Super Animation Catalogue 2.0

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Noah
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Noah » Mon May 22, 2017 11:44 pm

Jinzoningen MULE wrote: Considering that it's specifically a Precure reference, and the original Sailor Moon isn't representative of the current trends, this example doesn't really apply.
Either you like it or not, it does apply. Both have the same genre and Sailor Moon is also a show from Toei studio.
JulieYBM wrote:
Noah wrote:You have magical girls transforming just just fine without exaggerated stereotypes.
'Exaggerated stereotypes', tropes and clichés are the Japanese comics, animation, game and light novel industries in a nutshell. It's what people like to create and consume.
I'm not denying any of that. Is just a particular preference that things could be done in another way.
Last edited by Noah on Mon May 22, 2017 11:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Jinzoningen MULE » Mon May 22, 2017 11:45 pm

Noah wrote:Either you like it or not, it does apply. Both have the same genre and Sailor Moon is also a show from Toei studio.
...from 25 years ago. That's a quarter of a century ago, you aren't being realistic. It's not even a matter of like or dislike, there's nothing invalid about the parody.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Noah » Mon May 22, 2017 11:53 pm

Jinzoningen MULE wrote:...from 25 years ago. That's a quarter of a century, you aren't being realistic. It's not even a matter of like or dislike, there's nothing invalid about the parody.
Didn't they had running a new Sailor Moon anime 3 years ago? Anyway, even if my example is old, my point still stands. There's nothing wrong in not enjoying stuff for being too generic.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by aaronWgamer » Tue May 23, 2017 6:26 am

Noah wrote:
Jinzoningen MULE wrote:...from 25 years ago. That's a quarter of a century, you aren't being realistic. It's not even a matter of like or dislike, there's nothing invalid about the parody.
Didn't they had running a new Sailor Moon anime 3 years ago? Anyway, even if my example is old, my point still stands. There's nothing wrong in not enjoying stuff for being too generic.
Parody itself is supposed to be a form of criticism. The joke was very clearly a combination of a clichéd over the top transformation and the character's more fat and weird design, as compared to the typically attractive one you'd expect after such a transformation.

The transformation is generic, that's the joke. It's both out of place because of the series it's in and the character's transformed state.

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Alee9977 » Tue May 23, 2017 7:39 am

Jinzoningen MULE wrote:
Alee9977 wrote:Pretty sure it is Ishikawa, at least Bulma is.
The jaw does remind me of recent Ishikawa, but I'm not comfortable saying for sure.
Besides the jaw, the eyes, neck and ears make me think that shot is Ishikawa, also because it's on model but nowadays, almost everybody draws on model.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Ajay » Tue May 23, 2017 7:52 am

If it helps, there's absolutely nothing in that preview that looks like Itai to me. It's all Ishikawa, by my eyes.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Octorockandroll » Tue May 23, 2017 7:53 am

Noah wrote:
Jinzoningen MULE wrote:...from 25 years ago. That's a quarter of a century, you aren't being realistic. It's not even a matter of like or dislike, there's nothing invalid about the parody.
Didn't they had running a new Sailor Moon anime 3 years ago? Anyway, even if my example is old, my point still stands. There's nothing wrong in not enjoying stuff for being too generic.
They did, but it was a web animation. Not exactly the height of cultural relevance. Also not enjoying something for being generic when the fact that it is generic is the joke is entirely missing the point.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Tue May 23, 2017 8:01 am

Ajay wrote:If it helps, there's absolutely nothing in that preview that looks like Itai to me. It's all Ishikawa, by my eyes.
How would you rate Ishikawa's art, as it is now? Do you think it's pleasing to look at? Does it have a Dragon Ball feel to it or has it gotten better or worse over time?

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Ajay » Tue May 23, 2017 8:21 am

SaiyanGod117 wrote:How would you rate Ishikawa's art, as it is now? Do you think it's pleasing to look at? Does it have a Dragon Ball feel to it or has it gotten better or worse over time?
I have no issue with it, really. His entries are due for a bit of an update since some of the earlier episodes contain screenshots that weren't his work.

