What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by SSJgogeto » Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:40 pm

Well, the best of Super is 10/10 IMO, and the worst is 6/10, so I give 8/10 to anime.

However, the good things impacted me way more than the bad things, so it's 8.5/10 to me.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Simere » Sat Sep 08, 2018 1:02 am

PFM18 wrote:
Simere wrote:Something I miss from Nozawa's Goku voice is how quiet and calm she would speak sometimes, like when she first met Future Trunks or first turned SSJ3. When she was talking to Freeza during the ToP arc is the closest I've heard to that tone in Super, and I loved it for that.
Fixed. Nozawa is a girl lol
Well, she wasn't meeting Trunks or talking to Freeza, Goku was. Only that first pronoun change works, and it can go either way. I went with "he" to stress that I think that quality of voice is an intrinsic part of his character, not just a characteristic of Nozawa's acting at the time.
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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by FrostByte » Sat Sep 08, 2018 1:27 am

DBS is a 7/10 for me.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by PsionicWarrior » Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:51 am

PsionicWarrior wrote:Super is actually so inconsistent in term of quality between episodes with a range going from awful to excellent so I find an overall rating rather hard to do personally lol

I guess something around 7 lol
Actually now that Top arc is over I'd put that note down to 6.5 lol

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Shinsa » Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:41 am

Doctor. wrote:
PFM18 wrote:
Doctor. wrote: The time travel is a mess. Surprising considering how the Cell arc's time travel almost worked flawlessly.
I dont see how it is a mess. It functions the same way as the Cell arc outside of the one time loop.
The time loop itself is a mess, so I'm not sure why you're so nonchalantly disregarding it like it's a meaningless nitpick.

Regardless, no, it doesn't. Super fundamentally changes our understanding of how Dragon Ball time travel works. It used to be that every trip back in time would split the timeline (unless you were already travelling to the same timeline you already split). This was our understanding of how time travel worked for decades. Super changes it so that time only splits into timelines when a significant change to history is made, regardless of whether there has been a trip made to the past or not. This is why both Toei and Toyotaro signal the split in the present and Zamasu timelines at the point where Beerus kills Zamasu, instead of at splitting when Trunks travelled back as it normally should. Not only is this method of conveying time travel changes incredibly obtuse and arbitrary (because what qualifies a change in history?), it's also incredibly dumb when you consider the fact that these timelines have split because of a time loop.
I would also like to add that Mai's character in the future timeline is a plot holes. I'm pretty positive the Future Trunks in super is the exact same Trunks from the Cell saga. In that case Mai shouldn't exist unless she turned herself into a kid before Piccolo died. Which is a stretch because that just create more holes.

Side note...her and the pilaf gang are just awful characters. No idea why they would give her and Trunks this romance when she's about the same age as Bulma.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by OhHiRenan » Sat Sep 08, 2018 2:03 pm

Shinsa wrote:
Doctor. wrote:
PFM18 wrote:
I dont see how it is a mess. It functions the same way as the Cell arc outside of the one time loop.
The time loop itself is a mess, so I'm not sure why you're so nonchalantly disregarding it like it's a meaningless nitpick.

Regardless, no, it doesn't. Super fundamentally changes our understanding of how Dragon Ball time travel works. It used to be that every trip back in time would split the timeline (unless you were already travelling to the same timeline you already split). This was our understanding of how time travel worked for decades. Super changes it so that time only splits into timelines when a significant change to history is made, regardless of whether there has been a trip made to the past or not. This is why both Toei and Toyotaro signal the split in the present and Zamasu timelines at the point where Beerus kills Zamasu, instead of at splitting when Trunks travelled back as it normally should. Not only is this method of conveying time travel changes incredibly obtuse and arbitrary (because what qualifies a change in history?), it's also incredibly dumb when you consider the fact that these timelines have split because of a time loop.
I would also like to add that Mai's character in the future timeline is a plot holes. I'm pretty positive the Future Trunks in super is the exact same Trunks from the Cell saga. In that case Mai shouldn't exist unless she turned herself into a kid before Piccolo died. Which is a stretch because that just create more holes.

