"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Koitsukai
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Mon Feb 24, 2020 2:21 pm

ssj3kakarot wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:21 pm
What technique do you think Vegeta learned on Yardrat? His spirit control seems to have given him a boost in power, which is always nice, but power alone vs Moro won’t cut it.
I think it will be perfect control over his own power, in such a way that Moro won't be able to absorb it.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Feb 24, 2020 5:51 pm

emperior wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:39 am
Miracles wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 7:36 pm
I doubt Goku and Vegeta fuse. Doesn't fit the narrative. The story went out of it's way to make Vegeta betray his Saiyan pride, of beating opponents with fists, to humbling himself and learning a technique contrary to his view of battle. It would also take away from Goku's theme of self improvement. Especially deny the inner growth Goku gained after facing the stronger Broly. Which was a deeper appreciation for his Saiyan heritage. Broly "probably" being stronger than Beerus, who is a god, as a mere mortal Saiyan, inspired Kakarot.

The story has given both our protag's powers that has taken them months to acquire. I highly doubt Toriyama and Toyotaro will throw all that work away. It's time for our protagonists to develop on their own. There must be some positive repercussions from the past arc now. Goku and Vegeta has to show they can compete at higher levels than before. Besides we've seen fusion already, lol.
Well said. Fusion won’t appear in this arc, that much is clear. It may not even ever happen again, or so I wish.

Goku and Vegeta developing in two different paths is a good thing. If it continues in future arcs, it will spark all those debates about “who is better/stronger than who” which will add to their rivalry, and would make an incredible movie if they ever decide to do a movie about their final fight mentioned in Dragon Ball Online!
Yep. It continues the consistency of the story. About Vegeta's declaration, two arcs ago, in the TOP; how he was going to branch off and get back to gaining strength on his and in his own way again. Ultra Instinct is more suited for Goku. Since he had past teachings that reflect the principles of it. This does make this more of a rivalry, seeing which way would make one the better.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Yasai9001 » Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:27 am

Koitsukai wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 2:21 pm
ssj3kakarot wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:21 pm
What technique do you think Vegeta learned on Yardrat? His spirit control seems to have given him a boost in power, which is always nice, but power alone vs Moro won’t cut it.
I think it will be perfect control over his own power, in such a way that Moro won't be able to absorb it.
I strongly believe the same myself. Vegeta will learn a technique that makes him impregnable to Moro's energy absorbing powers but due to his battles with Goku and the other Earthlings beforehand, Moro will be very strong due to absorbing their life force, which will mean that Moro will still be a challenge for Vegeta, who will have to fight through the other tricks Moro will undoubtedly use due to his magic.

It's going to be a great battle imo.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Psajdak » Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:54 am

I really wish for that tehnique to be more than just some type of ki control; I want it to be something tangible, memorable, and as iconic as Shunkaido - something that will be related to Vegeta as Galick Gun is, but not another beam...

Apparently, it is more advanced than Shunkaido, but then again, Shunkaido itself is pretty useful and impressive, when you think about it.

Ability to jump between dimensions, or something time based, like Hit's Toki Tobashi seems pretty cool, IMO.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by ssj3kakarot » Tue Feb 25, 2020 4:47 pm

I wonder if Vegeta’s new ability/power will have any drawbacks to prevent him from spamming it in the future. Like he can take out Moro but it leaves him drained afterwards, making the ability less appealing against multiple adversaries. Kaioken is hard on the users body, spirit bomb takes a while to charge leaving Goku exposed, transformations drain energy, Ultra Instinct is near impossible to tap Into let alone sustaining, etc. There always seems to be a weakness in how Dragonball brings about a new ability or power.

I know it’s too early to tell since we don’t know what Vegeta’s training is going to yield but just food for thought.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by jplaya2023 » Wed Feb 26, 2020 9:13 am

ssj3kakarot wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:21 pm
What technique do you think Vegeta learned on Yardrat? His spirit control seems to have given him a boost in power, which is always nice, but power alone vs Moro won’t cut it.
he should be learning IT, but we know he won't someone will bring him to the battlefield. Honestly outside of some type of sealing technique i don't know what he can learn that will help him against Moro. Moro can't be beaten by just brute force alone ( see buu) it takes some type of special technique to win this fight.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:00 am

I think Vegeta will learn to control his Spirit/Ki to not let Moro steal it.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by GodVegetto91 » Wed Feb 26, 2020 6:15 pm

emperior wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:00 am
I think Vegeta will learn to control his Spirit/Ki to not let Moro steal it.
As any sane person would believe. Occam’s Razor folks. I can’t believe not more people bring this up. It was clear to me from the beginning. Vegeta needs a DEFENSIVE move against Moro, not an offensive one. It’s useless for him to use some sort of magic spell on Moro, if Moro could just eat his energy before Vegeta even has the chance to fire his offensive technique. Likewise, the stupid theory that Moro would somehow get “Yakon’d” doesn’t make sense either, since he doesn’t seem to have a known limit, and it would be super anti-climactic. And then there are people who believe Moro’s energy drain would work on Ultra Instinct Goku. That doesn’t make any sense either. Ultra Instinct Goku isn’t like Broly or Jiren with just raw power. It’s a form specifically made to avoid any and all danger. Including, thus, Moro’s energy drain, and the oxygenless vacuum of space.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by caire » Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:40 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 6:15 pm
And then there are people who believe Moro’s energy drain would work on Ultra Instinct Goku. That doesn’t make any sense either. Ultra Instinct Goku isn’t like Broly or Jiren with just raw power. It’s a form specifically made to avoid any and all danger. Including, thus, Moro’s energy drain, and the oxygenless vacuum of space.
From my understanding, Ultra Instinct is for avoiding any and all known danger in the context of fighting/physical blows? For example, in the ToP he could dodge any hits, but couldn't use it once it put too much of a strain on his body. The usage of UI is still conditional on the physical state of the user, and it still puts a huge amount of pressure on the body. It's true that Moro's energy drain might be the catalyst to triggering UI for Goku (assuming he's in the right emotional state of mind to activate it as well), so it won't be detrimental at the start - but realistically, you can't keep fighting with tiny amounts of ki even if your body can move on its own.
But again, that's my understanding of it - I might have misremembered something. Hopefully this fight will give as more of an indication as to what UI can counter.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Whis » Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:24 pm

