Kai Continues Outside Japan

Discussion specifically regarding the "refreshed" TV version of DBZ created in Japan for its 20th anniversary, including individual threads for each episode.

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Metalwario64
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Metalwario64 » Mon Nov 12, 2012 10:58 pm

Honestly, I think Gohan calling Boo a "dumbass" would work best without getting overly offensive, and still effectively get the insult aspect down.
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Kingdom Heartless » Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:33 pm

I don't think the line is necessary anyway. And honestly, I think it would feel really out of place in the dub, regardless of my feelings on it.
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Rocketman » Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:33 pm

The funny thing is that "idiot" and "moron" are both old technical terms for the mentally deficient, and basically identical to retard in every aspect except current emotional reaction.



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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by fps_anth » Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:59 am

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
bkev wrote:I would have liked to see them try to adapt the lines in a fashion that would represent the frustration that comes with profanity but without using it.
The videogames have that...including some hilariously over-the-top, enraged delivery of lines like, "DARN YOU!!!" that were so obviously meant to be, "DAMN YOU!!!"

Having said that, there's no way they'll use the word "retard." Not in this day and age. That word is a lightning rod for controversy, and rightfully so.
Just watched that episode from my Dragon Box, and honestly I was surprised that was a part of the script. I'm going to assume that word flies in Japan more so than it does here in North America, probably more so during the early 90s when that episode aired. I definitely don't expect that word being used for the Kai dub. "Idiot" works just fine.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by penguintruth » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:44 am

Gohan: "You differently skilled, but fully functional member of society whose IQ doesn't quite meet societal standards but is no less a beautiful creature for having lived in this universe... who happened to kill my mother and friends."

Buu: "This has upset me, but I acknowledge your feelings and find your criticism bracing and life-affirming, and hope to engage in a lively, but respectable debate on the merits of violence in the near future... and eat you."

Piccolo: "The orbs are currently deactivated and in a position of no movement, not that I'm judging in any way, and feel fully confident in myself and in the beauty of the underprivledged whom I constantly strive to comfort."

Vegeta: "You are a number more than zero but less than two, designated as being the top, greatest of something, but without judging anyone else by your lofty standards, Kakarotto."

Goku: "Fully-actualized beautiful friendship beam of turtles (not that other creatures aren't wonderous)-HA!"

Dragon Ball PC, coming to a device that transmits vile hate speech by misogynist maletocracy but also on occasion wonderful life-affirming green biodegradable confidence-restoring programming involving all wonderful, but flawed in a beautiful way unless they are racist or homophobic people, this time which is not summer, winter, or spring, not that they aren't fully-actualized and beautiful seasons!

Joyously play guitar in a robust and lively manner that is only life-affirming the green creature who resembles a snake but should not be judged by any hypocritical stereotypes of serpents!

"Your designated male sperm recepiant cis gender DNA contributor was a below exceptional, but still beautiful and worthy physical aggressor but he was exceptional in meager standards that focus only on IQ but should rather be more confidence-building person who studied natural things that are said to occur in this magnificent tapestry we call the universe!"
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Fizzer » Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:54 am

I think I quite like dickhead, even though it's a swear where there wasn't originally one.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by matt0044 » Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:06 pm

penguintruth wrote:Gohan: "You differently skilled, but fully functional member of society whose IQ doesn't quite meet societal standards but is no less a beautiful creature for having lived in this universe... who happened to kill my mother and friends."

Buu: "This has upset me, but I acknowledge your feelings and find your criticism bracing and life-affirming, and hope to engage in a lively, but respectable debate on the merits of violence in the near future... and eat you."

Piccolo: "The orbs are currently deactivated and in a position of no movement, not that I'm judging in any way, and feel fully confident in myself and in the beauty of the underprivledged whom I constantly strive to comfort."

Vegeta: "You are a number more than zero but less than two, designated as being the top, greatest of something, but without judging anyone else by your lofty standards, Kakarotto."

Goku: "Fully-actualized beautiful friendship beam of turtles (not that other creatures aren't wonderous)-HA!"

Dragon Ball PC, coming to a device that transmits vile hate speech by misogynist maletocracy but also on occasion wonderful life-affirming green biodegradable confidence-restoring programming involving all wonderful, but flawed in a beautiful way unless they are racist or homophobic people, this time which is not summer, winter, or spring, not that they aren't fully-actualized and beautiful seasons!

Joyously play guitar in a robust and lively manner that is only life-affirming the green creature who resembles a snake but should not be judged by any hypocritical stereotypes of serpents!

