"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by FutureGohanSSJ2 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:06 am

sintzu wrote:http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/daily-b ... con/.92575

Hopefully they'll announce the English dub of Super alongside Kai's Buu saga.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by TheRed259 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:41 am

I wonder if Toei is going to give them the 5th episode just like it was broadcasted on TV.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:32 am

TheRed259 wrote:I wonder if Toei is going to give them the 5th episode just like it was broadcasted on TV.
Maybe they can try and coincide the dub with the Japanese DVD/Blu-Ray release and get the (presumably) touched-up in quality DVD versions of the episodes (a la Sailor Moon Crystal).
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Araki » Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:49 am

The last episode, where unlike in the movie we see Vegeta complaining about Goku getting the SSG honor from the get go, and Goku assuring him he'll be the next, made me wonder if we'll see Gohan, Goten or Trunks on the receiving end of the ritual before Super is over.

I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation? The plot finding reasons to separate them all is a way out, of course...and they won't always have an enemy peacefully awaiting for it like Beerus. But still..it's possible.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 8:23 am

Araki wrote:The last episode, where unlike in the movie we see Vegeta complaining about Goku getting the SSG honor from the get go, and Goku assuring him he'll be the next, made me wonder if we'll see Gohan, Goten or Trunks on the receiving end of the ritual before Super is over.

I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation? The plot finding reasons to separate them all is a way out, of course...and they won't always have an enemy peacefully awaiting for it like Beerus. But still..it's possible.
I mean, they could just spend like a day giving it to every saiyan, but you could say the same about Old Kai's ritual and these kinds of stories have a history of not breaking the narrative by spamming exploitable power-ups.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:51 am

Captain Space wrote:
Araki wrote:The last episode, where unlike in the movie we see Vegeta complaining about Goku getting the SSG honor from the get go, and Goku assuring him he'll be the next, made me wonder if we'll see Gohan, Goten or Trunks on the receiving end of the ritual before Super is over.

I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation? The plot finding reasons to separate them all is a way out, of course...and they won't always have an enemy peacefully awaiting for it like Beerus. But still..it's possible.
I mean, they could just spend like a day giving it to every saiyan, but you could say the same about Old Kai's ritual and these kinds of stories have a history of not breaking the narrative by spamming exploitable power-ups.
The Elder Kaioshin ritual takes over a day and it doesn't work for everyone. If you don't have loads of hidden potential, you hardly get much. Happy fun time circle works for everyone and guarantee's massive gains in a short amount of time. Though since Tarble wasn't mentioned, now I ain't so sure the whole gods can't take part in the ritual theory works no more.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:08 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:
The Elder Kaioshin ritual takes over a day and it doesn't work for everyone. If you don't have loads of hidden potential, you hardly get much. Happy fun time circle works for everyone and guarantee's massive gains in a short amount of time. Though since Tarble wasn't mentioned, now I ain't so sure the whole gods can't take part in the ritual theory works no more.
Old Kai agreed to do it before he knew how much potential Gohan had. He never said anything that implies he can't do it to anyone, and additionally it takes you beyond your potential/limits so it'd power you up a decent amount even if you had virtually no potential. It worked extra well for Gohan, but it'd still give everyone else at least a good bit of a boost--and hell, it'd be great for Goku, he wouldn't need the energy-intensive SSJ3 anymore and he'd be over one of his (at the time) biggest weaknesses!

I had entertained the notion that gods can't do the ritual thus preventing too much spam, but given that they still basically were resigned to no way of contacting Tarble by the end of BoG and Goku still said "Yeah okay Vegeta, you get to be SSJG next time", I'd guess that no such thing ever crossed the writers minds.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:20 pm

Captain Space wrote:
dbzfan7 wrote:
The Elder Kaioshin ritual takes over a day and it doesn't work for everyone. If you don't have loads of hidden potential, you hardly get much. Happy fun time circle works for everyone and guarantee's massive gains in a short amount of time. Though since Tarble wasn't mentioned, now I ain't so sure the whole gods can't take part in the ritual theory works no more.
Old Kai agreed to do it before he knew how much potential Gohan had. He never said anything that implies he can't do it to anyone, and additionally it takes you beyond your potential/limits so it'd power you up a decent amount even if you had virtually no potential. It worked extra well for Gohan, but it'd still give everyone else at least a good bit of a boost--and hell, it'd be great for Goku, he wouldn't need the energy-intensive SSJ3 anymore and he'd be over one of his (at the time) biggest weaknesses!

