Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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DoomieDoomie911
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by DoomieDoomie911 » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:21 pm

There might be another series in the future, but just as FurtuneSSJ said, it will probably be a new cast without Toriyama.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Wed Jul 22, 2015 6:09 pm

I think it's quite likely we will be seeing new Dragon Ball series after Super, however as said previously this may be the last series with Toriyama and the old voice cast.

That said the thing I've seen with Battle of Gods, Resurrection F and Super so far is how well Toriyama knows the characters and his own unique humour. It remains to be seen whether anyone will ever replicate that, if not there could be another GT.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Wed Jul 22, 2015 6:44 pm

The series should end when Toriyama feels like that he is done with telling the story for good.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by DoomieDoomie911 » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:34 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:The series should end when Toriyama feels like that he is done with telling the story for good.
It should, but it won't. Too much money is involved.
"On my business card, I am a corporate president. In my mind, I am a game developer. But in my heart, I am a gamer." -Satoru Iwata
Cipher wrote:Dragon Ball is the story of a kind-hearted, excitable child who uses the power of friendship to improve those around him as he grows into a dangerous obsessive who sometimes accidentally saves the world.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Ushabtis » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:25 pm

DoomieDoomie911 wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:The series should end when Toriyama feels like that he is done with telling the story for good.
It should, but it won't. Too much money is involved.
agreed, mighty dollar speaks loudest.

they can keep making them it'll death, and I'll keep watching as long as they're entertaining. if they become boring and copy/paste plots over and over I'll just stop watching :lol:
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Basaku » Thu Jul 23, 2015 11:30 pm

It's not like Toriyama's pulling all-nighters on a constant weekly deadline of hell with Super. He's writing overall story, mails it to Toei and he's done. Compared to running a weekly manga, it may not be hard for Toei at all to convince him to write a general story for say, 3 more seasons, once a year

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by precita » Sun Aug 09, 2015 5:31 pm

If Super isn't a success then it will likely be the last Dragonball series for another 18 years. TOEI won't try a third Dragonball series after GT bombed and if Super doesn't do well. Not to mention the entire voice cast will likely pass away over the next 10 years or so.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by TheDBZmaster100 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:20 pm

Hopefully, just let the series end for crying out loud.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by FortuneSSJ » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:33 pm

If they are treating this like shit, it can end this week already.
I will always have DB/DBZ/GT animes and the manga. Its okay.
A world without Dragon Ball is just meh.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by precita » Sun Aug 23, 2015 10:36 pm

I think its sort of expected this will be the last series, especially with Goku's VA being 78 and all the others being up there in the years. I doubt most will be around another decade from now.

After the entire voice cast passed on what can they do? Would Japan really accept someone new voicing Goku for the first time since the 80's when it began?

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by DoomieDoomie911 » Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:27 am

precita wrote:especially with Goku's VA being 78
It's really hard to believe that she's that old. You would never guess it from here fantastic performances. Amazing.
precita wrote:After the entire voice cast passed on what can they do? Would Japan really accept someone new voicing Goku for the first time since the 80's when it began?
I'm sure they'll find a suitable replacement and most people will cope with it. It'll never be the same, though, just like with Daisuke Gōri... :(
"On my business card, I am a corporate president. In my mind, I am a game developer. But in my heart, I am a gamer." -Satoru Iwata
Cipher wrote:Dragon Ball is the story of a kind-hearted, excitable child who uses the power of friendship to improve those around him as he grows into a dangerous obsessive who sometimes accidentally saves the world.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by SaiyaSith » Tue Aug 25, 2015 12:30 pm

SpiritBombTriumphant wrote:
FortuneSSJ wrote:- Super is the last DB TV series that Toriyama will give us. And that's why I'm so disappointed for not taking place after EOZ and we will never getting his Z sequel.
- Its probably the last TV series that Nozawa and the rest oldschool voice actors will do too.

They aren't getting younger and they won't live forever either.
I read that Super is confirmed to have 100 episodes.
That was a placeholder for Toei's European website which was later removed. No real episode count has been announced.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by MCDaveG » Tue Aug 25, 2015 3:26 pm

Kendamu wrote:I don't think it's a "last hope" as much as it is an "aha!" moment regarding what fans want with their Dragon Ball content.

In recent years, Toei's only domestic TV "failure" was Kai as it failed to move merchandise. The only reason Buu Kai got on Japanese TV was to cheaply fill the hole where the failed Toriko was.

When Toei went ahead with BoG and RF, they realized that Dragon Ball animation can move merchandise in Japan, but it would be much more likely to do so with NEW animation (which is what fans have been saying all along)! Super is less of a "last hope" and more of a "new opportunity" to cash in on the DBZ revitalization that resulted from the new movies.
Honestly, I never understood how Toriko can be a hit series, as it just seemed to lame a shonen by my standards. I don't enjoy One Piece but I do understand it being a new generation's hit series. I would totally love it as a kid.
But well, I don't understand anime about food at all.

Dragon Ball doesn't need any hopes :) The original series will be there still and there will be just some spin-offs.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by precita » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:27 pm

I'd be surprised if Super passes GT's 64 episode count, let alone reaches 100 episodes. I just can't see it happening.

