Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie #1 Thread: "Broly"

[TheDevilsCorpse]

I think I must clarify that it's likely that the only portion of the movie I will mostly care about is the past of the Saiyans. If the main cast get their own "slice of life" scenes I won't care at all, it's certainly better if they do, I enjoy it as long as it doesn't consume a huge amount of time of the movie. First the responsibilities and duties, which is showing and explaining stuff about Saiyans, focusing on the past, then we get to "relax" at a later portion the movie.

I never really wanted Goku and the gang to be in this film in the first place. Having a film that fully stepped away from them to tell a new tale would have been an interesting choice, but it's too late now. We already got a lot of good content from our typical protagonists in Super lately. Especially with the slice of life material. So I'd honestly prefer a decent amount of the downtime to be spread in the past portions of the film, depending on what the specifics of the story are of course. We're going to be getting introduced to a lot of new characters this time around, it seems. And I'm not going to care one bit about any of them if we never get a moment to breathe with them. You can still progress the story and add lore during character interactions without needing to have them in some sort of action scene.

I don't really think the issue had anything to do with the extended fighting sequences in Fukkatsu no F, but I did enjoy the character scenes a lot. I think having a better director would've definitely helped structure the film in a way that felt more balanced in terms of flow between fighting and dialogue-heavy scenes.

It would help, but there's only so much that could be done with Toriyama's script being what it is. I don't hate it like a lot of people, but it's not overly interesting at its core. The most interesting parts of the movie are like the first 15-20 minutes and the last 5-10 minutes. I like the soldier battle mostly because of the character interactions, but it goes on a little long and Goku vs Freeza is way too long with too many cutaways.

If they absolutely wanted to stick with the fighting in both, then add in a sub plot of keeping Freeza from trying to destroy a city of innocents or something. At the very least they really needed a scenery change like that instead of a straight up revenge battle on that empty island. It does nothing but hearken back to Namek for yet another unnecessary reference in a film that is already full of them to the point of almost being a retelling of that arc.

[JulieYBM]

A stronger director would've redone the setying. Toriyama's script is only used as-is because Yamamuro didn't challenge it like a good director should. He crapped out his storyboard in a month and went along merrily on auto pilot. I don't think Nagamine will do that here.

[Ss5Troten]

I’m gonna put spoiler tags on part of my post purely because that portion is 90% parroted info with slight interjections. Feel free to read that for context or whatnot, the meat of this post is below the spoiler tags where I talk about what I think the movie will be!

[spoiler]Akio Iyoku, the Dragon Room Chief, did an interview at the beginning of the week, any info here is from our very own Herms, who translated the interview in what I assume is a summarized fashion on his Twitter about a week ago.

A lot of vloggers and bloggers have covered this info, I’m just mostly going to paraphrase those tweets and interject my own thoughts for the purpose of discussion and secondarily potentially bring the info to those of you that haven’t heard.

Toei has been working indirectly and occasionally directly with Toriyama-sensei since Spring 2017 to reach a story Toriyama saw fit.

They result of that planning is this:

The DBS movie will be a "multi-layered" story that switches between both the past & present, it will include multiple settings.

Toriyama has provided the story and over 20 sheets of designs, including characters, machines and at least one new planet.

He also told Toei to watch out when auditioning a new character designer and see if they could make a character look cool standing straight facing forward. Saying “It’s easier to make a character look cool facing to one side, but they often look awkward facing straight ahead.” He thoroughly checked body balance, to see if candidates properly understood the body inside the martial arts uniform.

So we know that he’s being very attentive to not only quality but a particular style he’s decided upon. He wants the designer to be able to take care of the fundamentals.

In the end, Toriyama personally selected Shintani as the new character designer.

This is the art style we saw within the new trailer meant to reflect the old Dragon Ball look in both design and animation. Hence why Goku looks like 23rd BT era. I personally love this art style a lot and the fluidity it brings.

Iyoku says Toriyama’s story includes a lot of crowd-pleasing generally I’d assume and many people are probably assuming relating to nostalgia among other things but perhaps also in the sense of “fan-service”, and indeed the wording he uses according to Herms is actually “fan-service”. He’s stated that Bulma and the rest of the female cast will be extra cute which could back the idea that they meant that.[/spoiler]

It’s likely we will see the past part of the story be a true origin, about planet Sadala, King Sadala and the conflict that lead to them leaving. This is my guess as “at least one new planet” is mentioned. This is likely where we’ll see the story of Yamoshi, the first Super Saiya-jin God and also possibly the Legendary Super Saiya-jin.

