"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[FortuneSSJ]

I don't understand how you can be a fan of Dragon Ball and think that a martial artist like Hit would consider the result of his battle vs Goku a win.

Don't pull off the fan card.

Only because Goku figured out how his time-skip works, doesn't mean he should lower himself like this. Both lines are unnecessary, because Goku didn't win that fight.
And the one in debt here is still Goku.

[ToshioWrites]

I don't like how the other 4 GoD are surprised to what happened to Universe 9 and they are relieved for not being in the Tournament. They should keep their posture.
But then again ask for a character to keep his posture in the manga when things get serious is asking too much. Hit and Goku Black are the best example of this compared to their anime counterparts.

You act like they were bawling on the sidelines. They were just happy they didn't have to participate in a tournament that risks erasure. Thats like saying people in First world countries shouldn't be exclaiming a sigh of relief they aren't in a war torn nation.

Why is Goku the only one fighting the Pride Troopers?! Seriously he already fought with all of them...
And why he's using SSJ2 against Dyspo/Toppo when Toppo alone already beat him in SSB...?! Mah power levels aren't making sense.

Cause he wanted to save stamina which he mentioned. As far as power levels. Dyspo and Toppo were both kicking his ass so not sure what you are bitching about

Hit stop relying only on his special techniques ruins what I like about his fighting style. See him fighting like a brawler was disappointing, because he just comes out as another normal guy. What make this more stupid is that after saying that, Toyotaro came up with the Time Lag technique which is actually an interesting concept. The writing was all over the place...

Again consider not speedreading. Hit already said his time skip didn't work vs Jiren and he didn't completely give up using techniques seeing as how he used Time lag, he had just given up complete reliance on them and instead focused on increasing his raw power as well which was shown by him rivaling if not outright being stronger than SSB Goku

Hit was wasted. He was eliminated before Universe 10 erasure and he didn't eliminate a single person.
It's obvious his character would never be as popular, if it wasn't for the anime.

So? Toppo and Dyspo had Zero eliminations in the anime. Also its not Toyotaro job to make characters popular so that toys and DLCs can sell. He needs to tell the story and clearly Toriyama checks off on this so maybe Hit wasn't supposed to be this broken ass fighter the anime made him out to be

I was angry with Toppo's ridiculous performance in the anime, but I pick Hit over him.

And I pick Toppo over HIt, your point?

I think at this point people stop asking Toyotaro to treat x character better than the anime. That clearly didn't work out with Krillin, Tenshinhan and Hit. And if this keeps going, Gohan will be the next one.

Nobody on here thinks Toyo bases his decisions on twitter posts asking him to do justice to characters. Obviously he and Toriyama write one way and Toei does their own thing

[Rebel Instinct]

Well, I was super excited about this chapter this morning and thought about gushing a little here before going to bed, but I thought "Nah, I'll post about it tomorrow. It can wait.". Reading through the thread today, I don't feel excited anymore - just sad. I realize I should have gone ahead and gotten it out of my system while I was still feeling happy about things so that my positive feelings would've at least gotten out there.

Never let a fandom ruin your enthusiasm for something. It's very difficult to do, but you'll be thankful you did. Honestly, I get that reading through this thread is a chore sometimes with now pointlessly negative people are with Toyotaro for some reason, but what works for me is not taking things too seriously.

I appreciate the sentiment. Really, I do. I know better than to take things too seriously and that it isn't rational to let a fandom ruin how you feel about something you like (I like GT, 'nuff said). Still, it's occasionally something that's hard to just tune out. A lot of the time I don't pay much mind to such things, but there have been a couple of franchises that have been soured for me over the years through sheer attrition (the Dark Souls series being one of them). It's usually never just the fans that do it to me either, but a combination of what's going on with the actual franchise itself in conjunction with the world's collective reaction to it. When it's both aspects of the whole that are weighing on you, you eventually just get tired.

In Dragon Ball's case it's a combination of the anime's irritating shenanigans and the community constantly saying and doing things that make me want to go dunk my head in a lake. The manga's the only version of Super I can really enjoy without feeling like pulling my hair out and 2/3 of the world either don't know it exists or actively hates it. I'm not even that fanatical about the manga, I just like it more than the anime. It still bums me out for the whole world to collectively crap on something I like.