I had entertained the notion that gods can't do the ritual thus preventing too much spam, but given that they still basically were resigned to no way of contacting Tarble by the end of BoG and Goku still said "Yeah okay Vegeta, you get to be SSJG next time", I'd guess that no such thing ever crossed the writers minds.
Elder Kaioshin: “Wh-what are you talking about…?! Above their limits! Above! There de~~efinitely isn’t anyone else that incredible! [ ] Hey, you over there, you were the one who pulled the sword out, right? Come over here a little. If someone could pull that sword out and swing it around, then once I get through with them they’ll de~~efinitely be able to become the best in the universe.”
http://web.archive.org/web/201111031821 ... mant_power

He immediately believed that if Gohan could pull out the sword, he has to have some big potential since none of the Kaioshin could do it. Also if you don't have dormant power, no change will occur. Also depending on how much you have it takes a minimum of 25 hours and longer if you have more. You have to sit still for that long. He could do it to others, but there's no guarantee it'd work.

Happy fun time circle takes no time at all and can be spread around without any limit. Tarble isn't mentioned so until he is, the theory could be considered moot now.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by ekrolo2 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 12:36 pm

Araki wrote:The last episode, where unlike in the movie we see Vegeta complaining about Goku getting the SSG honor from the get go, and Goku assuring him he'll be the next, made me wonder if we'll see Gohan, Goten or Trunks on the receiving end of the ritual before Super is over.

I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation? The plot finding reasons to separate them all is a way out, of course...and they won't always have an enemy peacefully awaiting for it like Beerus. But still..it's possible.
The runts don't deserve any transformation, not Super Saiyan, not fusion, and certainly not God. Gohan totally should though, the guy deserves a break after all these years of getting punked.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:02 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:
Elder Kaioshin: “Wh-what are you talking about…?! Above their limits! Above! There de~~efinitely isn’t anyone else that incredible! [ ] Hey, you over there, you were the one who pulled the sword out, right? Come over here a little. If someone could pull that sword out and swing it around, then once I get through with them they’ll de~~efinitely be able to become the best in the universe.”
http://web.archive.org/web/201111031821 ... mant_power

He immediately believed that if Gohan could pull out the sword, he has to have some big potential since none of the Kaioshin could do it. Also if you don't have dormant power, no change will occur. Also depending on how much you have it takes a minimum of 25 hours and longer if you have more. You have to sit still for that long. He could do it to others, but there's no guarantee it'd work.

Happy fun time circle takes no time at all and can be spread around without any limit. Tarble isn't mentioned so until he is, the theory could be considered moot now.
I agree that whatever the case, God ritual is much quicker and easier (and much more powerful), especially when you consider all the persuading it took to get Old Kai to save the friggin' universe.

However, "above their limits" should imply that no matter where your potential caps out at, he can take you further, right? That's sort of the whole difference between his power unlock and every other one prior to it (which is the joke in that scene). See, the thing that link describes is what Guru does; bring out dormant potential. But in the quote you gave, Old Kai specifically notes how his is different to anybody else's power unlock--it goes beyond what you'd be able to do just by 'unlocking someone's potential to its hidden limits' like Guru does.

The fact that Gohan pulled the sword out just means he has a lot of power now. Doesn't indicate anything about his potential (someone just as strong as SSJ Gohan with no remaining potential should be able to pull out the sword with exactly the same amount of effort). All Old Kai means by that last sentence is "if you're already strong enough to pull out the sword, think how much stronger you'll be after I power you up!" Like I said, it did turn out that Gohan had extra potential beyond their expectations so it worked better on him than it would on just about anybody else, but Old Kai had no way of knowing that before he started, just based on the sword.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:12 pm

Captain Space wrote:
dbzfan7 wrote:
Elder Kaioshin: “Wh-what are you talking about…?! Above their limits! Above! There de~~efinitely isn’t anyone else that incredible! [ ] Hey, you over there, you were the one who pulled the sword out, right? Come over here a little. If someone could pull that sword out and swing it around, then once I get through with them they’ll de~~efinitely be able to become the best in the universe.”
http://web.archive.org/web/201111031821 ... mant_power

He immediately believed that if Gohan could pull out the sword, he has to have some big potential since none of the Kaioshin could do it. Also if you don't have dormant power, no change will occur. Also depending on how much you have it takes a minimum of 25 hours and longer if you have more. You have to sit still for that long. He could do it to others, but there's no guarantee it'd work.

Happy fun time circle takes no time at all and can be spread around without any limit. Tarble isn't mentioned so until he is, the theory could be considered moot now.
I agree that whatever the case, God ritual is much quicker and easier (and much more powerful), especially when you consider all the persuading it took to get Old Kai to save the friggin' universe.

