"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Duo » Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:55 am

Noah wrote:
JazzHands wrote:I believe Toyotaro has been working on this manga since those first or before those manga scans of the arc. I believe it will be done much better than the Anime.
You wish.
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I don't see the recruitment material taking a great deal of time. The tournament will probably start after two more chapters. The manga has never even established Gohan as being "non-Ultimate", so that bit of continuity might be interesting to see unfold.

Also, I would like to re-iterate how great the fight between Beerus and Vegeta was. That was a great way to remind the reader of his superiority as a God of Destruction, as well as make a gauge for prior fights in the last couple of arcs. As an example, there is no question that Beerus would not be challenged by Hit.

It also shows that Goku and Vegeta have come a long way, considering Beerus has never taken a blow like that in the Manga.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Basako » Sun Sep 10, 2017 2:52 pm

Duo wrote: I don't see the recruitment material taking a great deal of time. The tournament will probably start after two more chapters. The manga has never even established Gohan as being "non-Ultimate", so that bit of continuity might be interesting to see unfold.

Also, I would like to re-iterate how great the fight between Beerus and Vegeta was. That was a great way to remind the reader of his superiority as a God of Destruction, as well as make a gauge for prior fights in the last couple of arcs. As an example, there is no question that Beerus would not be challenged by Hit.

It also shows that Goku and Vegeta have come a long way, considering Beerus has never taken a blow like that in the Manga.
If we get the exhibitions, I think we will, we may have Gohan a bit out of shape too, but that's all, not as far as the anime.

I agree about Beerus and Vegeta, even if it wasn't the most impressive fight, it couldn't be, it was just training, it was perfect to reestablish the power levels, to know about Vegeta mastering the SSB and the words of the oracle fish were gold.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by BWri » Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:40 pm

Jigurashi wrote:
Miracles wrote:
Noah wrote:
You wish.
It's very possible. Besides Dyspo vs Hit, anime's Tournament of power has been underwhelming so far.
Can't say I agree with that at all.

As for the other issue, Vegeta isn't meant to be on Goku's level in the anime. Unless the outline specifically says what level of power they're at, Toyo and Toei seem like they get free enough control to make some characters as strong as they want them to be at times. In the manga's case, Toyo has Goku and Vegeta on par. In the anime, Vegeta is one-shot material to Goku in the power department.
Toyo also had Piccolo in a similar ballpark to Frost in the U6 tournament, though he was burning through more stamina to keep up. I feel Toyo respects the strength of the other characters besides Goku. Only thing Toei did over Toyo is powering up Trunks to usefulness, but they did it in the worst possible way.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by BlueBasilisk » Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:52 pm

BWri wrote:Toyo also had Piccolo in a similar ballpark to Frost in the U6 tournament, though he was burning through more stamina to keep up. I feel Toyo respects the strength of the other characters besides Goku. Only thing Toei did over Toyo is powering up Trunks to usefulness, but they did it in the worst possible way.
Goku says that Piccolo has absolutely no hope of defeating Frost and Piccolo agrees that he can't win. He was playing on the defensive to burn up Frost's stamina but they noted that Piccolo was wearing down faster than Frost was.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by BWri » Sun Sep 10, 2017 6:38 pm

BlueBasilisk wrote:
BWri wrote:Toyo also had Piccolo in a similar ballpark to Frost in the U6 tournament, though he was burning through more stamina to keep up. I feel Toyo respects the strength of the other characters besides Goku. Only thing Toei did over Toyo is powering up Trunks to usefulness, but they did it in the worst possible way.
Goku says that Piccolo has absolutely no hope of defeating Frost and Piccolo agrees that he can't win. He was playing on the defensive to burn up Frost's stamina but they noted that Piccolo was wearing down faster than Frost was.
Piccolo's always downplayed lol. Goku says that before they started fighting. Piccolo jokes with Frost asking him if he intends to fight in Final Form then complains that everyone is underestimating him. He then declares that he's the reincarnation of Daimaou and admits that he can't beat Frost but declares that Frost won't beat him either. The fight appears to be tit for tat, Piccolo dodging everything Frost throws at him even before taking off his weights. Once the fighting intensifies Goku looks surprised and praises Piccolo. Champa and Vados also take note of Piccolo at this point, but mostly for his Namekian heritage. Vegeta notes that Piccolo is fighting defensively, Goku notes that Frost is losing energy but says that Piccolo is in worse condition (stamina wise). Tired of dragging the fight out, Frost resorts to poison though Piccolo looked confident in his abilities the whole time and even catches Frost's punch with little effort. Piccolo is knocked out after being poisoned, just like Goku. I'm not saying Piccolo is greater than Frost, but they are in the same realm of power in the manga. That much can be deduced from the visuals, from Frost's frustration during the fight, and from Piccolo's own dialogue.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Zeru14 » Sun Sep 10, 2017 11:45 pm

