"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Matches Malone
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Thu Feb 20, 2020 5:09 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:34 am
Goku arrives on earth already... Before Vegeta! This should be interesting.
caire wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:07 am
I'm really rooting for Vegeta to win this one.
Whoever starts the fight in DB tends to lose it in favor of whoever's waiting to fight next, so the chances of Vegeta getting the final fight have significantly went up.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:03 am

It’s getting more and more likely that Vegeta will be the one to finally get the final win! It would be nice, especially with all the focus he got during this arc. He’s also Toyotaro’s favorite so it would be expected for Vegeta to get the win in an arc mostly written by Toyotaro.

I hope next chapter Goku will easily get rid off all of Moro’s henchmen, and that he will showcase what he learned from Merus against Moro. But I expect Moro to pull off some new trick to gain the advantage over Goku until Vegeta arrives.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:37 am

emperior wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:03 am
It’s getting more and more likely that Vegeta will be the one to finally get the final win! It would be nice, especially with all the focus he got during this arc. He’s also Toyotaro’s favorite so it would be expected for Vegeta to get the win in an arc mostly written by Toyotaro.
As excited as I am to see Vegeta get the final fight, there's a good chance something will prevent him from outright winning on his own.

Goku got the final fight with Beerus but still couldn't beat him.
Vegeta got the final fight with Freeza but Whis ended up getting involved.
Goku got the final fight with Hit but ended up surrendering to him.
Trunks got the final fight with Fused Zamasu but Zeno was the one to kill him.
Goku got the final fight with Jiren but needed #17 and Freeza's help to ring him out.
Gogeta got the final fight with Broly but he was saved by the dragon.

Of course that won't (or shouldn't) take anything away from whatever Vegeta will do, I just think it's worth keeping in mind that DB now has a track record of pulling the rug from under the heroes at the last minute. With that said, I do hope Vegeta puts him down as he's loooooooong overdue for a main arc victory.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by GodVegetto91 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:07 am

Here’s what i believe will happen.

Goku activates Ultra Instinct at will, (silver hair), and knocks every one of Moro’s henchmen unconscious (not death) in a single blow. Then Moro powers up to maximum, shocking everyone in the whole multiverse by the amount of sheer power he has acquired, even Goku’s in awe, stating that Moro has now FAR surpassed Broly, and that he is absolutely the strongest opponent Goku has ever faced (excluding Beerus ofcourse). But Goku is still confident that he can beat him. So proceeds and completely dominates Moro in battle, allowing Moro to use every offensive trick in the book, attempting to attack MUI Goku with countless ki blasts aswell as physical punches and kicks, but every one of his assaults get either completely avoided, or reflected. Goku counters with a few strikes of his own, and nearly ends Moro’s life. It is then that Moro decides to do the one thing he came here for in the first place.... He absorbs the entire planet earth with everyone on it (except for MUI Goku, 17, and 18 who’s energy can’t be stolen and can survive in the vacuum of space), gaining an INCREDIBLE power-up, pushing Moro to new levels of power that even MUI Goku cannot touch. Moro, as expected, gains the upperhand on MUI Goku, and completely overpowers him. But then right when he is about to deliver the finishing blow to Goku, Vegeta shows up with instant transmission wearing Yardrat gi....

And we all know what happens next.

Vegeta finally destroys a main villain!

That is my prediction xD
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:22 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:07 am
Right when he is about to deliver the finishing blow to Goku, Vegeta shows up with instant transmission wearing Yardrat gi....And we all know what happens next.
Image

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by caire » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:35 am

Matches Malone wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:37 am
emperior wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:03 am
It’s getting more and more likely that Vegeta will be the one to finally get the final win! It would be nice, especially with all the focus he got during this arc. He’s also Toyotaro’s favorite so it would be expected for Vegeta to get the win in an arc mostly written by Toyotaro.
As excited as I am to see Vegeta get the final fight, there's a good chance something will prevent him from outright winning on his own.
I agree, I have a very strong feeling that it's going to be a case of "Vegeta got the win because [character X] did [action X]", or along those lines. But them's the breaks - as long as "vegeta got the win" is in the sentence, I'm happy with that :lol:

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Gt91 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:54 am

