"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Gt91 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:55 am

What can i say, it's one of the best chapter so far.
A LOT OF STUFF, really!

-Vegeta is following the path of a God of destruction, and this is great! I hope to see a new trasformation soon!
- MUI is only the beginning ... well, we knew it, but NOT at this level! MUI level 2 incoming?
- Good to see Whis in action as well. Is this the first time he actually used a kick? Or a punch?
- Granolah, his planet, his story, his eye ecc are very intruguing!
- Same for the new characters! The little guys is the strongest there? Wow.
- The "intel" theme is something new, isn't it? With Zuno they can know everything.
- I think there is a transmitter inside "the money" that the "ant guy" left for Granollah.
- We'll see freezer for sure, maybe broly too? He's a sayan after all, and Granollah can find him somehow.
- The last page is everything.... HYPE
Last edited by Gt91 on Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by The Undying » Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:59 am

Right off the bat, we already have a better grasp of this arc's underlying premise than the previous arc's own premise and themes when it began. That's important because it keeps the audience invested, which the chapter accomplishes by dedicating more of its panel space to exploring Granolah, his backstory, and his connections with the main cast so the reader can easily parse how various narrative elements and characters are going to come together. We don't know how they're going to come together, but we're aware of the mission statement. The plotting here is infinitely more interesting than anything with Moro on New Namek.

Also right off the bat, there's a stark difference in pacing between this month's chapter and the Galactic Patrol Prisoner arc's first (full) chapter. All 45 pages cover quite a bit of material, everything seems to tie into its main throughline, its individual beats are brisk and to-the-point as is typical of the original manga, and there are no largely irrelevant filler sequences (like the train heist) that go nowhere and overstay their welcome. DB's rapid quickfire progression is a large part of why its storytelling works so well, and it's one aspect of the Super manga's pre-GPP arcs I missed, so hopefully we'll see that kind of momentum continue. I can do without another story that drags its heels and pads everything to 11 from start to finish.

Lastly, I don't get the impression that this arc is trying to "rehash" anything in particular thus far. Sure, Elec's crew has similar clothing to Bojack's crew, and yes, Movie 9 is one of the worst DBZ films, but any perceived parallels end there. A lot of stuff in this chapter feels like fresh territory for Dragon Ball and even a bit tonally experimental compared to previous outings. If this entire post hasn't already made it obvious, I don't agree with people who maintain that Toyotaro always starts his stories off strong; he's slipped up at leaving a good first impression before, though thankfully, he isn't slipping yet this time.

That's mostly all I have to say since we're still just getting started. I like what I'm reading and hope the manga can return to form.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:03 pm

The Undying wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:59 am
Right off the bat, we already have a better grasp of this arc's underlying premise than the previous arc's own premise and themes when it began. That's important because it keeps the audience invested, which the chapter accomplishes by dedicating more of its panel space to exploring Granolah, his backstory, and his connections with the main cast so the reader can easily parse how various narrative elements and characters are going to come together. We don't know how they're going to come together, but we're aware of the mission statement. The plotting here is infinitely more interesting than anything with Moro on New Namek.

Also right off the bat, there's a stark difference in pacing between this month's chapter and the Galactic Patrol Prisoner arc's first (full) chapter. All 45 pages cover quite a bit of material, everything seems to tie into its main throughline, its individual beats are brisk and to-the-point as is typical of the original manga, and there are no largely irrelevant filler sequences (like the train heist) that go nowhere and overstay their welcome. DB's rapid quickfire progression is a large part of why its storytelling works so well, and it's one aspect of the Super manga's pre-GPP arcs I missed, so hopefully we'll see that kind of momentum continue. I can do without another story that drags its heels and pads everything to 11 from start to finish.

Lastly, I don't get the impression that this arc is trying to "rehash" anything in particular thus far. Sure, Elec's crew has similar clothing to Bojack's crew, and yes, Movie 9 is one of the worst DB films, but any perceived parallels end there. A lot of stuff in this chapter feels like fresh territory for Dragon Ball and even a bit tonally experimental compared to previous outings. If this entire post hasn't already made it obvious, I don't agree with people who maintain that Toyotaro always starts his stories off strong; he's slipped up at leaving a good first impression before, though thankfully, he isn't slipping yet this time.

