Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

Moderators: Kanzenshuu Staff, General Help

User avatar
mahakaishin1991
I'm pretty cozy, here...
Posts: 1658
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2017 6:32 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by mahakaishin1991 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:33 pm

majinwarman wrote:
Kinokima wrote:
majinwarman wrote:Why the hell do I see reviews saying that Broly promotes homophobia, racism, and bullying? Do people make shit up?
The bullying stance is just The fandom having some fun don’t take it seriously

The homophobia comes from this “wonderful” joke of a review .

https://rogersmovienation.com/2019/01/1 ... per-broly/
Well, great to see such cultured people reviewing Dragon Ball.
If someone can't work out that Vegeta is uncomfortable doing a dance because he has his whole 'pride' image then they aren't familiar with the work or totally looking to stir the pot

User avatar
Luso Saiyan
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:33 am
Location: Portugal

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Luso Saiyan » Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:21 pm

emperior wrote:
I like your thoughts on the movie. I wholeheartedly agree with you about how the original creator of a serie is, ultimately, the only one who can really write it.
I subscribe to that as well.

User avatar
Galan007
Regular
Posts: 582
Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:34 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Galan007 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:59 pm

Does anyone have all the movie promo material that cite's Broly as the strongest being ever or somesuch?

User avatar
NormalHero
Not-So-Newbie
Posts: 57
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:30 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by NormalHero » Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:27 pm

Kinokima wrote:
majinwarman wrote:Why the hell do I see reviews saying that Broly promotes homophobia, racism, and bullying? Do people make shit up?
The bullying stance is just The fandom having some fun don’t take it seriously

The homophobia comes from this “wonderful” joke of a review .

https://rogersmovienation.com/2019/01/1 ... per-broly/
I'm gay and i don't see any homophobic content in the movie and in the fact that the fusion dance embarrass Vegeta.
If I did the fusion dance I probably would feel embarrassed too.

And i hate.. really i hate these reviewers who want everything politically correct. Also because, I believe that companies like toei, are somehow scared by these judgments and they self-censor their products before the release (like the middle finger in the recent japanese blu ray release, and like this movie where i don't see any drop of blood)

User avatar
TKA
OMG CRAZY REG
Posts: 841
Joined: Sun Feb 02, 2014 1:26 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by TKA » Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:12 pm

As someone who enjoys Batman v Superman and Man of Steel, I've a lot of experience with those blogger types and their hot-takes. They thrive off getting fan angry, so they write and say outlandish things that they don't even necessarily believe because they know it'll rile people up. This gives them more hits on their websites as people go there to complain in the comments sections or simply to read what the "stupid" article is about. This, in turn, makes the site more attractive to advertisers, which gives them money.

They monetize fandom outrage. The best way to handle them is to ignore them. Don't give them the time of day when they're saying DBZ is homophobic, racist, or whatever.
The Creatives who inspire me: Akira Toriyama, George Lucas, Chris Nolan, J. R. R. Tolkien and Zack Snyder


http://i.imgur.com/XAnj7Yi.jpg

You saw Batman v Superman? Is it the Ultimate Edition? No? Then you haven't seen Batman v Superman. Batman is out there busting his ass to avenge Goku and you won't even go see him do it?!

User avatar
SaiyanGod117
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1226
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 2:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:25 pm

I just saw the movie (yesterday), and I liked it, but I felt there was too much action for what felt like an endless amount of time and that it should have broken up into segments. As a result, surprisingly my favorite bits were during scenes of exposition and worldbuilding; moreover, it's interesting to see at the end of the movie that Frieza is still conquering/ exterminating life on planets. Even while there are people who could again stop him, it also puts into the perspective the price of wishing him back to life, as it only not endangers the people of Earth but everyone in the Universe. Although in reverse one could say without him there would be no universe. I could easily see that played up in the next series, and as for Minus, I didn't mind it actually although I see no reason for it to exist. Honestly, it seems like it was made for corporate purposes rather than story purposes, more else Bardock's reason for suddenly caring about his sons while believable needs to be fleshed out. There needs to be a stimulus for why he thinks the way he does now, a shown one preferably if given a chance.