"Your designated male sperm recepiant cis gender DNA contributor was a below exceptional, but still beautiful and worthy physical aggressor but he was exceptional in meager standards that focus only on IQ but should rather be more confidence-building person who studied natural things that are said to occur in this magnificent tapestry we call the universe!"
...

What?

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Cold Skin » Tue Nov 13, 2012 1:35 pm

This is not a free insult Gohan is throwing, this is to emphasize the fact that Boo is unable to keep up and playfully point it out to him, it's not about being agressive, which isn't like Gohan.
So I don't think being rude is either in Gohan's temper, nor in his intention, especially since he's not attacking Boo on any kind of physical trait.
This is just to point out the fact that he's faster.

As such, the old French translation for the manga made him say what could be translated as: "Over here. Slime." or "Over here. Slug."
The new translation treats him with the French word "balourd". It's what you say about a person who has the clumsiness of a drunk man and possibly the same capacity to do things the right way than a drunk man. It is not a rude word, since it can even appear in Kingdom Hearts, as a word said by Disney villains being fed up with each other. However, it is not a "sweet insult" either, it is likely hurtful to hear from someone who just appeared behind your back without you noticing it, as it clearly states your inferiority compared to that person's agility of body and mind. People can easily get hurt and offended by this word, and might take it as a provocation or be pissed off instantly since it does insult them both in the way they move clumsily and in the way they think without subtlety.
Wictionnary gives the possible English translation as "chuckehead", but I'm not sure it has quite the same meaning actually.

In any case, Gohan shouldn't be rude, and his insult is to be directed at the fact that Majin Boo is ridiculously slow and lacks subtlety compared to him.
He will later compliment Boo on his better fighting abilities, but also on the fact that he has gained subtlety even in the way he now speaks correctly.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by dbboxkaifan » Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:37 pm

"Over here, idiot"

It's straight to the point and it is an insult used on TV.

But I can't honestly consider "idiot" as swearing. Damn, Hell, and whatever aren't neither.
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:41 pm

dbboxkaifan wrote:"Over here, idiot"

It's straight to the point and it is an insult used on TV.

But I can't honestly consider "idiot" as swearing. Damn, Hell, and whatever aren't neither.
Technically, "damn" and "hell" are considered swear words in the English language. Not every swear word is equally as offensive, though, and those two are definitely on the lower end of the spectrum. They are considered offensive enough that they can't be used in TV shows on children's networks (with some exceptions here and there, depending on how late the TV show in question is shown).
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Kaboom » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:04 pm

I'm with Metalwario64. I think "dumbass" would work beautifully for the uncut dub, and could be swapped with something more "tame" for a TV broadcast.
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by ultimateemail5000 » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:53 pm

Dumbass sounds good too, but every time I read anyone calling someone a dumbass, I jst hear Butt-Head saying "You dumbass." But it is a good replacement for retard. Or even idiot or moron. I think Gohan is just saying it to make Buu angry, and the fact that he isn't the brightest crayon in the box. So it just seems like Gohan is just insulting him because he is stupid.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by funrush » Tue Nov 13, 2012 8:17 pm

ultimateemail5000 wrote:Dumbass sounds good too, but every time I read anyone calling someone a dumbass, I jst hear Butt-Head saying "You dumbass." But it is a good replacement for retard. Or even idiot or moron. I think Gohan is just saying it to make Buu angry, and the fact that he isn't the brightest crayon in the box. So it just seems like Gohan is just insulting him because he is stupid.
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I think this would work well.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by dbzfan7 » Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:26 pm

penguintruth wrote:Gohan: "You differently skilled, but fully functional member of society whose IQ doesn't quite meet societal standards but is no less a beautiful creature for having lived in this universe... who happened to kill my mother and friends."

Buu: "This has upset me, but I acknowledge your feelings and find your criticism bracing and life-affirming, and hope to engage in a lively, but respectable debate on the merits of violence in the near future... and eat you."

Piccolo: "The orbs are currently deactivated and in a position of no movement, not that I'm judging in any way, and feel fully confident in myself and in the beauty of the underprivledged whom I constantly strive to comfort."

Vegeta: "You are a number more than zero but less than two, designated as being the top, greatest of something, but without judging anyone else by your lofty standards, Kakarotto."

Goku: "Fully-actualized beautiful friendship beam of turtles (not that other creatures aren't wonderous)-HA!"

Dragon Ball PC, coming to a device that transmits vile hate speech by misogynist maletocracy but also on occasion wonderful life-affirming green biodegradable confidence-restoring programming involving all wonderful, but flawed in a beautiful way unless they are racist or homophobic people, this time which is not summer, winter, or spring, not that they aren't fully-actualized and beautiful seasons!

