Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Miracles
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Fri Apr 24, 2020 11:40 pm

Sadala Elite wrote: Fri Apr 24, 2020 8:14 pm
Miracles wrote: Fri Apr 24, 2020 4:32 pm This isn't even up for debate. Moro's normal state is already at a suppressed UI omen level.
Not to mention a much stronger Goku than the one Jiren fought two arcs ago at that.
True. Moro at his normal state has to be at least on par with Supressed Jiren from the early ToP.
Jiren didn't fight this Goku, who is much stronger now.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Nevaeh » Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:10 am

Thani wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:47 pm I dunno, Piccolo just said it's hard to tell. But after all that training, he MUST have gotten stronger. Heck, his blue form was stated to be "way stronger than last time I saw it".
Maybe the gains from said training don't apply to Omen/UI because it's technically a technique and not a generic power up? Idk

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Gogeta_Blue » Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:26 pm

Both UI forms are techniques and power ups, at least in Goku's case. Any general power increase should also apply to them, otherwise at some point Blue's power would surpass theirs which wouldn't make any sense.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Jmass97 » Sun Apr 26, 2020 12:12 pm

Nevaeh wrote: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:10 am
Thani wrote: Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:47 pm I dunno, Piccolo just said it's hard to tell. But after all that training, he MUST have gotten stronger. Heck, his blue form was stated to be "way stronger than last time I saw it".
Maybe the gains from said training don't apply to Omen/UI because it's technically a technique and not a generic power up? Idk
The gains do apply, that was the entire point of the training. In order to maintain the form he has to train his body not only mentally but physically as well so that his body can harness and maintain that power. And yes it’s a technique but it’s already been shown that at least when a saiyan (Goku in this case) activates it it’s considered a form (Piccolo Gohan and Whis all called it such) and he definitely has more strength than he does in blue even if it isn’t a substantial increase.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Mon Apr 27, 2020 2:15 pm

So manga Hit, how strong is he really?

His supressed state that knocked out Vegeta Blue and used the Time Skip was said by Beerus to be weaker than SS Goku, but what about his FP? weaker than Blue of course, but stronger than God? somewhere in between? I know there is no way of telling because he did nothing with it.

And ToP Hit? he could fight alongside MSSB Goku and that wasn't even his FP. Would it be fair to say Manga ToP Hit's full power is stronger than ToP MSSB Goku?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Apr 27, 2020 4:30 pm

TOP manga Hit was weaker than Blue Goku. Goku lasted longer against Jiren.

In U6 Hit's full power was stronger than Red but weaker than Blue. Since Goku needed to go Blue to overcome his time stop after powering up.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Tue Apr 28, 2020 8:49 am

Eh, I wouldn't say Hit is weaker than Goku. We know that Goku was at Full-Power when fighting alongside Hit. Both of them are likely around the same level. Hit put his all into his Time Lag and Jiren basically overpowered him out of nowhere. If the U6 tournament is any indication, Hit only showed his Full-Power when it was time to do his Time Lag. That's the only time we see him do an intense power-up during the ToP.

So he could be above Goku for all we know.
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Tue May 05, 2020 2:12 pm

How much stronger than his SS2 was Trunks in SSR? He managed to give Black Rose a nice fight.

I was wondering if it wouldn't have been better to give him SS3, a perfected version of it that is? I mean, SSR is a mess, no one really knows how it works, if it's godly(that blue-ish glow) or not, while SS3 is a form we all know, and even if it has never been useful or defeated anyone, using it without drawbacks would have been nice, but I'm wondering if it would've been enough. Also a plus to master old forms instead of asspulling new ones that weren't even explained.

Although the anime doesn't hold Trunks' SS2 in such high regard as the Manga.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Tue May 05, 2020 2:30 pm

Koitsukai wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 2:12 pm How much stronger than his SS2 was Trunks in SSR? He managed to give Black Rose a nice fight.

I was wondering if it wouldn't have been better to give him SS3, a perfected version of it that is? I mean, SSR is a mess, no one really knows how it works, if it's godly(that blue-ish glow) or not, while SS3 is a form we all know, and even if it has never been useful or defeated anyone, using it without drawbacks would have been nice, but I'm wondering if it would've been enough. Also a plus to master old forms instead of asspulling new ones that weren't even explained.

Although the anime doesn't hold Trunks' SS2 in such high regard as the Manga.
The anime tends to keep forms as relatively identical in function as before; makes it simpler

Anyways, Future Trunks was solidly SSB-level in SS Rage, so it's presumably a proportional increase from this level.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Tue May 05, 2020 4:32 pm

Koitsukai wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 2:12 pm How much stronger than his SS2 was Trunks in SSR? He managed to give Black Rose a nice fight.

I was wondering if it wouldn't have been better to give him SS3, a perfected version of it that is? I mean, SSR is a mess, no one really knows how it works, if it's godly(that blue-ish glow) or not, while SS3 is a form we all know, and even if it has never been useful or defeated anyone, using it without drawbacks would have been nice, but I'm wondering if it would've been enough. Also a plus to master old forms instead of asspulling new ones that weren't even explained.