Similarly, story points needing to be fleshed out is a common problem in this movie, such as Broly and Paragus's experience on Planet Vampa, Paragus's reason for revenge, as well as, even Broly himself. Moreover, I don't know how anyone liked Cheelai this movie; she was utterly annoying and way too presumptuous on Broly and Paragus's relationship, she was even an asshole towards Goku when he showed no ill will. Also, she acts as Broly is her long lost brother or father, even though she just met him. It's also a little contrived how a lowly foot soldier (Cheelai) was able to pickpocket a grizzled and experienced Saiyan with little effort. With that being said, I do see the potential for her as a character because the times when she wasn't shitting on Paragus or being a jerk, she was likable.

Further, the power scaling the shit, Broly going from the power of Base Vegeta to more powerful than SSB and Beerus in the less than a day is not good writing. Toriyama keeps using high potential as a way to circumvent the trails of training and development. Likewise, I don't see how this Broly is that much better written than the previous Broly. Other than the occasional curiousness and humble attitude he wasn't that much different though again I can see the potential. More else, I didn't like Goku's characterization much this movie either he was too childish and absent-minded.

Additionally, Frieza's wish was lame, to say the least, and the story was severely lacking. But the fight scenes were great, some I can't remember due to quickness of it all, though ones I do remember are great. In spite of my criticisms, it was overall decent, and the soundtrack (barring the chanting) and direction were great which elevated the dialogue in various scenes. As well as, Frieza's characterization and his advisors they're all great characters, there are so many directions you could take with them, especially Frieza and that blue lady. Equally, King Cold is such an enigmatic character; it would be a waste not to explore him. Also, I liked how they fleshed out Frieza's reasons for exterminating the Saiyans minimal as it was, it was still commendable, and an area minus did better than the special. Other than that, I would take the Special over Minus any day along with Gine I like her. Last, but not least, the dub was fantastic, and Cheelai's voice was excellent.

User avatar
foxfang4
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 169
Joined: Tue Oct 01, 2013 1:52 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by foxfang4 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:51 pm

I was wondering, will the next series follow from where the manga is at (ignoring the Broly film) or will it ignore the manga and continue the series from the Broly film? Is it possible for both narratives to co-exist?
Last edited by foxfang4 on Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

WittyUsername
I Live Here
Posts: 2767
Joined: Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:09 am
Location: Houston, Texas

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by WittyUsername » Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:54 pm

It seems weird how despite the unexpected success of this film, this thread isn’t as active as the one for Ressurection ‘F’ was.

User avatar
PerhapsTheOtherOne
I Live Here
Posts: 2155
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2017 5:55 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 7:58 pm

WittyUsername wrote:It seems weird how despite the unexpected success of this film, this thread isn’t as active as the one for Ressurection ‘F’ was.
Probably because we're in the middle of the DB renaissance and thus aren't as "OMG what the heck is this? even more?!?"

User avatar
Diccolo-420
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:34 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Diccolo-420 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 8:45 pm

I found this article and it honestly touches on nearly every issue I have with this film, I'm wondering what thoughts are on it from you all

https://www.thegamer.com/dragon-ball-su ... -no-sense/

User avatar
Shaddy
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:38 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Shaddy » Sun Jan 20, 2019 8:53 pm

That is a wonderfully terrible list. The fact that "well uhhh there's no ultra instinct" is what it considers the most important writing issue is proof enough, though the whole article is pretty dumb ("but Raditz said there were only four saiyans left!" yeah it's almost like nobody knew about Broly or something). The whole thing is just ignorantly written, either to the continuity and production of the series, or to what actually matters in writing (read: this is also the problem with power scaling arguments).

I'm gonna tweet this to geekdom, see if he'll break it down like all those other backwards articles.
Mage of Blood yeets pizza wrote:Satanism is just Atheism wearing a funny hat
bjm knhhjnbguv cxkjmn bl,v wrote:Go yiff yourself

User avatar
Diccolo-420
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 237
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:34 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Diccolo-420 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:01 pm

Shaddy wrote:That is a wonderfully terrible list. The fact that "well uhhh there's no ultra instinct" is what it considers the most important writing issue is proof enough, though the whole article is pretty dumb ("but Raditz said there were only four saiyans left!" yeah it's almost like nobody knew about Broly or something).

I'm gonna tweet this to geekdom, see if he'll break it down like all those other backwards articles.
Yeah some of the points are quite head scratching, including the issue of Vegeta using SSG, Shenron being able to teleport someone.