I think the end of that timeline may see some sort of time traveling or something similar to bring that conflict or it’s protagonists to the future, our present post-ToP timeline. I believe the person we see in the trailer that Goku charges is the Legendary Super Saiyan or threat that Yamoshi had to battle when he became the first SSJG.

I think it may end with the correcting of the timelines after the battle, then we’ll see things go as they did along with the possible coverage of the Saiya-jin arrival and rise to power on Planet Plant, the rise of King Vegeta.

I’m really hoping it’s Sadala content and just touches a little on Plant so we can get good explanations on that stuff but not too much post-Plant Vegeta era stuff. I think it needs to feel really ancient like long before Vegeta and even his father.

The only part I’m confused about myself is how they’ll mesh the two eras together. Thoughts?

[JazzMazz]

I’m gonna put spoiler tags on part of my post purely because that portion is 90% parroted info with slight interjections. Feel free to read that for context or whatnot, the meat of this post is below the spoiler tags where I talk about what I think the movie will be!

[spoiler]Akio Iyoku, the Dragon Room Chief, did an interview at the beginning of the week, any info here is from our very own Herms, who translated the interview in what I assume is a summarized fashion on his Twitter about a week ago.

A lot of vloggers and bloggers have covered this info, I’m just mostly going to paraphrase those tweets and interject my own thoughts for the purpose of discussion and secondarily potentially bring the info to those of you that haven’t heard.

Toei has been working indirectly and occasionally directly with Toriyama-sensei since Spring 2017 to reach a story Toriyama saw fit.

They result of that planning is this:

The DBS movie will be a "multi-layered" story that switches between both the past & present, it will include multiple settings.

Toriyama has provided the story and over 20 sheets of designs, including characters, machines and at least one new planet.

He also told Toei to watch out when auditioning a new character designer and see if they could make a character look cool standing straight facing forward. Saying “It’s easier to make a character look cool facing to one side, but they often look awkward facing straight ahead.” He thoroughly checked body balance, to see if candidates properly understood the body inside the martial arts uniform.

So we know that he’s being very attentive to not only quality but a particular style he’s decided upon. He wants the designer to be able to take care of the fundamentals.

In the end, Toriyama personally selected Shintani as the new character designer.

This is the art style we saw within the new trailer meant to reflect the old Dragon Ball look in both design and animation. Hence why Goku looks like 23rd BT era. I personally love this art style a lot and the fluidity it brings.

Iyoku says Toriyama’s story includes a lot of crowd-pleasing generally I’d assume and many people are probably assuming relating to nostalgia among other things but perhaps also in the sense of “fan-service”, and indeed the wording he uses according to Herms is actually “fan-service”. He’s stated that Bulma and the rest of the female cast will be extra cute which could back the idea that they meant that.[/spoiler]

It’s likely we will see the past part of the story be a true origin, about planet Sadala, King Sadala and the conflict that lead to them leaving. This is my guess as “at least one new planet” is mentioned. This is likely where we’ll see the story of Yamoshi, the first Super Saiya-jin God and also possibly the Legendary Super Saiya-jin.

I think the end of that timeline may see some sort of time traveling or something similar to bring that conflict or it’s protagonists to the future, our present post-ToP timeline. I believe the person we see in the trailer that Goku charges is the Legendary Super Saiyan or threat that Yamoshi had to battle when he became the first SSJG.

I think it may end with the correcting of the timelines after the battle, then we’ll see things go as they did along with the possible coverage of the Saiya-jin arrival and rise to power on Planet Plant, the rise of King Vegeta.

I’m really hoping it’s Sadala content and just touches a little on Plant so we can get good explanations on that stuff but not too much post-Plant Vegeta era stuff. I think it needs to feel really ancient like long before Vegeta and even his father.

The only part I’m confused about myself is how they’ll mesh the two eras together. Thoughts?

Maybe you could just have had the villain frozen in ice, then he could have flashbacks to his experiences in the past, during the present, to naturally tie back who the antagonist is as a character, and what is currently occurring in the present? No time travel is really required.

Personally I think that would be the most natural route, or a natural route.

[AnimeNation101]

I’m gonna put spoiler tags on part of my post purely because that portion is 90% parroted info with slight interjections. Feel free to read that for context or whatnot, the meat of this post is below the spoiler tags where I talk about what I think the movie will be!

