Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by superfan2024 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:16 am

ironfist2020 wrote:I Dont buy that great ape transformation. Great apes stronger then ssj god red? I Dont think so. Just a other plot hole to a list of plot holes that this movie has
A Great Ape is a Saiyan's true power. The downside is that the Oozaru is too large and slow, so the fact that Broly can keep that power within himself makes him an incredible foe.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by mute_proxy » Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:22 am

ironfist2020 wrote:I Dont buy that great ape transformation. Great apes stronger then ssj god red? I Dont think so. Just a other plot hole to a list of plot holes that this movie has
There is no plothole. Broly is stronger because he's a mutant with an overabundance of ki. Not because of the "rage" form or oozaru power. Those forms only multiply what he already has.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by FrostByte » Sun Feb 03, 2019 9:40 am

ironfist2020 wrote:I Dont buy that great ape transformation. Great apes stronger then ssj god red? I Dont think so. Just a other plot hole to a list of plot holes that this movie has
Don't comment without knowing what a plot hole is.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Feb 03, 2019 1:45 pm

superfan2024 wrote:
ironfist2020 wrote:I Dont buy that great ape transformation. Great apes stronger then ssj god red? I Dont think so. Just a other plot hole to a list of plot holes that this movie has
A Great Ape is a Saiyan's true power. The downside is that the Oozaru is too large and slow, so the fact that Broly can keep that power within himself makes him an incredible foe.
Yes exactly. Paragus states exactly that by retaining the human form Broly now has the speed and agility but with the power of the Great Ape. Regardless of what form a person is in, a punch from a giant ape is gonna hurt like hell so imagine a punch from a Great Ape that one can't see coming to dodge it.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by RecolorSaiyan » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:01 pm

Great Ape isn't stronger than ssg.

Broly is just ridiculously powerful in base and kept growing stronger. Vegeta went to god for a reason, because golden forms wouldn't cut it.

If Broly and Vegeta had equal base forms and Broly didn't improve than even controlling the oozaru wouldn't give him a chance vs ssj vegeta

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Doctor. » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:06 pm

The Oozaru isn't slow. The Saiyan arc specifically commented on this.
It certainly seems odd that Broly went from weaker than base/Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta in his own base form to rivaling God with a 10x boost.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:19 pm

Doctor. wrote:The Oozaru isn't slow. The Saiyan arc specifically commented on this.
It certainly seems odd that Broly went from weaker than base/Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta in his own base form to rivaling God with a 10x boost.
I think Toriyama just forget Oozaru was a 10x in power. Or he applied the whole "Saiyans grow stronger the more they fight and can turn the tide in battle" trait to Broly.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by ruler9871 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:31 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:
ironfist2020 wrote:
bleed0range wrote:
I disagree. He’s shown character growth. He no longer sees wishing for immortality as desirable because of his time in Hell and he enjoys the “game” of trying to defeat his enemies. He wants to kill Goku, but he is somewhat enjoying the challenge of it now. He is vain and always has been. His only real use of the dragon balls now is for something simple like this. Because he knows that he can likely get stronger on his own. But you can tell that he’s starting to somewhat understand the saiyan mindset of enjoying fights and breaking limits like Goku. Honestly this is how Goku has changed him.
That is a another plot hole. He want to kill goku after fighting with him together and gaining his life back. He dosent have a reason to hate goku anymore..
I don’t think you know what a plot hole is.

I’m not a fan of Freeza being in modern DB, but still. It’s not a plot hole for him still being evil. You can help an asshole and they’ll still be an asshole
Exactly. Assholes and sociopaths don't change when you are nice to them, they only exploit your kindness.
zarmack wrote:The whole "Dragonball is only supposed to be light and funny" mentality that exist in a lot of the fandom is in many ways even dumber than the "edgeload" side of the fandom. You know, the contrarians who think DB should be a Slice-of-Life series, the folks who worship Pre-Raditz Dragonball uncritically, the folks who downplay and often flat-out deny that Dragonball is an action series, the folks who try to push that false argument that none of the serious moments in the series were mean't to be taken seriously, etc.

Dragonball doesn't have a single tone. It has both silly and serious moments, both humor and drama, just like real life. The idea that a work of fiction should be only all-comedy or all-serious is unnatural and frankly, retarded.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by ekrolo2 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:29 pm

Doctor. wrote:The Oozaru isn't slow. The Saiyan arc specifically commented on this.
It certainly seems odd that Broly went from weaker than base/Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta in his own base form to rivaling God with a 10x boost.
Maybe it being compressed makes it stronger? That's certainly the logic Super Saiyan 4 operated under.
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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by ruler9871 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:37 pm

Broly rapid power growth would have justified if they used the Legendary Super Saiyan idea in the movie.
zarmack wrote:The whole "Dragonball is only supposed to be light and funny" mentality that exist in a lot of the fandom is in many ways even dumber than the "edgeload" side of the fandom. You know, the contrarians who think DB should be a Slice-of-Life series, the folks who worship Pre-Raditz Dragonball uncritically, the folks who downplay and often flat-out deny that Dragonball is an action series, the folks who try to push that false argument that none of the serious moments in the series were mean't to be taken seriously, etc.

Dragonball doesn't have a single tone. It has both silly and serious moments, both humor and drama, just like real life. The idea that a work of fiction should be only all-comedy or all-serious is unnatural and frankly, retarded.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Dark_Tzitzimine » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:41 pm

SS4 has no official multiplier though, only a blank "it pushes the user power to its utmost limits" statement.

