"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Michsi
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Michsi » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm

Okay..... I didn't like the chapter that much.

1. Goku's turn is reduced to 2 seconds of getting pummeled and Vegeta get's right back up again. I swear, Toyotaro's really trying to give Vegeta all the relevancy with how often he put's him in the forefront. It's not just the action I'm referring to here: look at how much single panel attention Vegeta gets after he wakes up as opposed to Goku.

2 Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?

3. Don't care much for the Bulma part but the "my Vegeta" thing was funny.

4, Namekian fusion being brought up as if anyone geniuenly expected it to do something worthwhile. It would have been a bigger surprise if it had. As is stands, it's just a really bad attempt at a cliffhanger.

5. Namekians getting slaughtered a la Freeza arc. In addition to that, Goku saying before attempting to flee "I feel bad for the Namekians, but..." is a poor choice of words imo. It left a sour taste in my mouth because it didn't feel like he gave it all before coming to this dire decision.


I still like Moro's design. He's tall and lanky, we don't see that often.
Last edited by Michsi on Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Shaddy » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:15 pm

I really wish villains (and heroes, sometimes) would stop seeing heroes mostly dead and just fucking leaving like a bunch of dumbasses. Like, if you actually care all that much about winning, put fucking holes in their torsos and call it a day.

Other than that though, I must say that's one of the better chapters I've seen of this arc. Whenever I don't have to look at Toyotaro's action panels (or his legendary necks) I feel more like I'm actually reading Dragon Ball. Bulma chewing out Jaco, actually remembering Tights exists, Satan showing concern for Buu, it's actually got a little bit of charm I remembered these characters having.

I don't really know why they bothered spoiling it with trying to hype up an ultra-powerful Namekiannnn as some kind of actual stake just to have him job. Like, we've known Nameks were weak as shit for years at this point, even the ones Piccolo and Gohan fought in the ToP which I'd assume must have absorbed hundreds of others. But are we supposed to take this scrawny rando seriously or act like his death means much?

I wouldn't be surprised if the entire reason that was done is to give Piccolo more people to absorb to get closer to fighting strength, or something stupid like that. If so it's just another example of trying to "powerscale" in-universe instead of just actually making the story engaging. Like, these characters have been able to blow up entire solar systems for a while. My suspension of disbelief in the combat feats went out the window a long time ago.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Raimundo » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:32 pm

Best chapter of the arc so far, but still fairly uninteresting to me. Didn’t really like Beerus I’m the chapter and Moro remains boring as hell to me.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TheRed259 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:33 pm

3 Dragon Balls in 3 days?

I was expecting him to have all 7 by the time Goku and Vegeta woke up.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:16 pm

OLKv3 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:09 am
Beerus lets Freeza destroy planets, don't see why Moro would be any different
He also didn't help them against Broly at all
Except he just went through the TOP where his universe was nearly erased because he did such ha lousy job running things. After that, he goes back to being a lazy SOB. This goes right into Too Dumb to Live.

Beerus kept an eye on things with Broly and even show relief that they won. That and he was babysitting.
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precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Regarder » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:38 pm

TheRed259 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:33 pm
3 Dragon Balls in 3 days?

I was expecting him to have all 7 by the time Goku and Vegeta woke up.
This doesn't make much sense. It would have made more sense if the Namekians used Cranberry (2nd hand) and Moro's (third hand) limited knowledge of the Dragonballs to trick them into thinking the Dragonballs had to be made, and then Moro gave them three days, with him finally having enough on the day Goku and Vegeta woke up. Without being able to stall Moro in some way, it seems unlikely it would take Moro three days to go to just three villages and slaughter them all.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Liquir » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:53 pm

TheRed259 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:33 pm
3 Dragon Balls in 3 days?

I was expecting him to have all 7 by the time Goku and Vegeta woke up.
Indeed. long time to do so..
Even if he enjoyed slowly torturing the Namekians and not in a hurry to gather the Dragon Balls it's still too long, the way he quickly disposed of them, he should have destroyed more Villages by now.
Only logical thing for it would be the Namekians are simply not telling him where the Dragon Balls are, so him and Cranberry have to search them manually and he can't use force so he don't destroy them in the process.
Either way, it's going to be good for the anime, gives them extra footage they can use. One or two additional episodes in which they showcase those days where Moro searches the Dragon Balls and the healing process of Vegeta and Goku plus some side-stuff on Earth and the Galactic Patrol, Buu awaking and demanding food and stuff like that.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:58 pm

Michsi wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm
Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?
Whis not mentioning how Goku and Vegeta were in trouble was super weird and bit out of character for me. I mean , Whis isn't the kind of person to get majorly involved in every conflict, but you'd think he would at least inform Beerus of what the complete scenario is on Namek.

