Why do so many American fans hate Kai?

[Fizzer]

I see this an awful lot, mostly on places where you see casual American fans, like in the comments on Facebook pages for DB characters and stuff like that. Elsewhere I usually see people praising Kai for its pacing, script and voice acting, but around those parts I only ever see "KAI SUCKS!" or "I watched one episode of Kai and it was way less good than Z". Is it because they've seen the cut version? Is it because it doesn't have the Faulconer soundtrack? Is it because they simply don't like change?

[TheGmGoken]

Nostalgia. That's all. A lot of them are blinded by it. Even to the point of saying(I know it's their opinion) that Sean in Z was better than Sean in Kai.

[Ajay]

Because anything that even remotely differs from their butchered Faulconer/Funi-dub show is terrible.

There's also the idiots that claim that Kai is censored.

[TheBlackPaladin]

There's also the idiots that claim that Kai is censored.

I wouldn't call them idiots, because quite frankly, FUNimation hasn't helped. One of the things that I've pointed to constantly is that FUNimation really did (in my opinion) a bad job of informing people that the versions on Nicktoons and the CW4Kids/Vortexx are censored, and that the uncut version is on home video. I remember I told somebody online that they sold an uncut version of Kai, and he thought I was making it up.

If you'll notice, not a single one of FUNimation's commercials for Kai notes that it's uncut. The only way people would know that is if they read a (removable) sticker on the front cover, and...I mean, c'mon, who's gonna do that?

I used to think that FUNimation didn't need to advertise the word "uncut" anymore because that's standard practice nowadays, like, "OK, we get it, unless it's released by 4Kids, all anime on home video is uncut now." But after seeing the reactions from so many fans who didn't know that Kai was uncut on home video, I'm convinced that their ads do need that word attached to them, still. I've actually talked a few people into watching Kai because they were unaware of the uncut home video version.

But anyway...to answer your question more broadly, Fizzer, the most common complaints I see are complaints about how Kai is different. They don't like that the dialogue is different, they don't like that the music is different, they don't like that the voices are different (even though most of the original cast returned, a point that many Kai-haters completely ignore), and they don't like that it's censored (unaware of the uncut version). I've seen so many people say that the Kai dub is for kiddies, whereas the DBZ dub is for mature audiences.

I'll come to FUNimation's defense a little bit here, though. The thing is, one of the biggest selling points for Kai is how much better the dub is, and that's not a fact that FUNimation can advertise, or at least not as much as they might like to. Because that would require that they openly admit that their DBZ dub was bad, and that would be a stupid business descision because DBZ continues to be their highest-selling product, with most of the people buying it being people who want to see the dub. True, some of the voice actors (most notably Sean Schemmel) have been very vocal about how they didn't like the DBZ dub and love the Kai dub, but FUNimation themselves can't advertise on an official level that their Kai dub corrects so many of the shortcomings of the DBZ dub. So, for all the "average joe" knows, Kai is just DBZ with a shortened running time and changes that were made "for the heck of it." They see Kai as a bastardization of the show they loved, with so many seemingly unnecessary changes made that it feels like a completely different show.

..............I cannot even begin to go into how ironic that is.

Nevertheless, FUNimation could have at least advertised that they sell Kai uncut. It would clear up a major and very prevalent misunderstanding.

[Fizzer]

That's kind of what I thought it was. They think of the Z dub as the "true" version, and Kai as the edited one. It's really quite sad.

[dbzfan7]

They refer to all the actors in Kai as the "Kia actrs" when most of them are the same as they were in Z. So when I hear people complain about Goku/Vegeta/Piccolo/etc, I think, "So you basically want them all to half ass their performances like they did in Z.

[TheGmGoken]

They refer to all the actors in Kai as the "Kia actrs" when most of them are the same as they were in Z. So when I hear people complain about Goku/Vegeta/Piccolo/etc, I think, "So you basically want them all to half ass their performances like they did in Z.

LOL! I love the Kia actors.....WHAT THE FUCK is a kia? I know some people type fast. But a lot of people do it. Also I love how they say the Old voice actors > The new ones(MOSTLY the same). How is Sean Z Goku better than Kai Sean Goku? I guess Grandma Freeza was suddenly the greatest voice actor ever but before Kai came out they all complained how bad his voice was.

What makes me annoyed at times is when before Kai came out. They complained about filler, voice acting(Freeza especially), and yes even the non stop Music. But when all that is gone. The things that sucked are now the best thing ever.

[penguintruth]

Do American fans hate Kai? It did pretty well on Nicktoons, didn't it?