BWri wrote:
BlueBasilisk wrote:
BWri wrote:Toyo also had Piccolo in a similar ballpark to Frost in the U6 tournament, though he was burning through more stamina to keep up. I feel Toyo respects the strength of the other characters besides Goku. Only thing Toei did over Toyo is powering up Trunks to usefulness, but they did it in the worst possible way.
Goku says that Piccolo has absolutely no hope of defeating Frost and Piccolo agrees that he can't win. He was playing on the defensive to burn up Frost's stamina but they noted that Piccolo was wearing down faster than Frost was.
Piccolo's always downplayed lol. Goku says that before they started fighting. Piccolo jokes with Frost asking him if he intends to fight in Final Form then complains that everyone is underestimating him. He then declares that he's the reincarnation of Daimaou and admits that he can't beat Frost but declares that Frost won't beat him either. The fight appears to be tit for tat, Piccolo dodging everything Frost throws at him even before taking off his weights. Once the fighting intensifies Goku looks surprised and praises Piccolo. Champa and Vados also take note of Piccolo at this point, but mostly for his Namekian heritage. Vegeta notes that Piccolo is fighting defensively, Goku notes that Frost is losing energy but says that Piccolo is in worse condition (stamina wise). Tired of dragging the fight out, Frost resorts to poison though Piccolo looked confident in his abilities the whole time and even catches Frost's punch with little effort. Piccolo is knocked out after being poisoned, just like Goku. I'm not saying Piccolo is greater than Frost, but they are in the same realm of power in the manga. That much can be deduced from the visuals, from Frost's frustration during the fight, and from Piccolo's own dialogue.
How Toyo handled this battle, gives me hope that Piccolo, Krillin, Tien, Roshi and the Android Twins will have a decent showing in the TOP.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:33 am

Jigurashi wrote:Can't say I agree with that at all..
We must be watching different TOP's. So far, there is no tension and sense of endangerment within the battles.
The fights are even lackluster with shabby choreography and background music.
It's possible that the manga could do better than the anime in it's presentation.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:42 am

Miracles wrote:
Jigurashi wrote:Can't say I agree with that at all..
We must be watching different TOP's. So far, there is no tension and sense of endangerment within the battles.
The fights are even lackluster with shabby choreography and background music.
It's possible that the manga could do better than the anime in it's presentation.
I doubt the manga is going to 'fix' "no tension and sense of endangerment within the battles", since it certainly didn't for the Future Trunks Saga where things were played down compared to the anime. Also, the 'tension' argument is always eye-rolling to me since who buys the tension in Dragon Ball? No one dies in this series and not brought back outside of a few side-characters. So I am not sure why fans still pretend the main cast is ever in real danger.

As for "fights are even lackluster with shabby choreography and background music", can't agree at all with that. While some fights do leave a lot to be desire, a lot of the choreography is fine to great. The music is also good.

But I'm also one who thinks the manga's fights are extremely lackluster outside of a few, while people here thinks Toyo's fight choreography is great or up to par with Toriyama's. So unless Toyo completely up his game even from this recent fight with Vegeta and Beerus, his fight scenes are probably going to be just as boring as ever to me.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:51 am

HeroR wrote:
Miracles wrote:
Jigurashi wrote:Can't say I agree with that at all..
We must be watching different TOP's. So far, there is no tension and sense of endangerment within the battles.
The fights are even lackluster with shabby choreography and background music.
It's possible that the manga could do better than the anime in it's presentation.
I doubt the manga is going to 'fix' "no tension and sense of endangerment within the battles", since it certainly didn't for the Future Trunks Saga where things were played down compared to the anime.

As for "fights are even lackluster with shabby choreography and background music", can't agree at all with that. While some fights do leave a lot to be desire, a lot of the choreography is fine to great. The music is also good.

