"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Noitsnothim]

Ok so if you go back in this arc to when Buu and the Grand Supreme Kai Switch you can see that the grand Supreme Kai is wearing his Potara. This means one of two things.

Either this is just Buu’s body morphing that part to look like Potara.

OR

The vastly more interesting idea that when Buu absorbed the Grand Supreme Kai he also absorbed his Potara and those are real. Meaning Goku and Vegeta have access to Potara on the fly while on Earth.

I think this is probably just the former - I think the Future Trunks arc put Potara Fusion to bed by showing us that a super-powerful fusion of mortals by this means is so unstable that it could end at any moment. The stronger Goku and Vegeta are, the less stable it is, I should think. They might never use it again.

Moreover, I think the last couple of issues have actively tried to discount a fusion solution of any kind, particularly by having Moro steal Vegeta's Forced Spirit Fission powers - Piccolo specifically notes that all the fusion methods previously available are useless as a result. I think that's just as well - fusion needs a rest after seeing action against both Zamas and Broly, as well as featuring for Universe 6 in the Tournament of Power.

I agree I feel like fusion has been overdone too many times already (Gogeta shouldn't be brought back until the next couple sagas where instead of Blue he'll go into UI Omen/true *Silver*) them not fusing to beat an enemy of this caliber not only further cements how strong those two have become but also that they've move beyond the need of fusing

[Magnificent Ponta]

So, the general pattern of this thread over its many pages (Chapter -> Hot Takes -> Arguments and other opinions -> Resurgence of Hot Takes -> Further argument and scattered comment -> Lull -> Repeat) makes me curious as to whether there's any appetite here for a different set of threads doing a DBS manga retrospective, of similar style to what I can see in the DB Rewatch threads? Maybe like 4 chapters per thread, or something?

Just wondering, now there's some distance and a set of fully-developed plots in the Dragon Ball Super manga to discuss (rather than just a set of progressing story increments), whether anything like that would be of interest?

[Skar]

We now know Volume 13’s spine art:
https://mobile.twitter.com/DBSChronicle ... 3703923712

Usually each character take up 3 volumes of spine-art, therefore the manga should last at least until chapter 68. So, at least until January 2021.
I honestly doubt the Moro arc will be this long so I think it’s safe to assume that the manga isn’t ending anytime soon.

That makes sense. The spineart has shown most of the major antagonists so far except Freeza since that was skipped in the manga. Since the Broly movie was also skipped, we might see Moro and some other new characters from this saga after Belmod. I can't see this saga lasting until December but it might have to if the next one is announced at Jump Festa.

[MCDaveG]

Ok so if you go back in this arc to when Buu and the Grand Supreme Kai Switch you can see that the grand Supreme Kai is wearing his Potara. This means one of two things.

Either this is just Buu’s body morphing that part to look like Potara.

OR

The vastly more interesting idea that when Buu absorbed the Grand Supreme Kai he also absorbed his Potara and those are real. Meaning Goku and Vegeta have access to Potara on the fly while on Earth.

I think this is probably just the former - I think the Future Trunks arc put Potara Fusion to bed by showing us that a super-powerful fusion of mortals by this means is so unstable that it could end at any moment. The stronger Goku and Vegeta are, the less stable it is, I should think. They might never use it again.

Moreover, I think the last couple of issues have actively tried to discount a fusion solution of any kind, particularly by having Moro steal Vegeta's Forced Spirit Fission powers - Piccolo specifically notes that all the fusion methods previously available are useless as a result. I think that's just as well - fusion needs a rest after seeing action against both Zamas and Broly, as well as featuring for Universe 6 in the Tournament of Power.

I agree I feel like fusion has been overdone too many times already (Gogeta shouldn't be brought back until the next couple sagas where instead of Blue he'll go into UI Omen/true *Silver*) them not fusing to beat an enemy of this caliber not only further cements how strong those two have become but also that they've move beyond the need of fusing

Everything has been really overdone by this point and as I am happy that the defusion in Buu arc got explained, at the same time I am kinda bummed, that it is now really just another fusion and it doesn't feel unique at all. Ton of Super Saiyans, fusions, same attacks. I would really love something groundbreaking, as now after the introduction of Multiverse and the more lore info we get, the DB universe feels now somewhat small and finite. When I look back, Dragon Ball Online was something that got me excited the most and I really liked the atmosphere of the game. It felt like Dragon Ball. But, after it was cancelled, they took parts that were Z enough and used it for Xenoverse and Heroes, but somehow the Z formula is not exciting for me anymore... being old fan really sucks, sometimes I get those boomers and their ''Man, Star Wars is not as good as it was before''. My gripe with modern Dragon Ball is Super production quality and the Moro arc + over the top recycling and I hope, they will either push it further or end it.