[Hellspawn28]

It's the Funi purist that hates anything DB related if it does not have Bruce Faulconer music and the 1999-2005 voice cast. It reminds me how some Pokemon and Transformers fans are that some purist hate anything G1 and thinks everything after that sucks.

[TheGmGoken]

It's the Funi purist that hates anything DB related if it does not have Bruce Faulconer music and the 1999-2005 voice cast. It reminds me how some Pokemon and Transformers fans are that some purist hate anything G1 and thinks everything after that sucks.

Not to get off topic but. G2(My favorite) got some love and respect. It was G3 and on-wards that got extreme hate.

[TheBlackPaladin]

Do American fans hate Kai? It did pretty well on Nicktoons, didn't it?

Oh yeah, definitely. It did very well. But we're not talking Toonami numbers. Go to any YouTube video featuring a clip of the Kai dub, and (most unfortunately) there's a pretty high chance that the top-rated comments will be about how Kai "ruined" the scene, and that the DBZ version of the dub was infinitely better for every conceivable reason. At one point, I saw a top-rated comment that read, "Well, at least Kai will get kids interested in DBZ, then they'll grow up and realize what they've been missing out on."

It is my policy not to look down upon people for holding opinions about a show, regardless of how much I disagree with them. However, I can't help but completely disagree with (almost) every assertion that the DBZ dub was better than the Kai dub.

[Hellspawn28]

Kai does not have the same level of marketing and merchandise that DBZ had during the 90's and early 2000's. Back then, you had happy meal toys, coloring books, action figures at nearly toy store and fruit snacks. Most people don't even know that the show exist outside the Otaku fandom and a small amount number of kids.

[Kakarot88]

Kai's music (not Kenji Yamomoto but the old Z music in the original japanese dub that has been thrown back in) sounds terrible with the American actors. period
...it works beautifully in Japanese but just sounds clashing with this American cast.

Now, even if it was the American Z Faulconer music or the Ocean dub music was placed in there instead of the old Z music I still think it would sound terrible given the arrangement: the music is haphazardly thrown in and reused for certain moments ad nausium. It's just plain awful.

There is an over use of "silence" so there are these just awkward dead silent moments.

Gohan now sounds like a little girl and completely wrong.

A great majority of the actors in general sound bored when they say certain lines or over the topic shouting ridiculous.

A lot of the acting feels unnatural and lacks the lightheartedness or naturalness that the former americanized version had...it feels as if the actors took to heart all the negative criticsm and are specifically doing the lines in a way unnatural to them so much so that they sound forced as if they are trying to appease a certain fan base but hey if y'all buy it more power to you

The "filler' that was cut out includes fight scenes

There's more but those are the general complaints I hear. I agree with the statements at least as far as Gohan and music is concerned. Overall the acting performances are just different, so much so that I almost did not realize Sabat was still playing Piccolo because the voice sounds so different. Better? meh depends...worse? Meh depends...

[dbzfan7]

Kai's music (not Kenji Yamomoto but the old Z music in the original japanese dub that has been thrown back in) sounds terrible with the American actors. period
...it works beautifully in Japanese but just sounds clashing with this American cast.

Now, even if it was the American Z Faulconer music or the Ocean dub music was placed in there instead of the old Z music I still think it would sound terrible given the arrangement: the music is haphazardly thrown in and reused for certain moments ad nausium. It's just plain awful.

There is an over use of "silence" so there are these just awkward dead silent moments.

Gohan now sounds like a little girl and completely wrong.

A great majority of the actors in general sound bored when they say certain lines or over the topic shouting ridiculous.

A lot of the acting feels unnatural and lacks the lightheartedness or naturalness that the former americanized version had...it feels as if the actors took to heart all the negative criticsm and are specifically doing the lines in a way unnatural to them so much so that they sound forced as if they are trying to appease a certain fan base but hey if y'all buy it more power to you

The "filler' that was cut out includes fight scenes

There's more but those are the general complaints I hear. I agree with the statements at least as far as Gohan and music is concerned. Overall the acting performances are just different, so much so that I almost did not realize Sabat was still playing Piccolo because the voice sounds so different. Better? meh depends...worse? Meh depends...

Any of the english actors in Kai will tell you they are way better then they were in Z. Sean even said he was embarrassed at some of his old performance (he also said he was proud of some of it too) and has gotten softer on it over the years when before he was very hard on his old performance. He also said he was very comfortable with his Kai acting and that only the last season where he dubbed Goku when he was sick he wasn't happy about. You can go to his fan page or facebook to discuss with him his performance, he said he doesn't mind critiques.

[DragonBoxZTheMovies]

I think most of them are just misinformed. Or they go into it having decided that they already hate it, because it's not going to be what they remember or expect from certain scenes.