Matches Malone wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:22 am
GodVegetto91 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:07 am
Right when he is about to deliver the finishing blow to Goku, Vegeta shows up with instant transmission wearing Yardrat gi....And we all know what happens next.
Image
Don't play with my feelings, please :cry:

p.s. I don't think vegeta will learn istant transmission. Yardrat can teleport him on planet earth and then leave.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:57 am

Gt91 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:54 am
Don't play with my feelings, please :cry:

p.s. I don't think vegeta will learn istant transmission. Yardrat can teleport him on planet earth and then leave.
I doubt Vegeta will just be brought to earth by someone, I think it'll be an epic entrance with IT. That'll make things easier for the writers moving forward.
caire wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:35 am
I have a very strong feeling that it's going to be a case of "Vegeta got the win because [character X] did [action X]", or along those lines. But them's the breaks - as long as "vegeta got the win" is in the sentence, I'm happy with that :lol:
I'm not picky so I'll take what I can get. Moro will be fighting UI Goku so of course that'll turn things in Vegeta's favor, but a win's a win. :mrgreen:

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Thu Feb 20, 2020 10:39 am

This is a very feel good arc and I'm grateful for that but an evil part of me is hoping there's a late game swerve that knocks all the pieces off the board. Like we find out that Moro, via seventeen dimensional chess, was the cause of Goku's heart virus and he retriggers it during their fight. Just something messed that really puts the heroes on the ropes.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kinokima » Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:08 am

I think Vegeta playing a part in the final win makes sense (and I think same still goes for Goku) but I highly doubt the win will entirely be Vegeta’s. Just doesn’t seem that is how Dragon Ball works these days and wins are more a collaborative effort or there is some twist involved. I also still feel Merus will play a role somehow.

Just hope it’s not another Future Trunks arc type ending

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Alruneia » Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:16 am

That was interesting. I definitely wish the manga wasn't monthly with this pacing, though.

As far as the final win goes, it's interesting that Goku shows up first, since usually that's Vegeta's job, so I can understand that some people are expecting Vegeta to get the main credit for the win now. What I personally expect is that it's going to be mainly counted as a team victory, with neither Goku nor Vegeta being able to take "main credit". I also expect that Merus will show up at some critical point and break the rules (essentially sacrificing himself) to stop Moro from winning.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by jplaya2023 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:58 am

I think it's time for Kaioshin to teach goku & the others Instantaneous Movement. I think the running gag of goku always being late has run it course and now it's time for him to learn a technique in which he can be anywhere instantly.

What kind of fusion did those girls use? the aniraza fusion method or did they do a double fusion dance? I would like to see tien and yamcha fuse next chapter or something but we know it wont happen.

So we're to believe so random henchmen even after being enhanced by Moro is stronger than both Gohan and Android 17 (who was stalemating SSJ3 goku) i really have a hard time believing that. But whatever. This is still dragging out. Where is beerus at. Where is frieza i want to know the back story between those 3.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by The Undying » Thu Feb 20, 2020 12:56 pm

Now there's a pretty good chapter!

It's great to see Earth's fighters actively contributing to the plot now, whether that means Krillin making his ki detectable for Goku's teleportation or Gohan's group actually hitting a roadblock with Moro's strongest goon, doing all they can to hold out until the big guys arrive.

The fights were fun this time around, too. I laughed at Jaco pulling on Saganbo's leg; he's obviously not giving him a modicum of resistance, but dammit he's trying! Also loved the banter between Tenshinhan and Chaozu over the former's incompetence at insulting people. This is exactly the kind of comedic action I expect from Dragon Ball -- it's entertaining, the gags are totally Toriyama's speed, and here it's actually using the characters' flaws to provide them with interesting and unique challenges.

