Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Sat Mar 05, 2016 2:31 pm

apex_pretador wrote:isn't it possible that he got a power boost at that exact instant? like a rage boost type thing? or anything else to indicate that?
He could fight with Beerus in the movie without getting angry, and he is said to be a Saiyan that has surpassed God by the time of FnF, so I doubt that it was a rage boost.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.

Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Sat Mar 05, 2016 3:14 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:I guess Vegeta was right. Maybe the humans should stop slacking off and be Super Humans already.
They're already Super Humans. They need to become Goldy Humans.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Bullza » Sat Mar 05, 2016 8:26 pm

Well the episode is over, Herms had this to say

Piccolo: "So, do I have a chance?"
Goku: "Nope! But maybe you can wear Frost down a bit before Vegeta fights him!"

But he was able to take a few of his attacks and dodge and block a lot of his attacks. So either Frost is weaker than Tagoma who beat the tar out of Piccolo or he did power up.

I'm starting to wonder to if he really is more on the level of Namek saga Frieza as opposed to RoF saga Frieza and that perhaps Goku wasn't using his God power after all which would be why he turned Super Saiyan.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Doctor. » Sat Mar 05, 2016 9:33 pm

Why would he be on the level of Namek arc Freeza if he beat Piccolo?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Bullza » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:07 pm

Well not as weak as that but thinking about it.

When Base Gohan was sparring with Piccolo they looked even.

Base Gohan was equal to Tagoma. So Piccolo is probably on par with or slightly stronger than him. The tournament was only a few days after so he isn't going to get significantly stronger and I dont think anyone commented on Piccolo being stronger in this episode.

Frost wasn't stomping Piccolo whereas Frieza in his first form almost killed Gohan with one punch and all 5 of them together stood no chance.

Goku was more powerful than Frieza in his final form but then was on the losing side against Frost in his third form. When he turns Super Saiyan, he's gold not blue and there's no mention of SSJG at all.

So I'm thinking from strongest to weakest it could go like this

Base Goku (using God power)
Frieza Final Form
SSJ Goku (not using God power)
Frieza (First Form)
SSJ Gohan
Frost (Final Form)
Piccolo = Base Gohan
Tagoma
Frost (Third Form)
Base Goku (not using God power)

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by LightBing » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:35 pm

This episode didn't help. I again think their bases might not be SSJG level, even if there's contradictory material. Goku still had SSJB, which we have the confirmation in this episode, it's indeed an upgrade of SSJ. Unless their talking about SSJ2 and SSJ3, I hope that's not the case.

Time to remake the power levels, doing this every episode now...

Piccolo - 0,80 (80)
I'll assume he's at Mystic Gohan level, since he saw him train with him.

Tired Frost - 1,20 (120)
Rested Frost - 2 (200)

Goku didn't think Piccolo had any chance at all. I'm thinking Frost is slightly stronger than Freeza but lacks the Golden Transformation.

Base Goku - 1,50 (150)
SSJ Goku - 3 (300)
SSB Goku - 7 (700)

A lot of guessing here.

It's getting more clear that Universe 6 are "weaklings", by God Tier standard. It seems they might have retconned the Base Saiyans power, to allow SSJ to be an intermediate level.
This would also make Vegeta's power up more "acceptable", he did get a lot stronger but the huge boost is simply by discovering SSJB.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by dbzfan7 » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:42 pm

Before updating my levels I have (Non joking for once)

Vados
Whis
Beerus
Champa
Monaka
SSJB Goku/Vegeta
Golden Freeza
Tired Golden Freeza
SSJ Goku/Vegeta
Final Form Frost
3rd Form Frost
Base Goku/Base Vegeta
Frost
Botamo
Tired Frost
SSJ Gohan
Base Gohan/Piccolo
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:52 pm

Leaving the fucking lame ass bullshit aside for a minute, this episode made no sense power wise.

Goku flat out tells Piccolo he has no chance to win yet he not only took several hits without taking any noticeable damage but he also blocked all of Frost's hits with one hand and managed to restrain Frost with said hand to the point he needed to cheat again. Not to mention he broke the dome that even Champa couldn't.

P.S. I really hope Hit kills Frost.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by dbzfan7 » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:56 pm

Zombie wrote:Leaving the fucking lame ass bullshit aside for a minute, this episode made no sense power wise.

Goku flat out tells Piccolo he has no chance to win yet he not only took several hits without taking any noticeable damage but he also blocked all of Frost's hits with one hand and managed to restrained Frost with said hand to the point he needed to cheat again. Not to mention he broke the dome that even Champa couldn't.

P.S. I really hope Hit kills Frost.
Piccolo asked if he could power down for him, but Frost said he didn't have the strength to kill him. So he was SEVERELY drained. The Dome though...I got nothing.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Sat Mar 05, 2016 11:58 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:
Zombie wrote:Leaving the fucking lame ass bullshit aside for a minute, this episode made no sense power wise.

