What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

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LazyAles22
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What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

Post by LazyAles22 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 8:34 am

Do you think he does a good job on Dragon Ball? Is he a worthy successor of Toriyama? How does he compare to him? What do you think about his storytelling?
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Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

Post by Chuquita » Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:18 am

He gets major points for keeping ssjg relevant or at least semi-relevant in the manga. Also Gokû and Vegeta's matching lounge wear and tank tops made me smile.

His art is pretty good, I wouldn't be buying the dbs manga if it weren't, but that said it's still more rounded than I'm used to. Though there is a perfect shot of Gokû in the most recent volume that looks like it stepped out of the original.

I never really got into his af series back in the day. I tried and later dropped it, but that might be because of the characters, not the plot (I like the Zamasu arc, but didn't care for the Xicor thing it may have pulled from).

My only complaint is he goes for the nostalgia points too much by referencing stuff that already happened too often instead of forging his own memorable poses and techniques, but for all I know that's not his decision but what higher ups tell him to do.
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Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

Post by Marlowe89 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 1:20 pm

I think he's a fantastic author. His writing and dialogue is entertaining enough, he has a great sense of fight choreography, often provides backstory and lore elements that the anime may not be entirely clear with and obviously attempts to maintain a consistent narrative with consistent power-scaling between characters for the most part. Very rarely would you ever feel confused by his writing, which is really a testament that Toei doesn't have.

He's not perfect though and among his biggest weaknesses is a tendency to play his adaptation of Toriyama's outlines too safe, sometimes giving the anime an advantage in overall storytelling. The best example of this is probably the Goku Black / Future Trunks arc.

Still crossing my fingers for some anime/film/OVA adaptation of his version in the future, although I'm not too sure how likely the prospect would be.
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Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sat Aug 05, 2017 1:27 pm

His writing skills definitely are lacking, he struggles to write tension and villains, he seems more focused on wasting time showing us how big a fan of the series he is with all these "homages", definitely a fan first and lacks objectivity. His art has potential but can be incredibly sloppy and boring at times reading some of Toriyama's work on DB it just doesn't compete. A worthy successor to Toriyama definitely not at this moment... but that said he does have potential his character designs for the Universal Survival arc have been great I think he did a good job personally, if he learns to iron out some issues and improve his art and show more originality I think he can be a somewhat credible successor but right now not really.

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Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

Post by The gr » Sat Aug 05, 2017 1:41 pm

Hes ok as of right now,his improving with the tension and making his antagonist threatening?,just look at MZ in chapter 25/26 and his choreography really improved in those chapter, Goku vs mz is the best battle of dbs,not one panel distracted me,this could indicate his battle royal is gonna be way more exciting than the fluff were seeing right now and his design are good,l could totally see toyotaro designing the robots of u3
    But he still have issue, like too much exposition and homages,the antagonist/rival aside from mz are not that intimidating ,he toned down the exposition a little bit but man it didn't made any sense how mz cloned himself and the homages continues to be annoying
      hes a worthy successor of AT with some issues
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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by Doctor. » Sat Aug 05, 2017 1:49 pm

      He's a good artist that could use some improvement when it comes to anatomy, perspective and dynamism and a bad writer with little creativity, though I appreciate his attempts to explain some of the more vague plot points Toriyama leaves him with or plot points that are brought back from the original series. I don't think he compares to Toriyama's art, not in the slightest, and his storytelling skill is also severely lacking in charm, as it feels like you're reading a plot summary, and creativity.