[KaiserNeko]

"The actors sound bored!"

I think you mean, "They're acting with more subtlety than the over-the-top delivery they used to slap onto each scene."

I'm serious. The acting in Kai is ridiculously better than Z. There's a ridiculous amount of care taken with each line over the original Z dub. You say it's less "fun". I say it's more refined and realistic.

[dbzfan7]

"The actors sound bored!"

I think you mean, "They're acting with more subtlety than the over-the-top delivery they used to slap onto each scene."

I'm serious. The acting in Kai is ridiculously better than Z. There's a ridiculous amount of care taken with each line over the original Z dub. You say it's less "fun". I say it's more refined and realistic.

I agree 100% with this.

[Fizzer]

"The actors sound bored!"

I think you mean, "They're acting with more subtlety than the over-the-top delivery they used to slap onto each scene."

I'm serious. The acting in Kai is ridiculously better than Z. There's a ridiculous amount of care taken with each line over the original Z dub. You say it's less "fun". I say it's more refined and realistic.

I agree 100% with this.

Me too.

Seriously my only real complaint about Kai is the music placement. I understand that the music ruins certain moment, like Goku and Cell exploding, but most of the complaints are bizarre in my eyes. I guess these are most of the same people who think that the dub is better than the original version of Z too, though.

[Kakarot88]

I think you mean, "They're acting with more subtlety than the over-the-top delivery they used to slap onto each scene."

No I mean bored. There's a difference between subtlety and phoning it in. Some of the scenes sound like they just don't give a darn and some are worse over the top like when Kaio freaks out about Goku wanting to fight Freeza. Especially when Vegeta goes Super Saiyan for the first time in Kai. I love love love Sabat but hated the way that scene was done. It felt lack luster. I also love Schemmel, but did not feel connected or into the scene when Goku went Super Saiyan for the first time, the desperation and anger he exuded in Z was just not there. He says "bastard" and I feel like a lot of fans were like "ooooh soooo cooool Goku cursed!" Nah, not me, the scene was much better in the funimation dub in my opinion. Although I did like that they actually did the proper "go now while I still have a piece of my sanity left." Honestly, I''ve even heard that scene in Kai done with the old faulconer music put in on youtube and the scene still does not feel like Goku to me, so it's not the music and just the acting. Again I love Sean and think all the VAs had some improvements but don't find them as most do to be leaps and bounds better. I find it just different.

Some of the scenes sound as if they were taken from spliced together dialogue, more specifically that the actors were not actually in the same studio and interacting and rather recorded the scenes apart and then were packed ito the dialogue accordingly by the editors. The interactions feel off...and it makes sense because I've heard from them at panels that yeah they were in other states recording some scenes.

Not saying all of Kai is bad, I enjoy some of it. I was actually voicing the complaints I heard and what I agree with.

I personally just find Kai incredibly overrated. If I want herp derp action I'm gonna watch Funimation Dragon Ball Z. If I want genuine Dragon Ball Z I'm gonna watch it in Japanese. If I want poor music and intermitently compelling performances and a female sounding Gohan I'll be sure to watch Kai! Funny thing is I will watch all of the Buu arc in Kai, probably twice as I did the other arcs in Kai just to at least give it a chance.

[Gonstead]

Phoning-in is the absolute last place you'll be hearing any sort of acting in Kai. Compare ANY scene from DBZ compared to Kai and 99.99% of the time, Kai will win it over.

Quite frankly, EVERYONE in the old Funimation dub sucked and were full of reading-off-a-script and phoned-on dialogue because pretty much NONE of them had any real acting experience.

You speak about Goku not sounding like what Goku is. Reality check: What you hear Goku say in Kai IS who Goku is! Goku is not some superman clone that you hear in the old Z dub and that's a fact. There is no denying that.

And SSJ Goku? HE'S IN A FIT OF RAGE! He just lost is longtime best friend and the guy responsible is suggesting if he should kill his child next? What are you honestly expecting him to say in such a situation? Do you really expect him to go "Darn you! You big meanie-pants!"? He's fucking angry as hell for crying out loud. The whole scene in the Z dub feels like reading off a script.

If I want a legitimate translation of Dragon Ball Z, complete with better acting, better writing, better voices, better pacing, more manga accurate, music that at LEAST was originally composed for the show, I'll go with Kai. If I want an illegitimate version of Dragon Ball Z, complete with sub-par acting, sub-par writing, drawn-out longer than necessary scenes and music that 99.99% of the time never shuts up, I'll go with the original Z dub.

Hell, the Ocean dub of the Saiyan and Namek arcs is leaps and bounds better than the Funimation Z dub. Even if it was something corny, the acting at least made up for it.