For some reason I get the feeling this is a short-term series, and the only reason the two movies are being adapted is to simply give it more episodes. For example what happens after the Universe 6 arc? Is Toriyama going to be forced to continually come up with new storylines for more new sagas like a decade ago? I'm not sure.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by DragonHermit » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:33 pm

precita wrote:I'd be surprised if Super passes GT's 64 episode count, let alone reaches 100 episodes. I just can't see it happening.

For some reason I get the feeling this is a short-term series, and the only reason the two movies are being adapted is to simply give it more episodes. For example what happens after the Universe 6 arc? Is Toriyama going to be forced to continually come up with new storylines for more new sagas like a decade ago? I'm not sure.
There are 10 other universes....I highly doubt they'll stop without exploring all the universes.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by precita » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:35 pm

DragonHermit wrote:
precita wrote:I'd be surprised if Super passes GT's 64 episode count, let alone reaches 100 episodes. I just can't see it happening.

For some reason I get the feeling this is a short-term series, and the only reason the two movies are being adapted is to simply give it more episodes. For example what happens after the Universe 6 arc? Is Toriyama going to be forced to continually come up with new storylines for more new sagas like a decade ago? I'm not sure.
There are 10 other universes....I highly doubt they'll stop without exploring all the universes.
And you really think they're going to spend 20-30 episodes in each universe? For all we know most universes will only get 5-10 episodes each.

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by irreality » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:44 pm

precita wrote: And you really think they're going to spend 20-30 episodes in each universe? For all we know most universes will only get 5-10 episodes each.
The universe 6 will be at least as long as BoG, and maybe as long as BoG + RoF. Movie plots are short because they are movies. A new plot will be much more involved than 5 episodes. People were so skeptical when I said the BoG arc would last at least until episode 10 before it came out. Most Dragon Ball (or Z, or GT) are not that short. Only Super 17 was that short.

My guess is that they are scripting 50 or so episodes total to start -- 25 ish for retelling the movies and 25 ish for the new arc. If the show doesn't generate revenue it will stop after a year's worth of episodes. If not, they will tack on arcs one by one, maybe in 13 or 25 episode increments. (similar to their box set episode count).

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Ree » Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:59 pm

I hope not, I want to see more even if i dont always like what goes on.
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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by Kuririn Fan » Fri Aug 28, 2015 2:53 pm

I really hope that Super will last for at least 100 episodes...

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Re: Is Super Dragonball's last hope?

Post by MaGyunia » Fri Aug 28, 2015 5:54 pm

We really can't and shouldn't compare GT to DBSuper. GT was made in a rush, and while some of the characters and villains had some potential to them, there really is nothing to latch onto in order to deem it a worthy successor of DBZ; it took on the worst elements from the Majin Buu arc, by which time Toriyama was already pretty much - and understandably - running out of ideas (hence some of the silliness present in the saga) and none of the factors that made the later stages of DBZ and the entirety of DBZ so fantastic. After being almost "forced" to continue keeping up with new stories, characters, transformations and events with the same quality as always on a constant basis for over a decade, Toriyama wanted to put a quick end to DBZ - hence the unsatisfactory ending to it with those last 3 episodes -, and didn't want anything do to with GT. It could even be argued that GT was made for commercial purposes more than anything, at Dragonball's peak (or one of the peaks) of popularity in terms of TV series/franchise, with a "striking while the iron's hot" mentality behind it.

DBSuper, on the other hand, features entirely new characters and events placed just at the right time (exploring the 10 year gap in-between the defeat of Kid Buu and the last 3 episodes of DBZ), retelling the stories of the two great and large theatrical features they threw our way in pretty much the exact same circumstances, which after all this time might be seen as having been just the right way to approach the series, but indicative that at the time they made BoG in 2013 and Fukkatsu no F in 2015 they didn't, at the time, intend on generating an entirely new full-fledged TV series. After 11 years of inactivity, Toriyama has now fresh ideas in his creative process and we can look at the 2008 Special, Episode of Bardock, Kai, BoG and Fukkatsu no F as the slow but steady build-up for the real bomb: an entirely new series.

I don't see how DBSuper could be Dragonball's "last hope", as you put it, in terms of producing TV series for the franchise. Dragonball is immortal, it will never end and its potential is limitless. Even if they screwed up big time with it, they could always wait for a while, generate a new f****** fantastic Special or Movie just like BoG and the hype would reach the previous degrees in a flash.

It's becoming more and more obvious, as the series' episodes progress, that the entire retelling of BoG will take about 12 episodes, as previously estimated, after which we'll most likely get about two smoother episodes leading to the retelling of Fukkatsu no F, which should also be done within a matter of about 12 episodes, so one could argue and estimate that by episode 24/26 we should be moving on to the arc within DBSuper which really features entirely new, previous unseen characters, villains and events, in the exploration of the 6th Universe. Up until now, there's really no official and/or final information on whether or not they'll produce more episodes AFTER the 6th Universe arc still under the umbrella of DBSuper, but assuming they don't, I'd say it will be the last arc within the series, but also the longer one, so the entire thing will probably be comprised of far less than 100 episodes, but anyway, it's just like I said in previous paragraphs, after that there's always potential to tap onto and continue the story, either before and/or after the 10 year gap we've been exploring recently. No matter what road they choose to go down, a Dragonball TV series, or indeed any Special or Movie or anything related to the franchise will only fail if it's done really hastily, but even in that case the potential for complete and full recovery in a matter of years or even months is there and will always be. That's how I look at it.

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