[emperior]

We now know Volume 13’s spine art:
https://mobile.twitter.com/DBSChronicle ... 3703923712

Usually each character take up 3 volumes of spine-art, therefore the manga should last at least until chapter 68. So, at least until January 2021.
I honestly doubt the Moro arc will be this long so I think it’s safe to assume that the manga isn’t ending anytime soon.

That makes sense. The spineart has shown most of the major antagonists so far except Freeza since that was skipped in the manga. Since the Broly movie was also skipped, we might see Moro and some other new characters from this saga after Belmod. I can't see this saga lasting until December but it might have to if the next one is announced at Jump Festa.

This may indicate that Super is meant to go on for a very long time, surely past Moro, or else I feel like Toyotaro wouldn’t have included Toppo and Belmod over characters like Freeza or Moro.

Broly too still has to appear in the manga and I doubt he won’t make it in the spine art in the future.

And if this lasted until December it would be ending at chapter 66, so 4 more chapters. That could make sense in my opinion. It’s also possible the new arc will have already started by Jump Festa and it will be promoted there, and maybe new characters appearing later in the arc will also be revealed there.

[Dragon Wukong]

I can't believe (though I have seen) people actually believe the manga would end after the Moro arc. Well, it's nice to see some confirmation (in a sense) from the spine art that puts that'll put that idea to rest.

[Alruneia]

I can't believe (though I have seen) people actually believe the manga would end after the Moro arc. Well, it's nice to see some confirmation (in a sense) from the spine art that puts that'll put that idea to rest.

I wonder how much of that is actual belief that the manga is ending and how much of it is actually a wish for the manga to end. It's not a secret to anybody that some people actively want the Super manga to end and those responsible for it to be sacked. It's natural to believe what we want to believe to an extent.

Anyway, as far as the idea of the manga ending here goes, I'll just quote myself:

[...] I think it's unlikely that the Moro arc will be the last one, since there's still things left to do. At the very least, Goku still needs to fully master Ultra Instinct, otherwise his journey in Super will be kinda incomplete. (That doesn't have to happen before EoZ, mind you, but it should happen at some point.)

I'm also happy to see the spine art point to more chapters coming, but in my eyes, the alternative was already pretty unlikely.

[Noitsnothim]

I think this is probably just the former - I think the Future Trunks arc put Potara Fusion to bed by showing us that a super-powerful fusion of mortals by this means is so unstable that it could end at any moment. The stronger Goku and Vegeta are, the less stable it is, I should think. They might never use it again.

Moreover, I think the last couple of issues have actively tried to discount a fusion solution of any kind, particularly by having Moro steal Vegeta's Forced Spirit Fission powers - Piccolo specifically notes that all the fusion methods previously available are useless as a result. I think that's just as well - fusion needs a rest after seeing action against both Zamas and Broly, as well as featuring for Universe 6 in the Tournament of Power.

I agree I feel like fusion has been overdone too many times already (Gogeta shouldn't be brought back until the next couple sagas where instead of Blue he'll go into UI Omen/true *Silver*) them not fusing to beat an enemy of this caliber not only further cements how strong those two have become but also that they've move beyond the need of fusing

Everything has been really overdone by this point and as I am happy that the defusion in Buu arc got explained, at the same time I am kinda bummed, that it is now really just another fusion and it doesn't feel unique at all. Ton of Super Saiyans, fusions, same attacks. I would really love something groundbreaking, as now after the introduction of Multiverse and the more lore info we get, the DB universe feels now somewhat small and finite. When I look back, Dragon Ball Online was something that got me excited the most and I really liked the atmosphere of the game. It felt like Dragon Ball. But, after it was cancelled, they took parts that were Z enough and used it for Xenoverse and Heroes, but somehow the Z formula is not exciting for me anymore... being old fan really sucks, sometimes I get those boomers and their ''Man, Star Wars is not as good as it was before''. My gripe with modern Dragon Ball is Super production quality and the Moro arc + over the top recycling and I hope, they will either push it further or end it.

The explanation of Vegito's defusion in the Boo saga was horrible (why make Potara fusion for mortals literally Fusion dance except the stronger the two fusees are the less time they have for the fusion to be sustained whereas fusion dance offers no drawbacks and must be endured throught the duration of the 30 minutes) Super's not ending anytime soon but it can be improved from here on out if fans vocal their opinions to Toei/Shueisha Akira Toriyama needs to be more involved in the production of the anime/Movies and manga serialization cause Toyo is just not cutting it for me anymore

[DiscountDabi]

The explanation of Vegito's defusion in the Boo saga was horrible (why make Potara fusion for mortals literally Fusion dance except the stronger the two fusees are the less time they have for the fusion to be sustained whereas fusion dance offers no drawbacks and must be endured throught the duration of the 30 minutes)

The English here isn’t that good, not to be rude. I’m guessing you mean to say why make potara fusion for mortals only an hour as it makes it worse than the fusion dance. Well not necessarily, as you still have the draw back of the bad guy not standing there letting you do the dance. Granted you have the same thing for Potara but its way easier to hide and put on an earring than to do a dance.

