"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[MajinMan]

Naruto's manga episodes are fine, it's the filler that messed the flow if you were watching from week to week. Now that it's over you can easily skip them with no issues.

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Is this snark or an actual figure. I am honestly curious.

It's real. In fact I think the real number is like 44%. And if people like to complain that DB/Z has a lot of filler, imagine how Naruto fans feel.

[Totamo]

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Is this snark or an actual figure. I am honestly curious.

It's real. In fact I think the real number is like 44%. And if people like to complain that DB/Z has a lot of filler, imagine how Naruto fans feel.

the manga ended nearly 3 years ago and the anime ended this year.

[emi_b7]

Naruto's manga episodes are fine, it's the filler that messed the flow if you were watching from week to week. Now that it's over you can easily skip them with no issues.

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Is this snark or an actual figure. I am honestly curious.

According to animefillerlist.com Naruto has 43% filler and Shippuden has 44%. For comparison, both DB and DBZ have only 15%.

[Ripper 30]

"Composition of the arc is terrible"

What does that even meeeeeeean?

Series composition. The overall structure of the arc and how it will be paced which is decided by the director and head writer during the planning stages and sometimes producers as well. This arc's pacing and structure is terrible. That's what I meant. Sorry for the confusion.

Agreed, it's pacing is worse than Gokū Black Arc and the difference is that, atleast Gokū Black Arc was engaging in some way like finding Black's identity, etc. But this Arc is unnecessarily dragged.

[HeroR]

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Is this snark or an actual figure. I am honestly curious.

According to animefillerlist.com Naruto has 43% filler and Shippuden has 44%. For comparison, both DB and DBZ have only 15%.

I can believe it. I remember on the podcast on this site they talked about how closed the anime was to the manga to the point that the anime version of Super Saiyan Goku happened only weeks after the manga showed it. The Garlic Jr Saga was the only time Toei could insert some meaningful filler. The same almost happened in One Piece where the anime was only a few months away from the manga during Enies Lobby, which is why One Piece now have the terrible pacing of 1:1 anime episode to manga chapter instead of 1.5 to 2:1.

[sintzu]

For comparison, both DB and DBZ have only 15%.

Kai cut out half the first part and third of the Buu arc.

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

This is a great site for doing that.

http://www.animefillerlist.com/

Also, from the spoilers, getting the feeling that Goku's new form is not gonna get a lot of screentime or action either (as in like, appearing at the very end of it all then disappearing, then credits, then NEP)... (hope I'm dead wrong).

Hopefully it's not like the false Ssj in M4 where it just lasts a minute.

tien role is just sad man,i must feel really sad for the fans of this character if there is one out there

I think he was a great character in the original so it's a shame to see him written this way.

[SirTorra]

So it just crossed my mind that maybe goku goes blind. So how does he go blind? Well the spirit bomb is gonna explode in his face and a blinding white light will blind him. Unable to see jiren, he'll have to rely on his beaten up body to move on his own. This could explain the whole "pay attention to his eyes" thing. It could also be the "terrible" thing that happens. It's also been kinda foreshadowed in gohan vs lavender. I don't know, what do you guys think? Sound possible?

[sintzu]

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Let's take a look at how much filler Super has :

1-27 : movie recaps. (27 episodes)
30 : recap of the recaps.
15, 42-46 & 68-76 : "slice of life" episodes or in other words another way of saying filler. (15 episodes)

These 43 episodes represent 39% of Super total episode count. That's of course not counting how much time is wasted in the actual canon episodes (the current arc is also all over the place with no sense of direction to add to what I just mentioned) so if you also take that into account then you'll end up with an even larger % than Naruto's 42. To make things worse, Super isn't even based off a manga so there's no reason for it to be handled this way.

At least Naruto's filler is separate from the canon episodes, Super not only has filler episodes but is also filling the canon ones with it.

[Totamo]

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Let's take a look at how much filler Super has :

1-27 : movie recaps. (27 episodes)
30 : recap of the recaps.
15, 42-46 & 68-76 : "slice of life" episodes or in other words another way of saying filler. (15 episodes)

These 43 episodes represent 39% of Super total episode count. That's of course not counting how much time is wasted in the actual canon episodes (the current arc is also all over the place with no sense of direction to add to what I just mentioned) so if you also take that into account then you'll end up with an even larger % than Naruto's 42. To make things worse, Super isn't even based off a manga so there's no reason for it to be handled this way.

At least Naruto's filler is separate from the canon episodes, Super not only has filler episodes but is also filling the canon ones with it.

You made 3 mistakes here.

