Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:03 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:13 pmWe just had the Dragon tell us some chapters ago that Granolah is weaker than Beerus.
Well he didn't so why even lie like that? What's the purpose of that?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:13 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:03 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:13 pmWe just had the Dragon tell us some chapters ago that Granolah is weaker than Beerus.
Well he didn't so why even lie like that? What's the purpose of that?
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:14 pm

ZombieVito wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:00 pm So I'm starting to read the Moro arc and wondered. How strong was Dai Kaioshin before sealing up Moro's magic?

CSSB level? Above? Below?
Supposedly much weaker than Moro with his full strength. Without those divine powers, we know he is much weaker than CSSB though.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:31 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:13 pm
Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:03 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:13 pmWe just had the Dragon tell us some chapters ago that Granolah is weaker than Beerus.
Well he didn't so why even lie like that? What's the purpose of that?
Image
Where does it say that Granolah is stronger than Beerus? Specifically I mean.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:22 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:31 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:13 pm
Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:03 pm

Well he didn't so why even lie like that? What's the purpose of that?
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Where does it say that Granolah is stronger than Beerus? Specifically I mean.
You might want to fix your question.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by ZombieVito » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:49 pm

Hugo Boss wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:14 pm
ZombieVito wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:00 pm So I'm starting to read the Moro arc and wondered. How strong was Dai Kaioshin before sealing up Moro's magic?

CSSB level? Above? Below?
Supposedly much weaker than Moro with his full strength. Without those divine powers, we know he is much weaker than CSSB though.
I'm wondering him with his divine powers. We know that without them he's weaker than South Kaioshin.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:15 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:22 pm You might want to fix your question.
No. You said the Dragon said that Granolah was weaker than Beerus. Where on the image you showed me is that said?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:36 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:15 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:22 pm You might want to fix your question.
No. You said the Dragon said that Granolah was weaker than Beerus. Where on the image you showed me is that said?
"Apart from the gods."

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:53 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:36 pm"Apart from the gods."
So Granolah is also weaker than the Supreme Kai? King Kai?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:52 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:53 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:36 pm"Apart from the gods."
So Granolah is also weaker than the Supreme Kai? King Kai?
Those gods been surpassed by Goku and Vegeta. Who is stated to be weaker than Granolah. Wanna try again?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by DiscountDabi » Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:34 pm

Hugo Boss wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:14 pm
ZombieVito wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:00 pm So I'm starting to read the Moro arc and wondered. How strong was Dai Kaioshin before sealing up Moro's magic?

CSSB level? Above? Below?
Supposedly much weaker than Moro with his full strength. Without those divine powers, we know he is much weaker than CSSB though.
We don't actully know that for sure though. Dai Kaioshin could be far stronger than even Beerus given Uubs showing of his God power being able to Fuel Goku back to Perfect UI without even breaking a sweat. He doesn't even look strained or tired in the slightest.

It could just be that Moro was able to drain his energy and thats why the Kai's couldn't stop him.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Hugo Boss » Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:17 pm

DiscountDabi wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:34 pm
Hugo Boss wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:14 pm
ZombieVito wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:00 pm So I'm starting to read the Moro arc and wondered. How strong was Dai Kaioshin before sealing up Moro's magic?

CSSB level? Above? Below?
Supposedly much weaker than Moro with his full strength. Without those divine powers, we know he is much weaker than CSSB though.
We don't actully know that for sure though. Dai Kaioshin could be far stronger than even Beerus given Uubs showing of his God power being able to Fuel Goku back to Perfect UI without even breaking a sweat. He doesn't even look strained or tired in the slightest.

It could just be that Moro was able to drain his energy and thats why the Kai's couldn't stop him.
He and South Kaioshin were no match for Moro with his full strength. The bit about Oob’s divine power being able to replenish Goku’s may be related to Oob’s potential. Or Dai Kaioshin was very incompetent as a fighter.

Another possibility is that donating bits of energy can grant a greater scope of power, like Trunks using his ki to recover Goku’s back to full power against Zamasu.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sun Jul 25, 2021 12:40 pm

Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:52 pmThose gods been surpassed by Goku and Vegeta. Who is stated to be weaker than Granolah. Wanna try again?
But that's also not what the dragon said...the dragon said apart from the gods themselves to which he would then have made him stronger than gods anyway.

In that regard then Broly was said to be stronger than Beerus by Goku so if Granolah is stronger than Broly then he's stronger than Beerus.

Still either way, you said that the dragon said Granolah was stronger than Beerus. That's a lie.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:12 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 12:40 pm
Miracles wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:52 pmThose gods been surpassed by Goku and Vegeta. Who is stated to be weaker than Granolah. Wanna try again?
But that's also not what the dragon said...the dragon said apart from the gods themselves to which he would then have made him stronger than gods anyway.

In that regard then Broly was said to be stronger than Beerus by Goku so if Granolah is stronger than Broly then he's stronger than Beerus.

Still either way, you said that the dragon said Granolah was stronger than Beerus. That's a lie.
Where did I say the Dragon stated Granolah was stronger than Beerus?
Secondly, the Dragon said Granolah wished to be the strongest life form in the universe "apart from the gods." IE..Beerus and Whis.