Joyously play guitar in a robust and lively manner that is only life-affirming the green creature who resembles a snake but should not be judged by any hypocritical stereotypes of serpents!

"Your designated male sperm recepiant cis gender DNA contributor was a below exceptional, but still beautiful and worthy physical aggressor but he was exceptional in meager standards that focus only on IQ but should rather be more confidence-building person who studied natural things that are said to occur in this magnificent tapestry we call the universe!"
Bro did you just say what I was gonna say but smarter?
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Jackal puFF » Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:37 pm

I'd rather him say jackass than dumbass for some reason.

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by dbboxkaifan » Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:18 pm

'dumbass' sounds kinda kiddy and it's not really that insulting any more.

Hoping for 'idiot', 'asshole' or 'twat', twat's probably not going be used but idiot may be.

"Over here, idiot" (+)
"Over here, twat" (+)
"Over here, asshole" (+)
"Over here, dipshit" (+++)
"Over here, dumbass" (-/+)

Or.. "Over here, bugger"

Bugger off is the polite way of telling someone to go fuck off.

The American audience isn't likely to know about calling someone a bugger, I think, so not a choice.
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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by mattymoron » Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:57 am

penguintruth wrote:Gohan: "You differently skilled, but fully functional member of society whose IQ doesn't quite meet societal standards but is no less a beautiful creature for having lived in this universe... who happened to kill my mother and friends."

Buu: "This has upset me, but I acknowledge your feelings and find your criticism bracing and life-affirming, and hope to engage in a lively, but respectable debate on the merits of violence in the near future... and eat you."

Piccolo: "The orbs are currently deactivated and in a position of no movement, not that I'm judging in any way, and feel fully confident in myself and in the beauty of the underprivledged whom I constantly strive to comfort."

Vegeta: "You are a number more than zero but less than two, designated as being the top, greatest of something, but without judging anyone else by your lofty standards, Kakarotto."

Goku: "Fully-actualized beautiful friendship beam of turtles (not that other creatures aren't wonderous)-HA!"

Dragon Ball PC, coming to a device that transmits vile hate speech by misogynist maletocracy but also on occasion wonderful life-affirming green biodegradable confidence-restoring programming involving all wonderful, but flawed in a beautiful way unless they are racist or homophobic people, this time which is not summer, winter, or spring, not that they aren't fully-actualized and beautiful seasons!

Joyously play guitar in a robust and lively manner that is only life-affirming the green creature who resembles a snake but should not be judged by any hypocritical stereotypes of serpents!

"Your designated male sperm recepiant cis gender DNA contributor was a below exceptional, but still beautiful and worthy physical aggressor but he was exceptional in meager standards that focus only on IQ but should rather be more confidence-building person who studied natural things that are said to occur in this magnificent tapestry we call the universe!"

Hahahahahaha, brilliant! You forgot about the part where Boo has Gohan check his privilege, though! :p

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by LiamKav » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:13 am

"PC" essentially means "people trying to be polite to each other". And Gohan, no matter how angry, would never resort to words that demean others. He might insult the person he is talking to, but not a group. Calling someone a "bastard" is not offensive to all people born out of wedlock, but calling someone a "retard" is pretty offensive to most people with any sort of disability. There are plenty of insults that can be used without offending large parts of the population. I think that while Steve may have been technically correct with his use of "retard", it ignores the cultuural weight that the word has, at least in the US, which means it doesn't quite come across the way it's probably intended to.

(It does make me wince a little listening to the old podcasts and hearing the gang through the words "retard" and "gay" around a bit more freely than they do nowadays. But then, I was the same back then. You live and learn.)

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Super Sonic » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:53 pm

To us, "bugger" is just a funny word. Though I've seen things saying many US cartoons using it get censored in the UK. A for using synonyms, sometimes in they change between languages. For example I recall in the DB dub, Roshi asked Goku to get him a brewski once, while in Japanese he just said beer plainly. In a non-DB example, in Heaven's Lost Property Forte when a boy on a trivia show gave a wrong answer the dialogue from the announcer was different between Japanese and English in what he fell into:

Japanese translated subs: Oh my! It's a cesspit! Sakurai has fallen into a cesspit!

English audio: Oh no! It's a pile of s$%^! Tomoki has fallen into a pile of s$%^! (It wasn't censored but forget the thoughts on certain words so censored it myself)

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Re: Kai Continues Outside Japan

Post by Zephyr » Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:11 am

I would approve of the use of "dumbass", if only so as to liken Gohan to Red Foreman from That 70's Show.

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