I'll busy myself with other things for awhile and I'll see if I feel up to talking about the chapter later on. Normally I don't have such a visceral reaction like this, but I was really stoked this time and I got the emotional rug pulled out from under me before I got to talk about it. Hit's one of my favorites too, so there's a personal aspect to it too. I don't want to come off as being whiny, so I won't beleaguer the point. I just got kinda sucker punched today.

[CriticalThinker]

Well, I was super excited about this chapter this morning and thought about gushing a little here before going to bed, but I thought "Nah, I'll post about it tomorrow. It can wait.". Reading through the thread today, I don't feel excited anymore - just sad. I realize I should have gone ahead and gotten it out of my system while I was still feeling happy about things so that my positive feelings would've at least gotten out there.

Not to sound like a douche but this is a Internet forum and not an echo chamber so it's no surprise that not everyone agrees with one another when it comes to something. Won't deny though that it can be hard to want to engage with others if it only seems like there's a constant stream of negativity going on in the thread. But just because I and some others weren't that hot about this chapter shouldn't ruin your enthusiasm man. If you wanna gush about the chapter then you gush about it like no other, don't let some opposing opinions bring ya down.

[Marlowe89]

Well, I think I'm going to articulate a proper review now.

What I liked:

Jiren exhibiting some actual chemistry with Goku has to be one of my favorite things this month. He initially calls him a "nameless warrior" but eventually recognizes him by his actual name by the end of the chapter - even complimenting him on his observational skills - partially thanks to a compelling moment where Goku shouts his own name as he is inches away from getting eliminated. There's a developing relationship between the two here that feels a lot more carefully crafted than it ever was in the anime. I don't know how he does it, but I love how Toyotaro consistently manages to tie these character arcs and themes into the overarching plot in a way that makes it feel almost like a self-contained chapter without making the story feel episodic. Jiren also has a sense of intelligence in the manga, luring Hit to the edge of the ring and only overpowering him at that point as opposed to... uh... "breaking time itself"? Whatever.

Pretty much everything about Hit tickled my fancy, and having him grow in physical strength between tournaments was a brilliant move on Toyotaro's part. It ties even further into his dynamic with Goku, showcasing the fruits of Hit's labor birthed from his inspiration to become a stronger martial artist without simply relying on time manipulation. Hit was always this strong in the anime, but in the manga, that newfound raw power is a result of more cohesive character progression that began in Super's first tournament, and it helps that he's generally less stoic in this version. Removing his lower "kilt" was pretty fascinating in how weird and simultaneously cool it was -- when I read the initial spoilers, I wasn't expecting to be on board with it and had this really awkward image in my head, but his character design turned out to be a lot more appealing than I thought it would be.

Finally, I love how the general sense of an actual battle royale is still upheld in the manga, albeit somewhat differently than previously. Rather than highlighting the chaos of the arc's setting as in previous chapters, the manga is now taking the time to establish that absolutely nobody is safe in this tournament. The characters we have a personal investment in have been put in an extremely disorderly circumstance where even some of the most formidable fighters present can be taken out in seconds, and that's exciting. It conveys a feeling of uncertainty for our protagonists that I really don't think the anime quite nailed in its implementation.

What I didn't like:

Toyotaro's paneling this month had a bunch of cool poses and angles as usual, but some of the actual art was questionable at best. What in the actual hell is going on with Jiren's forehead in this chapter? Is El Hermano his stunt double now?

I couldn't really find much else to be disappointed about and I seriously don't understand the outrage at Goku vs. Dyspo/Toppo. Unless it's for some greater narrative purpose, neither Toei nor Toyotaro operate on the same kind of "one shot" philosophy that Toriyama often expressed in the original manga and I think that's ultimately for the better. As I've previously mentioned in the other thread, this specific case is still completely consistent with Toppo's strength, so it's fine.

Overall, this was an excellent chapter and probably my favorite one in the actual tournament so far. I'm super impressed at how it managed to make me really like Hit as a character in general, and I'm looking forward to seeing how the manga chooses to frame upcoming events later on.

[jeffbr92]

“Hit didn’t have any eliminations in the manga therefore this chapter is shit“

So what? The entire Pride Troopers outside of Jiren had 0 eliminations in the anime.