Not to mention you still have the fact that you don’t have to be equal to use potara, and its way less likely to fail unlike the dance where Goku and Vegeta failed twice costing them an hour

[ChronoTwigger]

If Frieza had to appear in the spine he should have long before, and probably Broly will be not there (why do a movie retell? It will be a movie spoiler on his own).
Also, spines are not actual hints on any manga lenght, some ended abruptly (like BT'X did, if my memory serves me well) before the panorama completed.

I don't think the manga will stop abruptly, but until something big is about to come it will be filler after filler after filler - considering we actually don't know what TOEI is planning for DB canon future. I don't want to see money wasted on this MORO arc.
Who knows, maybe some Beerus adventure. The story doesn't progress, but it could be nice to see him in action FOR REAL. Or a simple Sadal escapade with no consequence.

[Noitsnothim]

The explanation of Vegito's defusion in the Boo saga was horrible (why make Potara fusion for mortals literally Fusion dance except the stronger the two fusees are the less time they have for the fusion to be sustained whereas fusion dance offers no drawbacks and must be endured throught the duration of the 30 minutes)

The English here isn’t that good, not to be rude. I’m guessing you mean to say why make potara fusion for mortals only an hour as it makes it worse than the fusion dance. Well not necessarily, as you still have the draw back of the bad guy not standing there letting you do the dance. Granted you have the same thing for Potara but its way easier to hide and put on an earring than to do a dance.

Not to mention you still have the fact that you don’t have to be equal to use potara, and its way less likely to fail unlike the dance where Goku and Vegeta failed twice costing them an hour

Not rude at all I'm bad at articulating my thoughts on here at times lol Goku and Vegeta becoming Vegito would make no sense (as I've said before) at the level they're at right now the Potara fusion might not last the 30 minute duration

[Noitsnothim]

If Frieza had to appear in the spine he should have long before, and probably Broly will be not there (why do a movie retell? It will be a movie spoiler on his own).
Also, spines are not actual hints on any manga lenght, some ended abruptly (like BT'X did, if my memory serves me well) before the panorama completed.

I don't think the manga will stop abruptly, but until something big is about to come it will be filler after filler after filler - considering we actually don't know what TOEI is planning for DB canon future. I don't want to see money wasted on this MORO arc.
Who knows, maybe some Beerus adventure. The story doesn't progress, but it could be nice to see him in action FOR REAL. Or a simple Sadal escapade with no consequence.

I suspect Broly, Cheelai, and Lemo will come after Marcarita

[FortuneSSJ]

I can't believe (though I have seen) people actually believe the manga would end after the Moro arc.

It's understandable. A lot of us didn't believe the anime would end after ToP, due the amount of money DB is making nowadays and here we are 2+ years later.

[obiwan23s]

So, the general pattern of this thread over its many pages (Chapter -> Hot Takes -> Arguments and other opinions -> Resurgence of Hot Takes -> Further argument and scattered comment -> Lull -> Repeat) makes me curious as to whether there's any appetite here for a different set of threads doing a DBS manga retrospective, of similar style to what I can see in the DB Rewatch threads? Maybe like 4 chapters per thread, or something?

Just wondering, now there's some distance and a set of fully-developed plots in the Dragon Ball Super manga to discuss (rather than just a set of progressing story increments), whether anything like that would be of interest?

I'd be highly interested in a thread like that. I just purchased the English version of books 2-9 (already owned 1) because I am enjoying the Moro arc so much that I really wanted to go back and read the previous stuff. I mainly just read the online version of the new chapter, so it was nice to be able to read thru the previous arcs in full. There are some good moments in both the Goku Black and TOP arcs that the anime doesn't have. It left me with the opinion that the only arc that is really better in the anime version is the Tournament of Power. Mainly because Kale KO's so many combatants by herself in the manga. I also didn't really care for Gohan vs Kefla and felt him defeating a fused character is much less believable than UI Sign Goku doing it. However, the rest of the manga is pretty solid and I do like Toyotarou's artwork a lot. Would be cool to go through it again and have some fresh discussions without as many hot takes.

[DevilKing99]

The Saiyans of universe 6 are the defenders of their universe, if one day a villain comes into their universe to use Super Dragon Balls or the Dragon Balls of the Nameks Kyabe, Kale and Caulifla will be there to defend their universe!

And there is still a lot to tell with them like Caulifla's relationship with King Sadala, she has a large territory on Sadala, the Saiyan legend of universe 6 which could be deepened at the same time, new transformations for Kale, Caulifla and Kyabe and why not the Metamol fusion for Caulifla and Kale to create a new warrior!