[spoiler]Akio Iyoku, the Dragon Room Chief, did an interview at the beginning of the week, any info here is from our very own Herms, who translated the interview in what I assume is a summarized fashion on his Twitter about a week ago.

A lot of vloggers and bloggers have covered this info, I’m just mostly going to paraphrase those tweets and interject my own thoughts for the purpose of discussion and secondarily potentially bring the info to those of you that haven’t heard.

Toei has been working indirectly and occasionally directly with Toriyama-sensei since Spring 2017 to reach a story Toriyama saw fit.

They result of that planning is this:

The DBS movie will be a "multi-layered" story that switches between both the past & present, it will include multiple settings.

Toriyama has provided the story and over 20 sheets of designs, including characters, machines and at least one new planet.

He also told Toei to watch out when auditioning a new character designer and see if they could make a character look cool standing straight facing forward. Saying “It’s easier to make a character look cool facing to one side, but they often look awkward facing straight ahead.” He thoroughly checked body balance, to see if candidates properly understood the body inside the martial arts uniform.

So we know that he’s being very attentive to not only quality but a particular style he’s decided upon. He wants the designer to be able to take care of the fundamentals.

In the end, Toriyama personally selected Shintani as the new character designer.

This is the art style we saw within the new trailer meant to reflect the old Dragon Ball look in both design and animation. Hence why Goku looks like 23rd BT era. I personally love this art style a lot and the fluidity it brings.

Iyoku says Toriyama’s story includes a lot of crowd-pleasing generally I’d assume and many people are probably assuming relating to nostalgia among other things but perhaps also in the sense of “fan-service”, and indeed the wording he uses according to Herms is actually “fan-service”. He’s stated that Bulma and the rest of the female cast will be extra cute which could back the idea that they meant that.[/spoiler]

It’s likely we will see the past part of the story be a true origin, about planet Sadala, King Sadala and the conflict that lead to them leaving. This is my guess as “at least one new planet” is mentioned. This is likely where we’ll see the story of Yamoshi, the first Super Saiya-jin God and also possibly the Legendary Super Saiya-jin.

I think the end of that timeline may see some sort of time traveling or something similar to bring that conflict or it’s protagonists to the future, our present post-ToP timeline. I believe the person we see in the trailer that Goku charges is the Legendary Super Saiyan or threat that Yamoshi had to battle when he became the first SSJG.

I think it may end with the correcting of the timelines after the battle, then we’ll see things go as they did along with the possible coverage of the Saiya-jin arrival and rise to power on Planet Plant, the rise of King Vegeta.

I’m really hoping it’s Sadala content and just touches a little on Plant so we can get good explanations on that stuff but not too much post-Plant Vegeta era stuff. I think it needs to feel really ancient like long before Vegeta and even his father.

The only part I’m confused about myself is how they’ll mesh the two eras together. Thoughts?

Some of your info is wrong. It sounds like you are going off of BoG movie info but you should be going off of Toriyama’s interview info. Yamoshi never actually turned into a Super Saiyan God. He just turned Super Saiyan, lost (and died i presume), and became a spirit that ended up looking for 6 pure-hearted saiyans. My theory is that as Yamoshi is the first or legendary super saiyans his super saiyan might be ssberserk like Kale’s form.

[Ss5Troten]

Maybe you could just have had the villain frozen in ice, then he could have flashbacks to his experiences in the past, during the present, to naturally tie back who the antagonist is as a character, and what is currently occurring in the present? No time travel is really required.

Personally I think that would be the most natural route, or a natural route.

Actually what’s funny is given our trailer that would make a lot of sense, perhaps the trailer isn’t placed on earth? Who knows. I hadn’t thought of just literal freezing. Honestly that would be cool, start it in the past, show him frozen, present days scenes begin, flashbacks to fill in blanks. Dude that’s the best suggested explanation I’ve gotten so far lol.

Some of your info is wrong. It sounds like you are going off of BoG movie info but you should be going off of Toriyama’s interview info. Yamoshi never actually turned into a Super Saiyan God. He just turned Super Saiyan, lost (and died i presume), and became a spirit that ended up looking for 6 pure-hearted saiyans. My theory is that as Yamoshi is the first or legendary super saiyans his super saiyan might be ssberserk like Kale’s form.

