So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:51 am

JazzMazz wrote:
BWri wrote:
Miracles wrote:People thought Goku was done with red too but showed up with red against Dyspo. Even used the manga's "switch n bait" from red to blue.
It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
I keep on seeing people say that Goku stole Vegeta's idea, but I think people are forgetting that Goku was the one that came up with the idea of switching suddenly between forms.

Technically, it was Vegeta that used Goku's tactic in the manga Hit fight(which was an awful fight), and expanded upon it.

So technically the anime gave Goku a tactic that was used by Vegeta, that he stole from watching Goku.
Oh yeah, you're right. When I think on it. I believe Goku used a variant of this technique when he fought Future Trunks and briefly went SSJ3 to strike him, or was it SS3 to SSG? I can't really remember too well. I think it was the latter due to manga Trunks being so strong.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by Jigurashi » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:04 am

BWri wrote:
Miracles wrote:People thought Goku was done with red too but showed up with red against Dyspo. Even used the manga's "switch n bait" from red to blue.
It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
How was Gamma Burst Flash freshening up his moveset? It's continuing the problem of only adding another generic ki blast to his already dull skillset.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:13 am

Jigurashi wrote:
BWri wrote:
Miracles wrote:People thought Goku was done with red too but showed up with red against Dyspo. Even used the manga's "switch n bait" from red to blue.
It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
How was Gamma Burst Flash freshening up his moveset? It's continuing the problem of only adding another generic ki blast to his already dull skillset.
Point taken, but I don't find it generic. It appears that it can be fired in two different directions or combined over a wide area and THE NAME. Seriously though, at least its something. In the anime he has nothing that Goku doesn't have which is why I find him boring in the anime. He's very unnecessary when we have Goku.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by HeroR » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:34 am

BWri wrote: Point taken, but I don't find it generic. It appears that it can be fired in two different directions or combined over a wide area and THE NAME. Seriously though, at least its something. In the anime he has nothing that Goku doesn't have which is why I find him boring in the anime. He's very unnecessary when we have Goku.
If you're going to count the Gamma Burst Flash something unique to Vegeta that Goku doesn't have, then you have to count the Final Flash since Goku had no counterpart to it. And the Gamma Burst Flash is really just a Final Flash with a different hand position. The Final Shine from GT is more unique.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:12 am

HeroR wrote:
BWri wrote: Point taken, but I don't find it generic. It appears that it can be fired in two different directions or combined over a wide area and THE NAME. Seriously though, at least its something. In the anime he has nothing that Goku doesn't have which is why I find him boring in the anime. He's very unnecessary when we have Goku.
If you're going to count the Gamma Burst Flash something unique to Vegeta that Goku doesn't have, then you have to count the Final Flash since Goku had no counterpart to it. And the Gamma Burst Flash is really just a Final Flash with a different hand position. The Final Shine from GT is more unique.
Goku's Kamehameha is like Vegeta's Final Flash and Galick Gun all in one. I honestly don't know why Vegeta has two different beams. Badass factor I guess. I'd say that the Big Bang attack is something that Goku doesn't have ... well the Genki Dama is similar but bigger. Eh, I like the color of Final Shine but its just a one-handed beam. At least it looks like Gamma Burst Flash can be fired separately or in a wide area for multiple foes.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by HeroR » Mon Dec 18, 2017 3:43 am

BWri wrote: Goku's Kamehameha is like Vegeta's Final Flash and Galick Gun all in one. I honestly don't know why Vegeta has two different beams. Badass factor I guess. I'd say that the Big Bang attack is something that Goku doesn't have ... well the Genki Dama is similar but bigger. Eh, I like the color of Final Shine but its just a one-handed beam. At least it looks like Gamma Burst Flash can be fired separately or in a wide area for multiple foes.
It really isn't. The Kamehameha and the Galick Gun are in the same family, but not the Final Flash according to the Daizenshuu. The Big Bang is nothing like the Spirit Bomb since their function are utterly different.

And the Gamma Burst Flash is again just the Final Flash in a different hand position.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:14 pm

HeroR wrote:
BWri wrote: Goku's Kamehameha is like Vegeta's Final Flash and Galick Gun all in one. I honestly don't know why Vegeta has two different beams. Badass factor I guess. I'd say that the Big Bang attack is something that Goku doesn't have ... well the Genki Dama is similar but bigger. Eh, I like the color of Final Shine but its just a one-handed beam. At least it looks like Gamma Burst Flash can be fired separately or in a wide area for multiple foes.
It really isn't. The Kamehameha and the Galick Gun are in the same family, but not the Final Flash according to the Daizenshuu. The Big Bang is nothing like the Spirit Bomb since their function are utterly different.