Some of it was a little inconsequential and I wasn't blown away or anything, but this is a step forward from last month.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:13 pm

Random and scattered thoughts of Chapter 57:

- Krillin beating the bear guy with some strategy and cunning was nice.
- Chiaotzu using insult to take down that guy from Magetta's race was a nice call-back
- Chiaotzu: "You suck at insulting people, Ten." Tenshinhan: "A-Apologies." I don't know why this made me laugh, but it did.
- Goddamnit... why did Toyotaro have to bring up that Roshi can use some form of Ultra Instinct. Of all the shitty thing that should have forgotten in the Universal Survival arc, that was one of things I was hoping would stay in the black hole that is that arc in the manga.
- Miza, Iwaza and Kikaza fuse into a giant and heavy-set women and Roshi immediately, and Roshi immediately says they ain't cut at all. Hmm. Now... that is just RIFE with unfortunate implications. I hate to be that guy but, this really feels like fat shaming. A terrible throwback to the kind of dated humour Toriyama gets a kick out of. Ugh.
- Moro coming finally confronting the supporting cast feels so... eh. I guess that's because Moro has the personality of cold porridge.
- More scrubs show up to fight Gohan, Piccolo, #17, #18 and Yamcha and... oh God, these glorified playground scrap fights are gonna get dragged out for another month. At least the story is providing some jobbers for Goku to dispose of to show off how he mastered Ultra Instinct. At least that's what I hope.
- It's just dawned on me... why the fuck is Goku using a spaceship to travel? Goku can teleport from literally different planes of existence all the way back to Earth. Why can't he just teleport to Kaio-sama's planet and then teleport to Earth instantly like he's down so in the past? Ugh. That tells me everything I need to know about how dragged out this arc has felt at times.
- Okay. Real talk... has there been anything about the supporting cast fighting Moro's scrubs that has provided anything substantial to the plot or moved the story forward, that couldn't have been otherwise resolved in one chapter or less? I'm sure a lot of fans will wet their pants over Chiaotzu and Yamcha doing something in the plot, but it's done nothing to impact the narrative or develop their characters, so why is it being featured in this story. This is just filler. This Galactic Patrol could have handled this off-screen and it would have carried just as much weight to the story as seeing the supporting cast deal with it on-screen.
- The pacing of this arc in general has been terrible. Mainly due to the fact that there's been too much material in this arc that has felt unnecessary.

Overall... can Goku and/or Vegeta fight Moro already!? This is getting padded out to hell and back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:31 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:13 pm
- It's just dawned on me... why the fuck is Goku using a spaceship to travel? Goku can teleport from literally different planes of existence all the way back to Earth. Why can't he just teleport to Kaio-sama's planet and then teleport to Earth instantly like he's down so in the past? Ugh. That tells me everything I need to know about how dragged out this arc has felt at times.
Merus took Goku to an uninhabited planet where it was impossible for Moro to reach. Moro's henchmen were able to reach Planet Yardrat, which is outside the jurisdiction of the Galactic Patrol and is so far away that Irico cannot even communicate with HQ. This says a lot about how far Goku is from any known point (New Namek was already far enough away that he needed King Kai's help to get there).

The only one who can feel energies on the other side of the galaxy now is Vegeta because of his training

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by The Undying » Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:51 pm

I'd also like to mention I'm glad Roshi's UI Lite was acknowledged. I honestly wasn't sure if it was going to come up again after the Tournament of Power, but here the manga is being consistent with its own storytelling and lore. That's good.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:00 pm

Nice chapter!

The highlight of it was definitely Goku’s arrival. I wished to see such a scenario again in Super. I know it was played a lot of times since the Piccolo Daimao days but Goku arriving late to save everyone is still something which gets me all hyped for what’s next!

I suppose Toyotaro has played a bit with the rules of Instant Transmission in this arc, but honestly I think it’s for the better. It sort of clashes with what happened in the arc, when Goku was able to get to New Namek easily. But the same happened in the early parts of this manga, so I buy the explanation that this time Goku was too far to lock onto the decreasing Ki of his allies, even though he could sense them? (why couldn’t he lock on to Moro or Saganbo, though?).
I really don’t mind this by the way. The move being nerfed a little is only better for the story.

I also quite liked the gag with Tenshinan being unable to come up with insults, and it was fun to see Chaozu go back to his old bad-mouthing habits he displayed in the 22nd Budokai Tenkaichi.
Unlike many others, I also found Kame Sennin’s gag to be funny as it was not over the top like in episode 89 of Super’s anime.
And I think Toyotaro did a good thing calling back to his pseudo-Ultra Instinct power displayed in the tournament, because acting like that was never a thing would have been confusing.