Please read the story and my posts carefully before responding.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Sun Jul 25, 2021 4:11 pm

Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:12 pmWhere did I say the Dragon stated Granolah was stronger than Beerus?
Secondly, the Dragon said Granolah wished to be the strongest life form in the universe "apart from the gods." IE..Beerus and Whis.

Please read the story and my posts carefully before responding.
Vice versa then. You said "We just had the Dragon tell us some chapters ago that Granolah is weaker than Beerus."

Nowhere in your image is that said. He said strongest apart from the gods. Why are you saying "IE Beerus and Whis"?

Where was it said that the exception was Beerus and Whis? Why are you cherry picking which gods he's weaker than? If he's stronger than Supreme Kai then it's not a part from the gods to begin with so clearly he's stronger than some and not others.

Why can it not merely just be Whis he's weaker than? If Broly is a lifeform and he's stronger than Beerus and Granolah is stronger than Broly then he's stronger than Beerus.

You're just cherry picking and making an assumption to suit yourself.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Marz » Sun Jul 25, 2021 4:28 pm

Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:12 pm Where did I say the Dragon stated Granolah was stronger than Beerus?
Secondly, the Dragon said Granolah wished to be the strongest life form in the universe "apart from the gods." IE..Beerus and Whis.

Please read the story and my posts carefully before responding.
Beerus will probably still be stronger because he's a moving goalpost that Toriyama hasn't decided if he should be overcome yet or not, but what you're saying isn't really proof of that. The loophole of the wish is that the dragon can make Granola the strongest among humans/mortals. So if these humans were stronger than Gods then Granola would obviously be raised to a level above the Gods who were already surpassed by humans. So if Goku were supposed to be stronger than Beerus, Granola would have surpassed him

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:29 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 4:11 pm
Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:12 pmWhere did I say the Dragon stated Granolah was stronger than Beerus?
Secondly, the Dragon said Granolah wished to be the strongest life form in the universe "apart from the gods." IE..Beerus and Whis.

Please read the story and my posts carefully before responding.
Vice versa then. You said "We just had the Dragon tell us some chapters ago that Granolah is weaker than Beerus."

Nowhere in your image is that said. He said strongest apart from the gods. Why are you saying "IE Beerus and Whis"?

Where was it said that the exception was Beerus and Whis?
Why are you cherry picking which gods he's weaker than? If he's stronger than Supreme Kai then it's not a part from the gods to begin with so clearly he's stronger than some and not others.

Why can it not merely just be Whis he's weaker than? If Broly is a lifeform and he's stronger than Beerus and Granolah is stronger than Broly then he's stronger than Beerus.

You're just cherry picking and making an assumption to suit yourself.
There is no cherry picking. It was already stated in Dragonball that Goku/Vegeta been surpassed Kai and Kaioshins. So which god do you wanna try next...Dende? It's amazing how your mental gymnastics literally took us back to Buu saga power levels. :lol:

I really urge you to reread the plot to get in line with the fact that the gods being spoken of is Beerus and Whis.

Marz wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 4:28 pm
Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 2:12 pm Where did I say the Dragon stated Granolah was stronger than Beerus?
Secondly, the Dragon said Granolah wished to be the strongest life form in the universe "apart from the gods." IE..Beerus and Whis.

Please read the story and my posts carefully before responding.
Beerus will probably still be stronger because he's a moving goalpost that Toriyama hasn't decided if he should be overcome yet or not, but what you're saying isn't really proof of that. The loophole of the wish is that the dragon can make Granola the strongest among humans/mortals. So if these humans were stronger than Gods then Granola would obviously be raised to a level above the Gods who were already surpassed by humans. So if Goku were supposed to be stronger than Beerus, Granola would have surpassed him
That's exactly why we know which gods the dragon is talking about. The story already had our protagonists's surpass every god in universe 7 except Beerus and Whis.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Xeno Goku Black » Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:05 am

Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:29 pmThat's exactly why we know which gods the dragon is talking about. The story already had our protagonists's surpass every god in universe 7 except Beerus and Whis.
Except you don't know "exactly" which gods he's talking about because it was never specified. It is merely a cherry picked assumption on your part.

Broly was said to be stronger than Beerus so then I guess Granolah is stronger than Beerus.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:16 am

We don't need to know the dragon was talking about Beerus and Whis, because we already know that. The other gods are fodder ever since the Cell Games. That only leaves the Bog-introduced deities.

And we've already seen Granola is stronger than every other mortal, he defeated UI Goku and SSBE Vegeta. He might even be weaker than FP Vegeta, who is NOT stronger than Beerus. So even if the dragon wouldn't have said anything, the story did.

I mean, we might disagree over if Beerus should still be stronger than everyone else and by that margin, but the story is clear in that regard. The dragon couldn't make Granolah surpass Beerus and Whis.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Mon Jul 26, 2021 4:37 pm

Xeno Goku Black wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 10:05 am
Miracles wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 5:29 pmThat's exactly why we know which gods the dragon is talking about. The story already had our protagonists's surpass every god in universe 7 except Beerus and Whis.
Except you don't know "exactly" which gods he's talking about because it was never specified. It is merely a cherry picked assumption on your part.

Broly was said to be stronger than Beerus so then I guess Granolah is stronger than Beerus.
Get your facts straight. Broly was never said to be stronger than Beerus.
Also, Thank you for confirming that Dende, King Kai and Kaioshins are stronger than Granolah.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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