Side note...her and the pilaf gang are just awful characters. No idea why they would give her and Trunks this romance when she's about the same age as Bulma.
Mai turning herself into a child before Piccolo dies is exactly what happens in the manga at least. It’s covered in a bonus chapter.
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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by ZombieVito » Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:35 pm

Anime: 8.5
Manga: 2

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by PFM18 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:42 pm

ZombieVito wrote:Anime: 8.5
Manga: 2
That's fair

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Mister_Popo » Sat Sep 08, 2018 3:50 pm

7,5/10 (DBZ a 9), not outstanding but very enjoyable and entertaining nontheless.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Puaru » Sat Sep 08, 2018 4:53 pm

Speaking just of the anime, I would probably give it at most a 3 because it made my favorite character Gohan seem weak. Thankfully the managa showed that Gohan is actually strong, but speaking solely of the anime it made us believe that Gohan was a weak peice of garbage that even that piece of shit androiud 17 was stronger than.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by PFM18 » Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:44 pm

Puaru wrote:Speaking just of the anime, I would probably give it at most a 3 because it made my favorite character Gohan seem weak. Thankfully the managa showed that Gohan is actually strong, but speaking solely of the anime it made us believe that Gohan was a weak peice of garbage that even that piece of shit androiud 17 was stronger than.
They are different continuities. How Gohan was portrayed in the manga doesn't affect his anime self at all whatsoever

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Shinsa » Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:51 pm

OhHiRenan wrote:
Shinsa wrote:
Doctor. wrote: The time loop itself is a mess, so I'm not sure why you're so nonchalantly disregarding it like it's a meaningless nitpick.

Regardless, no, it doesn't. Super fundamentally changes our understanding of how Dragon Ball time travel works. It used to be that every trip back in time would split the timeline (unless you were already travelling to the same timeline you already split). This was our understanding of how time travel worked for decades. Super changes it so that time only splits into timelines when a significant change to history is made, regardless of whether there has been a trip made to the past or not. This is why both Toei and Toyotaro signal the split in the present and Zamasu timelines at the point where Beerus kills Zamasu, instead of at splitting when Trunks travelled back as it normally should. Not only is this method of conveying time travel changes incredibly obtuse and arbitrary (because what qualifies a change in history?), it's also incredibly dumb when you consider the fact that these timelines have split because of a time loop.
I would also like to add that Mai's character in the future timeline is a plot holes. I'm pretty positive the Future Trunks in super is the exact same Trunks from the Cell saga. In that case Mai shouldn't exist unless she turned herself into a kid before Piccolo died. Which is a stretch because that just create more holes.

Side note...her and the pilaf gang are just awful characters. No idea why they would give her and Trunks this romance when she's about the same age as Bulma.
Mai turning herself into a child before Piccolo dies is exactly what happens in the manga at least. It’s covered in a bonus chapter.
I was not aware of this...mind explaining? To me this seems like bad writing and I don't like to think that the last wish before everyone died was a stupid wish for the Pilaf gang. Seems to be a retcon/ plot hole that wasn't well thought out.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Marlowe89 » Sun Sep 09, 2018 4:39 am

Anime: 5/10
Manga: 7.5/10

The anime did an admirable job of fleshing out Black's character and included some occasionally fun gag moments, which I appreciate, and there were also around a dozen standout episodes give or take. That's about it for me; there's too much obvious padding in every single arc, too much fanservice that doesn't jive, and far too many instances of those two problems actively detracting from the narrative for me to derive a ton of enjoyment out of something that only truly feels Toriyama-esque if you focus on the barebones plot points. If I call it "filler", people will swarm in droves to correct me, but that's honestly what a lot of the anime feels like. I prefer the manga in part because most of its content - even the stuff that's seemingly exclusive to Toyotaro - usually (but not always) adheres to Toriyama's intended story beats and themes without feeling like total fluff, but I also think it has a much firmer grasp over Dragon Ball's tone. Frankly, everything crafted by the man since 2012 is more structurally appropriate for films or super short arcs rather than 12+ episode spectacles that deliberately add all this extraneous nonsense to compensate for the fact that the plotlines just aren't that large in scope, even if some people do believe that shoving 80 random fighters into a single tournament somehow supports that notion.

