"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by ryou766 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:15 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Black said in the manga that he is the most troublesome Hakaishin in all 12 Universes, implying that he is the strongest one.
What chapter and page was this said in again? My mind is faint.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by ArchedThunder » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:19 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
GodKaio-Ken wrote:Didn't Beerus even say there are 12 Universe, some with Gods of Destruction more powerful than himself? In the movie I mean?
He just said that he is the Hakaishin of the 7th Universe, and that there could be even more powerful people in the other universes in general. Black said in the manga that he is the most troublesome Hakaishin in all 12 Universes, implying that he is the strongest one.
In the anime Whis said the other Gods of Destruction are much more violent than Beerus and Champa. Both lines are probably just shit made up by Toyotaro and Toei.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:21 pm

ryou766 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Black said in the manga that he is the most troublesome Hakaishin in all 12 Universes, implying that he is the strongest one.
What chapter and page was this said in again? My mind is faint.
Chapter 16.
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Though this is a better translation from Herms:
Black: “Kukuku…Wonderful. The most troublesome one of all…Universe 7’s God of Destruction…How fortunate that there’s a world without him…”
ArchedThunder wrote:In the anime Whis said the other Gods of Destruction are much more violent than Beerus and Champa. Both lines are probably just shit made up by Toyotaro and Toei.
Which episode & when?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by giovanni02 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:23 pm

Legion wrote:
giovanni02 wrote:I believe that Vegetto and Merged Zamasu surpassing Beerus and perhaps even Whis is pratically necessary at this point. Because, if not, it means that Goku and Vegeta separately might never surpass them, after all, it's likely that Vegetto from Buu Saga has a base form that's more powerful than Goku and Vegeta's current base form. What I'm trying to say is, that these are fusions and the next villains are probably not going to be fusing or needing fusion against them, but Vegetto is imensely more powerful than Goku and Vegeta and if Beerus is never surpassed by them, then it's going to be very hard to make any sagas related to Gods of Destruction or Angels, which I think is the point of their existence, I mean, Dragon Ball always ends up creating characters and especially Gods to be surpassed eventually. (And there's still lots of them).
Are you sure? Toriyama can always create a new transformation angel level or above, if he wants, without any explanation. Remember that the power levels are shit.

I think that Goku/Vegeta will surpass Beerus and Whis at the end of super probably, but not people like Grand Priest or Zeno. Is not necessary.
Well, the only problem with that is that it wouldn't be any transformation, it would have to be "the transformation". I mean, Vegetto base could take on Goku SSJ3 and Vegeta without any issues (in the anime anyways). What I'm trying to say is that SSJ Blue 2 or SSJ Blue 3 wouldn't even come close to surpassing Vegetto, and I think we might not be seeing transformations for a while, I think Goku and Vegeta should work on their base with Whis, which actually seemed to be Whis's intention. As for not surpassing the Grand Priest, I hardly think that's going to be the case unless the anime is cancelled, after all Goku's objective is to become the strongest in the Multiverse, now I can't really say anything about Zen'oh, because his power is apparently unsurpassable. But I think the Grand Priest might eventually be surpassed, things tend to happen very quickly in Dragon Ball.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Legion » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:24 pm

Which episode & when?
Episode 42....but that episode is a toei filler, anyway. Actually, that episode is really stupid, the poor Goku was more retarded than usual :crazy:

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:26 pm

Legion wrote:
Which episode & when?
Episode 42....but that episode is a toei filler, anyway. Actually, that episode is really stupid, the poor Goku was more retarded than usual :crazy:
About which minute was that said?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Noah » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:26 pm

dbgtFO wrote:I would love it, if Vegetto's weakness is because they are two humans fusing together, when the merging was specifically designed for Kaioshin and if Merged Zamasu is also getting screwed over because he defiled the Potara by fusing together with a human's body(though that would raise questions about Elder Kaioshin's merger with that old witch :think: ).
It's a double thumbs up, if this also explains why Vegetto is dual voiced, when all other Potara Mergers so far only have one voice(though I also liked the theory, that it's simply because one personality overpowered the other, due to power, whereas Vegeta and Goku were more even, thus both having a say).
They are Saiyans, and that weakness would be as lame as the retcon about Dragon Balls being capable of defusing aa Potara Fusion.
Legion wrote:About Beerus i wait the next episodes, but i have really no doubt that Whis kick Zamasu ass.
Er... No. I don't think Whis could handle Merged Zamasu either, for logic reasons SSJB Vegetto has to be way beyond Beerus's power, maybe even greater than all Hakaioshin, all this nerf is something really off to be happening in Dragon Ball lately
Last edited by Noah on Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Avok » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:27 pm