1. Super's anime by definition doesn't have filler. Its not based on anything official which is what canon means. The word does not mean waste of time otherwise the great saiyanman arc would be filler. and the movie recaps arent even filler because they have an impact on the story and the anime does bring back things from those episodes you listed

2. Naruto at one point had nearly 100 episodes of filler straight and shippuden in year only put 8 full canon episodes and that was in 2015 a year after the manga ended. Dragon ball nor Z ever had that problem, or one piece.

3. Super may not have a manga but it did have bad pre production and we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes but rumors are its not pretty. The episodes that slow down help them work with the other stuff


Look, this is silly. bad pacing and bad directing does not mean filler, sometimes it means bad management . Look, super's main reason for existence is to sell merch, its an advertisement which means every episode matters because its selling something. Just you don't like it doesn't make it filler, it makes it funny for me.

[Shaqazooloo]

People shouldn't put too much stock on these previews. Most seem to be a bit misleading or even inaccurate which contributes to a fake hype and disappointment later when an episode actually airs

They never listen. I've warned people a couple of times but it goes mostly ignored.

[HeroR]

The naruto anime is 42% filler, have fun skipping all of that.

Let's take a look at how much filler Super has :

1-27 : movie recaps. (27 episodes)
30 : recap of the recaps.
15, 42-46 & 68-76 : "slice of life" episodes or in other words another way of saying filler. (15 episodes)

These 43 episodes represent 39% of Super total episode count. That's of course not counting how much time is wasted in the actual canon episodes (the current arc is also all over the place with no sense of direction to add to what I just mentioned) so if you also take that into account then you'll end up with an even larger % than Naruto's 42. To make things worse, Super isn't even based off a manga so there's no reason for it to be handled this way.

At least Naruto's filler is separate from the canon episodes, Super not only has filler episodes but is also filling the canon ones with it.

You made 3 mistakes here.

1. Super's anime by definition doesn't have filler. Its not based on anything official which is what canon means. The word does not mean waste of time otherwise the great saiyanman arc would be filler. and the movie recaps arent even filler because they have an impact on the story and the anime does bring back things from those episodes you listed

2. Naruto at one point had nearly 100 episodes of filler straight and shippuden in year only put 8 full canon episodes and that was in 2015 a year after the manga ended. Dragon ball nor Z ever had that problem, or one piece.

3. Super may not have a manga but it did have bad pre production and we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes but rumors are its not pretty. The episodes that slow down help them work with the other stuff


Look, this is silly. bad pacing and bad directing does not mean filler, sometimes it means bad management . Look, super's main reason for existence is to sell merch, its an advertisement which means every episode matters because its selling something. Just you don't like it doesn't make it filler, it makes it funny for me.

Not to mention stuff from those 'filler' episodes are shown again in the 'canon' episodes, like all of Hit's new techniques, Krillin training again, and Frost being on the run. And calling the retellings filler is just stupid.

Filler doesn't mean 'stuff I don't like'.

[sintzu]

Super's anime by definition doesn't have filler.

The movie recaps arent even filler because they have an impact on the story and the anime does bring back things from those episodes you listed

Naruto at one point had nearly 100 episodes of filler straight and shippuden in year only put 8 full canon episodes and that was in 2015 a year after the manga ended.

Dragon ball nor Z ever had that problem, or one piece.

super's main reason for existence is to sell merch, its an advertisement which means every episode matters because its selling something.

Whatever you want to call it, point is that there are a good amount of episodes not connected to the main arcs.

It doesn't matter, they took movies that were perfectly fine on their own and wasted time and $$$ that could've went into new content to turn them into episodes that didn't need to happen.

What they did with Shippuden during that year and 2016 with the filler is easily one of the worst moves made by any anime studio. However, no one can say they didn't make up for it when things went back to canon, especially naruto's final fight with Sasuke.

I agree with DB, Z on the other hand was full of filler within the canon episodes. Didi you forget about the 20 episodes of Goku vs Freeza ? In terms of One Piece, you've got fan left and right dropping it because of how slow it's gotten, sure it doesn't have full filler episodes but instead they're taking less than a chapter and mixing it with filler material to slow things down.

I'm judging Super based on what it shows, not what it makes or why it's made. As a story, as a Shonen & as a DB sequel, it falls flat on its face.

Filler doesn't mean 'stuff I don't like'.

It mean stuff that slows down the pace of the main story in any form of entertainment.

[HeroR]

Whatever you want to call it, point is that there are a good amount of episodes not connected to the main arcs.

It doesn't matter, they took movies that were perfectly fine on their own and wasted time and $$$ that could've went into new content to turn them into episodes that didn't need to happen.

What they did with Shippuden during that year and 2016 with the filler is easily one of the worst moves made by any anime studio. However, no one can say they didn't make up for it when things went back to canon, especially naruto's final fight with Sasuke.