But I'm also one who thinks the manga's fights are extremely lackluster outside of a few, while people here thinks Toyo's fight choreography is great or up to par with Toriyama's. So unless Toyo completely up his game even from this recent fight with Vegeta and Beerus, his fight scenes are probably going to be just as boring as ever to me.
Beerus vs Vegeta wasn't suppose to be a fight but a beat down. Black vs Vegeta was actually better in the manga than the anime. Cleverly used interchange with red/blue.
Goku vs fused Zamasu had better thrill with it's choreography and sense to it unlike the anime where Goku just overpowers fused Zamasu.
The TOP can be improved with ferocious dialogue and better choreography with bone crushing hits and facial expressions.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:21 am

Miracles wrote: Beerus vs Vegeta wasn't suppose to be a fight but a beat down. Black vs Vegeta was actually better in the manga than the anime. Cleverly used interchange with red/blue.
Goku vs fused Zamasu had better thrill with it's choreography and sense to it unlike the anime where Goku just overpowers fused Zamasu.
The TOP can be improved with ferocious dialogue and better choreography with bone crushing hits and facial expressions.
Even a beatdown can be good and fun to watch, like a lot of stomps in Dragon Ball. Beerus vs. Vegeta was just boring and sloppy. And "Black vs Vegeta was actually better in the manga than the anime", can't agree with that at all and I never found the going from red/blue clever, especially in that fight where Vegeta had no real reason to conserve stamina. I actually prefer Goku briefly overpowering Merge Zamasu over fighting him as an equal using the asspull that is mastered Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan. Once Merged Zamasu got serious, he should have cracked Goku like an egg, but Merged Zamasu in the manga was lackluster.

The dialog in the manga has never been fierce outside of Vegeta shit talking and again, the choreography in the manga has never been that good to me. In fact, I think it's one of the most overrated things about the Super manga since people keep praising and telling me how good the choreography is and I am never impressed.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kataphrut » Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:32 am

I'm not a fan of the manga, but I reckon it will do a somewhat better job with the Tournament of Power in some instances. For example, the 48 minute timeline has been a complete joke since before it started in the show since we have to suspend our disbelief that this 48 minute battle is taking place over at least a dozen 22-minute episodes. The manga won't have that problem since the pace it goes all depends on how fast you can read it, and it's easier to buy things like Talking is a Free Action and multiple things happening at once.

As for whether it will be more tense, I don't know. The story changes it made to U6 and Future Trunks arc only served to make Goku and Vegeta more overpowered, but it's hard to see how it could top the anime version of the ToP in that department.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by The gr » Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:35 am

With the anime version of Top having the most blandest & uninspired fighting scene I've seen in this show aside from a couple of battles,I highly doubt the manga will make anything better,is gonna be as boring & forgettable, I certainly hope that is not the case

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Duo » Mon Sep 11, 2017 8:55 am

Basako wrote: If we get the exhibitions, I think we will, we may have Gohan a bit out of shape too, but that's all, not as far as the anime.

I agree about Beerus and Vegeta, even if it wasn't the most impressive fight, it couldn't be, it was just training, it was perfect to reestablish the power levels, to know about Vegeta mastering the SSB and the words of the oracle fish were gold.
I have doubts about the exhibition matches taking place. I'm mostly curious about how the Buu / Freeza situation will be handled, because almost every else can be glossed over in a montage. I prefer the manga do as much of its own thing as possible, just to keep itself somewhat fresh.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Sep 11, 2017 9:55 am

HeroR wrote:No one dies in this series and not brought back outside of a few side-characters. So I am not sure why fans still pretend the main cast is ever in real danger.
Future Trunks' actual mother was killed (in front of his eyes in the anime, and off-camera in the manga), and her entire world/timeline is gone as far as we know right now. Sure, the future version of Bulma isn't a "main character", but her impact on one of the main characters (Trunks) was significant, and I definitely felt for him. Alternate timeline versions of Bulma are a consolation prize, but never a true replacement for what's in his heart.

Also, can we please steer away from the "I dunno man we must be watching different shows lulululz!" retorts? That's not conversation; that's being a jerk, and that's not welcome here.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:45 am

VegettoEX wrote:
HeroR wrote:No one dies in this series and not brought back outside of a few side-characters. So I am not sure why fans still pretend the main cast is ever in real danger.
Future Trunks' actual mother was killed (in front of his eyes in the anime, and off-camera in the manga), and her entire world/timeline is gone as far as we know right now. Sure, the future version of Bulma isn't a "main character", but her impact on one of the main characters (Trunks) was significant, and I definitely felt for him. Alternate timeline versions of Bulma are a consolation prize, but never a true replacement for what's in his heart.