Oh yes, not the BoG info specifically but the November 2017 Saikyo Jump interview with Toriyama I had apparently gotten a paraphrased version of it that just essentially went straight from his defeat as a Legendary Super Saiyan and swept the part where his spirit went on to search for the Super Saiya-jin God under the rug stating that was directly him saying it was Yamoshi that went SSJG. I’ve since read a direct translation, thanks to you and seen that it is in fact his spirit looking for the God to save them. This new info (to me) actually raises so many more questions and theories. So perhaps Yamoshi wandering spirit shows up after realizing or sensing Goku was SSJG, he tests Goku to be sure he’s the Saiya-jin his spirit has searched for, then when he knows Goku is the one he brings him back in time or some weird story like that? What do you guys think? Also I felt like Goku was not on edge in the trailer like he would be with a real enemy threat, so that could potentially back that idea.

[Grimlock]

I never really wanted Goku and the gang to be in this film in the first place. Having a film that fully stepped away from them to tell a new tale would have been an interesting choice, but it's too late now. We already got a lot of good content from our typical protagonists in Super lately. Especially with the slice of life material. So I'd honestly prefer a decent amount of the downtime to be spread in the past portions of the film, depending on what the specifics of the story are of course. We're going to be getting introduced to a lot of new characters this time around, it seems. And I'm not going to care one bit about any of them if we never get a moment to breathe with them. You can still progress the story and add lore during character interactions without needing to have them in some sort of action scene.

But again, we don't have much time, I bet the movie will be one hour and a half long again, I doubt they'll ever make a two-hour long movie. There's no time to show Saiyans doing some interactions and I would really hate if they summarized Saiyans vs Tsufurujins war in mere words, events like that I must see it, not hear it. I also assume that the fight between the Saiyan and Goku won't be as short as his fight against Beerus too. I want "slice of life" moments with Saiyans too, more than anything, only Dende knows how long I wait for it and how important those moments might end up being, but now's not the time for that.

Just so you know, the bolded and italic part made me happy. Nice to see that someone else is seemingly tired of the main cast as well, I thought I was the only one around here thinking exactly that the main cast shouldn't even be in this movie.

Oh yes, not the BoG info specifically but the November 2017 Saikyo Jump interview with Toriyama I had apparently gotten a paraphrased version of it that just essentially went straight from his defeat as a Legendary Super Saiyan and swept the part where his spirit went on to search for the Super Saiya-jin God under the rug stating that was directly him saying it was Yamoshi that went SSJG.

There's a (most likely a huge) gap in time between Yamoshi becoming Super Saiyan in planet Sadala and the savior becoming Super Saiyan God in planet Vegeta. And during that time is when Yamoshi's spirit wandered searching for the savior.

Also, you may want to fix your quote, it breaks the thread.

[sintzu]

We don't have much time, I bet the movie will be one hour and a half long again, I doubt they'll ever make a two-hour long movie.

One Piece strong world was 113 minutes long so hopefully if the story is as deep as they say it is it'll be that long. Then again, Toriyama hyped up RF by saying things like Torishima liking it which got us all excited for what ended up being a longer version of Z's generic movies so we should keep our expectations a bit low.

[jeffbr92]

Yeah, I agree with some opinions from the last page, hope we get a movie balanced with good fights and character interactions.

[DragonBallFoodie]

The info I've heard sounds intriguing. Hoping for something good and entertaining.

[majinwarman]

Yeah, I agree with some opinions from the last page, hope we get a movie balanced with good fights and character interactions.

I think all of us want that to happen.

[Meshack]

I wonder if the movie will be canon. Even movies 14 and 15 got retconned (somewhat) when Super's episode adaptions changed things around a little.

Battle of Gods, Resurrection F, and Dragon Ball Super the Movie are definitely canon.

[Meshack]

Maybe you could just have had the villain frozen in ice, then he could have flashbacks to his experiences in the past, during the present, to naturally tie back who the antagonist is as a character, and what is currently occurring in the present? No time travel is really required.

Personally I think that would be the most natural route, or a natural route.

Actually what’s funny is given our trailer that would make a lot of sense, perhaps the trailer isn’t placed on earth? Who knows. I hadn’t thought of just literal freezing. Honestly that would be cool, start it in the past, show him frozen, present days scenes begin, flashbacks to fill in blanks. Dude that’s the best suggested explanation I’ve gotten so far lol.

