Yeah, Piccolo and Gohan mention that Vegeta is using the same Blue form from the TOP in this chapter. IE That evolved version of Blue.
Which Vegeta also used against Moro, earlier in the arc.
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Yeah, Piccolo and Gohan mention that Vegeta is using the same Blue form from the TOP in this chapter. IE That evolved version of Blue.
Agreed. I stated the evolved version of Blue, meaning Blue evolution.Noitsnothim wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 1:57 amIt is evolution (The aura is flamelike like SSG)
I like the Manga's version better than the anime'sMiracles wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 2:16 amAgreed. I stated the evolved version of Blue, meaning Blue evolution.
The form Vegeta used in the TOP. Like Piccolo and Gohan were discussing.
Me too. The anime made Vegeta look like he's advertising for Crest toothpaste.Noitsnothim wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 2:20 amI like the Manga's version better than the anime's
Thank you. I've read through some more of Cipher's tweets, and the overall impression I'm getting is that this is mostly an interpretation of manga statements, there's not really any new information here. It's an interesting summary, I guess, but the way I see it, it doesn't really "resolve" the Not-Kaioken thing. We'll probably just have to ask Toyotaro directly...The Undying wrote: ↑Fri May 22, 2020 1:21 pm Cipher translated the whole thing here:
Some key takeaways:
- "Blue Kaioken" might be a convenient shorthand rather than a literal Kaioken. The blurb still mentions that he's only using the principles of Kaioken to stress the form beyond its normal limit, just like what the manga said, although I suppose it's all up to interpretation.
- Goku and Vegeta really did learn to transform into Super Saiyan God on their own after Battle of Gods. I'd suspected this, but it's nice to have that extra confirmation. The ritual retains its status as a temporary method, but it's just one of two ways to activate SSG.
- Blue Vegetto rivals Beerus. Not sure why that was ever debatable (there wouldn't be dialogue mentioning it in the first place if it wasn't true) but there you go.
- Blue Evolved is a "uniquely styled mastery of Blue", so it's still just Blue at its core.
None of this information is terribly new, but it confirms what you could infer by just reading the manga.
I also like Moro. And I even welcome characters like Saganbo and 7-3.Draconic wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 6:10 am Some great action this chapter. However, this chapter really confirms to me that this whole thing is just filler. Goku still can't use UI, even though he trained for it, and Vegeta hasn't moved past Blue Evolution. The status quo is the same as at the end of the Tournament of Power. Nothing changed, like... at all... Vegeta learned a new technique and that's kind of it.
Each passing chapter I'm liking Moro's design more and more... I don't know, but it keeps growing on me. I don't think he's great by any means, but I don't think he's a trainwreck either. Merus on the other hand... terrible character.
It doesn't help that Moro himself is paper-thin. He doesn't have any real chemistry with any character in the main cast unlike previous antagonists, and the story itself lacks the base through thread of actual narrative for them (the cast) as well. They're all just there because they read the script at this point. Goku, the main character, can be removed from the entire arc and not much would change. That's a huge problem.
He's not the only one, As Broly, Jiren, and Hit suffered from the same issues. Broly was a raging lunatic, Jiren had the personality of a spoon, and Hit although had interesting abilities, he didn't have much of a personality. That's a far cry from Freeza, Beerus, Cell, Fat Buu, etc. Moro definitely has interesting abilities and a great design, but his personality and character could've used more work.
What about the progress of Goku being able to transform into UI sign at will?Draconic wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 6:10 am Some great action this chapter. However, this chapter really confirms to me that this whole thing is just filler. Goku still can't use UI, even though he trained for it, and Vegeta hasn't moved past Blue Evolution. The status quo is the same as at the end of the Tournament of Power. Nothing changed, like... at all... Vegeta learned a new technique and that's kind of it.
Each passing chapter I'm liking Moro's design more and more... I don't know, but it keeps growing on me. I don't think he's great by any means, but I don't think he's a trainwreck either. Merus on the other hand... terrible character.
I agree, Moro doesn’t have that connection to the protagonists like other villains did. Even someone like Jiren, who a lot of people hate, had conflict with Goku and his beliefs. Moro is just like, “hey you mortals are strong let me suck your energy and continue to grow stronger.” Which is a shame, by the way, because I like his design and powers. The arc also dipped in quality after the fights on Namek, which I thought were more tense and fun to read.Kagari wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 1:48 pmIt doesn't help that Moro himself is paper-thin. He doesn't have any real chemistry with any character in the main cast unlike previous antagonists, and the story itself lacks the base through thread of actual narrative for them (the cast) as well. They're all just there because they read the script at this point. Goku, the main character, can be removed from the entire arc and not much would change. That's a huge problem.
Exactly, I think that's the missing piece that makes Moro feel more like a movie villain than a true antagonist, because aside from killing innocents and fighting, what specific personality trait or conflict of interest of his is antagonistic to our protagonists' ideologies? Buu had similar problems but he made up for it with a more unique personality which contrasted against the other characters in fun ways (at least until he started absorbing people and lost most of those traits).MajinMan wrote: ↑Sun May 24, 2020 4:16 amI agree, Moro doesn’t have that connection to the protagonists like other villains did. Even someone like Jiren, who a lot of people hate, had conflict with Goku and his beliefs. Moro is just like, “hey you mortals are strong let me suck your energy and continue to grow stronger.” Which is a shame, by the way, because I like his design and powers. The arc also dipped in quality after the fights on Namek, which I thought were more tense and fun to read.Kagari wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 1:48 pmIt doesn't help that Moro himself is paper-thin. He doesn't have any real chemistry with any character in the main cast unlike previous antagonists, and the story itself lacks the base through thread of actual narrative for them (the cast) as well. They're all just there because they read the script at this point. Goku, the main character, can be removed from the entire arc and not much would change. That's a huge problem.
Buu too didn’t have much chemistry with the characters, but he was interesting and what was happening around him was even more interesting.Kagari wrote: ↑Sat May 23, 2020 1:48 pmIt doesn't help that Moro himself is paper-thin. He doesn't have any real chemistry with any character in the main cast unlike previous antagonists, and the story itself lacks the base through thread of actual narrative for them (the cast) as well. They're all just there because they read the script at this point. Goku, the main character, can be removed from the entire arc and not much would change. That's a huge problem.