emperior wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:00 am
I think Vegeta will learn to control his Spirit/Ki to not let Moro steal it.
Please let Vegeta have this big W. It's time for him to shine over the villain of the story.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by GodVegetto91 » Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:41 am

ssj3kakarot wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:21 pm
What technique do you think Vegeta learned on Yardrat? His spirit control seems to have given him a boost in power, which is always nice, but power alone vs Moro won’t cut it.
Immunity to Moro’s energy draining ability. There is no other alternative as far as rationalism goes.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Fri Feb 28, 2020 3:35 pm

Yeah, I think it would be something simple yet effective. I believe it will be a technique/ability to emphasize Vegta's stubborn character. Resisting Moro's absorption, not allowing it to take control of Vegeta's power will exemplify his regal bloodline heritage and personality. Vegeta's always been about pure power, I don't think he will resort to gimmicky technical tricks, so the skill may just be something simple as temperance.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by WittyUsername » Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:53 pm

I’ve lost interest in this arc by now, but is there any idea on when exactly it’ll end?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:01 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:53 pm
I’ve lost interest in this arc by now, but is there any idea on when exactly it’ll end?
No idea when it will end. Why'd you lose interest?
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by WittyUsername » Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:05 pm

Miracles wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:01 pm
WittyUsername wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:53 pm
I’ve lost interest in this arc by now, but is there any idea on when exactly it’ll end?
No idea when it will end. Why'd you lose interest?
It just feels like it’s been going on for too long, and I don’t find the story all that engaging. I guess it doesn’t help that I’m not as invested in Dragon Ball in general at the moment as I was back when the anime was still airing. I don’t know if the ToP burned me out, but at this point, I think I’d rather they just go with more movies at this point.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips » Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:08 pm

WittyUsername wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:05 pm
Miracles wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:01 pm
No idea when it will end. Why'd you lose interest?
It just feels like it’s been going on for too long, and I don’t find the story all that engaging. I guess it doesn’t help that I’m not as invested in Dragon Ball in general at the moment as I was back when the anime was still airing. I don’t know if the ToP burned me out, but at this point, I think I’d rather they just go with more movies at this point.
You're not alone in that. For me it's been hard to really care since the Zamasu Arc. While I don't think the arc was all that great it felt like the last status quo upsetting arc of the series.

Now, I do appreciate a lot of the cool moments the Unremarkable Earth-bunch have been getting but with this arc also being about a super secret power up (which is what Spirit Control and Ultimate Instinct are. Let's not kid ourselves.) I'm just eh. It's hard to stay hyped.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kinokima » Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Maybe I’m just being pessimistic but who is to say that when this arc ends the manga will even continue?

I’m personally enjoying this arc even though it does feel like it being dragged out. But I just think that’s because there are no future upcoming plans for Dragon Ball and that’s also affecting this arc’s length.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by caire » Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:17 pm

Kinokima wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:12 pm
Maybe I’m just being pessimistic but who is to say that when this arc ends the manga will even continue?

I’m personally enjoying this arc even though it does feel like it being dragged out. But I just think that’s because there are no future upcoming plans for Dragon Ball and that’s also affecting this arc’s length.
To be honest, I'm of the same opinion. This arc seems to be tying up a couple of loose ends and getting everyone together for an "endgame"-type finale (hell, even chichi's showed up to watch, never thought I'd see that again!) It's all up to Toriyama, ultimately.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by The Undying » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:30 pm

Kinokima wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:12 pm
Maybe I’m just being pessimistic but who is to say that when this arc ends the manga will even continue?
I'm okay with that. Whether it concludes after this arc or continues, I don't see the problem.

No writer should ever force themselves to come up with more stories if they're out of the creative juices required to keep churning them out. There will obviously be some degree of fan insistence that Toriyama should expand on certain vague ideas introduced in past arcs, but those are ultimately just ideas, not fleshed-out plotlines.

Heroes already used tropes that people wanted after the Tournament of Power, but that all seems a bit too predictable and repetitive to be regurgitated here. Super by its nature is a superfluous "time gap" series, so it doesn't necessarily have to be pigeonholed into some dramatic overarching narrative or anything.
Last edited by The Undying on Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:32 pm

This arc is 15 chapters long, I think it'll end up being 20 chapters long, the 16th chapter is about to finally start the final fight, so perhaps by the 18th or 19th it ends. If it picks up the pace because this arc, although enjoyed it very much, has been pretty slugish.

We are getting closer to the EoZ, I don't think we can cram more villains into those years without retconning it. Maybe one more after Moro in another universe to give the sense of Goku not being around like Bulma complained about.
Also Goku training with an angel to control UI and Vegeta learning to become waaay stronger seem to suggest that they are coming full circle in their god journey, maybe they'll end the arc on the level of Beerus or even stronger and even get one last shot at him.

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