I agree with DB, Z on the other hand was full of filler within the canon episodes. Didi you forget about the 20 episodes of Goku vs Freeza ? In terms of One Piece, you've got fan left and right dropping it because of how slow it's gotten, sure it doesn't have full filler episodes but instead they're taking less than a chapter and mixing it with filler material to slow things down.

I'm judging Super based on what it shows, not what it makes or why it's made. As a story, as a Shonen & as a DB sequel, it falls flat on its face.

Filler doesn't mean 'stuff I don't like'.

It mean stuff that slows down the pace of the main story in any form of entertainment.

That isn't what filler is. Filler is stuff used to fill time so adaption doesn't catch up to the main source. The retellings are not filler since the stuff that happened in them carries into the series. It doesn't matter if the movies came first, especially when the movies don't perfectly fit into Super since they retcon Beerus' power. And it has been pointed out, several things that has happened in the breather episodes have carried over to the 'canon' story.

The Goku vs. Freeza fight actually doesn't have much filler, at least not as much as fans seem to think. The podcast on this site went into details on this.

Also, "As a story, as a Shonen & as a DB sequel, it falls flat on its face". Yeah, that's call opinion.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

This is true. 3 or 4 Tomioka episodes in a row usually does mean the end of the arc. I didn't pick up on Toshio signaling it probably wasn't the end at the time.

I low key worry about why this arc is dragging. Are they just trying out a yearly arc format ala Precure? Is Toriyama getting bored again so they're stalling for time?
I'd think a more plot heavy arc would be more worthy of getting an entire year of episodes; not a tournament. Did they bite off more than they could chew?

At least I won't feel bad if I miss it live after daylight savings time swaps in early November.

Most of the dragging, Imo, happened in the recruitment episodes. The tournament for the most part isn't really dragged given the scale. Also, this arc is bringing in elements from all the previous, including Resurrection 'F' that people wrote off as 'filler'. Overall, this arc seems like a turning point for Super much like how the Namek/Freeza Saga was turning point back in its day.

You hit the nail on the proverbial head!! RF story most shrugged as an unimportant side story but WITHOUT that story Freeza's current revival would not have worked or been as good, that movie was development for Freeza more than anything it showed it how his thirst for revenge ultimately became his downfall and now after that we're getting this unpredictable version of Freeza back, plus the tease of Whis saying move without thinking. Brilliant. I absolutely love how everything is coming together.

Let's take a look at how much filler Super has :

1-27 : movie recaps. (27 episodes)
30 : recap of the recaps.
15, 42-46 & 68-76 : "slice of life" episodes or in other words another way of saying filler. (15 episodes)

These 43 episodes represent 39% of Super total episode count. That's of course not counting how much time is wasted in the actual canon episodes (the current arc is also all over the place with no sense of direction to add to what I just mentioned) so if you also take that into account then you'll end up with an even larger % than Naruto's 42. To make things worse, Super isn't even based off a manga so there's no reason for it to be handled this way.

At least Naruto's filler is separate from the canon episodes, Super not only has filler episodes but is also filling the canon ones with it.

You made 3 mistakes here.

1. Super's anime by definition doesn't have filler. Its not based on anything official which is what canon means. The word does not mean waste of time otherwise the great saiyanman arc would be filler. and the movie recaps arent even filler because they have an impact on the story and the anime does bring back things from those episodes you listed

2. Naruto at one point had nearly 100 episodes of filler straight and shippuden in year only put 8 full canon episodes and that was in 2015 a year after the manga ended. Dragon ball nor Z ever had that problem, or one piece.

3. Super may not have a manga but it did have bad pre production and we have no idea what goes on behind the scenes but rumors are its not pretty. The episodes that slow down help them work with the other stuff


Look, this is silly. bad pacing and bad directing does not mean filler, sometimes it means bad management . Look, super's main reason for existence is to sell merch, its an advertisement which means every episode matters because its selling something. Just you don't like it doesn't make it filler, it makes it funny for me.

Not to mention stuff from those 'filler' episodes are shown again in the 'canon' episodes, like all of Hit's new techniques, Krillin training again, and Frost being on the run. And calling the retellings filler is just stupid.

Filler doesn't mean 'stuff I don't like'.

Also Copy Vegeta arc was referenced as well more subtle teasing of moving without thinking (Goku dodging Bulma). Probably much more too. Crazy how just something that isn't fighting or part of a main arc is considered "filler" like how? This is more realistic not every time there is gonna be one arc after another we need time to breath with our protagonists, it fleshes them and the world out. What's next in the current ToP when Beerus and co are talking will that be considered "filler"?