I am very very hyped for what’s to come in the next months.
I like to speculate, so my theory this time around is that Goku will fight against Moro using the Omen version of Ultra Instinct, or maybe something even rougher, and this way his energy won’t be absorbed by Moro but then Moro will absorb the Ki of all living beings on Earth, including Gohan and the others, and will get the upper hand on Goku (and the Androids too) until Vegeta arrives.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DestructoDisc » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:38 pm

Is there anyone that found the 3 girls fusion funny? Nobody? Good. That was painfully unfunny and without a doubt the worst thing about this chapter. Toyotaro, someone turning fat isn't comedic, like, at all. When Toei did it with Ribrianne at least nobody called her unattractive like Roshi just did with this chick. There was also absolutely no point in making her look like the way she did either. With Ribrianne it was a parody of magical girls. This chick just ended up looking like this because "haha, fat people are funny aren't they?".

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Yasai9001 » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:44 pm

I'm glad that Chaotzu is heavily involved in this one.

Reading this manga chapter, I started off listening to "The terror of Freeza's army". By the time Moro showed up and grabbed 73, I played "Unwinnable Battle" and when Goku showed up, I played "The Braveheart's Triumphant Return."

I love listening to the right music because it feels so much more immersive. This entire chapter was just vintage Z all together, it felt like. As aforementioned, the music merely emphasized that feeling.

I don't like how it's taken Bulma all this time to finally be able to make drones to monitor the battles that go on with the main characters. In my opinion this was long overdue, but I'm glad Toyo did this because he's getting the others involved somehow. They're not just non-existent here. Pilaf literally tried to kill Bulma a while ago and the fact that he's getting along with her now is just hilarious to me.

Roshi having to resort to using the blindfold against the females is funny and cool for him because it shows how much of a seasoned martial artist he is all the while emphasizing just how much of a pervert that he is as well.

One thing I disliked was the fact that they didn't like about this manga chapter was that we didn't get to see the three-way fusion between the girls because it would add a bit to world building and showing how others could fuse in a different way. Regardless, she looked real scary and intimidating whenever they fused.

I also really liked how the main villain didn't kill any of his own subordinates here. He knows the value of 73 and because of that, he kept him alive because he might need him. This why I think Moro could potentially be a better villain than Freeza, because he's think more, using his head. But knowing that whenever Moro no longer needs you and you mess up, that's it. That's part of what makes Moro great imo.

And I really like the panel shot when everybody was fighting Saganbo. It was also funny because Jako was just there hanging on his leg. Would have been even funnier if he had bitten him or something, lol.

Most of all, Krillin really played a good part in this battle. He was outmatched by the panda dude and used his smarts in battle to stay in. He even took a long shot, shot out his ki in hopes of Goku arriving. Lo and behold, Son Goku makes it there just in time.

Also, given how Goku has shown up against Vegeta, I strongly believe Goku will fight Moro and eventually get to a point of where he's pushed to using Ultra Instinct until he starts getting drained before Vegeta arrives in time to save his behind. Either that, or Vegeta jumps in just in time for he and Goku to both team up and take Moro down.

One thing that's been emphasized in the past is that Goku and Vegeta make a great team whenever they are fighting together. They're nearly impossible to stop, so with Vegeta learning a technique to make himself impregnable to Moro's magic, I believe that if they are to team up, they'll come out victorious together courtesy to Vegeta.

Really liking the action and pacing thus far. Each chapter has been having me excited for the next.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:50 pm

Yasai9001 wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:44 pm
With Vegeta learning a technique to make himself impregnable to Moro's magic, I believe that if they are to team up, they'll come out victorious together courtesy to Vegeta.
If Moro were to fight someone as strong as Vegeta without being able to take his energy, is there anything he could pull that would require Goku to help Vegeta ? I'm not saying Moro is weak as he's clearly capable of holding his own, but he's not a power house like Broly or Jiren who can destroy anything that's in front of him, at least not without his power draining ability. Apart from blocking Moro's ability, Vegeta was shown to have gotten a massive power boost, and that was in the middle of his training, so combine that with him being able to block Moro's ability, I think Vegeta will be able to (mostly) handle him on his own.
Last edited by Matches Malone on Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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