Outside of Jiren, only Toppo and Dyspo were interesting from the Pride Troopers, though still a shame they two didn't got any K.O, but anime made Hit somewhat relevant to the plot and the manga trashed on it.

[Rebel Instinct]

Not to sound like a douche but this is a Internet forum and not an echo chamber so it's no surprise that not everyone agrees with one another when it comes to something. Won't deny though that it can be hard to want to engage with others if it only seems like there's a constant stream of negativity going on in the thread. But just because I and some others weren't that hot about this chapter shouldn't ruin your enthusiasm man. If you wanna gush about the chapter then you gush about it like no other, don't let some opposing opinions bring ya down.

I figured being emotionally honest on the internet for a moment wouldn't go well. Should've just kept it to myself. I absolutely do not want an echo chamber. A situation like that would be far worse than what we currently have, regardless of which side it would be in favor of. My post history is a litany of discussing and engaging with differing opinions. Being a little tired of all the negativity and wishing things were a little more even-handed isn't the same as wanting everyone to agree with you. Fans of the anime have been asking for the same thing for years. Don't take my venting personally if you didn't like the chapter as much as I did. It's a cumulative thing that isn't any one person's doing. It's also not like I heard one differing opinion on the internet and fell into a heap, it's like this almost every month. Just kinda gets old after a while.

[TKA]

In Dragon Ball's case it's a combination of the anime's irritating shenanigans and the community constantly saying and doing things that make me want to go dunk my head in a lake. The manga's the only version of Super I can really enjoy without feeling like pulling my hair out and 2/3 of the world either don't know it exists or actively hates it.

Dark Souls 2 for life!

I totally understand. That's how I feel about Star Wars' now-defunct Expanded Universe, especially when compared to Disney Wars. There's people that'll never know how good the EU is and forever will they think Disney's garbage is Star Wars. So be it. I came to peace with that when I made myself understand that the EU I loved will always be there and Disney can't take it away or influence it in any way.

Likewise, the manga exists regardless of the forums, and the fans. Don't worry, there's plenty of people here who like the manga more than the anime (like myself) that you can interact with.

[Bergamo]

I really loved the chapter, but I feel as if it might have been too soon for Jiren to recognize Goku. I'm also not quite sure if he and Goku are still fighting.

[Zephyr]

I observe and evaluate this with the lense of a computer scientist, because that is exactly what and who I am. I have a lot to to with classification and amusingly enough the word "Generics" have a lot to do with what I do as well. That goes too far though, no excourse now.

I'm discussing this through the lens of a philosopher, because that's what and who I am. I too engage in a lot of logical classification and the demarcation of concepts. I also deal in and prioritize clear arguments, defining of terms, and an attempt at least to avoid logical fallacies.

Anyway, I rate Dragon Ball for what it is supposed to be. The "style of Toriyama-san" does not come into play here because every, I repeat every, person that creates something, even those that try to imitate bring in their own style as it is not possible not to do that.

I will always love the artstyle of Toriyama-san. I have learned from it. But that is not really something I am looking for when talking about generic shows and if one wants to stretch it so far to say such things should also count, then it still is an art style that, while being the personal invention of Akira Toriyama, still has a lot in common with others. But I guess if we want to go the extra route and count things like artstyle then I can give you that. That is really the only outstanding thing for me.

And traits being presented with he personal way of the other does a) not make them any less the same traits that appear all the time, b) as said would result if we really want to use it as a counter argument, in the argument of nothing being perceived as generic as everyone has "their own way" and c) to be honest, even those "personal touches" I can see in at least very, very similiar fashion in other shows, such as the dorkiness summoning the comedic feeling or characters making something funnier because you would never expect something from guys like them (e.g. Vegeta) and that of course is just a bunch of examples. The list is endless.

As a matter of fact Dragon Ball even does not really have anything special that I am looking for so I always wonder why I even love it so much because it is substantially lacking what I prefer. But in the end it is actually always thanks to it being silly, light-hearted, playing a nostalgic role and simply an easy show where you can enjoy it for what it is - not incredibly deep and complex (though I am glad the Toei writers did some approaches for Super here) but a charming, silly and "awesome feeling" show. Nothing it really has to awake this feeling inside of me is anything that I have not seen 1 million times in my life though.