If Dragon Ball is like a music album, then Super is a mixtape. It's a sequel of sorts, but not a lofty continuation; it's the "lost chapter" of a much bigger story set in an untold era before the original manga concluded. I don't mind the premise of a B-story, but one medium sticks to that premise far more successfully than the other as far as I'm concerned.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by supercat » Sun Sep 09, 2018 4:52 am

I think it's great how Android 17 was portrayed as SSB-tier. Seriously, just that alone shows how great it all is. I mean, can you imagine how boring it would be if Goku and Vegeta were the only ones boasting such power?

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Puaru » Sun Sep 09, 2018 5:50 am

PFM18 wrote:
Puaru wrote:Speaking just of the anime, I would probably give it at most a 3 because it made my favorite character Gohan seem weak. Thankfully the managa showed that Gohan is actually strong, but speaking solely of the anime it made us believe that Gohan was a weak peice of garbage that even that piece of shit androiud 17 was stronger than.
They are different continuities. How Gohan was portrayed in the manga doesn't affect his anime self at all whatsoever
No I'm pretty sure that the manga showed us Gohan's true strenght. The anime made Gohan seem weak because he never got a chance to do anything impressive. He was stuck fighting nobodys like the namekians and Dyspo. But then the manga showed a fight bewteen him and a REAL opponent and showed that he is in fact strong and not a completely useleless weaking pile of shit like the anime made him seem like due to never giving him a chance to do anything against anyone significant.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by PFM18 » Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:25 am

Puaru wrote:
PFM18 wrote:
Puaru wrote:Speaking just of the anime, I would probably give it at most a 3 because it made my favorite character Gohan seem weak. Thankfully the managa showed that Gohan is actually strong, but speaking solely of the anime it made us believe that Gohan was a weak peice of garbage that even that piece of shit androiud 17 was stronger than.
They are different continuities. How Gohan was portrayed in the manga doesn't affect his anime self at all whatsoever
No I'm pretty sure that the manga showed us Gohan's true strenght. The anime made Gohan seem weak because he never got a chance to do anything impressive. He was stuck fighting nobodys like the namekians and Dyspo. But then the manga showed a fight bewteen him and a REAL opponent and showed that he is in fact strong and not a completely useleless weaking pile of shit like the anime made him seem like due to never giving him a chance to do anything against anyone significant.
One of them isn't this "true" Gohan because each are their own continuities. If Anime Gohan was as strong as manga Gohan In terms of being Kefla level, then he would have one shot Toppo/Dyspo or at least would have been able to damage Toppo at all. He is simply weaker in the anime continuation

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by OhHiRenan » Sun Sep 09, 2018 1:42 pm

Shinsa wrote:
OhHiRenan wrote:
Shinsa wrote:
I would also like to add that Mai's character in the future timeline is a plot holes. I'm pretty positive the Future Trunks in super is the exact same Trunks from the Cell saga. In that case Mai shouldn't exist unless she turned herself into a kid before Piccolo died. Which is a stretch because that just create more holes.

Side note...her and the pilaf gang are just awful characters. No idea why they would give her and Trunks this romance when she's about the same age as Bulma.
Mai turning herself into a child before Piccolo dies is exactly what happens in the manga at least. It’s covered in a bonus chapter.
I was not aware of this...mind explaining? To me this seems like bad writing and I don't like to think that the last wish before everyone died was a stupid wish for the Pilaf gang. Seems to be a retcon/ plot hole that wasn't well thought out.
There's really not too much to it. Gohan rushes to find the Dragon Balls with Bulma as the Androids attack, but Pilaf and co already had them together to make their wish. They wish for youth, turning them into babies, and then Piccolo dies. The whole chapter itself is pretty tongue in cheek.