And the Gamma Burst Flash is again just the Final Flash in a different hand position.
How is Final Flash any different? It's a beam and it can be amped, but so can the Kamehameha. It's function is essentially the same. I only compared the BB and SB, because they're both Ball attacks, otherwise, I already know that they're different in function. The hand position in the Gamma Burst Flash allows Vegeta to effect a larger area with his attack, what looks like two beams merged into one large one,therefore it is unique from any of his other attacks including Final Flash. The palms are aimed outward which makes a difference in the beams wideness.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by HeroR » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:28 pm

BWri wrote:
HeroR wrote:
BWri wrote: Goku's Kamehameha is like Vegeta's Final Flash and Galick Gun all in one. I honestly don't know why Vegeta has two different beams. Badass factor I guess. I'd say that the Big Bang attack is something that Goku doesn't have ... well the Genki Dama is similar but bigger. Eh, I like the color of Final Shine but its just a one-handed beam. At least it looks like Gamma Burst Flash can be fired separately or in a wide area for multiple foes.
It really isn't. The Kamehameha and the Galick Gun are in the same family, but not the Final Flash according to the Daizenshuu. The Big Bang is nothing like the Spirit Bomb since their function are utterly different.

And the Gamma Burst Flash is again just the Final Flash in a different hand position.
How is Final Flash any different? It's a beam and it can be amped, but so can the Kamehameha. It's function is essentially the same. I only compared the BB and SB, because they're both Ball attacks, otherwise, I already know that they're different in function. The hand position in the Gamma Burst Flash allows Vegeta to effect a larger area with his attack, what looks like two beams merged into one large one,therefore it is unique from any of his other attacks including Final Flash. The palms are aimed outward which makes a difference in the beams wideness.
The Final Flash is stronger while the Galick Gun and Kamehameha are equal in strength.

And your depiction of the Gamma Burst Flash is head canon.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by dbs fanboy » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:42 pm

sintzu wrote:We thought for the longest time that Goku wouldn't use it again in the anime then out of nowhere he used it so don't be surprised if Vegeta uses it in some random episode like a 2.0 baseball one.

An anime writer was asked about it when Goku used it with Hit and he said Vegeta can as well so it'll happen if whoever's writing the episode wants to use it.
So then we simply have to wait............. for the basketball episode.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by gofishus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:46 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:He doesn't need it. I don't understand the obsession is with Vegeta having all the SSJ forms that Goku has. First, it was displeasure that Vegeta didn't get SSJ3 and now it's SSJG.

Just let Vegeta do his own thing. Him getting SSJG at this stage is pointless.
Then whats the point of Goku using SSJG? he doesnt need it either right? point is there's certain advantages to the form like for stamina etc there IS reason to use it obviously...

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:52 pm

gofishus wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:He doesn't need it. I don't understand the obsession is with Vegeta having all the SSJ forms that Goku has. First, it was displeasure that Vegeta didn't get SSJ3 and now it's SSJG.

Just let Vegeta do his own thing. Him getting SSJG at this stage is pointless.
Then whats the point of Goku using SSJG? he doesnt need it either right? point is there's certain advantages to the form like for stamina etc there IS reason to use it obviously...
Goku uses SSJG the same reason he uses any other SSJ form... he feels that transformation is the appropriate one to take care of an opponent once he's gauged how strong they are.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Tue Dec 19, 2017 1:30 am

HeroR wrote:
BWri wrote:
HeroR wrote:
It really isn't. The Kamehameha and the Galick Gun are in the same family, but not the Final Flash according to the Daizenshuu. The Big Bang is nothing like the Spirit Bomb since their function are utterly different.

And the Gamma Burst Flash is again just the Final Flash in a different hand position.
How is Final Flash any different? It's a beam and it can be amped, but so can the Kamehameha. It's function is essentially the same. I only compared the BB and SB, because they're both Ball attacks, otherwise, I already know that they're different in function. The hand position in the Gamma Burst Flash allows Vegeta to effect a larger area with his attack, what looks like two beams merged into one large one,therefore it is unique from any of his other attacks including Final Flash. The palms are aimed outward which makes a difference in the beams wideness.
The Final Flash is stronger while the Galick Gun and Kamehameha are equal in strength.

And your depiction of the Gamma Burst Flash is head canon.
You can clearly see from the illustration of it that Gamma Burst Flash hits a wide area. Vegeta used the attack for the sake of destroying multiple opponents. Nothing headcanon about that.

"The Final Flash is stronger while the Galick Gun and Kamehameha are equal in strength."
This sounds more headcanon than anything, since beams can be amped i.e. Gohan's Kamehameha against Cell.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by JulieYBM » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:03 am

TBMx wrote:They're too lazy or time constrained to design a SSG model for Vegeta and go to the trouble of drawing something new that doesn't have to be there.
Buddy, how many hours a day do you work? Your average anime worker clocks in at least ten hours a day. Are you pulling twenty hour days? You must be, if you think the staff here is lazy and you must--clearly--know that they definitely work less than you do. Right? Correct? Yes? You're right, right? Only you know what real, hard work is, right? What's it like pulling in those twenty hour days, by the way?

Like, holy cow. This shit gets run through various parties before it can be approved. Various people are all running around trying to do three months of work in the span of two or less. 'Lazy'? Please, use your vast experience as a hard working member of society to properly explain why they are 'lazy'.