That being said, he does bring up some valid points

Trunks and Goten don't age again, despite being at the same point in time as the FT special
Lack of connection of theme
Minus's retelling sucked
Frieza turned into a joke
No Gohan
Vegeta doesn't use SSBE

If the film hadn't tried so hard to hype up theme, backstory, and writing then it wouldn't be as much of an issue but it's clear toriyama is out of his depth when trying to tell a cohesive story nowadays. He should stick to just keeping the script simple since trying to put in depth clearly isn't a strong suit of his.

Kinokima
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1396
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:02 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Kinokima » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:08 pm

Shaddy wrote:That is a wonderfully terrible list. The fact that "well uhhh there's no ultra instinct" is what it considers the most important writing issue is proof enough, though the whole article is pretty dumb ("but Raditz said there were only four saiyans left!" yeah it's almost like nobody knew about Broly or something). The whole thing is just ignorantly written, either to the continuity and production of the series, or to what actually matters in writing (read: this is also the problem with power scaling arguments).

I'm gonna tweet this to geekdom, see if he'll break it down like all those other backwards articles.

Agreed not saying all the point are invalid but most are as is usually the case with these type of list articles.

User avatar
prince212
OMG CRAZY REG
Posts: 791
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 3:30 pm
Location: wild west

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by prince212 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:09 pm

Shaddy wrote:
I'm gonna tweet this to geekdom, see if he'll break it down like all those other backwards articles.
:D :lolno: :lol:
Need backup ?
It was as if a whole lot of people ...were screaming in pain....

User avatar
Shaddy
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:38 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Shaddy » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:18 pm

Diccolo-420 wrote:Shenron being able to teleport someone.
That's one of the only good points, actually.
Diccolo-420 wrote: Trunks and Goten don't age again, despite being at the same point in time as the FT special
It's actually still unclear whether they should or not. I'm certainly tired of it, but given the anime saying "some time later" ("a few months later" in the translation), it's not actually unfeasible that they wouldn't change much.
Diccolo-420 wrote:Frieza turned into a joke
This is a misunderstanding of the character's motivations. He's petty, and childish. Fighting Goku lit a fire under him to be more than what he was, and being in hell made him realize that immortality is basically worthless, given that it's only a matter of time before he comes back anyway, as long as he doesn't repent. He wasn't going to Earth because he reeeally neeeded to get taller, he went there to fight Goku.
Diccolo-420 wrote:No Gohan
This is not a narrative flaw. Crowding the scene with extra characters in a movie where the protagonist is Broly is pointless. Gohan has nothing to do with this story. Including him would be fanservice, just as much as Gogeta.
Diccolo-420 wrote:Vegeta doesn't use SSBE.
Also not an actual aspect of the story, especially when nobody expected the series to follow anything but Toriyama's outline from the start. If anything it's a complaint that should be levied at Toei for making half-baked meaningless extra forms like Evolution without Toriyama's input from the start. There's no "story elements" in coloring Vegeta's hair a slightly different shade of blue for fifteen minutes, especially when Broly is stronger than that anyway.
Diccolo-420 wrote:If the film hadn't tried so hard to hype up theme, backstory, and writing then it wouldn't be as much of an issue but it's clear toriyama is out of his depth when trying to tell a cohesive story nowadays. He should stick to just keeping the script simple since trying to put in depth clearly isn't a strong suit of his.
Besides the fact that this movie was advertised more by going "BROLY! IT'S BROLY! DID YOU HEAR!? BROLY!!! EVERYONE VERSUS BROLY!!!", that wasn't input from Toriyama, and moreover it's not what should be taken into account given how it will fade in passing time.

And my point isn't really that "this movie's story is amazing", it's that most of what this article suggests is completely meaningless in terms of making a better story, or misunderstanding why some of the decisions were made in this film. It criticizes things for being fanservice then asks for other things that would also be fanservice. It complains about contradicting original writing for it being shit and at other points suggests that the original writing was shit and needs to be changed. It's confused and broken, like 99% of these comicbook.com-type articles.
prince212 wrote: :D :lolno: :lol:
Need backup ?
What does this even mean? Is this a shallow attempt to insult my credibility just because I'm not making a video myself? Are you THAT petty?
Mage of Blood yeets pizza wrote:Satanism is just Atheism wearing a funny hat
bjm knhhjnbguv cxkjmn bl,v wrote:Go yiff yourself

User avatar
TheOne
OMG CRAZY REG
Posts: 942
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2017 6:01 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by TheOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:27 pm

