Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Deathbringer
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Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by Deathbringer » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:17 pm

Now I have no proof of this apart from some of my own reasoning that I have used to come to a single question, but, I was wondering if there was any way for us to know if Dragon Ball Super was always going to include a re-telling of Battle of Gods and Resurrection F before getting to a new storyline. I was only thinking this because:

1) Why would Toriyama want to give us the same story twice?
2) DBSuper includes things taken right out of filler and movies, and it makes a few changes to the general story of BoG (so far at least) was any of that actually Toriyama's idea?
3) Toriyama seems to be busy working on the manga version of this story alongside Toyotaro, the manga is going faster than the anime what will happen when it reaches the Universe 6 arc, will it be the same as what the anime will end up being?
4) Meanwhile on the anime side of things, Toriyama is only doing the story and character draft...the same story and character draft as was used for BoG? What if he's suddenly listed as a writer once the series moves into Universe 6?
5) The title "Dragon Ball Super" seems to be in partial reference to the Super Dragon Balls of Universe 6, as if the title is patiently waiting for the story to get to that part.

This all starts to make me think that what if Toriyama had pitched the idea of Super to be an anime following on from the two movies, with a new story about the characters going to Universe 6 and looking for the super dragon balls (interestingly similar to the space exploration idea in GT) what if after that perhaps Toei (or even Toriyama) decided to put in a refreshed version of the two movies to maybe get everyone up to speed if they hadn't seen the movies (which is silly because the show appeals to Dragon Ball fans, most of whom saw the movies)


Maybe this is just wishful thinking from me (even though I'm mostly enjoying Super) I probably just think it's a better and more logical idea to have started with Universe 6, but has anyone else had thoughts like this? Even if it's not wishful thinking it's still speculation on my part, I don't actually believe that what I just typed in this post is 100% true, but do any of you think some of this might be likely?
Last edited by Deathbringer on Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Did Toriyama intend to start DBSuper off with Universe 6

Post by ekrolo2 » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:28 pm

I keep hearing that they're remaking the movies as a way to give Toriyama the time to work on the U6 arc but I can't verify if that's 100% legitimate or simple fan speculation.
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Re: Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Mon Aug 24, 2015 5:37 pm

Why would Toriyama want to give us the same story twice?

No one from TOEI has came out to say that, so we can't really tell for sure.

DBSuper includes things taken right out of filler and movies, and it makes a few changes to the general story of BoG (so far at least) was any of that actually Toriyama's idea?

Contrary to popular belief Battle of Gods wasn't written entirely by Toriyama. The first draft for the story wasn't his, but he did make a lot of changes that made Battle of Gods the movie it is now.

Toriyama seems to be busy working on the manga version of this story alongside Toyotaro, the manga is going faster than the anime what will happen when it reaches the Universe 6 arc, will it be the same as what the anime will end up being?

I'd guess the pacing of the manga will be the same, a lot of events will be left out but the major plot points will remain intact.

Meanwhile on the anime side of things, Toriyama is only doing the story and character draft...the same story and character draft as was used for BoG? What if he's suddenly listed as a writer once the series moves into Universe 6?

Toriyama is already credited as the concept writer for DBS. A lot of the overall story is his idea, but Toyataro and TOEI have a lot of their own input, which differs depending on the medium (manga/anime).

The title "Dragon Ball Super" seems to be in partial reference to the Super Dragon Balls of Universe 6, as if the title is patiently waiting for the story to get to that part.

For all we know more could be introduced later on in the series that would tie in with the "Super".
ekrolo2 wrote:I keep hearing that they're remaking the movies as a way to give Toriyama the time to work on the U6 arc but I can't verify if that's 100% legitimate or simple fan speculation.
More than likely it's speculation.
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Re: Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by irreality » Mon Aug 24, 2015 6:12 pm

I think as to the whys of it being retold, everything is fan speculation, but I think it is good for many reasons, both practical for Toei and for the fans. For example, I have many fans of Ghost in a Shell among my friends who are vey frustrated with how complicated it is to follow the series since it is partly in movies and partly in episodes, now. I don't follow Ghost in a Shell so I don't know the veracity of that, but thinking about DB, I know people who used to be fans years ago who haven't even heard of BoG or RoF, and they only just heard of the series coming out. I think having to go back an buy a movie or two before watching the series is more investment than a lot of casual fans want to put in. If you look at the sales figures of the movies, yeah, they are high, but they aren't so high that every fan interested in DB has seen it. So there is that practical aspect.

There is also the practical aspect of time: you need time to write scripts, storyboard stories, etc. They had such little lead time to making DBS. Not enough time to do all that for brand new content if they needed to start animating the very next day, pretty much. Best to start with known material for a bit to ease people in to "where we are now" and give them time for pre-production.

Also, there are things that need to be fleshed out from the movies. They probably will flesh out Jaco, and that needs to happen before the events of RoF. They need to add a reason for Vegeta to go SSG as a prerequisite. They need to introduce plothooks for the universe 6 plot and not just do it in one episode a la GT. They might have wanted to shift all the events back in time to give themselves more "time" in the 10 year span to play with. They didn't want to exist in the JSAT special continuity since that is not really available for general viewing anymore.

I don't think it is about making a "better" version of BoG or RoF. They are both pretty good as is. I think it is about placing them into a coherent narrative, both in terms of production, in universe details, and viewership.

Despite people being "bored" seeing BoG (I'm not -- I watched BoG two or three times (once extended), and like all the new details this time around), I don't think it would be "better" to start with Universe 6. People can always skip what they don't like. And a lot of casual fans of DBZ won't even notice once it is in syndication in other countries.

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Re: Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by Herms » Mon Aug 24, 2015 6:37 pm

Deathbringer wrote:3) Toriyama seems to be busy working on the manga version of this story alongside Toyotaro
Toriyama's not working on the Super manga, at least not any more than he's involved with the anime version.
ekrolo2 wrote:I keep hearing that they're remaking the movies as a way to give Toriyama the time to work on the U6 arc but I can't verify if that's 100% legitimate or simple fan speculation.
That's just fan speculation. It's possible, but there's been no word about it from Toriyama or any other legitimate source.
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Re: Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by DBZGTKOSDH » Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:12 pm

Toriyama's statement about Super seems to imply that he will only write the U6 arc, while the BoG & FnF arcs will be based on the movies he has already written. With all the anime-only stuff in the BoG arc (like Gregory & Toei Kuririn), I doubt Toriyama has anything to do with the BoG & FnF arcs.
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Re: Was Super intended to start with the Universe 6 arc?

Post by dbzfan7 » Mon Aug 24, 2015 9:24 pm

I can't really say, but I do kinda think the BOG and FNF retellings are basically stalling time for the universe 6 stuff to be thought out.
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