That's mostly all I have to say since we're still just getting started. I like what I'm reading and hope the manga can return to form.
Gotta love forming a relatioship of understanding with the possible (?) antagonist of the arc. Although to be honest, I think that just the fact that this arc continues from where the previous left off, using some of it's elements to naturally progress the story without the need to build up every character and their motivation (mostly referring to Goku and Vegeta tbh) has helped a lot. WIsh we saw more of this in the previous arcs. Not just a premise for the next arc, rather a series of actions/events that are the direct effect of the previous arc's outcome.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:10 pm

Good to see them following up on Vegeta being a good potential GoD. Hopefully it isn't that shitty thing from the anime with the edgelord aura, tattoo and muscles. Ugh. What a way to ruin Toppo's design.

Anyway, I won't really comment much on this. It's off to a more interesting start than the Moro arc was. Those first 2 chapters of Moro's arc were straight out of the worst bits of GT.

Soshiru, I thought he was whatever Neiz's species was, but he looks slightly different. No ears.

Goku's fight Whis plays well with Vegeta's fight with Beerus at the start of the Tournament of Power arc. Also of note is both fights ending with Goku and Vegeta getting knocked down.
Also, looks like that little guy is a big mark. Sick Poisonrana into a Rings of Saturn there.
Finally, can't help but compare Granola to Future Trunks because of their similar debuts. Of note, the difference that might end up making Granola very different is people noting he isn't super strong, whereas Trunk's debut was him being the now-most powerful character. The writing is slightly different, as is the narrative purpose, so it doesn't feel like a rehash.

Hopefully Toriyama fleshing this out makes it substantially better than the last arc, which again, was the nadir of the super manga.
Last edited by TKA on Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DiscountDabi » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm

Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by OrangeBanana » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:29 pm

DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm
Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.
wasn't this fixed in the Buu arc where the namekians had upgraded the dragon balls?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by AndLad92 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:29 pm

DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm
Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.
It's not a plot hole.
Moori tells in the Buu saga that he upgraded Porunga's power, so that he can revive groups of beings now.
As a big fan of Dragon Ball, I should be expected to hate the live action movie "Dragon Ball: Evolution", but I don't. I don't like it because of the content, but because it gave us Dragon Ball Super:

"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:30 pm

DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm
Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.
"We powered up Porunga like we powered up Shenron."

Focusing on easily-addressed "plot holes" instead of talking about more interesting things is lazy and/or uninteresting. Don't be surprised when people don't care to get into them.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Devilman21/ » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:32 pm

DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm
Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.
Wasn't it explained that the Namekian upgraded their Dragon Balls to wish back large groups after the Freeza incident? Pretty sure this was addressed back in the Boo arc when Dende used their Namek balls to wish back everyone on Earth who was killed by Boo.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DiscountDabi » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:34 pm

AndLad92 wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:29 pm
DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:23 pm
Ok I know this new chapter is out and everyone is talking about Granolah and UI Goku, but we have a plot hole on our hands that I don't think anyone has mentioned until now.

So in chapter 67 Goku takes Esca Back to New Namek and uses Porunga to revive everyone killed by Moro and his men. And we know that was the wish because Moori is alive and Cranberry Killed him. Except for the fact that Porunga can only bring back people one at a time. This was explicitly a plot point in the Namek arc. So the Moro arc goes out once again with a plot hole.
It's not a plot hole.
Moori tells in the Buu saga that he upgraded Porunga's power, so that he can revive groups of beings now.
Ack, thats right. Totally slipped my mind. They even brought back earth when Kid Buu Destroyed it. Take my Dragon Ball Membership Card now :D
TKA wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:30 pm
Focusing on easily-addressed "plot holes" instead of talking about more interesting things is lazy and/or uninteresting. Don't be surprised when people don't care to get into them.
No need to be rude. It was an honest mistake.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:41 pm

DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:34 pm

No need to be rude. It was an honest mistake.
Not being rude, my man.