giovanni02 wrote:
Well, the only problem with that is that it wouldn't be any transformation, it would have to be "the transformation". I mean, Vegetto base could take on Goku SSJ3 and Vegeta without any issues (in the anime anyways). What I'm trying to say is that SSJ Blue 2 or SSJ Blue 3 wouldn't even come close to surpassing Vegetto, and I think we might not be seeing transformations for a while, I think Goku and Vegeta should work on their base with Whis, which actually seemed to be Whis's intention. As for not surpassing the Grand Priest, I hardly think that's going to be the case unless the anime is cancelled, after all Goku's objective is to become the strongest in the Multiverse, now I can't really say anything about Zen'oh, because his power is apparently unsurpassable. But I think the Grand Priest might eventually be surpassed, things tend to happen very quickly in Dragon Ball.
Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.

They'll continue to get stronger and stronger, but I think the frontier of the upper Gods will never be crossed.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Legion » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:31 pm

DBZGTKOSDH wrote:
Legion wrote:
Which episode & when?
Episode 42....but that episode is a toei filler, anyway. Actually, that episode is really stupid, the poor Goku was more retarded than usual :crazy:
About which minute was that said?
Minute 10:11, more or less.
Er... No. I don't think Whis could handle Merged Zamasu either, for logic reasons SSJB Vegetto has to be way beyond Beerus's power, maybe even greater than all Hakaioshin, all this nerf is something really off to be happening in Dragon Ball lately
We don't know absolutely nothing about Whis real power. And there is no logic in dragon ball super.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Noah » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:32 pm

Avok wrote:Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.
And when did we have an anime series running for 30 years straight? lol

I don't believe in Super lasting more then a couple of years, let alone 30 years :lol:
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Jinzoningen MULE » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:33 pm

Noah wrote:
Avok wrote:Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.
And when did we have an anime series running for 30 years straight? lol

I don't believe in Super lasting more then a couple of years, let alone 30 years :lol:
Super will last for as long as it makes bank. That could be anywhere between 6 more months and 20 more years.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Noah » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:37 pm

Jinzoningen MULE wrote:Super will last for as long as it makes bank. That could be anywhere between 6 more months and 20 more years.
They will need good writters for such ambitious plans, because with the direction the story is going, it is difficult to imagine anything beyond without entering in the "fanfic territory" as that Dragon Room may serve as well
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by ChaosLordBrandon » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:41 pm

Avok wrote:
giovanni02 wrote:
Well, the only problem with that is that it wouldn't be any transformation, it would have to be "the transformation". I mean, Vegetto base could take on Goku SSJ3 and Vegeta without any issues (in the anime anyways). What I'm trying to say is that SSJ Blue 2 or SSJ Blue 3 wouldn't even come close to surpassing Vegetto, and I think we might not be seeing transformations for a while, I think Goku and Vegeta should work on their base with Whis, which actually seemed to be Whis's intention. As for not surpassing the Grand Priest, I hardly think that's going to be the case unless the anime is cancelled, after all Goku's objective is to become the strongest in the Multiverse, now I can't really say anything about Zen'oh, because his power is apparently unsurpassable. But I think the Grand Priest might eventually be surpassed, things tend to happen very quickly in Dragon Ball.
Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.

They'll continue to get stronger and stronger, but I think the frontier of the upper Gods will never be crossed.
Agreed. they brought the series back for it to last a very long time. And it can't do that if the main character becomes the strongest right at the start of the story.

It would be like if Luffy from One Piece became Yonko level right after the Arlong Park Arc. Who the hell is the main character suppose to fight besides like the other top 5 strongest characters in his or her series if she or he is already the strongest?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Avok » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:42 pm

Noah wrote:
Avok wrote:Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.
And when did we have an anime series running for 30 years straight? lol

I don't believe in Super lasting more then a couple of years, let alone 30 years :lol:
Come on now...
Should have used the word "franchise" instead.

Let it be movies, manga, OVA, tv series, videogames, novels, whatever.
Super is clearly aimed at children (more than the original series) because they want to plant the seed for the future generation to love the series when they grow up, 15/20 years from now.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by giovanni02 » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:47 pm

ChaosLordBrandon wrote:
Avok wrote:
giovanni02 wrote:
Well, the only problem with that is that it wouldn't be any transformation, it would have to be "the transformation". I mean, Vegetto base could take on Goku SSJ3 and Vegeta without any issues (in the anime anyways). What I'm trying to say is that SSJ Blue 2 or SSJ Blue 3 wouldn't even come close to surpassing Vegetto, and I think we might not be seeing transformations for a while, I think Goku and Vegeta should work on their base with Whis, which actually seemed to be Whis's intention. As for not surpassing the Grand Priest, I hardly think that's going to be the case unless the anime is cancelled, after all Goku's objective is to become the strongest in the Multiverse, now I can't really say anything about Zen'oh, because his power is apparently unsurpassable. But I think the Grand Priest might eventually be surpassed, things tend to happen very quickly in Dragon Ball.
Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.

