"Borrowed Attacks" Tidbit

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"Borrowed Attacks" Tidbit

Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 09, 2009 11:15 am

Hey, all!

I know it's been a long time since we posted anything up in this section, but we have a new page for everyone to check out and give some last-minute suggestions & read-throughs on.

We have a new "Tidbit" called "Borrowed Attacks". You can probably infer what it's about right from the title.

So what do we need? Well, we're pretty sure we grabbed most of the examples of this that happened, though there might be some we missed. Can you think of any? The chat helped out with a bit, so thanks!

We're not purposefully excluding DBGT, so if you have any concrete examples, let us know. It is most helpful if you have actual episode numbers (DBGT or otherwise) to go along with your suggestions, since that will let us easily dig into the DVDs and grab the necessary screen-shot.

Also, any random typos or textual inconsistencies that you can point out would be appreciated. Finally, I desperately need an image to represent Cell and the Genki-Dama down at the bottom. I was thinking of maybe resorting to an image from one of the recent video games, but I don't have a working video capture system anymore. Help is appreciated!

http://www.daizex.com/general/tidbits/b ... acks.shtml
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Post by Bardock the Mexican » Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:56 pm

Very interesting new material. The thing I noticed was the look of everything and how nice it all kind of blended in. The pics brought back some nostalgia from old times and that more than anything helped to sell the little tidbit to me. Overall good work.
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Post by Kaboom » Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:57 pm

I personally think it'd be safe enough to count Goku and 18's Kienzan attacks as "the real deal."
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Post by The Tori-bot » Fri Jan 09, 2009 1:26 pm

Everything looks good as-is, but I thought of a few little things that you could mabye add:

- Pointing out when something is filler (e.g. the Cell Jrs.' attacks, Cell using the Shiyo-Ken) or non-canon in general (Tullece using the Power Ball, etc.), stuff like that.

- Would it be worth noting that whenever Goku uses it, he states that he's using Tien's move?

- While Gohan is the first person to use the Masenko, didn't it originate with Piccolo? In the Viz version it's noted as "Piccolo's signature move!", so would it be presumable that he could use it?

- Kaio-shin uses a sort-of Shunkan-Ido-like technique after he merges with Kibito, so could that go under the "Variations" part?

- It's only in the Budokai games that Cell uses the Genki-Dama; he never has it as an attack after Budokai 3.

- Could we assume that Freeza got the idea to use the "Energy Slicers" (as they're labelled in the Sparking! games) from when Kuririn sliced off his tail with it and he thought it could be effective if it was powerful enough to cut off a piece of his body?

That's all I gots for now.
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Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 09, 2009 1:31 pm

The Tori-bot wrote:- Pointing out when something is filler (e.g. the Cell Jrs.' attacks, Cell using the Shiyo-Ken) or non-canon in general (Tullece using the Power Ball, etc.), stuff like that.
I was thinking about doing that, but not sure how to do it without cluttering things up. Maybe an alternate color-coding for the text?
The Tori-bot wrote:- Would it be worth noting that whenever Goku uses it, he states that he's using Tenshinhan's move?
Maybe. I don't think it matters too much, personally.
The Tori-bot wrote:- While Gohan is the first person to use the Masenko, didn't it originate with Piccolo? In the Viz version it's noted as "Piccolo's signature move!", so would it be presumable that he could use it?
Is that in the original...?
The Tori-bot wrote:- Kaio-shin uses a sort-of Shunkan-Ido-like technique after he merges with Kibito, so could that go under the "Variations" part?
Good point. Thinking about also tossing in Chibi Buu's, as well.
The Tori-bot wrote:- It's only in the Budokai games that Cell uses the Genki-Dama; he never has it as an attack after Budokai 3.
Right, which is where I would think a screen-shot from said games would make sense, because while he noted in the original story that he COULD do it, those games are the only places we see it.
The Tori-bot wrote:- Could we assume that Freeza got the idea to use the "Energy Slicers" (as they're labelled in the Sparking! games) from when Kuririn sliced off his tail with it and he thought it could be effective if it was powerful enough to cut off a piece of his body?
Also was considering tossing that info in there.

Thanks!
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Post by MisterFlashdude » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:12 pm

Goku can use Kienzan too, or at least an attack that looks exactly like it. He cuts Super Buu in half with it upon his return from the after life.