Some of your info is wrong. It sounds like you are going off of BoG movie info but you should be going off of Toriyama’s interview info. Yamoshi never actually turned into a Super Saiyan God. He just turned Super Saiyan, lost (and died i presume), and became a spirit that ended up looking for 6 pure-hearted saiyans. My theory is that as Yamoshi is the first or legendary super saiyans his super saiyan might be ssberserk like Kale’s form.

Oh yes, not the BoG info specifically but the November 2017 Saikyo Jump interview with Toriyama I had apparently gotten a paraphrased version of it that just essentially went straight from his defeat as a Legendary Super Saiyan and swept the part where his spirit went on to search for the Super Saiya-jin God under the rug stating that was directly him saying it was Yamoshi that went SSJG. I’ve since read a direct translation, thanks to you and seen that it is in fact his spirit looking for the God to save them. This new info (to me) actually raises so many more questions and theories. So perhaps Yamoshi wandering spirit shows up after realizing or sensing Goku was SSJG, he tests Goku to be sure he’s the Saiya-jin his spirit has searched for, then when he knows Goku is the one he brings him back in time or some weird story like that? What do you guys think? Also I felt like Goku was not on edge in the trailer like he would be with a real enemy threat, so that could potentially back that idea.

Yamoshi never became a Super Saiyan God, only Super Saiyan.

[AnimeNation101]

The info I've heard sounds intriguing. Hoping for something good and entertaining.

Wat info?

[jeffbr92]

Yeah, I agree with some opinions from the last page, hope we get a movie balanced with good fights and character interactions.

I think all of us want that to happen.

Not really, some just want more flashy stuff no matter if the story is poor (see DBS Episode #130).

[Bullza]

Just to continue on from yesterday briefly because I also watched Resurrection F today.

I do agree with some things. I'm no animation except but it didn't seem as good as BoG. The CGI was a bit jarring and the characters looked a bit angular at times and yeah most of the movie being set in a boring looking environment didn't really help.

Still it is the better movie. It's writing is a lot better, mainly thanks to Frieza. It's the funnier movie too and it didn't really need to resort to the gag humour and Pilaf spray painting poops to get laughs.

The musical score is drastically better. The action sequences are for the most part. Goku and Vegeta vs Whis is better than Goku vs Beerus 1. Z Fighters vs Frieza's Army is better than Z Fighters vs Beerus....I don't know about the main battle, it did cut aw a bit too much but it was also longer and did involve Vegeta. The fighting choreography was much better though.

The use of it's characters was much better. BoG had too many that it didn't know what to do with them. RoF actually gave a lot of screentime to other characters not named Goku and Vegeta. They didn't really have much screentime until about 55 minutes in.

So all in all unlike BoG it actually had a solid beginning, middle and end. No useless padding or filler. It was appropriately intense and actually feels like a genuine movie whereas BoG feels more like that JSAT special if it were longer and more expensive, just a light hearted, gag fest with some cool but not too intense action at the end.

It probably wasn't as interesting though so I'm hoping this one will properly the two. It sounds like it might because of the whole jumping back and forth between timelines and being multi layered.

[DragonBallFoodie]

The info I've heard sounds intriguing. Hoping for something good and entertaining.

Wat info?

The info you mentioned in Ss5Troten's post.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Resurrection "F"'s biggest issue is that 90% of it is basically two big fights, and the only thing that saves it from that narrative standpoint is the character interactions inserted during them. Otherwise it's fairly boring and drags the pacing down quite a bit in the sense that it feels like the movie is way longer than what the events happening really are.

I'd gladly take something closer the Battle of Gods structure (not necessarily a party, just the downtime). Because despite the fact that nothing significant is occurring during the majority of the film, the extended edition never once feels like it's dragging its feet. The film feels like it's over almost as soon as it starts because of how easily it is to be immersed during the viewing.

If the Super movie is more akin to Resurrection "F" than Battle of Gods, it probably won't be very high up on my list of favorites, no matter what kind of lore it introduces. Which is a shame, because I love lore.

Gotta disagree here, the extended edition makes the film a lot worse and it so drags for me, non extended cut the film lacks immediacy and this is more apparent in the extended cut, examples before Goku arrives shit gets dragged on and we get some lame rock paper scissors gag or the fact that as soon as the big "battle" between Goku and Beerus starts we get more pointless cutaways to the cast that just kill any sense of the battle. Nothing in the film screamed yes this deserved to be a movie I gotta agree with Bullza throughout the entire thing it just screamed "OVA".

