet another cast of talented actors!
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by NitroEX » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:41 pm

I wonder if Scott McNiel played the farmer again.

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