Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

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MasenkoHA
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Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by MasenkoHA » Thu Jun 24, 2021 4:33 pm

Something I was thinking about. The Boo arc, specifically the ending, only works when taken into context of Dragon Ball as a whole. We’re introduced to Goku as a martial artist. His call to action wasn’t saving the world or seeing a wish granting dragon but to go out and see the world and become stronger. This culminates in him wishing Majin Boo back as a good person and taking Oob to train for that one great fight he’s been looking for to truly test himself.

But Kai doesn’t introduce him as a martial artist who lived in seclusion for the first 12 years of his life it introduces him as a baby from another world being sent off to earth as a write off not knowing he’ll be destined to avenge his race from the evil emperor. All of Goku’s beginnings prior to finding out his ancestry is glossed over in a brief recap as mere background info about his story.

And that’s honestly why I have a huge problem with using the Bardock special as a prologue. Having the story begin with Goku’s father seeing him face off against Freeza sets up the Goku vs Freeza battle as the big endgame of the series where everything will lead up to.

But even the Cell saga fits as a proper ending to Kai’s beginning. We begin the story with Goku have just recently been born and we end the story with him choosing to stay dead and move on to the afterlife. Bardock leaves the world of the living knowing his son will avenge his race. Goku leaves the word of the living feeling confident his son will protect his adopted race.

And yeah there’s obvious commercial reasons for Boo Kai to exist but from the way Dragon Ball Kai constructs it’s narrative it just does not work imo.

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Yuji » Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:25 pm

Good points, I didn't think about it before but the argument you make is quite compelling. I'd also argue the Cell arc ending fits thematically because of the resolution of the Gohan story. Stripped of context from the original series, Kai truly is more of Gohan's story rather than Goku's.

Tangentially related, I'd like to say I enjoy how all of Dragon Ball's arcs being so self-contained allow for such different readings of the thematic undercurrent of the story.

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Fri Jun 25, 2021 7:27 am

Very good points, though honestly given the drastically different production approach I tend to look at Kai 1.0 and Final Chapters as two separate shows with the latter being a sequel to the former.
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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Muffin Man » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:37 am

But there's nothing stopping you from simply...watching the original Dragonball before watching DBZ Kai, though. The original Dragonball tended to have much more entertaining filler than the original DBZ, so it still holds up pretty well. And thanks to The Final Chapters, we can finally watch the entirety of DB/DBZ in English with a chronologically recorded dub from beginning to end. It feels weird to think back on it now, but for a long time I thought we'd always be stuck with the weird backwards dub of the original release, that started awkwardly in the middle of the Frieza saga and then looped around backwards to the original DB and then to a redub of the Saiyan saga and early Frieza saga.

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Majin Man 101 » Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:54 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 4:33 pm Something I was thinking about. The Boo arc, specifically the ending, only works when taken into context of Dragon Ball as a whole. We’re introduced to Goku as a martial artist. His call to action wasn’t saving the world or seeing a wish granting dragon but to go out and see the world and become stronger. This culminates in him wishing Majin Boo back as a good person and taking Oob to train for that one great fight he’s been looking for to truly test himself.

But Kai doesn’t introduce him as a martial artist who lived in seclusion for the first 12 years of his life it introduces him as a baby from another world being sent off to earth as a write off not knowing he’ll be destined to avenge his race from the evil emperor. All of Goku’s beginnings prior to finding out his ancestry is glossed over in a brief recap as mere background info about his story.

And that’s honestly why I have a huge problem with using the Bardock special as a prologue. Having the story begin with Goku’s father seeing him face off against Freeza sets up the Goku vs Freeza battle as the big endgame of the series where everything will lead up to.

But even the Cell saga fits as a proper ending to Kai’s beginning. We begin the story with Goku have just recently been born and we end the story with him choosing to stay dead and move on to the afterlife. Bardock leaves the world of the living knowing his son will avenge his race. Goku leaves the word of the living feeling confident his son will protect his adopted race.

And yeah there’s obvious commercial reasons for Boo Kai to exist but from the way Dragon Ball Kai constructs it’s narrative it just does not work imo.
I guess I can see what you are saying but I think I don’t know if I can ever think about Kai in a context outside of Dragon Ball and then Dragon Ball Z. If they never would have finished Kai I think I would have had a nervous breakdown because for me The Majin Boo arc is such an integral part of the story.

In fact, it drives my brain nuts to this very day that the original dragon ball didn’t get the Kai treatment along with Dragon Ball Z.