Goku flat out tells Piccolo he has no chance to win yet he not only took several hits without taking any noticeable damage but he also blocked all of Frost's hits with one hand and managed to restrained Frost with said hand to the point he needed to cheat again. Not to mention he broke the dome that even Champa couldn't.

P.S. I really hope Hit kills Frost.
Piccolo asked if he could power down for him, but Frost said he didn't have the strength to kill him. So he was SEVERELY drained. The Dome though...I got nothing.
So Goku can' t sense ki now?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by dbzfan7 » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:01 am

Zombie wrote:
dbzfan7 wrote:
Zombie wrote:Leaving the fucking lame ass bullshit aside for a minute, this episode made no sense power wise.

Goku flat out tells Piccolo he has no chance to win yet he not only took several hits without taking any noticeable damage but he also blocked all of Frost's hits with one hand and managed to restrained Frost with said hand to the point he needed to cheat again. Not to mention he broke the dome that even Champa couldn't.

P.S. I really hope Hit kills Frost.
Piccolo asked if he could power down for him, but Frost said he didn't have the strength to kill him. So he was SEVERELY drained. The Dome though...I got nothing.
So Goku can' t sense ki now?
Frost was still significantly stronger than Piccolo, but not as overwhelming as he would be at full strength. We have no idea where he ranks in relation to anything. But that's Super power levels in a nutshell. Batshit insane.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Vice » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:04 am

So Piccolo can't even beat a severely weakened Frost? dat Toriyama's favorite character.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:08 am

Vice wrote:So Piccolo can't even beat a severely weakened Frost? dat Toriyama's favorite character.
He was about to do it but since this is the Goku and Vegeta show, Vegeta needs to be the one to beat him.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Vice » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:18 am

Zombie wrote:He was about to do it but since this is the Goku and Vegeta show, Vegeta needs to be the one to beat him.
Well of course Vegeta had to step in, he was annoyed by his voice or some shit, it's only natural. Piccolo was only cheated out of a victory and then had a hole shot through his chest, why would anyone be mad about an asinine thing like that for?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by fexus » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:18 am

Looks like Piccolo is at least stronger than base Goku and Vegeta. Stronger than normal Frost. And also stronger than Gohan in RoF. Not as strong as SSJ or final form Frost but Piccolo still became really strong at least.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Kuririn Fan » Sun Mar 06, 2016 1:00 am

Gohan has the highest potential, because he's the best of both worlds (human - saiyan , fighter - scholar). He's the best, much better than Goku and Vegeta.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Bullza » Sun Mar 06, 2016 2:14 am

It might be a bit presumptuous to say but the preview for the next episode showed Vegeta turning Super Saiyan. Unless that happened to be against another fighter then it would appear than Frost couldn't have weakened to below his third forms strenght.

Also while it may look like Piccolo is stronger than base Goku and Vegeta, I can't see him being stronger than the Goku (or Vegeta) that fought Frieza in his final form because they were leagues ahead of Piccolo. It'd mean that Gohan was stronger too.

How could they possibly catch up and overtake them when Goku and Vegeta were so far ahead and then trained for 3 years?

I definitley think that the Goku who fought Frieza in his final form is waaaaaay stronger than the Goku who fought Frost. He's not tapping into the SSJG power, that's why he's turned into a SSJ Gold.

Base Goku (RoF using God power) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Piccolo (U6) > Base Goku (U6 not using God power)

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Sun Mar 06, 2016 2:26 am

No distinction was made between base forms. They never used God ki in base in Super.

You do make a great point with Frost. If Vegeta his using regular Super Saiyan against Frost that means that the weakened Frost in his final form is still superior to his assault form. This means Piccolo is in fact on par or stronger than the base Saiyans.

That would make the feat of Piccolo destroying Vados dome not that impossible.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Chillekasper » Sun Mar 06, 2016 3:07 am

Piccolo is stronger than Goku and Vegeta in bass form. But not than there SSJ form...

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Power Level Discussion Thread

Post by Bullza » Sun Mar 06, 2016 3:09 am

I'm talking about the God power. The power he supposedly absorbed which boosted his base and SSJ power to a completely different level. Is that something they can tap into at will perhaps.

It'd clear a couple things up possibly, like Goku being able to fight with Beerus and stop his attack at one point but then Whis comparing his power to Beerus' as a staff to a gigantic tree.

Base Goku was stronger than Frieza in his final form. Piccolo was significantly weaker than Frieza in his first form.

Goku then trained 8 months on Beerus' planet with Whis' special weights, then 3 years in the ROSAT.

Piccolo (and Gohan who was on par with him) surpassing base Goku just by training for 8 months on Earth doesn't make any sense.

There was also no comment (I believe or Herms would have said on Twitter) about Piccolo's power level spiking. If it had increased that drastically that quickly you'd think that at least one person there would have said something.

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