Maybe it's just me, but I feel as though, since the conclusion of the Future Trunks arc, Toyotaro's character writing has been quite poor across the board.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:05 pm

Liquir wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:53 pm
TheRed259 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:33 pm
3 Dragon Balls in 3 days?

I was expecting him to have all 7 by the time Goku and Vegeta woke up.
Indeed. long time to do so..
Even if he enjoyed slowly torturing the Namekians and not in a hurry to gather the Dragon Balls it's still too long, the way he quickly disposed of them, he should have destroyed more Villages by now.
Only logical thing for it would be the Namekians are simply not telling him where the Dragon Balls are, so him and Cranberry have to search them manually and he can't use force so he don't destroy them in the process.
Either way, it's going to be good for the anime, gives them extra footage they can use. One or two additional episodes in which they showcase those days where Moro searches the Dragon Balls and the healing process of Vegeta and Goku plus some side-stuff on Earth and the Galactic Patrol, Buu awaking and demanding food and stuff like that.
They did that with Freeza and he still got the Dragon Balls in a few minutes. Even Vegeta got the Dragon Ball in a few minutes after no one told him the Dragon Ball was.

And we don't even know if the anime is going to adapt this arc. In fact, if the pre-production started in October, they're likely not. That and the Super anime doesn't dragged stuff like that. They're not going spend two episodes of Moro dicking around.
Lord Beerus wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:58 pm
Michsi wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm
Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?
Whis not mentioning how Goku and Vegeta were in trouble was super weird and bit out of character for me. I mean , Whis isn't the kind of person to get majorly involved in every conflict, but you'd think he would at least inform Beerus of what the complete scenario is on Namek.

Maybe it's just me, but I feel as though, since the conclusion of the Future Trunks arc, Toyotaro's character writing has been quite poor across the board.
Future Trunks Saga's character writing wasn't the good either like how he wrote Black.
Last edited by HeroR on Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Michsi » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:06 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:58 pm
Michsi wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm
Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?
Whis not mentioning how Goku and Vegeta were in trouble was super weird and bit out of character for me. I mean , Whis isn't the kind of person to get majorly involved in every conflict, but you'd think he would at least inform Beerus of what the complete scenario is on Namek.

Maybe it's just me, but I feel as though, since the conclusion of the Future Trunks arc, Toyotaro's character writing has been quite poor across the board.
I haven't read the manga version FT arc yet (will get to it soon) but I've been seeing people complain about how he handles characters a lot . Guess I'm one of them now. I don't want to assign blame too much cuz you never know if wasn't Toriyama's doing.

I swear, every character is a bit worse in the manga with the exception of Vegeta.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by namekiansaiyan » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:10 pm

Every arc will have Beerus being lazy and not getting involved.

Moro will probably end up failing to control someone's power and lose.
Last edited by namekiansaiyan on Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:14 pm

This was a nice chapter. I still feel like the pacing is too slow and that Toyotaro could be advancing the plot more.
The excuse to not have Beerus go and fight Moro is lame, as other people have pointed out. It would have been better if he was sleeping, or if Toyotaro didn’t show him at all. Nobody asked what was happening to Beerus, and it was reasonable to assume that he had no idea of what was happening. Hell, it seems like neither Whis nor Beerus had any idea of the destruction Moro and Majin Buu were causing millions of years ago, as they also had no idea that Freeza was resurrected during the events of RoF.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kinokima » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:14 pm

I honestly really enjoyed this chapter except the Namekian part (since we never met the Namekian then saying he was super strong and then getting beat right away is pretty meaningless. We already know Moro is strong because he beat Goku & Vegeta) and also Yeah Moro is sadly a pretty generic villain. But at least he is less boring then Jiren so it’s not too bad

However what I really loved was the drama. I love that the Namekians couldn’t completely heal Goku and Vegeta. So tired of all these things that make things too easy for our heroes.


And I also don’t mind that Moro left them not dead. I I guess to Moro letting them die slowly was better. It’s not like Moro would know the Namekians were capable of healing. Yeah in a way it’s stupid but we know Goku & Vegeta have to survive somehow so it doesn’t bother me too much.