That said, Ikari has more in common with Goku tapping into the Oozaru to beta King Piccolo than to SS4, is more of a "fake" SS4 if anything.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by RedHeat » Sun Feb 03, 2019 5:41 pm

ruler9871 wrote:Broly rapid power growth would have justified if they used the Legendary Super Saiyan idea in the movie.
Would it really? It makes sense as it is because it's been shown he kept keeping boosts and adapted the longer he fought.
Feels over Reals.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:04 pm

You know, I wonder......

Broly's Oozaru power leveled off in his base form, but once he turned Super Saiyan, he gained another Oozaru boost that resulted in the Full-Power Super Saiyan form; he then seemed to level off again.

Strange theory, but maybe every successive Saiyan form has a hard limit to how much it can take from Broly's innate Oozaru power. Maybe every successive form can be boosted by his Oozaru potential, but each form has a hard limit on this. So, Broly's potential for rapid simian strength growth is capped for his Super Saiyan form, but maybe by attaining additional higher forms, he can continue to infuse Oozaru into them in succession.

I dunno, just a weird idea I had.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Potara-Warrior96 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:09 pm

RedHeat wrote:
ruler9871 wrote:Broly rapid power growth would have justified if they used the Legendary Super Saiyan idea in the movie.
Would it really? It makes sense as it is because it's been shown he kept keeping boosts and adapted the longer he fought.
How else would you explain Broly abnormally high power level as an infant if he's not the Lssj? The old Broly didn't have this problem due to him already having the title of Legendary Super Saiyan which gave justifications for Broly infinite ki reserves, bizarre ki control, overly brutal yet God like transformation, and the fact that old Broly had all the pro of the Ussj forms without any of its cons.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:29 pm

Potara-Warrior96 wrote:
RedHeat wrote:
ruler9871 wrote:Broly rapid power growth would have justified if they used the Legendary Super Saiyan idea in the movie.
Would it really? It makes sense as it is because it's been shown he kept keeping boosts and adapted the longer he fought.
How else would you explain Broly abnormally high power level as an infant if he's not the Lssj? The old Broly didn't have this problem due to him already having the title of Legendary Super Saiyan which gave justifications for Broly infinite ki reserves, bizarre ki control, overly brutal yet God like transformation, and the fact that old Broly had all the pro of the Ussj forms without any of its cons.
It's explained that he's a mutant... that's why he has such an absurd level of power without training and why he gets stronger incredibly fast.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Dark_Tzitzimine » Sun Feb 03, 2019 6:40 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:[quote="Potara-Warrior96"It's explained that he's a mutant... that's why he has such an absurd level of power without training and why he gets stronger incredibly fast.
Is this explicitly stated in the american and japanese dub? Because in the Latam dub that is just a off handed remark by King Vegeta to justify his decision to send Broly away, while Paragus only spoke of Broly as being "someone with a huge potential". So, Broly being a mutant has a much narrative weight as taking at face value the Saiyan scientists suggestions of him being the LSS.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Potara-Warrior96 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:07 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Potara-Warrior96 wrote:
RedHeat wrote: Would it really? It makes sense as it is because it's been shown he kept keeping boosts and adapted the longer he fought.
How else would you explain Broly abnormally high power level as an infant if he's not the Lssj? The old Broly didn't have this problem due to him already having the title of Legendary Super Saiyan which gave justifications for Broly infinite ki reserves, bizarre ki control, overly brutal yet God like transformation, and the fact that old Broly had all the pro of the Ussj forms without any of its cons.
It's explained that he's a mutant... that's why he has such an absurd level of power without training and why he gets stronger incredibly fast.
But Old Broly was just that, a mutant as well also I'm beginning to think that many fans buy way too much into the whole "mythological" aspect of the old lssj form (which to be fair considering the amount of crap it does that's really isn't all that surprising). The old Broly lssj form was simply a mutation that ate away at it's users mind while also inflicting hellish pain by causing it's user to literally explode when accessed plus less not for get that the user also becomes consumed by their saiyan instinct to a dangerous level.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by bleed0range » Sun Feb 03, 2019 7:40 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Doctor. wrote:The Oozaru isn't slow. The Saiyan arc specifically commented on this.
It certainly seems odd that Broly went from weaker than base/Super Saiyan Goku/Vegeta in his own base form to rivaling God with a 10x boost.
I think Toriyama just forget Oozaru was a 10x in power. Or he applied the whole "Saiyans grow stronger the more they fight and can turn the tide in battle" trait to Broly.
Yeah, but you know he doesn’t have to abide by any rules. He can be creative as he wants. Maybe when a saiyan accesses the oozaru power while in human form, they can get a much bigger boost. Maybe it’s that in addition to Broly having power levels that are all over the place. You know, he can make it work with an explanation as simple as that, so I don’t get too caught up on it.

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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by Super Saiyan Swagger » Sun Feb 03, 2019 8:22 pm

Broly's Oozaru power-up must've been Super's version of Super Saiyan 4. The yellow iris. The black outline around his eyes. How it's connected to the Oozaru transformation. It's really cool and I love how Toriyama uses established material to explain Broly's strength, rather than coming up with something outta nowhere. One thing I never liked about Super Saiyan 4 was how it was basically a Super Saiyan transformation, but it looked drastically different from the previous Super Saiyan transformations. It really stuck out. But I always thought that it would've been so much better if it was treated as its own seperate transformation rather than another numbered Super Saiyan form. That's pretty much what Broly does with it.
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Re: Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie Thread: "Broly"

Post by omaro34 » Sun Feb 03, 2019 8:24 pm

Doesn't Shenron grant 2 wishes now? They only used 1 wish and he vanished
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