You were surprised nobody was talking about an uninteresting point, when there was more meaty things to talk about. What discussion can come from pointing out that there was a continuity error? It's just a fun fact/trivia. Not something worthy of pages of posts: it's either congruent with events that unfolded before or not. Binary. Boring.

Dunno why you'd read it as an insult at you, but it isn't. It's just stating my opinion on that kind of topic.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DiscountDabi » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:47 pm

TKA wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:41 pm
DiscountDabi wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:34 pm

No need to be rude. It was an honest mistake.
Not being rude, my man.

You were surprised nobody was talking about an uninteresting point, when there was more meaty things to talk about. What discussion can come from pointing out that there was a continuity error? It's just a fun fact/trivia. Not something worthy of pages of posts: it's either congruent with events that unfolded before or not. Binary. Boring.

Dunno why you'd read it as an insult at you, but it isn't. It's just stating my opinion on that kind of topic.
Its not that I was expecting people to talk about it, Just that nobody had mentioned it ( For whats now obvious reasons). But if your intention wasn’t to offend then no harm is done

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:49 pm

Wow, people actually weren't that far off with Granola's origins. He isn't a tsufuru but he has a history with saiyans and even with Freeza, and hates them. This chapter was nice, little about the heroes, a lot about the new guys. We already know more about Granola than Moro. I hope Granola isn't the bad guy, or at least his revenge is against Freeza only, Goku and Vegeta can't be kept being held accountable for what their ancestors did.

Nice to see the Oracle fish getting his Covid vaccine shot. Got vibes of Goku catching Bubbles too.
Vegeta after dropping every master in the ToP, has gotten more masters than ever before lol.
Elec's crew gives me Bojack vibes. But in a good way, not in a re-hashed way. I hope they are not dropped or treated like Moro's henchmen. They do have a way (7-3) to become relevant.
OG-73 never recovered, he is just half the man he's ever been.
Good thing Freeza is coming back, the powercreep is moving way too fast for Freeza to make his comeback in 3 years and be a threat without a need of an asspull.
Granola vs Freeza... that could be a great way to start an arc. Granola killing Freeza would make the front page.
I'm still wondering if it'll be Granola or Gas the one becoming the strongest. Gas might use 7-3, we don't know how Granola would get stronger.
While I'd love Broly here, it might get too crowded... although Granola vs Broly... :oops:


Let's just hope this arc doesn't last 2 years.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:30 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:49 pm
Elec's crew gives me Bojack vibes.

Let's just hope this arc doesn't last 2 years.
I don't think Elec is their boss, he might be a Ginyu type of character who works for someone higher. It would be funny if their boss is a rebooted Bojack.

I wouldn't mind if the story's content demanded that length.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:32 pm

Okay this was incredible. Such a strong start for the arc (I consider last chapter more transitional).

I am amazed at how well they are setting things up from just one chapter. We got straight to the point about Granola’s motives and personality, we got to meet new characters AND see how the whole universe has, and still is, influenced by Freeza’s presence. That was just wonderful to see them talking about him like the tyrant he is. It’s all wonderfully connected to established stuff: we see the consequences of Freeza’s tyranny (and Saiyans’ sins) with Granola, we once again see the universal currency from Broly, the Heeter gang is already well characterized and connected to the established lore, as they are well informed about Freeza and know of Zuno (I wonder what they need to know from him?)... it’s all very well thought out.

It’s nice to also have immediate confirmation of what’s next for both Goku and Vegeta. Ultra Instinct as expected is not the pinnacle of power for Goku. I hope that once he fully masters it he will too be in constant instinct state, so that he can go back to fight without changing appearance... that would bring some nostalgia of pre-Super Saiyan fights.
And Vegeta is getting a new technique from Beerus! That’s super interesting, I hope it gets revealed by next chapter.

This chapter has me super hyped up. The arc is off to a wonderful start. Moro’s arc underwhelmed from the beginning, and it only picked up once Goku and Vegeta left Namek.
This time the potential for this to be the best arc of Super is there. I will cross my fingers.