I am also glad Beerus and Whis are not getting involved. I like them as comic relief or as mentors but I dont want them to help solve problems.


Finally of course I loved the “My Vegeta” part


Personally I am enjoying this arc 100% more than the TOP in the manga or anime.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Raimundo » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:18 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:58 pm
Michsi wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm
Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?
Whis not mentioning how Goku and Vegeta were in trouble was super weird and bit out of character for me. I mean , Whis isn't the kind of person to get majorly involved in every conflict, but you'd think he would at least inform Beerus of what the complete scenario is on Namek.

Maybe it's just me, but I feel as though, since the conclusion of the Future Trunks arc, Toyotaro's character writing has been quite poor across the board.
That’s how I’ve been feeling as well. I find the characterization of most of the major characters subpar post-FT arc
Kinokima wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:14 pm
I honestly really enjoyed this chapter except the Namekian part (since we never met the Namekian then saying he was super strong and then getting beat right away is pretty meaningless. We already know Moro is strong because he beat Goku & Vegeta) and also Yeah Moro is sadly a pretty generic villain. But at least he is less boring then Jiren so it’s not too bad

However what I really loved was the drama. I love that the Namekians couldn’t completely heal Goku and Vegeta. So tired of all these things that make things too easy for our heroes.


And I also don’t mind that Moro left them not dead. I I guess to Moro letting them die slowly was better. It’s not like Moro would know the Namekians were capable of healing. Yeah in a way it’s stupid but we know Goku & Vegeta have to survive somehow so it doesn’t bother me too much.

I am also glad Beerus and Whis are not getting involved. I like them as comic relief or as mentors but I dont want them to help solve problems.


Finally of course I loved the “My Vegeta” part


Personally I am enjoying this arc 100% more than the TOP in the manga or anime.
He seems about as boring as Jiren was so far
Last edited by Raimundo on Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Marlowe89 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:19 pm

Kanassa wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:07 am
Wait, so suddenly things don't count as character development if the narrative doesn't make a big deal and point out that it's development?
That's not what I said. I specifically said a lot of your examples stem from Beerus' development during the BoG arc and were not necessarily cases of development by themselves.

Let's just get this out of the way right now: Beerus doesn't care about Goku and Vegeta's safety enough to get off his ass when shit hits the fan. He didn't care when they were fighting Freeza, he didn't care when they were fighting Black in Trunks' timeline, he didn't care when they were fighting Broly. In two out of three of those examples, he flat-out said he didn't care. His erasure of Zamasu or newfound respect for some of Goku's friends doesn't suddenly imply otherwise; he can be a lazy buffoon overall and still occasionally take action, since that's hardly black and white.

This is a case of confirmation bias where you're reaching for irrelevant nonsense to support the notion that Beerus isn't apathetic and lazy while ignoring everything else in the series that fully demonstrates he's still apathetic and lazy. His only real development in Super material - namely Battle of Gods - had nothing to do with his competence at his job.
He has every reason to go after Shin both because of his previous encounter and because he wants revenge.
And even if that were true, Beerus doesn't know that.

Every month you people try to look for instances of character regression where they don't exist. It's such a passé stance at this point because it's often rooted in opinions about how characters should behave rather than how they instrinsically do behave based on their personality and character flaws.
Last edited by Marlowe89 on Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:33 pm

emperior wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:14 pm
This was a nice chapter. I still feel like the pacing is too slow and that Toyotaro could be advancing the plot more.
The excuse to not have Beerus go and fight Moro is lame, as other people have pointed out. It would have been better if he was sleeping, or if Toyotaro didn’t show him at all. Nobody asked what was happening to Beerus, and it was reasonable to assume that he had no idea of what was happening. Hell, it seems like neither Whis nor Beerus had any idea of the destruction Moro and Majin Buu were causing millions of years ago, as they also had no idea that Freeza was resurrected during the events of RoF.

Whis knew about Buu's destruction in the manga. He just didn't bother to wake up Beerus about it, for some reasons. And Whis was training Goku and Vegeta when Freeza was revived.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by HeroR » Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:38 pm

Raimundo wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:18 pm
Lord Beerus wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:58 pm
Michsi wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 1:10 pm
Beerus' portrayal and Whis, even though clearly annoyed Beerus' chooses to do nothing, failing to mention Goku and Vegeta's presence on Namek. Why?
Whis not mentioning how Goku and Vegeta were in trouble was super weird and bit out of character for me. I mean , Whis isn't the kind of person to get majorly involved in every conflict, but you'd think he would at least inform Beerus of what the complete scenario is on Namek.