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:30 pm

Majin Man 101 wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:54 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 4:33 pm Something I was thinking about. The Boo arc, specifically the ending, only works when taken into context of Dragon Ball as a whole. We’re introduced to Goku as a martial artist. His call to action wasn’t saving the world or seeing a wish granting dragon but to go out and see the world and become stronger. This culminates in him wishing Majin Boo back as a good person and taking Oob to train for that one great fight he’s been looking for to truly test himself.

But Kai doesn’t introduce him as a martial artist who lived in seclusion for the first 12 years of his life it introduces him as a baby from another world being sent off to earth as a write off not knowing he’ll be destined to avenge his race from the evil emperor. All of Goku’s beginnings prior to finding out his ancestry is glossed over in a brief recap as mere background info about his story.

And that’s honestly why I have a huge problem with using the Bardock special as a prologue. Having the story begin with Goku’s father seeing him face off against Freeza sets up the Goku vs Freeza battle as the big endgame of the series where everything will lead up to.

But even the Cell saga fits as a proper ending to Kai’s beginning. We begin the story with Goku have just recently been born and we end the story with him choosing to stay dead and move on to the afterlife. Bardock leaves the world of the living knowing his son will avenge his race. Goku leaves the word of the living feeling confident his son will protect his adopted race.

And yeah there’s obvious commercial reasons for Boo Kai to exist but from the way Dragon Ball Kai constructs it’s narrative it just does not work imo.
I guess I can see what you are saying but I think I don’t know if I can ever think about Kai in a context outside of Dragon Ball and then Dragon Ball Z. If they never would have finished Kai I think I would have had a nervous breakdown because for me The Majin Boo arc is such an integral part of the story.

In fact, it drives my brain nuts to this very day that the original dragon ball didn’t get the Kai treatment along with Dragon Ball Z.
Fair enough. It was more me expressing my annoyance they started off with footage from the Bardock special and then reduced the first 194 chapters of the manga to a recap. It just feels like "Yeah nothing before the Saiyan stuff actually matters"

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Majin Man 101 » Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:11 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:30 pm
Majin Man 101 wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:54 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Thu Jun 24, 2021 4:33 pm Something I was thinking about. The Boo arc, specifically the ending, only works when taken into context of Dragon Ball as a whole. We’re introduced to Goku as a martial artist. His call to action wasn’t saving the world or seeing a wish granting dragon but to go out and see the world and become stronger. This culminates in him wishing Majin Boo back as a good person and taking Oob to train for that one great fight he’s been looking for to truly test himself.

But Kai doesn’t introduce him as a martial artist who lived in seclusion for the first 12 years of his life it introduces him as a baby from another world being sent off to earth as a write off not knowing he’ll be destined to avenge his race from the evil emperor. All of Goku’s beginnings prior to finding out his ancestry is glossed over in a brief recap as mere background info about his story.

And that’s honestly why I have a huge problem with using the Bardock special as a prologue. Having the story begin with Goku’s father seeing him face off against Freeza sets up the Goku vs Freeza battle as the big endgame of the series where everything will lead up to.

But even the Cell saga fits as a proper ending to Kai’s beginning. We begin the story with Goku have just recently been born and we end the story with him choosing to stay dead and move on to the afterlife. Bardock leaves the world of the living knowing his son will avenge his race. Goku leaves the word of the living feeling confident his son will protect his adopted race.

And yeah there’s obvious commercial reasons for Boo Kai to exist but from the way Dragon Ball Kai constructs it’s narrative it just does not work imo.
I guess I can see what you are saying but I think I don’t know if I can ever think about Kai in a context outside of Dragon Ball and then Dragon Ball Z. If they never would have finished Kai I think I would have had a nervous breakdown because for me The Majin Boo arc is such an integral part of the story.

In fact, it drives my brain nuts to this very day that the original dragon ball didn’t get the Kai treatment along with Dragon Ball Z.
Fair enough. It was more me expressing my annoyance they started off with footage from the Bardock special and then reduced the first 194 chapters of the manga to a recap. It just feels like "Yeah nothing before the Saiyan stuff actually matters"
OG Dragon Ball gets so neglected and it's so sad.

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Wrigglything » Sun Jul 31, 2022 11:29 am

It's pretty lame but I suppose since Z is the more remembered and popular part of the original run, what incentive would Shueisha and Toei have to bother with the earlier material if there isn't a whole lot of folks clamouring for it? You certainly don't see the general public discuss Mercenary Tao/Pai Pai or King Piccolo as much they do for Vegeta and Freeza, after all

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Re: Thematically speaking the Boo arc never should have gotten a Kai cut

Post by Adamant » Mon Aug 01, 2022 6:24 pm

I mean Boo Kai only happened because international licensees were throwing money at Toei begging them to let them rebuy more Dragon Ball Z. I don't think thematics ever entered anyone's minds at the time.
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