Also... if Broly and friends get involved in this, I would love it.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:38 pm

Matches Malone wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:30 pm
Koitsukai wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:49 pm
Elec's crew gives me Bojack vibes.

Let's just hope this arc doesn't last 2 years.
I don't think Elec is their boss, he might be a Ginyu type of character who works for someone higher. It would be funny if their boss is a rebooted Bojack.

I wouldn't mind if the story's content demanded that length.
It would make sense. Bojack's crew had 5 members, the group we see now has 4. I can totally see this:

Female character = Zangya
Gas = Bujin
Oil = Kogu
Elec = Bido
Leader = Bojack

He is simply more secretive and acts from the shadows probably due to security reasons. Besides Elec said it: INformation means pwoer, so with no one being aware of the true boss, the threat of the Heaters getting discovered/destroyed is significantly lower.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by FortuneSSJ » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:41 pm

-Chapter 68-

Not only this arc connected directly to the previous arc like good stories do, but also Toyotaro's panelling is getting better, we have new characters with cool designs and the story seems like it will be interesting. The manga is in a good place right now!

Granolah and base Android 21 are by far my favourite character designs from modern Dragon Ball so far.

Granolah having an unusual eye (which may be golden?) is a welcome addition, because I don't think we have anyone like in that in this franchise. For now he's giving me Kintoki vibes from Toriyama one-shot manga. Kintoki was a survivor from his race, had golden eyes, a similar design and really good aim (Granolah is fighting like a sniper)

Heaters prioritizing money and intel over raw power is a breath of fresh air for a main villain/antagonist in this franchise.

The way they kept talking about how the balance of U7 is changing, reminds me of how alive One Piece world feels (One Piece is still on a level of its own in that regard though).

Freeza's involvement is a guarantee and looking to the name puns he having a conflict with heaters seems the logical way to go. 8)
Now hoping Broly somehow appears too.

Ultra Instinct being Goku's last form would be too good to be true. If the next UI levels didn't change his appearance and only shows subtitles differences like getting skinnier or a new aura color it would be great. Not really interested in having SSJ UI, SSJ2 UI...

Beerus was written good in this chapter. It's easy for me to forget how interesting he can be thanks to his interactions revolving around food over and over. Thanks to this chapter for remind me of that.

Vegeta keep walking his path instead of trying to get everything that Goku has is the right decision to his character. Hopefully Beerus teaches him something cool that doesn't give him a new hair color.

Fantastic start for what can be a great arc, to say the least. As someone who liked Moro arc, I want this one to be better. With a potential like this there's no reason for not to be.
Last edited by FortuneSSJ on Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:41 pm

Also, interesting bit about angels being perpetually in Ultra Instinct. Their white hair made this obvious since the form was first revealed, but nice to have confirmation, I guess.

This would also explain why using this technique gave Beerus such a huge edge over the other GoDs during the exhibition fight. They're all using GoD powers, so Beerus using an angel ability in addition to all that gave him a slight lead.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:57 pm

Grand Marshal 1 wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:38 pm
He is simply more secretive and acts from the shadows probably due to security reasons. Besides Elec said it: Information means power, so with no one being aware of the true boss, the threat of the Heaters getting discovered/destroyed is significantly lower.
Exactly. I don't know how the fan base would react to Bojack ending up as the main villain, but it would be an interesting choice. I'm not hoping for this to be the case, but I'm not totally against it either.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:10 pm

Matches Malone wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:57 pm
Grand Marshal 1 wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:38 pm
He is simply more secretive and acts from the shadows probably due to security reasons. Besides Elec said it: Information means power, so with no one being aware of the true boss, the threat of the Heaters getting discovered/destroyed is significantly lower.
Exactly. I don't know how the fan base would react to Bojack ending up as the main villain, but it would be an interesting choice. I'm not hoping for this to be the case, but I'm not totally against it either.
Totes. Especially after getting introduced to the underworld of U7. Galactic Patrol, galactic prison, Moro's bandit brigade, Freeza's empire, Granolah's bounty hunter vibe etc. Space pirates sound like the best concept possible to be re-adjusted into the new 'meta'.
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