I give up, I'm just going to watch this for fun

[Totamo]

There is no point in these debates while the episodes are airing weekly, we don't know what is going on and if it's anything completely different from what we think we will feel like we wasted our time.

A lot of people are having fun with this and don't seem to care about these accusations of inconsistent characters. Toei has been doing this throughout all of super, if they thought it was a problem, they would have fixed it by now.

They obviously don't care, I see no reason why they should. Super was made to sell toys and merchandise and its doing just that.


This is why I told people if you don't like super now, you aren't going to like it ever. It's a roller-coaster and to expect that to change after 77 episodes is just lying to yourself

[Nejishiki]

Did you first consider the question, "Would Goku give up a challenge?" The challenge is where the fun is discovered!

Speaking seriously, why not focus your attention towards subjects you're interested in? If you're not enjoying particular topics, you're not required to participate in those discussions. You weren't hired to maintain everyone's opinions so you shouldn't treat the forum as your job (unless you're one of the four founders ).

[Alee9977]

Did you first consider the question, "Would Goku give up a challenge?" The challenge is where the fun is discovered!

Speaking seriously, why not focus your attention towards subjects you're interested in? If you're not enjoying particular topics, you're not required to participate in those discussions. You weren't hired to maintain everyone's opinions so you shouldn't treat the forum as your job (unless you're one of the four founders ).

That's right, that is why I never pay attention to power levels, because since the freeza saga they were bullshit.


So... Do you want to know everything that will happen before it airs, and to everything make sense in one episode? Really, if that is what you are looking for, then you clearly don't watch a lot of series. This isn't a movie, they won't give you all the Info in one ep.

[MKCSTEALTH]

Honestly, I've been hooked to the series since the Universe 6 and 7 Tournament arc. The Future Trunks saga was really good, it had its problems and wtf moments that have still not been explained (much to my frustration but I'm hoping the manga will elaborate when we finally get there), and this arc looks to be pretty bonkers, regardless of whether it'll be good or not. This is the first time we will have such a massive scope to Dragonball. An 80 man battle royale is just mind boggling to me and even though we will just focus on our fighters from our universe rather than all 80 fighters, it still has promise.

Right now, the past 3 episodes (79-81) have had fantastic fights, and that's why I watch Dragonball. And hopefully this will carry on to the Tournament

[ChronoTwigger]

You're right, most of those debates happen too early and most of them are not debates at all, just rants to get notified and don't feel alone.
In a strict sense this very section could live with 4 topics: last episode, animation, manga and regional debate/info.

As for myself, I enjoy the most some topic that teach me stuff, like the animation one or the manga section that lack in my country( I also enjoy the "support your universe" section, is quite relaxed and well managed XD).
I also found some friend.

But having the show airing weekly, in fact start discussions on speculations (that get destroyed 6 to 5 or even the very next day) is a waste of time. 99% of them could fit the episode thread.

[Bajosexto]

I've been watching Super "just for fun" since day one. I know Super has it's problems like bad art, Goku being an idiot(he's always been an idiot but Super really exaggerated this), Sumitomo's score, etc but besides this I do enjoy it unlike GT which I find very boring. I'll watch Super as long as I find it entertaining. Honestly I don't understand the people that keep complaining about Super but still watching it. There's nothing wrong with criticising the show, but if you genuinely don't like it, why even bother to watch it.

[Saturnine]

That's right, that is why I never pay attention to power levels, because since the freeza saga they were bullshit.

Not really. All the way up to the Cell Games, all the power relations and scaling were pretty consistent. The problems came in the Buu saga, and Super is continuing them in pretty much the same vein as that saga did.

[Ki Breaker]

You're right, most of those debates happen too early and most of them are not debates at all, just rants to get notified and don't feel alone.

That was pretty funny..
I wonder about this though, with so many social media sites at hand feeling alone is pretty rare ( even if it's just a feeling it provides and you are still aone in this void of a life slowly rotting away waiting for death to embrace you and give your existence meaning )


Regarding the topic at hand..
Sure, give up, if that's how you can enjoy it to the fullest go ahead

[Totamo]

That's right, that is why I never pay attention to power levels, because since the freeza saga they were bullshit.