      He's not a worthy successor, but frankly I don't know who is. He's doing an okay job.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by Lord Beerus » Sat Aug 05, 2017 1:54 pm

      Toyotaro is very much a fan of the franchise and his love for Dragon Ball overflows into the Super manga with all his call backs, homages, uses of gags and how he overall crafts and re-envisions the plot outline from Toriyama. And of course his art and battle look great. He just need to come out of his comfort zone when it comes to developing characters and creating more tension. That's his major flaws.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by superfan2024 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:05 pm

      As a person, I feel as though Toyo is a very dedicated person. As a fan, I know that he knows his Dragon Ball, and based on interviews, I know that he respects Dragon Ball and Akira Toriyama with high gratitude. As for his work on Super, I have to say it's pretty decent. We specifically don't know how much or how little input Toriyama does on Toyo's manga, so we can't entirely blame Toyo for character progression and character interactions in the manga. He still created the fan-made Dragon Ball Zero which is the unofficial "origin" of Raditz:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBNfDQ2SF7s

      Alhough he may not be the absolute best, once Toriyama finally gives up on Dragon Ball, then I feel like Toyo should be the true successor to Toriyama. He already created character designs for the ToP arc, he knows his Dragon Ball, and he knows what he's doing.

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      The gr
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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by The gr » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:11 pm

      Lord Beerus wrote:Toyotaro is very much a fan of the franchise and his love for Dragon Ball overflows into the Super manga with all his call backs, homages, uses of gags and how he overall crafts and re-envisions the plot outline from Toriyama. And of course his art and battle look great. He just need to come out of his comfort zone when it comes to developing characters and creating more tension. That's his major flaws.
      The last two chapter of the ft trunks manga have tension,you could see everything is falling apart,like mz using mai as a human shield to avoid hakai,Goku trying to maintain his ki inside of his body or else he will explode and the army of zamas threatening Goku and friends saying he will follow them no matter what,he just need to make his antagonist memorable
      Last edited by The gr on Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:28 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by BlueBasilisk » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:18 pm

      It's clear that he's a huge fan but I feel like he's a much better artist and character designer than he is a writer. His slice of life stuff between Goku and Friends is pretty nice though.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by Lord Beerus » Sat Aug 05, 2017 2:49 pm

      The gr wrote:
      Lord Beerus wrote:Toyotaro is very much a fan of the franchise and his love for Dragon Ball overflows into the Super manga with all his call backs, homages, uses of gags and how he overall crafts and re-envisions the plot outline from Toriyama. And of course his art and battle look great. He just need to come out of his comfort zone when it comes to developing characters and creating more tension. That's his major flaws.
      The last two chapter of the ft trunks manga have tension,you could see everything is falling apart,like mz using mai as a human shield to avoid hakai,Goku trying to maintain his ki inside of his body or else he will explode and the army of zamas threatening Goku and friends saying he will follow them no matter what,he just need to make his antagonist memorable
      I mean prior to confronting Merged Zamasu. Right before before Merged Zamasu happened, SSJG Goku was smacking around Zamasu like he was nothing and treating him like a joke while SSJG/SSJB Vegeta had SSJR Goku Black flustered. Say what you will about Zamasu and Goku Black in the anime, but they remained a constant threat, even when the decked was stacked against them and even when you don't take into consideration Zamasu was immortal. And that's not even getting into the fact that Goku had Mastered SSJB in his back pocket and didn't decide to use it at any point before Goku Black and Zamasu fused.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by perucho1990 » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:04 pm

      Toyo needs to tone down with the homages and make the antagonists less generic, and the manga would be greatly received by everyone in the DB Fandom.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by PeanutSaiyan » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:20 pm

      Baggie_Saiyan wrote:His writing skills definitely are lacking, he struggles to write tension and villains, he seems more focused on wasting time showing us how big a fan of the series he is with all these "homages", definitely a fan first and lacks objectivity. His art has potential but can be incredibly sloppy and boring at times reading some of Toriyama's work on DB it just doesn't compete. A worthy successor to Toriyama definitely not at this moment... but that said he does have potential his character designs for the Universal Survival arc have been great I think he did a good job personally, if he learns to iron out some issues and improve his art and show more originality I think he can be a somewhat credible successor but right now not really.
      There is so much bias in your posts it's so hard to take them seriously. First and foremost you keep bringing up this "homage" argument in almost every post. You might want to check the anime on that one. Whereas the anime gives you in your face, shot for shot fanservice (which is laughably worse than the original), Toyo either references panels due to lack of creativity or inserts a throwback for fans of the manga. Tastefully, might I add. (I think it's a mix of both tbh) You need to stop clinging to that argument because if you're driven crazy by a panel here and there that looks similar to a manga drawn over 2 decades ago to the point where you claim it's unreadable, you are wearing some crazy hate goggles my friend. And it's obnoxious. You've gone as far to say that he has no talent whatsoever as an artist and frankly that is so objectively wrong on so many levels and you come across as a child. So stop.