I'm not talking strictly about the style of his illustrations. When I say "art", I'm talking about it in the broad sense of "expressing the author's imaginative or technical skill, intended to be appreciated for their beauty or emotional power", not strictly the visual sense. Music, writing, acting, directing, and so on are likewise forms of art.

You can't look at any piece of artistic creation for "what it's supposed to be" without taking the author into consideration, because art is supposed to be a reflection of the artist. The work wouldn't be the work that it is without the author, their style, their taste, their creative process, and their skill. And yes, that does indeed apply to every work ever made. Some works, however, have so many people working on them that authorial flair and charm don't really shine through. With Dragon Ball, however, it does. Not only because the manga is a one-man show, but because Toriyama's specific style is so distinctive and noticeable. You bring up "characters unexpectedly doing funny things" as one of Toriyama's personal touches that you see elsewhere, but that's not something I ever denied was visible elsewhere, or specifically endemic of Toriyama's style.

Just a suggestion, but I think if you broaden your approach to the appreciation and consumption to this kind of stuff, you might get more out of the stuff you're evaluating. You might find that which you're lacking.

If you want to take that to say something is generic, than nothing is generic. I as a computer scientist am used to the word "generic" in combination to a meta-datatype that can be written in advance so later you can derive others that follow the rules of this meta-datatype and make it easier for yourself when working (which is quite funny actually because a lot of people have a problem programing with generics but whatever, I wanted to bring in some irony here).

Also your argument of him "writing" something is something that I can tell you have more of a problem with than me using the word "generic" because I always said and will always say Dragon Ball hardly has any writing. I am a massive Role-Playing Game fan, I read a lot and am thoroughly interested in story-heavy/narratively driven pieces of work. What happens over the course of the "story" though is so sparse it is not even funny.

Alright, so now not only is your use of "generic" unclear, but so is your use of "writing" and "story". I don't know what concepts and ideas any of these terms actually correspond to your in your specific perspective here. I fail to see how Toriyama isn't writing a story.

What I do find masses of though is Dragon Ball fans that try to treat it like a holy grail and don't actually care about what they say, as long as they can defend. I would never do such a thing. I will not defend a show I love in a way of treating it like something pure and perfect because it will never be able to be such a thing. The point is, I read Dragon Ball so often. But really no trait I can find that makes this show the way it is is unique enough for it to be classified different.

I'm not saying Dragon Ball is holy, sacred, or exempt from criticism. "Generic" and "Perfect" are hardly the only two valid boxes to put things into. There's an ocean of nuance between the two. And the "Dragon Ball isn't some ultra complex thing" argument is true, but something not being Citizen Kane or whatever doesn't preclude it from still having an impressive degree of nuance. Things aren't black and white. The "false dilemma" seemingly at play here is a fallacious form of reasoning.

I already mentioned that using the argument of something living in the moment has nothing to do with something not being generic. It is all about the results. Tons of people are lazy and do something 5 before 12.

Yes, it is all about the results, which is why I mentioned the results. Because he writes by the seat of his pants, exciting developments happen in organic ways. The blind forward momentum of the story feels genuine and realistic, and unexpected things happen as a result, even things the author didn't expect. Toriyama thrives in this sort of creative environment. Others might not. The resulting authentic realistic feeling of its world (in the broad sense that it changes naturally over time) and human feeling of its inhabitants (in who they are, as people, who change and grow apart over time) are what keep Dragon Ball's story a fair cut above bog standard, generic, by-the-numbers Shonen demographic anime/manga, and that is, again, because of the author's style and his creative process. If said style and creative process didn't specifically yield these results that preclude it from being generic, I wouldn't have brought them up.

That's your way of thinking and that is fine. I prefer to classify it in a more scientific way. As mentioned, I read and play a lot and Dragon Ball consists of multiple traits for which I can throw it in the same drawer while not presenting me one actually really good and outstanding trait for which I can say "okay, you belong in the other drawer".

You insist that you're trying to classify things in a more scientific way, but you're outright dismissing crucially relevant factors in your scientific analysis. I don't think science is supposed to downplay or discount important evidence and data in its objective analysis. It feels like you're trying to break down or reverse-engineer the "formula" for what Dragon Ball is, one that could be emulated to create an identical sort of work. Unfortunately, none of the components you've given are themselves very distinctive. Silly, light-hearted, charming, and "awesome feeling" aren't specific at all. You could throw those things in a pot and mix them up, and there's no guarantee that you'd get Dragon Ball. There's no guarantee that you'd get anything in particular. Dragon Ball is, most fundamentally, in its DNA, two things: it is an Akira Toriyama comic telling a Wuxia story; as a result of these two genes, its phenotypes are naturally comedic and action-packed.