Not really. All the way up to the Cell Games, all the power relations and scaling were pretty consistent. The problems came in the Buu saga, and Super is continuing them in pretty much the same vein as that saga did.

The problem with power scale started in the freeza saga but weren't that major because toriyama used plot devices to help him but in Cell, it really makes no sense that Dr gero was able to make 18, 17 and 16 as strong as they were.

[precita]

If you're not enjoying Super this late in (over 80 episodes and 4+ sagas into it), you might as well stop. It's unlikely things will change drastically from the formula they're using.

[Saturnine]

That's right, that is why I never pay attention to power levels, because since the freeza saga they were bullshit.

Not really. All the way up to the Cell Games, all the power relations and scaling were pretty consistent. The problems came in the Buu saga, and Super is continuing them in pretty much the same vein as that saga did.

The problem with power scale started in the freeza saga but weren't that major because toriyama used plot devices to help him but in Cell, it really makes no sense that Dr gero was able to make 18, 17 and 16 as strong as they were.

I meant it was always clear who was stronger than who, and stronger characters invariably won. In the Buu saga problems with even that have started, and DB Super is even worse in that regard.

[Kastex]

i have no clue what you're talking about. most of us who actually enjoy super have fun watching it regardless. there's nothing wrong with talking about something you are enjoying. debates often just make it better. no one made an account here for the sake of talking shit. it's so we can talk about something we enjoy. that's why these forums were made.

i've had many opinions, theories and predictions on the show so far. things have often played out completely different from what i expected and it sent me straight to cloud nine. i don't know anyone who can enjoy a show so boring that they can easily predict everything, or everything other than what they predict has no entertainment value. certainly not dragon ball super.

[nite_jay]

This doesn't make sense. Isn't watching shows for fun supposed to be the main purpose of the show in the first place?

[TekTheNinja]

We're going to discuss the show, flaws and all. If you don't like that then you shouldn't be on a discussion forum.

[DBZAOTA482]

Probably the best method when approaching the Super anime. It's obvious Toei (and possibly Toriyama) don't really care about quality or consistency, they just wanna cater to kids who have yet to develop the mentality to look at things critically... just like Nickelodeon.

[VegettoEX]

Probably the best method when approaching the Super anime. It's obvious Toei (and possibly Toriyama) don't really care about quality or consistency, they just wanna cater to kids who have yet to develop the mentality to look at things critically... just like Nickelodeon.

See, I don't get this kind of response. At all.

Toriyama has consistently, throughout the entire run of the series, explicitly said he writes things by the seat of his pants, doesn't intend for you or even want you to examine things too closely, because he's specifically writing for young boys purely for low-level entertainment.

That's not to say he doesn't end up having consistency from time to time, and that's not to say his works shouldn't be examined closely if you really want to, but at this point over 30 years later with this franchise, can't you accept that a spade is a spade? This is, and always has been, a series for children. If you're an adult, you need to understand that.

Is this just a case of people in that middle area of their fandom, between the wide-eyed optimism of their childhood fandom, and the (let's be honest here?) elitist-sage level of their adult fandom? Right in that spot where you reject what you liked as a kid, but still cling to it and want it to be something it can never be? For an author and a product to grow alongside you when it's clear that there's absolutely zero intention or willingness for them to do so?

Join us in this echelon of blissful apathy! It's the happiest place on Earth, despite how contradictory that may sound.

(I guess I also don't understand the need to "announce" one's intention to consume the series differently. Just... do it, I guess? And maybe just naturally shift up the way you publicly interact with other fans? I dunno, I'm just far more interested in the societal stuff surrounding a fandom sometimes than I am the series itself. Watching people for 20 years will do that to you, I guess. The whys behind how people tick fascinates me.)

[Cipher]

We're going to discuss the show, flaws and all. If you don't like that then you shouldn't be on a discussion forum.

This is more or less my take. One of the things that puts me off about ... announcements? ... like this is that there's often an implicit idea that anyone tuning in who is less than fully satisfied is somehow going about things the wrong way.