Maybe it's just me, but I feel as though, since the conclusion of the Future Trunks arc, Toyotaro's character writing has been quite poor across the board.
That’s how I’ve been feeling as well. I find the characterization of most of the major characters subpar post-FT arc
Kinokima wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:14 pm
I honestly really enjoyed this chapter except the Namekian part (since we never met the Namekian then saying he was super strong and then getting beat right away is pretty meaningless. We already know Moro is strong because he beat Goku & Vegeta) and also Yeah Moro is sadly a pretty generic villain. But at least he is less boring then Jiren so it’s not too bad

However what I really loved was the drama. I love that the Namekians couldn’t completely heal Goku and Vegeta. So tired of all these things that make things too easy for our heroes.


And I also don’t mind that Moro left them not dead. I I guess to Moro letting them die slowly was better. It’s not like Moro would know the Namekians were capable of healing. Yeah in a way it’s stupid but we know Goku & Vegeta have to survive somehow so it doesn’t bother me too much.

I am also glad Beerus and Whis are not getting involved. I like them as comic relief or as mentors but I dont want them to help solve problems.


Finally of course I loved the “My Vegeta” part


Personally I am enjoying this arc 100% more than the TOP in the manga or anime.
He seems about as boring as Jiren was so far

He's more boring Jiren. Jiren may have been dry and stoic, but he gave great fights and the fact that he was a hero with a tone of issues made him interesting. Moro is just a generic villain and there is no there, there with him. What you see is what you get, which is ashamed since his power could be interesting, but Toyo have no creativity.

Not helping that this arc is only going because the heroes and how the villain was dumb. First, Goku and Vegeta knew about his drain ability, yet they still allowed Moro to drain them. Even more annoying, they let him eat an energy ball right in front of them. Now we have Moro grabbing the Villain Ball and leave the heroes half dead instead of finishing them. This is so cliche that it's honestly painful.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:06 pm

HeroR wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:33 pm


Whis knew about Buu's destruction in the manga. He just didn't bother to wake up Beerus about it, for some reasons. And Whis was training Goku and Vegeta when Freeza was revived.
Mind telling me which chapter this was elaborated on?
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by AnimeNation101 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:19 pm

Super Saiyan Turlast x4 wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:06 pm
HeroR wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 3:33 pm


Whis knew about Buu's destruction in the manga. He just didn't bother to wake up Beerus about it, for some reasons. And Whis was training Goku and Vegeta when Freeza was revived.
Mind telling me which chapter this was elaborated on?
Lmao, wasn’t this only a thing in Dragon Ball Multiverse? Whis knowing of Buu’s destruction and not waking Beerus up?
I called it that Gogeta, Bardock, and something Broly related would be in the movie before it was even announced that it was a Broly movie. 8)

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by dbzfan7 » Tue Mar 19, 2019 4:50 pm

I'm honestly surprised Toriyama is ok with what Toyotaro put down here. I guess he is really lax when it comes to proof checking as well as ok with this story. Moro's alright, I don't mind him. I like the situation he puts us in rather than the character. He still has a better design and personality than Jiren, but that's like impossible to be worse than. Making it so Super Saiyan forms can't happen and weaponizing the planet is neat. I wonder what he even wants from the Dragon Balls anyways. Well we'll see I guess. Hopefully not the Piccolo Daimao special.

Still not really interested in what Goku and Vegeta are doing as it doesn't feel much different or unique from any other interaction they are put in. I mean no one is upset about Vegeta? I get he is good and is doing good things, but it shouldn't be so easy for him to be forgiven here. He still slaughtered tribes that will NEVER come back. At least that would make an interesting scenario where the nameks are hesitant around him still, and Goku has to help them accept Vegeta. As well as Vegeta trying to make amends, and show his changed ways. Instead I feel this as a MEMBER NAMEK!!! thing.

I liked the beginning stuff with the galactic patrol involvement, and I really hope Boo comes into play. At the moment this kinda feels like a filler ala the evil goo from that Super filler arc. It's about as compelling as that too. I'm still more interested than the lows of the Tournament of Power, and probably most of it since it's just fighty fight fighty. So I remain cautiously optimistic.

Oh and Beerus as highlighted continues to become a character I once liked that I hardly want to see anymore. Like Goku in a perpetual mud hole going nowhere.
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