However, "above their limits" should imply that no matter where your potential caps out at, he can take you further, right? That's sort of the whole difference between his power unlock and every other one prior to it (which is the joke in that scene). See, the thing that link describes is what Guru does; bring out dormant potential. But in the quote you gave, Old Kai specifically notes how his is different to anybody else's power unlock--it goes beyond what you'd be able to do just by 'unlocking someone's potential to its hidden limits' like Guru does.

The fact that Gohan pulled the sword out just means he has a lot of power now. Doesn't indicate anything about his potential (someone just as strong as SSJ Gohan with no remaining potential should be able to pull out the sword with exactly the same amount of effort). All Old Kai means by that last sentence is "if you're already strong enough to pull out the sword, think how much stronger you'll be after I power you up!" Like I said, it did turn out that Gohan had extra potential beyond their expectations so it worked better on him than it would on just about anybody else, but Old Kai had no way of knowing that before he started, just based on the sword.
The guidebook entry also states you can end up wasting your time too. You can end up getting no boost at all. The quote at least to me indicates that anyone who can pull out the sword must have tons of potential as none of his fellow Kaioshin can do it. The whole point was about potential as no matter how strong you start off as, you can end up with no increase if you don't have hidden potential, as sourced from the guidebook. The reason why he thinks he has to have potential is because he pulled out the sword. That's not something everyone could do. That was rare. If he saw someone lift 1000 tons he wouldn't immediately think they'd have potential just cause of raw strength.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by FortuneSSJ » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:18 pm

I'm really hoping Toei doesn't screw up the climax of this arc. God Goku vs Beerus must look good.
If anything has to look beautiful, its the climax. Their battle.

Lets hope that one the main reasons why episode 9 dragged so much, was for them to have resources for the big fight.
Araki wrote:The last episode, where unlike in the movie we see Vegeta complaining about Goku getting the SSG honor from the get go, and Goku assuring him he'll be the next, made me wonder if we'll see Gohan, Goten or Trunks on the receiving end of the ritual before Super is over.

I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation? The plot finding reasons to separate them all is a way out, of course...and they won't always have an enemy peacefully awaiting for it like Beerus. But still..it's possible.
Overkill and lame. I hate this idea. Any saiyan can join the ritual, but only full blooded saiyans should be able to become God.
I already don't like the idea of having 2 Gods for the saiyan race at the same time, Goku and Vegeta. Any race should have just one God to represent them.
At least, make this god form special and don't give it to everyone.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:26 pm

dbzfan7 wrote: The guidebook entry also states you can end up wasting your time too. You can end up getting no boost at all. The quote at least to me indicates that anyone who can pull out the sword must have tons of potential as none of his fellow Kaioshin can do it. The whole point was about potential as no matter how strong you start off as, you can end up with no increase if you don't have hidden potential, as sourced from the guidebook. The reason why he thinks he has to have potential is because he pulled out the sword. That's not something everyone could do. That was rare. If he saw someone lift 1000 tons he wouldn't immediately think they'd have potential just cause of raw strength.
I mean, I'd also point out the guidebook not being 100% manga-canon, but it's not like the manga ever contradicts it on that point, it just doesn't say anything either way.

I would like to point out that pulling out the sword is almost certainly an indicator of strength and nothing else, since that's all it took to pull it out, strength. Otherwise going SSJ wouldn't have helped, and especially wouldn't have been the deciding factor.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:33 pm

Captain Space wrote:
dbzfan7 wrote: The guidebook entry also states you can end up wasting your time too. You can end up getting no boost at all. The quote at least to me indicates that anyone who can pull out the sword must have tons of potential as none of his fellow Kaioshin can do it. The whole point was about potential as no matter how strong you start off as, you can end up with no increase if you don't have hidden potential, as sourced from the guidebook. The reason why he thinks he has to have potential is because he pulled out the sword. That's not something everyone could do. That was rare. If he saw someone lift 1000 tons he wouldn't immediately think they'd have potential just cause of raw strength.
I mean, I'd also point out the guidebook not being 100% manga-canon, but it's not like the manga ever contradicts it on that point, it just doesn't say anything either way.

I would like to point out that pulling out the sword is almost certainly an indicator of strength and nothing else, since that's all it took to pull it out, strength. Otherwise going SSJ wouldn't have helped, and especially wouldn't have been the deciding factor.
Fair enough.