You're free to say one's judgment is shitty (I do it all the time), but describing one's actions as 'lazy' is just disgusting.
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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by Zeru14 » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:08 am

BWri wrote:
Miracles wrote:People thought Goku was done with red too but showed up with red against Dyspo. Even used the manga's "switch n bait" from red to blue.
It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
Yeah it always irked me that the anime treated Goku as the originator for the red-blue combo, anyway I'm glad that Toyotaro gave red to Vegeta since it was stated that you need Super Saiyan God before you can get Saiyan beyond God and Super Saiyan Blue, you shouldn't be able to just skip it. That's like the ridiculousness of the Heroes where Raditz skipped SSJ and SSJ2 and went right to SSJ3.

And you know, since this franchise is all about making money off merchandise, its weird that Toei wouldn't try to cash in on "Red Vegeta" products.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by JazzMazz » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:13 am

Zeru14 wrote:
BWri wrote:
Miracles wrote:People thought Goku was done with red too but showed up with red against Dyspo. Even used the manga's "switch n bait" from red to blue.
It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
Yeah it always irked me that the anime treated Goku as the originator for the red-blue combo,
In the anime, Goku is the guy that came up with the red-blue combo. The same is true in the manga, or are you forgetting what happened during the (awful) Hit fight in the manga? If anything, Vegeta stole Goku's idea and expanded upon it to suit his purposes.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by TBMx » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:18 am

JulieYBM wrote:
TBMx wrote:They're too lazy or time constrained to design a SSG model for Vegeta and go to the trouble of drawing something new that doesn't have to be there.
Buddy, how many hours a day do you work? Your average anime worker clocks in at least ten hours a day. Are you pulling twenty hour days? You must be, if you think the staff here is lazy and you must--clearly--know that they definitely work less than you do. Right? Correct? Yes? You're right, right? Only you know what real, hard work is, right? What's it like pulling in those twenty hour days, by the way?

Like, holy cow. This shit gets run through various parties before it can be approved. Various people are all running around trying to do three months of work in the span of two or less. 'Lazy'? Please, use your vast experience as a hard working member of society to properly explain why they are 'lazy'.

You're free to say one's judgment is shitty (I do it all the time), but describing one's actions as 'lazy' is just disgusting.
No one works twenty hours a day. Don't be ridiculous. But I absolutely draw more than any one of them does. So I'll say it again. They're too lazy to draw a bit of lightning on Vegeta or make a SSG model. And if "lazy" triggers you, how about "cheap". They're too cheap to hire another artist to do it.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by Saturnine » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:21 pm

In terms of inherent power of beam techniques:

Kamehameha < Super Kamehameha = Galick Gun < Final Flash

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by Jigurashi » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:00 pm

JazzMazz wrote:
Zeru14 wrote:
BWri wrote: It's strange that they just gave Goku Vegeta's invention from the manga. I don't get that decision at all. I think that's the main reason he should have it, is because he invented that technique. I mean sheesh, give the poor bastard something. I actually thought that and Gamma Burst Flash were some good ways to freshen up Vegeta's fighting style, but he has yet to show either in the anime.
Yeah it always irked me that the anime treated Goku as the originator for the red-blue combo,
In the anime, Goku is the guy that came up with the red-blue combo. The same is true in the manga, or are you forgetting what happened during the (awful) Hit fight in the manga? If anything, Vegeta stole Goku's idea and expanded upon it to suit his purposes.
This. Not sure why people keep saying he stole it as if Vegeta invented the idea. Even in the manga Goku invented it. Vegeta just "stole" it and improved on it. I don't really get why people get so irked over it.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by HeroR » Tue Dec 19, 2017 2:48 pm

Jigurashi wrote:
JazzMazz wrote:
Zeru14 wrote:
Yeah it always irked me that the anime treated Goku as the originator for the red-blue combo,
In the anime, Goku is the guy that came up with the red-blue combo. The same is true in the manga, or are you forgetting what happened during the (awful) Hit fight in the manga? If anything, Vegeta stole Goku's idea and expanded upon it to suit his purposes.
This. Not sure why people keep saying he stole it as if Vegeta invented the idea. Even in the manga Goku invented it. Vegeta just "stole" it and improved on it. I don't really get why people get so irked over it.
They want to believe that Vegeta invented something other than bigger explosions.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: So it seems no SSG Vegeta in the anime

Post by BWri » Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:47 am

Saturnine wrote:In terms of inherent power of beam techniques:

Kamehameha < Super Kamehameha = Galick Gun < Final Flash
At first glance it might appear this way, but Cell gave Vegeta ample time to charge his FF and did not fight against it, merely tried to block it. Super doesn't treat one beam as superior over the other either. Vegeta uses them interchangeably and when he fires FF from the hip, it functions as any ordinary two handed beam, with no one commenting or reacting to its power. Of course, when charged like against Magetta, it's a different story, but so is a charged Kamehameha.
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