I feel like your scientific analysis only pays mind to the surface level results of the actual underlying formula, and outright balking at the idea of looking at the actual formula. Yes, it's funny, yes it's exciting and cool; but so many other things are as well, so that's hardly an exhaustive or helpful description. Until you can cite and pinpoint why and how it is as funny and exciting and cool as it is, you'll never be able to reverse engineer it. You're missing the forest for the trees; and, unfortunately, science and logic always compel a deeper dive down the rabbit hole. Your scientific approach is like a geneticist who decided to stop at Mendel, without paying any mind to what Watson and Crick were up to.

[CriticalThinker]

Not to sound like a douche but this is a Internet forum and not an echo chamber so it's no surprise that not everyone agrees with one another when it comes to something. Won't deny though that it can be hard to want to engage with others if it only seems like there's a constant stream of negativity going on in the thread. But just because I and some others weren't that hot about this chapter shouldn't ruin your enthusiasm man. If you wanna gush about the chapter then you gush about it like no other, don't let some opposing opinions bring ya down.

I figured being emotionally honest on the internet for a moment wouldn't go well. Should've just kept it to myself. I absolutely do not want an echo chamber. A situation like that would be far worse than what we currently have, regardless of which side it would be in favor of. My post history is a litany of discussing and engaging with differing opinions. Being a little tired of all the negativity and wishing things were a little more even-handed isn't the same as wanting everyone to agree with you. Fans of the anime have been asking for the same thing for years. Don't take my venting personally if you didn't like the chapter as much as I did. It's a cumulative thing that isn't any one person's doing. It's also not like I heard one differing opinion on the internet and fell into a heap, it's like this almost every month. Just kinda gets old after a while.

Naw don't keep that stuff to yourself man isn't good to do that better to let it out than keep it bottled up. And it's not like I disagree with you about the negativity as it can be a bit much sometimes. And I didn't take any of your venting personally it's all good I just wanted to throw in my two cents. Probably shouldn't have but its to late now, again apologies if I came off as a rude or as a douche in anyway.

[Doctor.]

I do appreciate how Toyotaro utilizes the various SS forms. Even if I think some of their drawbacks are stupid (SSB) and some of the ways he makes the forms plot-relevant is convoluted (SSG in the Black arc), I like how he at least puts some effort into making each form feel unique, in contrast with the anime that just arbitrarily pulls whatever form the writers feel like using that week. Using SS2 as the 'default' form seems more appropriate now than just plain SS.

[FortuneSSJ]

You act like they were bawling on the sidelines. They were just happy they didn't have to participate in a tournament that risks erasure. Thats like saying people in First world countries shouldn't be exclaiming a sigh of relief they aren't in a war torn nation.

We're talking about Gods of Destruction here. Not normal human beings. They erase planets too and they should keep their posture in this situation.

Cause he wanted to save stamina which he mentioned. As far as power levels. Dyspo and Toppo were both kicking his ass so not sure what you are bitching about.

Probably because he's saving stamina by using SSJ2 against someone who already beat him in SSB...If you know the competition, there's no point in doing that.
Maybe he should stay in base following that logic...

Again consider not speedreading. Hit already said his time skip didn't work vs Jiren and he didn't completely give up using techniques seeing as how he used Time lag, he had just given up complete reliance on them and instead focused on increasing his raw power as well which was shown by him rivaling if not outright being stronger than SSB Goku

Thank you, but I read the chapter. My point still stands. I like the technical aspect of Hit fighting style in the anime. He punch and kick like another normal guy is boring.

By the way since you're so busy defending the chapter- Hit's strategy to take down Jiren is a lot like what happened with Raditz. He wanted Goku to keep him busy while he powers up to use his new technique that he was been working on to defeat Goku in their rematch, which can only be used "once" and is their "only" chance to win. That's Toyotaro's lack of creativity showing up. It usually appears every month around this time.

So? Toppo and Dyspo had Zero eliminations in the anime.