WittyUsername wrote:It seems weird how despite the unexpected success of this film, this thread isn’t as active as the one for Ressurection ‘F’ was.
....unexpected success..? Why in the world would you think this movie wasn’t going to be successful? Because you read from a small group of fans on the internet complain about it being about Broly?
How i predict the tournament will end:

User avatar
Shaddy
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:38 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Shaddy » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:31 pm

It's unexpected in that it made something like ten fuckin' times as much as Res F did opening weekend. Don't accuse WU of only listening to vocal minorities, it can still be impressive that it's doing as well as it is.
Mage of Blood yeets pizza wrote:Satanism is just Atheism wearing a funny hat
bjm knhhjnbguv cxkjmn bl,v wrote:Go yiff yourself

Lukmendes
Beyond Newbie
Posts: 243
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:11 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Lukmendes » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:32 pm

So I watched the movie today, and my suspicions about it turned out to be correct, it's a better RoF, meaning, the story is forgettable, but the action is good.

Chelai is a dumb characterm, one of her worst scenes is that one which she bitches about Paragus using the shocking thing to stop Broly, and talks like he's a horrible person for doing that, but the problem is, Broly was about to fight and possibly kill some guy, which Paragus told Broly to not do it, which Broly ignored and was about to attack him anyway, only then Paragus used the shock thing, and she bitches at him for stopping Broly from killing someone, then at the end of the movie she keeps acting condescending towards Goku for most of the interaction, understandable at first, but Goku was showing nothing but good intentions and she kept going, when you expect her to not get any worse she keeps talking...

The minus part of the movie was okay, there wasn't much for it, one thing that was weird was how it was edited at the end, since Bardock was fighting Freeza's men in space, but if you don't really pay attention, it's hard to tell he is in space, and since Freeza never acknowledges Bardock being there, it just looks like dumb fanservice for the Ova fans, except that since the editing for that scene when it cuts to Bardock is so bad, it's hard to tell it was supposed to be that to begin with.

Broly is whatever as a character, he gets some decent development when interacting with Chelai and that other guy, but once the fighting starts he's just a simple raging brute, and nothing else, there is some potential for him but the movie barely scratched the surface, his fight is poorly made since his power keeps increasing while fighting until he's only weaker than SSG Vegeta in base form, kinda like how Caulifla kept improving too much in ToP anime, but even worse.

Freeza's wish is dumb since before the movie he never showed insecurity about his height, but another thing that is just as bad is him saying that he learned while being tortured in hell that "not being able to die would result in unending misery", which makes zero sense since dying is what made him keep suffering to begin with, so if anything, he should be trying to become immortal more than before, besides that his characterization is fine though.

Dunno why the hell Shenlong was only granting one wish in the movie, guess it's because only one was needed and so they decided to ignore how it actualy works.

For some things that they promissed that were poorly fulfilled, the "3 saiyans' destinies" thing wasn't there, the movie is just about Broly, so why them meeting should matter, well, doesn't much besides freeing Broly from Paragus, that shit of Bulma's voice actress saying that "there's a scene that really shows Vegeta loves Bulma" is just a lazy rip off of Boo saga, and "Goku finaly" thing with him calling himself Kakarot is whatever since he never seemed to care about Vegeta calling him that, so there wasn't disdain, he had accepted his saiyan legacy all the way back in Namek saga, and they didn't even retcon that away since Goku's thoughts about it are never shown, so that scene in the end means nothing.

So yeah, the story is just whatever, but the fight scenes are really good, that's the only thing going for the movie, like RoF, but I guess for the fanbase overall, that's enough.

User avatar
SaiyanGod117
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1226
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 2:31 am

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:37 pm

Shaddy wrote:or to what actually matters in writing (read: this is also the problem with power scaling arguments)..
Are you implying power scaling doesn't matter in the context of writing or story?

User avatar
Shaddy
Advanced Regular
Posts: 1200
Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2015 7:38 pm

Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Shaddy » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:42 pm

More that the nature of DB's power structure is inherently anti-narrative, and criticizing the series for breaking from that to make a more interesting or engaging battle is completely detrimental to the series' storytelling. I really want them to just overhaul the massively-linear scale entirely, both to provide more unique encounters, and to hopefully get all the naysayers who want the series to function only on magical number boosts and predictability to leave the fandom in frustration.
Mage of Blood yeets pizza wrote:Satanism is just Atheism wearing a funny hat
bjm knhhjnbguv cxkjmn bl,v wrote:Go yiff yourself

Post Reply