In reality, his work hasn't changed that much. You'll still find a couple of weird looking shots in earlier episodes next to the stuff that's pretty good.

I think the issue is that we only got a real grasp on his style fairly recently. In the past, I think many of us believed he was Yamamuro 2.0, when in reality, I think those earlier episodes probably were just other animators, or even direct Yamamuro corrections. I mean, I guess he still is Mr. On-Model to a degree - some of his close-ups are extremely well done - but on the whole, he definitely has his own look.

The only significant change I noticed when I went back over his work was the addition of long necks. Not entirely sure how or why that happened, but hey ho. I don't mind it too much.
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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by ArchedThunder » Tue May 23, 2017 8:33 am

His style has gotten chubbier and rounder though, hasn't it?

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Mazingerdestro » Tue May 23, 2017 9:39 am

Noah wrote:
Mazingerdestro wrote:
Ajay wrote:

That was some Shida level work. Heck I could see that scene fitting perfectly in the opening.

As for the storyboard...this must be a result of the schedule improving. There was a lot of detail. Maybe their "tournament non-filler" episodes are storyboarded in advance ?
I usually don't like much Tate (mainly because of his art), but sometimes I appreciate his work and that one was really good, still it would be better if it had less hearts and the pink background all over it. It's like they can not portrayal a magical girl transforming without going "full girly", which is a lame stereotype.
When you make a reference, you hope that people will get it and maybe laugh. In this case, the animation is so over the top and so much better than the rest of the episode that makes the scene look more than perfect IMP. Also Ribrianne is literally a reverse idol magical girl, which is hilarious. Basically, they made that beautiful scene and in the end we get a teletabi. This is basically Toriyama style writing. I don't know who thought of it but it feels so Toriyama "you like cute magical girls? Fine. I will make a reverse cute magical girl".
Still Ribrianne is beyond cute. Her fluffy movement and her voice, make her unbelievably adorable (the soundtrack helps too). As I stated many times, round characters are Tate's forte. His Buu fight was great and now Ribrianne is great.
Finally, let's think a little why Ribrianne exists.
Super is a kids show that avoids showing violence. Having Brianne de Chateau been punched and kicked by Vegeta would be beyond brutal. I don't think that Vegeta will beat the shit out of Ribrianne but still it's way easier having her fighting than Brianne

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by ArchedThunder » Tue May 23, 2017 9:43 am

Mazingerdestro wrote: Super is a kids show that avoids showing violence. Having Brianne de Chateau been punched and kicked by Vegeta would be beyond brutal. I don't think that Vegeta will beat the shit out of Ribrianne but still it's way easier having her fighting than Brianne
Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Nasryyy » Tue May 23, 2017 10:34 am

ArchedThunder wrote: Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.
does you know why is that ?

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue May 23, 2017 10:50 am

Nasryyy wrote:
ArchedThunder wrote: Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.
does you know why is that ?
So that the show is easier to market to international audiences. The standards for what can be condoned, in terms of violence in kids shows, has become much more strict over the last 20 years, in not just Japan, but across the world.

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Mazingerdestro » Tue May 23, 2017 11:55 am

ArchedThunder wrote:
Mazingerdestro wrote: Super is a kids show that avoids showing violence. Having Brianne de Chateau been punched and kicked by Vegeta would be beyond brutal. I don't think that Vegeta will beat the shit out of Ribrianne but still it's way easier having her fighting than Brianne
Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.
None of the violence in super could be characterized serious. The sound effects are softer to the ear, the characters don't suffer, the music rarely sounds menacing, and excluding one or two lines regarding death, the characters don't mention it. I can't see a child getting scared from Toppo or Zeno.
Consider how violent were cartoon and series when I was a kid, super is nothing.
Heck I watched like a month ago the final match in tiger mask (the first one). Even as an adult I felt disturbed. The main character beats the shit out of his opponent and the whole ring is full of blood. Even the in universe characters are shocked by the main character's brutality. Try watching it on YouTube is fucked up