And of course it's a retcon. Super itself is basically one giant retcon, filling in a ten year gap that the original series made clear was pretty uneventful. As for bad writing, it's really the only way to make sense out of Mai being Future Trunks' age in his timeline.
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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Spider-Man » Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:36 pm

I would give the Anime version of the ToP arc 7/10 but the pacing and writing could have been a lot better and the recruitment episodes were not great, so I give it a 6/10. Frieza and 17 we're cool though.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by Artorias » Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:14 am

Rebel Instinct wrote:
Artorias wrote:Also, if I'm being honest, I dislike the manga even more simply because of how beloved it is. Everyone's always going on and on about how it's so much better than the anime and fixes all the issues...and I just don't see it. For every issue it fixes, it creates another one in a different place. So I'd be lying if I said there wasn't a part of me that has a bit of extra hate simply because of how much blind praise it gets.
Artorias wrote:The blind praise it gets at least on social media and whatnot is just so baffling to me. People will shit all over the anime for the most mundane issues, and then completely ignore GLARING problems in the manga. I think people are just easily impressed with the pretty pictures, and conflate that with the actual writing being good.
Imaginary boogeymen are fun.

Never mind the fact that there's a thread right here on the front page calling for Toyotaro to be fired with several people in it agreeing that he's "ruining the manga" and should be either fired or replaced with someone else, or the fact that nearly every major Dragon Ball internet personality (both on Youtube and every social media platform and forum you can imagine) constantly mock and ridicule the manga, Toyotaro and their fans, or that the manga discussion thread here on Kanzenshuu has to be locked by the mods every single month to curb the hysterical outrage over leaks, or that last month multiple threads had to be locked to try and contain the sheer amount of outrage. It's no wonder people have started taking breaks from (or outright abandoning) the fandom as of late.

But yeah, no. The manga is over praised. That's totally the real problem that's ailing the fandom. :roll:

And that's not even addressing the ridiculous notion of hating something out of sheer spite because other people like it too much, or acting like it isn't a two way street with people "shitting all over" the manga and ignoring glaring issues with the anime as well.
Artorias wrote:I think people are just easily impressed with the pretty pictures, and conflate that with the actual writing being good.
There's so much irony to unpack about this one statement alone, that I don't even know where to begin.
Umm...what? I genuinely don't get what you're referencing here.

And in response to everything else, this is a simple case of confirmation bias on both of our parts if I had to guess. Because quite literally 80%+ of the discourse I saw about the manga, up until a few months ago when it started falling off a cliff, was blind praise where the manga was used as a stepping stool to just crap all over the anime for no reason. That's almost ALL of the discourse I ever noticed, again to be clear, up until the last few months or so. I'm willing to admit that I probably fell victim to typical bias where I only payed attention to what confirmed my beliefs. But I'm just being honest when I claim that someone stating the manga gets pooped on too MUCH is such a foreign statement to me as to be almost incomprehensible.

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Re: What would you rate DBS out of 10?

Post by wolflonnie » Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:15 am

I skipped the anime version of Beerus saga, so...

Movie

Beerus: 7/10
Revival of F: 6/10

Anime

Beerus: /
Revival of F: 6.5/10 (more memorable scenes, though the animation is way worse)
U6 tournament: 7.3/10
Zamasu: 8.5/10
Pre-ToP: 7.8/10
ToP: 8.5/10

Overall around 8/10 for the anime.

Manga

Beerus: 5/10
U6 tournament: 6.5/10
Zamasu: 7/10
Pre-ToP: 6.5/10 (awesome idea in having GoDs fighting, finally making Beerus do something, but I can't remember much of the rest)
ToP: 2/10 (thus far)

Now you see I hardly give low scores, but the manga ToP is the epitome of horrid to me for several reasons. Toyotaro did a incredibly bad job with that arc.
Overall 6/10 if not below.

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