If you want to argument with me, you have to do your homework. Gohan, one of the strongest U7 fighters, sacrificed himself to eliminate Dyspo.
We will talk about Toppo when the time comes and somehow Toyotaro does worse than Toei. I thought that would be hard but from what I've seen in the last two chapters, he may pull it off.

He needs to tell the story and clearly Toriyama checks off

I would like an entertaining story, if possible.

so maybe Hit wasn't supposed to be this broken ass fighter the anime made him out to be

He's not broken, he's fun.

I was angry with Toppo's ridiculous performance in the anime, but I pick Hit over him.

And I pick Toppo over HIt, your point?

With this answer, tell me yours?!

Obviously he and Toriyama write one way and Toei does their own

Cut the crap. It's already said countless times Toei often consults Toriyama. Toriyama isn't only supervising Toyotaro.

[TheSaiyanGod]

Why is Goku the only one fighting the Pride Troopers?! Seriously he already fought with all of them...
And why he's using SSJ2 against Dyspo/Toppo when Toppo alone already beat him in SSB...?! Mah power levels aren't making sense.

Toppo was not using God Ki in this fight (which was why he was able to rival with MSSB) and he certainly wanted to save energy.
And even then, he was pressing Goku SSJ2, who needed to use Blue.

Goku/Hit vs Jiren is a good idea, but the execution is bad.
Hit stop relying only on his special techniques ruins what I like about his fighting style. See him fighting like a brawler was disappointing, because he just comes out as another normal guy. What make this more stupid is that after saying that, Toyotaro came up with the Time Lag technique which is actually an interesting concept. The writing was all over the place...

Hitto did not just want to depend on his abilities, that is, he did not want to be a Time Skip spammer, and that's why he trained. This does not mean that he will not use his special abilities any more.

Hit was wasted. He was eliminated before Universe 10 erasure and he didn't eliminate a single person.
It's obvious his character would never be as popular, if it wasn't for the anime.

Why number of eliminations means something?

Muten Roshi eliminated more warriors than a GoD, and the warrior with a speed that surpasses Golden Freeza did not eliminate anyone.

[batistabus]

I want to talk a little about the differences between Hit and Jiren.

I've heard people say that Jiren is just a more boring copy of Hit, which isn't totally unfair based solely on the anime. I think the manga does a much better job of making these characters feel different. Yes, both are somewhat stoic, bad-ass, bald rivals to Goku, but what drives these characters is completely different.

Before the Universe 6 tournament, Hit was an assassin. As a 1,000 year old individual, he had likely been assassinating for quite some time. Whatever the reason for getting into assassination in the first place, it's something that he stuck with. He didn't continue to do it due to a lust for killing. He didn't continue to do it for the money. He did it because he was good at it. Nobody could challenge him, and it's likely that nobody had in centuries. He didn't find assassination thrilling at this point, but it's all he knew how to do anymore. He was bored.

When he agreed to attend the Universe 6/7 tournament, he did it on the condition that he would be given the Cube Spaceship if he participated. It's never stated as to why he wanted the spaceship, but I'll get into that later.

Once the tournament had started, Hit proceeded to sleep up until the point where Vegeta went Super Saiyan Blue. Hit was so far above everything else that had happened up until that point that he wasn't even interested in the tournament for the sake of sport. Vegeta Blue gave him hope that he might find a challenge, but Hit quickly disposed of him as he would have any other target. He was so let down by this that he asked the ref if he should throw Vegeta's unconscious body off-stage just to get the tournament over with.

Once Goku appears on stage and starts revealing his strategy immediately, Hit knows something is different about this contestant. At first, he's inclined to think Goku is simply stupid, but when Goku suggests he's gotten a hint as to how to defeat Hit, we get this devilish grin. Fuwa mentions that Hit - a person who never talks - is becoming quite chatty with Goku. Hit is grinning, sweating, and put on edge.

Eventually, Goku takes the edge in the battle. Hit can't believe it, but even then he smiles. When he powers up to max and is able to stop SSG Goku for a moment, the expression on his face is absolutely ecstatic. All he did was manage to stop Goku for a fraction of a second, but the look on his face was completely different from when he actually defeated Vegeta.