      As for tension, the end of the arc with Goku and Vegeta vs Zamasu was written with much more "tension" than anything to come out of the anime so far. It was organic, the heroes had a few trump cards that ultimately fell short and were ultimately put in a very dire situation. Can't say the same for the anime.

      As far as his art being sloppy, I think me and others who read the manga have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. Not only do the characters sound and act like themselves, but they also look like themselves. Consistently. I personally prefer Young Jiji but hell if Toyo didn't draw the fuck out of that last battle. The dynamism, composition, and fight choreography throughout most of the manga has been top notch. Again, I don't know what the fuck you're reading,

      Is Toyo the next Toriyama? I really don't think so. Toyo is not immune from criticism, and I have seen plenty of people raise good criticism against his work. But not you. For some reason it does not dawn on you that somebody following a bunch of bullet points from somebody else has managed to deliver a more grounded, truthful, and better written representation of Super much more so than the monkeys at Toei. All you do is parrot the same arguments trying to rip Toyo apart, some of which are not even in his control. So take a step back, take a breath, and think before the next time you post the same word for word drivel. :thumbup:

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by ssjprodigy » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:37 pm

      he is a great artist! but mediocre writer imo

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by Kanious » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:38 pm

      A great artist who screwed DBS in manga.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by hardcorefakes » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:40 pm

      Hit's fanboys can't stand him, but he does a better job than the anime at consistency and logic.

      The manga is the real continuation of Dragon Ball, really.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by GreatSaiyaJeff » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:50 pm

      His art style is near perfect in my opinion, being really close to Toriyama. My only real complaint is his writing doesn't seem consistent. On one hand, when he does it right, it's great, when it feels off, it feels out of place.

      I will say this though, while I prefer the animes U6 arc over his, his Trunks arc I feel was better paced and consistent better quality over the anime. Even if we didn't get that Gohan episode version in the manga.
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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by The gr » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:51 pm

      Even if the manga do homage you can't deny the anime do it as well,ep 98 vegeta did the pose of the saiyan saga and he copied the move that he did against ginyu and kale/caulifla did the father and son kamehameha and ep 100 as a whole is like this so is a double edge sword ,they will never stop with the reference
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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by RedHeat » Sat Aug 05, 2017 3:52 pm

      Really mediocre TBH.

      I haven't read too much of the manga, but what I did read felt like the cliff-notes of a different story. I do appreciate the fact that he's taking a different approach to Super than the anime, but it has gotten to the point where it's basically a GT-tier elseworld. Coupled with the plentiful asspulls (which the anime has a fair share of too), only the U6 tournament and beginning of the Black arc being better than the anime, it feels like something one would read after the series ends if you're curious.
      Feels over Reals.

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      Re: What's your opinion on Toyotaro?

      Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sat Aug 05, 2017 4:00 pm

      The gr wrote:Even if the manga do homage you can't deny the anime do it as well,ep 98 vegeta did the pose of the saiyan saga and he copied the move that he did against ginyu and kale/caulifla did the father and son kamehameha and ep 100 as a whole is like this so is a double edge sword ,they will never stop with the reference

      I don't think anyone is saying otherwise but this thread isn't talking about the anime and just because the anime does it shouldn't negate the fact it's a criticism of the Toyotaro aswell.

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