Anyway ... I want to see the new characters fight with Goku and Vegeta! I'm fed up with characters whose development is complete like Gohan, Krillin, Piccolo, Android 18 and 17!

And Broly there is nothing more to say about him! The thing we can get from him is new fights and nothing more and maybe future interactions with Kale!

The new characters like Hit, Caulifla, Kale, Kyabe, Jiren need more development!

We need new scenery too, so fights in new planets in other universes, so on...

Currently we are going around in circles and the stories repeat themselves with the same characters in the same place.

I hope the next arc one takes place outside Universe 7, with Goku and Vegeta of course, and the new characters from Universe 6 and 11!

My first post on this forum and I have to say I agree with this 100%,

With the Pride Troopers or the Saiyans of Planet Sadala, you can introduce an infinite amount of characters to develop or follow. As Well as new planets to see, there is Jiren master to who was one of the pride troopers and with the U6 Saiyans, there is fact King Sadala exists which means there is a royal Saiyan family of U6 to follow.

Even as a major Human fan I think the story is suffering from just focusing on U7, because there is pretty much nothing to develop in U7 besides my man Tien unlocking some three-eyed human power-up or Uub and the next and that's pretty much it. Even with the next-gen heroes of Earth, you would run into the same problem as we would get no world building because we would still be stuck on Earth.

Toriyama, plus his editors plus Toei and even Bandai Writers already explored Namek, Earth, Planet Vegeta, and U7 long ago.

It's honestly kinda baffling to me I don't see this more topics like this with the Pride Troopers or Saiyans of Planet Sadala straight up having an infinite amount of potential stores to tell as they both go around there entire universe helping people out and having been doing it for well over 100,000 years since Toyo reveled Belmod used to be a Pride Trooper.

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

I mean, they should take the next arc out of Universe 7. Moro ate most of Universe 7 anyway and most of the people are dead, so Goku and Vegeta might as well go see what other universes look like beyond the surface level. Even when Moro's killed, most of Universe 7 is still dead.

[DiscountDabi]

I mean, they should take the next arc out of Universe 7. Moro ate most of Universe 7 anyway and most of the people are dead, so Goku and Vegeta might as well go see what other universes look like beyond the surface level. Even when Moro's killed, most of Universe 7 is still dead.

See, that would be great if we had consequences. But alas, dragon balls.

[Magnificent Ponta]

I mean, they should take the next arc out of Universe 7. Moro ate most of Universe 7 anyway and most of the people are dead, so Goku and Vegeta might as well go see what other universes look like beyond the surface level. Even when Moro's killed, most of Universe 7 is still dead.

See, that would be great if we had consequences. But alas, dragon balls.

Hmm. Consequences are fine and all, but at this point I wouldn't mind if the Super Dragon Balls did some fixing in Universe 7 - after all, we can't use what isn't there any more. I'd rather we had a Universe full of options for new stories rather than a dead one, unless this itself becomes the driving problem that occasions a future arc.

I'd be highly interested in a thread like that. I just purchased the English version of books 2-9 (already owned 1) because I am enjoying the Moro arc so much that I really wanted to go back and read the previous stuff. I mainly just read the online version of the new chapter, so it was nice to be able to read thru the previous arcs in full. There are some good moments in both the Goku Black and TOP arcs that the anime doesn't have. It left me with the opinion that the only arc that is really better in the anime version is the Tournament of Power. Mainly because Kale KO's so many combatants by herself in the manga. I also didn't really care for Gohan vs Kefla and felt him defeating a fused character is much less believable than UI Sign Goku doing it. However, the rest of the manga is pretty solid and I do like Toyotarou's artwork a lot. Would be cool to go through it again and have some fresh discussions without as many hot takes.

Cool, thanks for your reply (to be honest, I was starting to worry that there might not be any interest -_-').

I was thinking of maybe doing it fortnightly, and including stuff like Toyotarou's Revival of F promo manga, the bonus chapters and the interstitial drawings for the volumes (though they're mostly gags). I don't know if anyone has suggestions of anything else they'd like to see?

[Femme Fatale Kikaza]

Honestly they should have the consequences of Moro's planet feast be a thing. I mean, other than Earth, Yardrat and some of Namek, everywhere else has been screwed over by Moro and his army. Even when Moro's defeated, I'm not too sure if they'll be able to use the super dragon balls. Besides, wishing it away would feel hollow.

[Matches Malone]

I wonder how much of that is actual belief that the manga is ending and how much of it is actually a wish for the manga to end.

A lot of it was wishful thinking, and unrealistically at that. There's simply too many plot points to resolve before it ends. We've got Freeza, Planet Sadala, Broly, the 4 universes that didn't take part in the TOP, Goku fully mastering UI, and finally (I think) Beerus getting his rematch with Goku and Vegeta. Once those are resolved, then we can start seriously considering the possibility of it ending.