We know the rest. The point is, despite seeming totally detached from the tournament initially, Hit loves battle. He had grown incredibly bored at the top in his universe (similar to Saitama in One Punch Man), but Goku showed him that there was still plenty of room for him to improve. Now, we never hear exactly why Hit wanted the Cube Spaceship, but based on his battle with Goku, and based on the fact that he gave up on the Cube immediately after taking the fall against Monaka, it seems that Hit wanted the Cube in order to seek out a challenge. Now that he had his wish granted another way, it was time to get to training.

Upon seeing Goku again at the Tournament of Power, he plays it cool for a second, only to relent a grin and say "Do you really think I've been sitting on my hands since the last tournament?" Goku replies "Great! Should be fun" with his own challenging grin. They exchange similar chemistry throughout this most recent chapter. When Hit asks Goku to team up against Jiren, but Goku refuses, he's confused at first, but not frustrated. He doesn't berate Goku for making such an irresponsible decision, but rather, he smiles as he realizes that was the "right" answer all along.

We know from the anime that all universes would be destroyed if the winner of the Tournament of Power didn't wish for the revival of all universes, and if Hit had been the last man standing, I'm certain that he would have made the right wish in order to continue challenging himself.

While Jiren is quite stoic and quiet as well, I don't get the sense that he is as bored as Hit. At the very least, he has a sense of purpose. He is certainly on top in his universe - above the God of Destruction even - but he has something he actively pursues on a daily basis. Whether or not he has fun doing it, he cares deeply about justice. He wants to ensure that he lives in a just world, and knowing that he can do something about it keeps him moving non-stop. The idea of attending a 48 minute tournament that MIGHT allow evil to go unpunished for even that long sickens him. Having seen the anime and read developer interviews, we know that Jiren's hunger for justice is motivated by what happened to him growing up.

If Jiren had an interest in becoming Universe 11's God of Destruction, he could do so in an instant. Like Goku, he's uninterested in the job. Both characters don't want to be burdened by the responsibility because it would get in the way of doing what they love. The prestige of the position is meaningless to both of them. When Jiren hears that Goku and Jiren share this sentiment, it grabs his attention. There is nobody else in his world that thinks in that way. Toppo wants the position. The rest of the Pride Troopers are just a rag-tag team of fighters assembled for a job. Nobody, not even Vermoud understand why his purpose is so important, but perhaps Goku would. It's not that Goku actively pursues justice, but he would understand the idea of doing anything to accomplish your goals. While Hit would also likely be uninterested in the prospect of becoming a God of Destruction, his role as an assassin inherently makes him less suited to the position than do-gooders like Goku and Hit.

While Hit is a very passive character when he meets Goku, Jiren is very active. While he's not interested in the prospect of the tournament in itself, he wants to get the battle over with so that he can go home and continue enforcing justice and peace. Even if the World of Void is outside of time, the time passing in Jiren's head is constantly reminding him of his true objective. The anime does little to support this when they have Jiren in a meditative state for half of the tournament.

There are many things we still don't know about the manga's incarnation of Jiren. Does he love to fight? What is the wish he wants granted? How will Goku affect him moving forward, and vise-versa?

For the sake of speculation, let's assume that Jiren's wish is to revive his loved ones that were murdered over the course of his lifetime. If the Super Dragon Balls were awarded to him at the end of the tournament, would he have made the right wish? We know that Jiren doesn't want to be responsible for the destruction of other universes, but he agreed to join the ToP despite that under the assumption that he would be able to have his wish granted. While he may have changed his mind by the end, it's entirely possible that he would have misused the wish and ended up erased.

TLDR;
Hit: Passive // Jiren: Active // Goku: Active
Hit: Motivated by Battle // Jiren: Motivated by Justice // Motivated by battle and his loved ones
Hit: Unaffected by murder or evil // Jiren: Cannot abide evil for even a moment, refuses to kill // Goku: Hates evil but does not go out of his way to punish it
Hit: Typically calm but electrified by his passion // Jiren: Pursues his passion intensely but calmly // High energy despite not constantly seeking social interactions, electrified by his passion
Hit: Doesn't hesitate to accomplish the task at hand but will enjoy a fight above all // Jiren: Accomplishes the task at hand so he can get back to his true mission // Goku: Seeks to enjoy a challenge at great risk up until the point of hopelessness, but does the right thing in the end
Hit: Would restore all universes // Jiren: Might not restore all universes // Goku: Would restore all universes
Hit: Changed by Goku // Jiren: Will be changed by Goku // Goku: Goku

While I may have gone in-depth into the mental state of these characters just now, we know of course that Akira Toriyama would never explain emotions so blatantly. It's not his style. That being said, just because a character doesn't explicitly say something, that doesn't mean that the point isn't still getting across somehow. That's the genius of Dragon Ball; it's able to keep things light on the surface while still allowing you to dig deeper when you're thinking about it later.