They'll continue to get stronger and stronger, but I think the frontier of the upper Gods will never be crossed.
Agreed. they brought the series back for it to last a very long time. And it can't do that if the main character becomes the strongest right at the start of the story.

It would be like if Luffy from One Piece became Yonko level right after the Arlong Park Arc. Who the hell is the main character suppose to fight besides like the other top 5 strongest characters in his or her series if she or he is already the strongest?
I didn't say it would be right away, much to the contrary, Vegetto being more powerful than Beerus and Whis would still mean that Goku and Vegeta are decades/transformations away from them. Besides, we don't know the difference of power between the Great Priest and Whis, there is room for an infinite number of characters in between. Goku and Vegeta will however continue to ascend and get stronger, it will, however, be very boring if they never surpass Beerus. As for how long the series will last, that is up to Akira (the good parts anyway), unless we are hoping for another GT. Vegetto's power is not something that can be reached immediately for Goku and Vegeta and unless there's another "God Transformation", which would start to get repetitive, they might take thousands of years to reach his level.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Jinzoningen MULE » Thu Nov 10, 2016 6:47 pm

Avok wrote:Super is clearly aimed at children (more than the original series) because they want to plant the seed for the future generation to love the series when they grow up, 15/20 years from now.
Not really. Toei has always used the exact same strategy for Dragon Ball. They pander a little more now, for sure, but the marketing has hardly changed. Dragon Ball's target demographic started with young boys, and that's where it will stay.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by dbs fanboy » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:21 pm

Avok wrote:
giovanni02 wrote:
Well, the only problem with that is that it wouldn't be any transformation, it would have to be "the transformation". I mean, Vegetto base could take on Goku SSJ3 and Vegeta without any issues (in the anime anyways). What I'm trying to say is that SSJ Blue 2 or SSJ Blue 3 wouldn't even come close to surpassing Vegetto, and I think we might not be seeing transformations for a while, I think Goku and Vegeta should work on their base with Whis, which actually seemed to be Whis's intention. As for not surpassing the Grand Priest, I hardly think that's going to be the case unless the anime is cancelled, after all Goku's objective is to become the strongest in the Multiverse, now I can't really say anything about Zen'oh, because his power is apparently unsurpassable. But I think the Grand Priest might eventually be surpassed, things tend to happen very quickly in Dragon Ball.
Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.

They'll continue to get stronger and stronger, but I think the frontier of the upper Gods will never be crossed.
Pretty much this, if Goku gets that strong, it will probably be the end of his journey and we'll have to say goodby again (like in GT).
I really miss ma boy, Black :( :cry:


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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by ArchedThunder » Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:22 pm

Avok wrote:
Goku will never be the strongest in the Multiverse.

Where do you go from there then? If they revived the series after so long is because they want it to last for another 30 years. It wouldn't make sense for the characters to be the strongest of all the universes.

They'll continue to get stronger and stronger, but I think the frontier of the upper Gods will never be crossed.
Never say never, Goku could always become the strongest in the multiverse and then the torch could be passed on to a new cast as Goku leaves in a fashion similar to the end of GT.
That ain't happenin for a LONG time though.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Neon Z » Thu Nov 10, 2016 10:22 pm

GodVegetto91 wrote:It doesn't make any sense at all for Vegetto to have trouble sustaining SSJ Blue. Because SSJ Blue is the most stable and controlled SSJ Form. (Stated) when Goku tried to use Kaioken. So Forget the Manga! with Toyotaro needlessly adding that tidbit about the downside of SSJ Blue because he doesn't have one! What happens in the manga has absolutely no bearing on the anime.
MSSJ and SSJ Blue are the two most stable and ki-controlled versions of SSJ out there! No question. And there would be no point at all for them to nerf Vegetto thay way who used to be the ultimate warrior.
Although the silly "transforming twice burns 90% of your power!" flaw was Toyotaro-only, there's also a line about how the transformation eats energy that seems to have come from Toriyama himself, considering how it was in both anime and manga. It's the whole reason Goku initially faces Hit in base. The idea that it's the most stable and controlled Super Saiyan form doesn't seem to come from Toriyama. So, it's possible he could write something about SSB alongside Fusion being unstable for some reason.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by SansrivaaL » Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:58 pm

So it seems that weakness may be the reason as to why Vegito looked serious and was going all out.... or it could just be because he finally found an opponent worthy of his time.

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