If so then why are they so doubtful about him if none of the Kaioshin, especially South Kaioshin couldn't pull out the sword. A whole deal is made especially by Kibito about how if none of the Kaioshin could do it than Gohan can't. If there all so clearly weaker than Gohan, then why is he keep going on about how Gohan can't do it? He saw SSJ2 which massively dwarfs his master, and yet is so sure Gohan can't do what the Kaioshin of old couldn't. I don't really count games since they don't take part in the series, but they had in SB2 that only F. Gohan could pull out the Z Sword of the future timeline.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by sintzu » Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:01 pm

Araki wrote: I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation?
Because they won't be able to absorb the form's power like Goku&Vegeta and they aren't as strong so if Goku&Vegeta can't handle whoever they're fighting why would they think their weaker sons would be able to ?
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:05 pm

sintzu wrote:
Araki wrote: I mean, it does sound overkill, and Gohan wouldn't care, but...since we're going beyond RoF, why shouldn't they try it in a desperate situation?
Because they won't be able to absorb the form's power like Goku&Vegeta.
Considering the next generation always, and I mean always has learned everything faster than those two whether it be Super Saiyan, Kamehameha, Fusion, Super Saiyan 3, then it stands to reason they can not only accomplish SSGSS, but at an even faster rate. It can be argued SSGSS is a whole different thing, but past evidence suggests it's plausible to be accomplished by any of the next gen. At least til we get some confirmation, nothing says they can't do it like those two could.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Doctor. » Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:07 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:Considering the next generation always, and I mean always has learned everything faster than those two whether it be Super Saiyan, Kamehameha, Fusion, Super Saiyan 3, then it stands to reason they can not only accomplish SSGSS, but at an even faster rate. It can be argued SSGSS is a whole different thing, but past evidence suggests it's plausible to be accomplished by any of the next gen. At least til we get some confirmation, nothing says they can't do it like those two could.
Not to mention that if they just failed to absorb it, they can, y'know, try again.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 3:10 pm

Doctor. wrote:
dbzfan7 wrote:Considering the next generation always, and I mean always has learned everything faster than those two whether it be Super Saiyan, Kamehameha, Fusion, Super Saiyan 3, then it stands to reason they can not only accomplish SSGSS, but at an even faster rate. It can be argued SSGSS is a whole different thing, but past evidence suggests it's plausible to be accomplished by any of the next gen. At least til we get some confirmation, nothing says they can't do it like those two could.
Not to mention that if they just failed to absorb it, they can, y'know, try again.
Agreed. Unlike the Elder Kaioshin ritual which takes 25 hours or longer (and may not work for everyone), this takes like a minute, and then 5 minutes to mess around with said power. Mess up, then just do it again til you absorb the power. There's no said cool down or restrictions to be mentioned yet, such as if you botch your first attempt you don't get another. Nor the theory of gods can't take part in the ritual, which with Tarble not being mentioned, he plausibly may not exist now.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by TheRed259 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:06 pm

trunkschan90 wrote:Dragon Ball Super will be dubbed for Latin America.
http://www.anmtvla.com/2015/09/dragon-b ... -para.html
I don't understand too much Spanish but as it seems the VA of Krillin said in his Twitter account that this was for the Buu arc of Kai and not for Super.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Captain Space » Sun Sep 06, 2015 6:09 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:
If so then why are they so doubtful about him if none of the Kaioshin, especially South Kaioshin couldn't pull out the sword. A whole deal is made especially by Kibito about how if none of the Kaioshin could do it than Gohan can't. If there all so clearly weaker than Gohan, then why is he keep going on about how Gohan can't do it? He saw SSJ2 which massively dwarfs his master, and yet is so sure Gohan can't do what the Kaioshin of old couldn't. I don't really count games since they don't take part in the series, but they had in SB2 that only F. Gohan could pull out the Z Sword of the future timeline.
Kaioshin during the scene tells Kibito that because he wasn't there on Babidi's ship (being dead and all) he didn't see the power of the saiyans, so Kibito is assuming Gohan, a mortal, can't be nearly as powerful as the gods' gods' gods' gods. Evidently Kibito somehow failed to realise how powerful they were when Gohan went SSJ2 at the Budokai (and so did Kaioshin since he continued to underestimate them until he saw them in action on the ship and in the battles immediately afterwards, when Kibito wasn't present). I don't know why this is, but that's the clear implication I got. I dunno, Kaioshin and Kibito are pretty bad at...well everything.

Like, I agree that potential would make more sense, but that's never mentioned or implied. Kibito is all like, he can't possibly be strong enough! Kaioshin says, (Viz translation so accuracy may not be 100% but serviceable enough), "While you were dead you could not see...how incredibly powerful Gohan is." Gohan can't do it in base, then turns SSJ, which increases his power, and that enables him to pull out the sword. Everything in the scene is pointing towards the only requirement being that you're hella strong.

The fact that they should've already seen and acknowledged the power of his SSJ2 is...a really weird plothole I guess.
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