[Bergamo]

A 1v1-ish fight was a nice change of pace from the frantic nature of the last 2 chapters. People may have forgotten this after watching the anime, but antagonists actually need to be developed. If we got 6 chapters of battle royal and then Goku began to fight Jiren, then Jiren would just seem like the bland strong guy. Because we actually see Jiren and Goku's dynamic, I feel a sense of anticipation for the final showdown. Goku vs Jiren in the anime was just the two strongest guys fighting eachother, nothing more.

[Rebel Instinct]

Naw don't keep that stuff to yourself man isn't good to do that better to let it out than keep it bottled up. And it's not like I disagree with you about the negativity as it can be a bit much sometimes. And I didn't take any of your venting personally it's all good I just wanted to throw in my two cents. Probably shouldn't have but its to late now, again apologies if I came off as a rude or as a douche in anyway.

No prob! We're square.

You actually touched on a part of my specific situation. Out of all of my friends IRL, only one of them really likes Dragon Ball as much as I do and he doesn't really think much of Super as a whole - anime or manga. As such, he hasn't kept up with Super beyond watching a small handful of episodes and reading a couple chapters. Talking to him about modern Dragon Ball is more or less a one-sided conversation rather than a proper discussion. With that being the case, it's either talk at my buddy about material he hasn't seen, visit the forums for discussion or bottle up my thoughts on modern Dragon Ball. With online discussion regarding the manga being a crapshoot, it's kinda just me and my own thoughts most of the time. There's nowhere for my passion to go.

Kanzenshuu has been better about open discussion than most places, but it still frequently bogs down about certain topics. I do my best to keep conversation stimulating, but like @batistabus said, it feels like I spend more time arguing the merits of the manga than I do just chatting about it. It can be difficult to keep up the desire when just talking about the thing you like is an uphill battle by default.

Bleh. Regardless, this is turning into more of blog than a manga discussion thread. I'll stop straying off-topic and go gather my thoughts on the chapter for later discussion. I've derailed the topic enough.

[ToshioWrites]

We're talking about Gods of Destruction here. Not normal human beings. They erase planets too and they should keep their posture in this situation.

So? Does that mean they don't have feelings or emotions? They are at the whims of a child

Probably because he's saving stamina by using SSJ2 against someone who already beat him in SSB...If you know the competition, there's no point in doing that.
Maybe he should stay in base following that logic...

A. He had no idea about Dyspo speed
B. Toppo wasn't using his god ki either

If you want to argument with me, you have to do your homework. Gohan, one of the strongest U7 fighters, sacrificed himself to eliminate Dyspo.
We will talk about Toppo when the time comes and somehow Toyotaro does worse than Toei. I thought that would be hard but from what I've seen in the last two chapters, he may pull it off.

Maybe you should use your head, gohan sacrificing himself doesn't give dyspo an elimination since you know freeza blasted them off the stage. Lol use your head

I would like an entertaining story, if possible.

So would we all but some of us can't digest the dumb shit the anime shows every week but when we point that out you get triggered

With this answer, tell me yours?!

Point is nobody gives a crap if you like hit more than toppo. Characters importance to the narrative isn't based on what fortunessj wants

Cut the crap. It's already said countless times Toei often consults Toriyama. Toriyama isn't only supervising Toyotaro.

How about you cut the crap. Nowhere has it been said toriyama checks off on anime storyboards or scripts.Giving them some insight into jirens background and such doesn't mean he's involved nearly as much

[ToshioWrites]

The shit that anime defenders bitch about " its not bad writing , you just didn't like what happened" when they defend the anime is the same argument they use vs the manga.


"My favorite character didn't get some glorious moment, REEEEEEEEEE! Toyotaro is a hack"

[LightBing]

At the start it's mentioned how 2-3 members of each Universe had been eliminated, with the exception of Universe 11. Did we actually saw all of those? My memory fails me.