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by ArchedThunder » Tue May 23, 2017 12:11 pm

Mazingerdestro wrote: None of the violence in super could be characterized serious. The sound effects are softer to the ear, the characters don't suffer, the music rarely sounds menacing, and excluding one or two lines regarding death, the characters don't mention it. I can't see a child getting scared from Toppo or Zeno.
Consider how violent were cartoon and series when I was a kid, super is nothing.
Heck I watched like a month ago the final match in tiger mask (the first one). Even as an adult I felt disturbed. The main character beats the shit out of his opponent and the whole ring is full of blood. Even the in universe characters are shocked by the main character's brutality. Try watching it on YouTube is fucked up
The violence in Super gets pretty serious, it just doesn't get graphic. They played Beerus stabbing Goku in the chest seriously, as well as Tagoma being tortured by Freeza, Gohan being tortured by Freeza and Piccolo's death, and then all of the brutal stuff that happened in the Future Trunks arc, stabbings, killings etc.

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Araki » Tue May 23, 2017 12:21 pm

Yeah, that was an extremely biased and wrong analysis. Toppo isn't even a villain, that kids are supposed to fear. Being a hero is the freaking whole point of his character.
I doubt any kid feared villains like Android 19 or Buu, anyway. Definitely not more menacing than Black, Zamasu or Hit.
Death was brought up many times and we saw characters suffering, including one going through PTSD.

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Nasryyy » Tue May 23, 2017 12:47 pm

Mazingerdestro wrote:
ArchedThunder wrote:
Mazingerdestro wrote: Super is a kids show that avoids showing violence. Having Brianne de Chateau been punched and kicked by Vegeta would be beyond brutal. I don't think that Vegeta will beat the shit out of Ribrianne but still it's way easier having her fighting than Brianne
Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.
None of the violence in super could be characterized serious. The sound effects are softer to the ear, the characters don't suffer, the music rarely sounds menacing, and excluding one or two lines regarding death, the characters don't mention it. I can't see a child getting scared from Toppo or Zeno.
Consider how violent were cartoon and series when I was a kid, super is nothing.
Heck I watched like a month ago the final match in tiger mask (the first one). Even as an adult I felt disturbed. The main character beats the shit out of his opponent and the whole ring is full of blood. Even the in universe characters are shocked by the main character's brutality. Try watching it on YouTube is fucked up
i hope you never mentioned tiger mask final match i got curious and went to see it and now i feel so disturbed i can't even eat, i do want super to have blood but not that kind of violence and brutality

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by Mazingerdestro » Tue May 23, 2017 1:03 pm

Nasryyy wrote:
Mazingerdestro wrote:
ArchedThunder wrote: Super doesn't really avoid violence, it just almost never uses blood or bruises.
None of the violence in super could be characterized serious. The sound effects are softer to the ear, the characters don't suffer, the music rarely sounds menacing, and excluding one or two lines regarding death, the characters don't mention it. I can't see a child getting scared from Toppo or Zeno.
Consider how violent were cartoon and series when I was a kid, super is nothing.
Heck I watched like a month ago the final match in tiger mask (the first one). Even as an adult I felt disturbed. The main character beats the shit out of his opponent and the whole ring is full of blood. Even the in universe characters are shocked by the main character's brutality. Try watching it on YouTube is fucked up
i hope you never mentioned tiger mask final match i got curious and went to see it and now i feel so disturbed i can't even eat, i do want super to have blood but not that kind of violence and brutality
Isn't this....thing.....hard to watch? Who the fuck storyboarded that and who are the madmen, who animated it. I seriously felt bad for the bad guy. I was like "leave him alone" and then Tiger Mask picked up a broken table and start hitting him on the back xD

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Re: Super Animation Catalogue 2.0 - Episode 90

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Tue May 23, 2017 1:22 pm

I tried to watch Tiger Mask too, but couldn't the wrestling moves are brutal.

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