[sintzu]

Filler is stuff used to fill time so adaption doesn't catch up to the main source.

The retellings are not filler since the stuff that happened in them carries into the series.

The movies don't perfectly fit into Super.

Several things that has happened in the breather episodes have carried over to the 'canon' story.

The Goku vs. Freeza fight actually doesn't have much filler.

Also, "As a story, as a Shonen & as a DB sequel, it falls flat on its face". Yeah, that's calld opinion.

Super isn't an adaption though. you can call them what you want, the point is that they are there to buy time where it's not needed.

Which wouldn't have happened had the retellings not happened.

That's because Super wasn't written around the movies.

So ? like with the movie retellings, that wouldn't have happened had those episodes not happened.

Then how did Kai cut it in half ?

I'm taking a story&Novel class and Super goes against everything in that book so it's not really an opinion. You don't even have to take a class to see what's it doing wrong, all you have to do is compare it to any other anime to see it. Super works simply because of the names attached to it, any other show would've dropped dead long before its 100th episode had it been handled this way.

What's next in the current ToP when Beerus and co are talking will that be considered "filler"?

How much progress have we made in these last 15 episodes or so ?

[Kinokima]

I'm taking a story&Novel class and Super goes against everything in that book so it's not really an opinion.

When you get a bit older you will realize a class doesn't make you an expert on what is good writing.

You don't even have to take a class to see what's it doing wrong, all you have to do is compare it to any other anime to see it.

I've watched 100's of anime from all different genres and I don't see It. Not saying Super is perfect but plenty of other anime have flaws.

I for one find Super a whole lot less draggy then a lot of other long shounen action series including Naruto. That's just my opinion though. There is no fact here.

How much progress have we made in these last 15 episodes or so ?

We are down to less than 1/2 the characters of the tournament.

Also people are criticizing the next few episodes but we don't actually know what is going to happen in them or how they will move the story forward or not. It's all speculation.

[sintzu]

When you get a bit older you will realize a class doesn't make you an expert on what is good writing.

We are down to less than 1/2 the characters of the tournament.

No, it takes years of hard work beyond a classroom but you can at least learn the basics, something Super's staff must've slept through.

Half of nobodies with lots more to get through. They could've done so much more with a smaller cast instead of trying to do something this big.

[Kinokima]

When you get a bit older you will realize a class doesn't make you an expert on what is good writing.

We are down to less than 1/2 the characters of the tournament.

No, it takes years of hard work beyond a classroom but you can at least learn the basics, something Super's staff must've slept through.

Half of nobodies with lots more to get through. They could've done so much more with a smaller cast instead of trying to do something this big.

This is all your opinion. Nothing you have said is fact. And good luck on your classes I am
glad you are taking them to learn more but it doesn't mean your opinion is more valid about Super than someone else's

You seem like a nice guy and I know you like the Dragon Ball series and its great that you gave Super a chance but if you really aren't enjoying it why continue to watch it if you think it's so bad after so many episodes? I guess I just don't understand that.

I don't think it's a Masterpiece but I still love it despite its flaws and I see plenty of things that do make it great in my opinion. You don't have to agree but this constant Super is bad because it is or because I took a class is still in the end just your opinion.And I am sorry you don't enjoy it but I don't think I will change your mind just like you won't change anyone's mind who is enjoying it.

[sintzu]

its great that you gave Super a chance but if you really aren't enjoying it why continue to watch it if you think it's so bad after so many episodes? I guess I just don't understand that.

I watch it cause there are things I like about it but I'm not a fanboy so I'm not going to turn a blind eye to what it does wrong, especially knowing that it can do better.

Z was my very first anime and my favorite one so I have very high expectations for this franchise. I don't complain because I hate super, it's because how much I love db and how much I want to see it be the best it can.

[GodVegetto91]

Guys! I am now certain that the Technique and Transformation are in fact the same thing!

So in a leak last time, they stated:
"Goku has been injured head-to-toe by Jiren, however, immediately before going down, he starts to awaken to a power called "Mastery of Self-Movement"" (Technique)

Now a SIMILAIR leak came out a few weeks ago saying:
"Goku has all of his attacks deflected and is knocked down by Jiren, however, a mysterious KI never before seen suddenly erupts from his body!" (Transformation)

So in one of the leaks, they stated that Goku would start to master this "Technique", (right after Jiren knocks down SSJ Blue Kaioken X20 Goku). While in the other leak they state that a "mysterious KI" (Transformation side of things) suddenly erupts from his body. At that exact same point in the episode! I.e. After Jiren knocks down SSJ Blue Kaioken X20 Goku!

Therefore, the Technique and Transformation are synonymous! Confirmed!