Those who are put off enough to truly drop the series will simply stop commenting, and that's fine, but there's also nothing wrong with wanting the show to be better and outlining lapses in quality in discussion. No one who's still chiming in each week at this point wants the show to disappoint.

[dbgtFO]

Probably the best method when approaching the Super anime. It's obvious Toei (and possibly Toriyama) don't really care about quality or consistency, they just wanna cater to kids who have yet to develop the mentality to look at things critically... just like Nickelodeon.

See, I don't get this kind of response. At all.

Toriyama has consistently, throughout the entire run of the series, explicitly said he writes things by the seat of his pants, doesn't intend for you or even want you to examine things too closely, because he's specifically writing for young boys purely for low-level entertainment.

That's not to say he doesn't end up having consistency from time to time, and that's not to say his works shouldn't be examined closely if you really want to, but at this point over 30 years later with this franchise, can't you accept that a spade is a spade? This is, and always has been, a series for children. If you're an adult, you need to understand that.

Is this just a case of people in that middle area of their fandom, between the wide-eyed optimism of their childhood fandom, and the (let's be honest here?) elitist-sage level of their adult fandom? Right in that spot where you reject what you liked as a kid, but still cling to it and want it to be something it can never be? For an author and a product to grow alongside you when it's clear that there's absolutely zero intention or willingness for them to do so?

If Toriyama truly felt that way, then he wouldn't get his knickers in a twist over the anime misrepresenting Goku's character as some heroic guy, when he really intended him to be quite the self-serving guy before being a hero and family man.
Furthermore he must be using some of that japanese humility, because even if his work is mostly lowest common denominator entertainment, it doesn't stop it from exploring deeper themes like the aforementioned characterization of Goku and it did evolve with us as we got older.
It started out as a gag manga after all, until it became "more mature" with straight up evil villains instead of the joke villains from earlier, so we eventually ended up having to deal with the concept of death and sacrifice and the cruelty of man. Simply put Toriyama's very nature of self-deprecating, hinders him from giving credit to himself, when he likely did consciously or subconsciously write it having certain thoughts in his mind.

You just don't get upset over misrepresentation of a specific character, if you never intended for that character to be analyzed to have one consistent feature in the first place.

[VegettoEX]

You just don't get upset over misrepresentation of a specific character, if you never intended for that character to be analyzed to have one consistent feature in the first place.

I continue to point out that just because we happened to translate a certain thing at a certain point in time, that does not necessarily mean Toriyama is constantly muttering to himself over the same point for decades on end. Please be wary of context and history in your discussions. That being said, I think giving the dude a break and letting him have an opinion on a thing when directly asked about it is absolutely fair. Just as we're complicated people and have complicated opinions on things, so too can the author, while simultaneously having a very simple product.

Overall, I get and in fact conceded to a bit of what you're saying in my response that you're quoting, but I also think the whole thing needs to be wrapped up in reality a little bit. It is possible to get too analytical with a series like Dragon Ball, where you're effectively just making up tangential and (let's just call them) worthless comparisons and arguments for the sake of... being argumentative? I love the series with all my heart, but I gotta recognize when, hey, maybe this part isn't worth going down the rabbit hole on.

And I definitely feel and likely come across as judgmental on a lot of that kind of stuff, so I'm very conflicted ON THAT, too. Like, let people have their fun. That's cool. Fine. At the same time... I'm in a unique position where I can help guide people to what I think are the best ways to enjoy the series, learn more about it (and the people who made it), etc.

Being a DB fan is weird.

[SansrivaaL]

For me you really didnt have to make a thread about this.
Forums exists for discussions/spoilers/debates etc. basically interacting with someone, and thats where the fun is, hearing other random peoples opinions and takes on the show, DBS is a show for kids, you shouldnt take every detail they do into heart (but I get where you're coming from, you cant exactly just take what they're doing with Goku) but the arc aint finished yet so whats to say we wont be looking like idiots when all of us are proven wrong about judging his character again, Akira Toriyama may have intended DBS for young boys but it sure as hell still grabbed my interest despite a lot of animes out there intended for a more mature audience.
Ok I dont even know where I'm going with this but if you dont like what you see in the forums then take a break from it.