Ultimately that is what I want to feel from this new movie as I finish it I want to be like yes this deserved to be a movie.

[JazzMazz]

Resurrection "F"'s biggest issue is that 90% of it is basically two big fights, and the only thing that saves it from that narrative standpoint is the character interactions inserted during them. Otherwise it's fairly boring and drags the pacing down quite a bit in the sense that it feels like the movie is way longer than what the events happening really are.

I'd gladly take something closer the Battle of Gods structure (not necessarily a party, just the downtime). Because despite the fact that nothing significant is occurring during the majority of the film, the extended edition never once feels like it's dragging its feet. The film feels like it's over almost as soon as it starts because of how easily it is to be immersed during the viewing.

If the Super movie is more akin to Resurrection "F" than Battle of Gods, it probably won't be very high up on my list of favorites, no matter what kind of lore it introduces. Which is a shame, because I love lore.

Gotta disagree here, the extended edition makes the film a lot worse and it so drags for me, non extended cut the film lacks immediacy and this is more apparent in the extended cut, examples before Goku arrives shit gets dragged on and we get some lame rock paper scissors gag or the fact that as soon as the big "battle" between Goku and Beerus starts we get more pointless cutaways to the cast that just kill any sense of the battle. Nothing in the film screamed yes this deserved to be a movie I gotta agree with Bullza throughout the entire thing it just screamed "OVA".

Ultimately that is what I want to feel from this new movie as I finish it I want to be like yes this deserved to be a movie.

How doesn't any of your criticism here apply to ROF, in an equal, or greater capacity?

Half of ROF was just pointless meiandering around waiting for Goku to show up(hell, even the fight against 1000 warriors was kind of pointless, as the anime demonstrated), and when he finally did show up, we were subjected to one of the lamest fights of the entire franchise that literally added nothing to the pathos of the characters, which is something that could at least be said about BOG. At the very least, the final conflict in BOG had a really fantastic climax, with Shida contributing his best work on the franchise to date, over Hero by Flow.

At least during BOG, the pointless meiandering scenes placed our characters in humourous and somewhat unique situations, something I would take any day of the week over pointless and poorly executed action sequences(which sums up the majority of the film, boring fights are us).

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Resurrection "F"'s biggest issue is that 90% of it is basically two big fights, and the only thing that saves it from that narrative standpoint is the character interactions inserted during them. Otherwise it's fairly boring and drags the pacing down quite a bit in the sense that it feels like the movie is way longer than what the events happening really are.

I'd gladly take something closer the Battle of Gods structure (not necessarily a party, just the downtime). Because despite the fact that nothing significant is occurring during the majority of the film, the extended edition never once feels like it's dragging its feet. The film feels like it's over almost as soon as it starts because of how easily it is to be immersed during the viewing.

If the Super movie is more akin to Resurrection "F" than Battle of Gods, it probably won't be very high up on my list of favorites, no matter what kind of lore it introduces. Which is a shame, because I love lore.

Gotta disagree here, the extended edition makes the film a lot worse and it so drags for me, non extended cut the film lacks immediacy and this is more apparent in the extended cut, examples before Goku arrives shit gets dragged on and we get some lame rock paper scissors gag or the fact that as soon as the big "battle" between Goku and Beerus starts we get more pointless cutaways to the cast that just kill any sense of the battle. Nothing in the film screamed yes this deserved to be a movie I gotta agree with Bullza throughout the entire thing it just screamed "OVA".

Ultimately that is what I want to feel from this new movie as I finish it I want to be like yes this deserved to be a movie.

How doesn't any of your criticism here apply to ROF, in an equal, or greater capacity?

Half of ROF was just pointless meiandering around waiting for Goku to show up(hell, even the fight against 1000 warriors was kind of pointless, as the anime demonstrated), and when he finally did show up, we were subjected to one of the lamest fights of the entire franchise that literally added nothing to the pathos of the characters, which is something that could at least be said about BOG. At the very least, the final conflict in BOG had a really fantastic climax, with Shida contributing his best work on the franchise to date, over Hero by Flow.

At least during BOG, the pointless meiandering scenes placed our characters in humourous and somewhat unique situations, something I would take any day of the week over pointless and poorly executed action sequences(which sums up the majority of the film, boring fights are us).

Okay... Except I didn't bring RF up at all so I don't understand this response. I was merely talking about BoG in isolation. Even so being better RF doesn't mean it's great, frankly both movies are crap.