Although the anime doesn't hold Trunks' SS2 in such high regard as the Manga.
I wouldnt be so sure about the last part. He was clearly holding back and only went full power when Goku turned SS3. I have Trunks twice as strong as Goku on equal forms. This also makes the multiplier for SSR far less than SSB.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Tue May 05, 2020 5:12 pm

In the manga, Trunks SSJ2 was stated to be "nearly" as powerful as Kakarot's SSJ3.
In the anime, Trunks SSJ2 got bullied by SSJ3 Goku. So manga Trunk's SSJ2 is more powerful.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Nevaeh » Thu May 14, 2020 3:44 am

After lolstomping the likes of SSJ3 Goku, Ultimate Gohan, Gotenks etc 2 arcs prior, Beerus thought SSJ2 Trunks was impressive. Also, SSJ2 Goku was so strong Gowasu thought he rivaled a hakaishin and Trunks was equal to him

Anime Trunks was on another level

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by wolflonnie » Thu May 14, 2020 4:38 am

Nevaeh wrote: Thu May 14, 2020 3:44 am After lolstomping the likes of SSJ3 Goku, Ultimate Gohan, Gotenks etc 2 arcs prior, Beerus thought SSJ2 Trunks was impressive. Also, SSJ2 Goku was so strong Gowasu thought he rivaled a hakaishin and Trunks was equal to him

Anime Trunks was on another level
Not to mention an even more improved SSJ2 Goku was able to spar with a stronger Ultimate Gohan.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by GodVegetto91 » Thu May 14, 2020 7:39 am

Based only on the rough image drafts that came out yesterday, it only further validates my point/topic I made earlier about how Moro isn’t as impressive as I first thought. At all.

UI Omen Goku straight up OVERPOWERED Moro during an aura power struggle. This is no longer just about him having superior speed. This is about power too. Then he further continued to “dominate” him in the next panels. Even kicking the energy ball out of his hands without him even realizing UIO Goku was already there, and then elbowing him down and continuing his assault until Moro grabbed Goku’s leg.

If “Full Power” Moro can’t beat Full Power UI Omen Goku, then he should absorb the whole planet with everyone on it, including MUI Goku when he does appear. Than heal Goku afterwards after absorbing all of his MUI energy aswell as the whole planet earth and everyone on it and THAN continue the fight!😎

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Sadala Elite » Sat May 16, 2020 2:42 pm

ZombieVito wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 4:32 pm
Koitsukai wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 2:12 pm How much stronger than his SS2 was Trunks in SSR? He managed to give Black Rose a nice fight.

I was wondering if it wouldn't have been better to give him SS3, a perfected version of it that is? I mean, SSR is a mess, no one really knows how it works, if it's godly(that blue-ish glow) or not, while SS3 is a form we all know, and even if it has never been useful or defeated anyone, using it without drawbacks would have been nice, but I'm wondering if it would've been enough. Also a plus to master old forms instead of asspulling new ones that weren't even explained.

Although the anime doesn't hold Trunks' SS2 in such high regard as the Manga.
I wouldnt be so sure about the last part. He was clearly holding back and only went full power when Goku turned SS3. I have Trunks twice as strong as Goku on equal forms. This also makes the multiplier for SSR far less than SSB.
SSJ Rage is obviously equal to SSB, what are you talking about? Rage Trunks was able to fight off Rose Black & Future Zamasu by himself, the same Rose Black who causally beat down SSB Vegeta & Goku in their 1st future fight.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat May 16, 2020 5:06 pm

Too bad Blue Goku could of wrapped the Future Trunks arc up anytime he wanted in that second bout. Able to beam struggle and overpower a fused Zamas. :lol:

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sat May 16, 2020 5:09 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:06 pm Too bad Blue Goku could of wrapped the Future Trunks arc up anytime he wanted in that second bout. Able to beam struggle and overpower a fused Zamas. :lol:
As seen with Roshi later on in the Tournament of Power, put enough power into a Kamehameha and you can overwhelm even those stronger than you, albeit at great cost to your body.

Goku was pushing his Kamehameha beyond its normal limits and ended up numbing his arms entirely and draining himself significantly.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat May 16, 2020 7:19 pm

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:09 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:06 pm Too bad Blue Goku could of wrapped the Future Trunks arc up anytime he wanted in that second bout. Able to beam struggle and overpower a fused Zamas. :lol:
As seen with Roshi later on in the Tournament of Power, put enough power into a Kamehameha and you can overwhelm even those stronger than you, albeit at great cost to your body.

Goku was pushing his Kamehameha beyond its normal limits and ended up numbing his arms entirely and draining himself significantly.
Except Goku didn't break his limits. That was stated to be his "full power" against merged Zamas.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Sadala Elite » Sat May 16, 2020 8:22 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 7:19 pm
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:09 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:06 pm Too bad Blue Goku could of wrapped the Future Trunks arc up anytime he wanted in that second bout. Able to beam struggle and overpower a fused Zamas. :lol:
As seen with Roshi later on in the Tournament of Power, put enough power into a Kamehameha and you can overwhelm even those stronger than you, albeit at great cost to your body.

Goku was pushing his Kamehameha beyond its normal limits and ended up numbing his arms entirely and draining himself significantly.
Except Goku didn't break his limits. That was stated to be his "full power" against merged Zamas.
Yet it broke his arms and he didn't use Kaioken, which logically means that he broke his normal SSB limits.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat May 16, 2020 8:59 pm

Sadala Elite wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 8:22 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 7:19 pm
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote: Sat May 16, 2020 5:09 pm
As seen with Roshi later on in the Tournament of Power, put enough power into a Kamehameha and you can overwhelm even those stronger than you, albeit at great cost to your body.

Goku was pushing his Kamehameha beyond its normal limits and ended up numbing his arms entirely and draining himself significantly.
Except Goku didn't break his limits. That was stated to be his "full power" against merged Zamas.
Yet it broke his arms and he didn't use Kaioken, which logically means that he broke his normal SSB limits.
"Goku broke his limits," Not factual. Goku just used his "full power," facts.

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