Also, can we please steer away from the "I dunno man we must be watching different shows lulululz!" retorts? That's not conversation; that's being a jerk, and that's not welcome here.
"I dunno man we must be watching different shows lulululz!"

How was that my retort? All I said was that Dragon Ball never had any real tension and the example you named is extremely recent. Again, when you watch Dragon Ball, do you feel any real tension that the main characters are in danger of dying or losing (this is a real question, not me being smart)? The Future Trunks Saga is the exception in Dragon Ball's long history and even then the main characters came out alive. Dragon Ball never been Attack on Titan if you know what I mean.

So when people say 'Super has not stake or tension', I wonder how they watched Dragon Ball Z since it didn't either. Especially when people called Resurrection 'F' on 'fake tension' because everyone knew Piccolo wasn't going to stay dead, even though that also held true in Z with the Saiyan and Buu Saga when it killed Piccolo. Super just doesn't really pretend to have tension and go for a humor tone most of the time. When it did have tension, it was actually warrant, Future Trunks Saga.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:49 am

Sorry if it wasn't clear, but that part wasn't geared toward you. I'm responding both as a user and a moderator to various points and posts.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:30 pm

HeroR wrote:
Miracles wrote: Beerus vs Vegeta wasn't suppose to be a fight but a beat down. Black vs Vegeta was actually better in the manga than the anime. Cleverly used interchange with red/blue.
Goku vs fused Zamasu had better thrill with it's choreography and sense to it unlike the anime where Goku just overpowers fused Zamasu.
The TOP can be improved with ferocious dialogue and better choreography with bone crushing hits and facial expressions.
Even a beatdown can be good and fun to watch, like a lot of stomps in Dragon Ball. Beerus vs. Vegeta was just boring and sloppy. And "Black vs Vegeta was actually better in the manga than the anime", can't agree with that at all and I never found the going from red/blue clever, especially in that fight where Vegeta had no real reason to conserve stamina. I actually prefer Goku briefly overpowering Merge Zamasu over fighting him as an equal using the asspull that is mastered Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan. Once Merged Zamasu got serious, he should have cracked Goku like an egg, but Merged Zamasu in the manga was lackluster.

The dialog in the manga has never been fierce outside of Vegeta shit talking and again, the choreography in the manga has never been that good to me. In fact, I think it's one of the most overrated things about the Super manga since people keep praising and telling me how good the choreography is and I am never impressed.
Goku' and Vegeta's life long training to finally achieve Blue's full energy for a longer period of time is an "asspull." Yet a Goku on life support overpowering a fused character isn't? The manga explains and actually has variations. Vegeta using the interchange was great and better than what he did in the anime against Black. The manga even demonstrates better punching styles so it isn't an exaggeration to say it's choreography is better than the anime's repetitive punches with no good sound effects. Even the anime used that interchange idea between red and blue from the manga. And No one is suppose to battle Beerus head up...So the point is the battle against Beerus is not going to be exciting..Nothing more than a gauge to see where Vegeta and Goku are. When Beerus gets angry there is suppose to be no hope.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Noah » Tue Sep 12, 2017 7:18 pm

I'm curious for what we'll see from Toyotaro this week. Not a big fan of the manga, but it can be amusing.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Totamo » Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:11 am

The manga could improve the tournament but not in the way people will think.


Its not going to improve tension but it might improve explanation. Toyo loves exposition.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by JazzHands » Wed Sep 13, 2017 3:57 am

Totamo wrote:The manga could improve the tournament but not in the way people will think.


Its not going to improve tension but it might improve explanation. Toyo loves exposition.
Toyotaro seems more respectful with power levels. Trunks never got a ass pull power boost. SS2 thats it. A strong one but cant go up against SS Rose Black. Toei does whats cool. Not what makes sense. And its a shame because I would say majority of the fans are not kids that like flashy lights. SS Rage cool looking, spirit sword cool looking, Roshi dominating U4 and its strongest fighter looks cool. But none of it has any logic or build up to it. Roshi Pl is 139 when buff 180. Hes been wearing the shell for hundreds of years. He has no Kami or King Kai training. And never trained for the Androids or participated in any major battles. So "secret training" is not enough. The manga can be better with him using the Mafu ba and Lightning attack but not have him one hand smack a over SS1 character.

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