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Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:15 pm

MisterFlashdude wrote:Goku can use Kienzan too, or at least an attack that looks exactly like it. He cuts Super Buu in half with it upon his return from the after life.
See the bottom of the page :).
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Post by The Tori-bot » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:18 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:- Pointing out when something is filler (e.g. the Cell Jrs.' attacks, Cell using the Shiyo-Ken) or non-canon in general (Tullece using the Power Ball, etc.), stuff like that.
I was thinking about doing that, but not sure how to do it without cluttering things up. Maybe an alternate color-coding for the text?
I actually think that'd be a great way to do it.
VegettoEX wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:- While Gohan is the first person to use the Masenko, didn't it originate with Piccolo? In the Viz version it's noted as "Piccolo's signature move!", so would it be presumable that he could use it?
Is that in the original...?
Uh... Herms? Somebody...?
VegettoEX wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:- It's only in the Budokai games that Cell uses the Genki-Dama; he never has it as an attack after Budokai 3.
Right, which is where I would think a screen-shot from said games would make sense, because while he noted in the original story that he COULD do it, those games are the only places we see it.
Not that it makes much difference, but did you take it to mean that I was noting that Cell only uses it in the video games, or that the only games he uses it in are the Budokai games? Because I meant the latter.
Last edited by The Tori-bot on Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by MisterFlashdude » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:20 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
MisterFlashdude wrote:Goku can use Kienzan too, or at least an attack that looks exactly like it. He cuts Super Buu in half with it upon his return from the after life.
See the bottom of the page :).
Aww, I hadn't gotten that far... Sorry!

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Post by Super Ghost Kamikaze » Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:45 pm

Bukûjutsu is mentioned twice, but there's no actual section for it. Why?

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Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:47 pm

Super Ghost Kamikaze wrote:Bukûjutsu is mentioned twice, but there's no actual section for it. Why?
The 'Borrowed Attacks' Page wrote:Also, we are leaving out Bukûjutsu (levitation, or flying). The explanation for this one? Lots of characters use it. Lots!
I thought we summed it up OK, right there :oops: .
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Post by Kaboom » Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:50 pm

You could just have one panel for Bukujutsu that says "just about everyone in the freakin' universe." :D
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Post by Super Ghost Kamikaze » Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:06 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
Super Ghost Kamikaze wrote:Bukûjutsu is mentioned twice, but there's no actual section for it. Why?
The 'Borrowed Attacks' Page wrote:Also, we are leaving out Bukûjutsu (levitation, or flying). The explanation for this one? Lots of characters use it. Lots!
I thought we summed it up OK, right there :oops: .
I don't particularly think so, to be honest. It doesn't talk about Videl's training with the technique, which I think is pretty important as far as borrowed techniques go. It could also be more thorough in how the techninque became easier for Goku, how it replaced the Kinto'un as a fast travel option, and other such things. It just seems odd to mention Bukûjutsu as the "most-borrowed technique", and then to not give it a slot in the list of borrowed techniques!

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Post by VegettoEX » Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:12 pm

Super Ghost Kamikaze wrote:I don't particularly think so, to be honest. It doesn't talk about Videl's training with the technique, which I think is pretty important as far as borrowed techniques go. It could also be more thorough in how the techninque became easier for Goku, how it replaced the Kinto'un as a fast travel option, and other such things. It just seems odd to mention Bukûjutsu as the "most-borrowed technique", and then to not give it a slot in the list of borrowed techniques!
All fair points. Very interested in hearing other thoughts on it.
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Post by jda95 » Fri Jan 09, 2009 5:01 pm

Freeza's Kienzan is known as Tsuibi Kienzan (Tsuibi roughly translates to homing).

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Post by SSj_Rambo » Fri Jan 09, 2009 6:46 pm

The only thing that I have to say is that totally I agree with listing Buu and Kibito-Kaio as borrowers of the Shunkan-Ido and using different colored font to note which cases of borrowing are canonical or not. Other than that the page looks great and I love the nice images!

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Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:03 pm

Dubism alert! Unless Bio-Broli is a term used by the fans from long ago or is in the original.
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Post by Herms » Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:09 pm

The Tori-bot wrote:
VegettoEX wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:- While Gohan is the first person to use the Masenko, didn't it originate with Piccolo? In the Viz version it's noted as "Piccolo's signature move!", so would it be presumable that he could use it?
Is that in the original...?
Uh... Herms? Somebody...?
Viz is wrong in calling the Masenko Piccolo's "signature move", since Gohan's use of it is the first time it's ever seen. During the battle with Freeza though, Piccolo does use an attack that looks very similiar, but he doesn't name it. Daizenshuu 7's technique dictionary says Piccolo taught Gohan the attack, and lists Piccolo as one of its users.

On Freeza and the Kienzan, from Daizenshuu 7's technique dictionary's entry on Freeza's "Pursuing Kienzan":
A Kienzan that senses the opponent’s ki and continues pursuing them. It can also be fired in a pair. It seems he imitated the Kienzan that Krillin used.
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Post by The Tori-bot » Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:23 pm

JulieYBM wrote:Dubism alert! Unless Bio-Broli is a term used by the fans from long ago or is in the original.
I'm pretty sure (not 100%) it originates in the Daizenshuu.

While I'm here, Goku first used the Taiyo-ken in the 23rd Budokai against the four Tenshinhans, not against Vegeta. ;)
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Post by Herms » Fri Jan 09, 2009 7:34 pm

Yeah, "Bio-Broli" is used in Daizenshuu 6 and 7. It might even be from the movie too, but it's been too long since I've seen it.
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