Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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AdventurousAugustus
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Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by AdventurousAugustus » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:57 pm

Last edited by AdventurousAugustus on Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:11 pm

It depends. The Super anime has a lot of good writing. For example, i really enjoyed the writing in the initial stage of the Future Trunks' arc. The debut of the malevolent Goku Black, the mystery surrounding this individual, his motives, the introduction of Zamasu and his possible relationship with Black. And of course, it was really interesting to watch Zamasu's fall from grace. Personally, episodes 47-60 had very good writing (Goku's odd, immature, childish, disrespectful and unforgivable behaviour in episode 53 aside).

But then i also remember Super Saiyan Rage, which is an illogical form. Toei hasn't even managed to explain how the form worked, or where that massive surge of power came from. So that would be an example of bad writing. I shouldn't have to theorize the origins of the form called 'Super Saiyan Rage' if the writing had been good enough.

I didn't watch the arcs prior to the Future Trunks saga, so i don't have an opinion about them.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by precita » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:18 pm

It's essentially glorified fanfiction. I mean that in kind of a good way. Feels exactly like those Dragonball fanfictions you'd see in the early 2000's where everyone would try to come up with new ideas of what would happen after the Buu saga (or after GT, etc).

There's a lot I like about Super. While some characters feel stagnant or regressed prior to their Buu saga selves. It also seems like they have no idea what to do with Trunks/Goten, Buu or the humans anymore.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Lord Beerus » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:37 pm

As a whole? No. It's far too inconsistent. But there are enough well written episodes (in my opinion) to give me the incentive to keep following the show under the pretense of, "They've shown they can give really good episode on several occasions, so I'll stick around for now."

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Grimlock » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:46 pm

No, it lacks too much explanation even for things that should matter the most. The only saga that had an actual plot going on so far (Future Trunks saga) saw its ending being the most terrible ending of all sagas, with so many options to choose, for some reason they really thought that Trunks living with himself was
an ideal one. It's very predictable too (I must say that there are some special cases where Toei impressed though), like the return of Vegetto.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by VegettoEX » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:56 pm

AdventurousAugustus wrote:Personally, I don't think the writing in Dragon Ball Super is good. In my opinion, it's quite a mess. But what do you guys think?
It's helpful and encouraged that you add your own thoughts to the mix when creating threads and asking others' their opinions. Perhaps you could have outlined some of the examples that you think highlight your point the most.
SupremeKai25 wrote:But then i also remember Super Saiyan Rage, which is an illogical form. Toei hasn't even managed to explain how the form worked, or where that massive surge of power came from. So that would be an example of bad writing.
Not liking something does not inherently equal "bad writing". All the reasons you need, from the form itself up through his ending attack, were presented to you through ways other than verbal exposition from characters. I say this, however and openly conceding, and someone with less than zero interest in power scaling and its incorporation into the storyline.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Elvis143BRA » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:57 pm

Heck no, it's more inconsistent than Krillin's height in DBZ.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:10 pm

Not liking something does not inherently equal "bad writing". All the reasons you need, from the form itself up through his ending attack, were presented to you through ways other than verbal exposition from characters.
In that case, please show me the various reasons behind the form itself that were presented to me through ways other than verbal exposition from characters. I'm afraid Toei was so subtle and clever with their writing that i had overlooked them.

Actual valid reasons that clearly explain the origin of the transformation, what it precisely consists of, and how Trunks attained it. I would genuinely be interested to see them, so that i may finally understand what this so-called 'Super Saiyan Rage' exactly is.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by precita » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:54 pm

Dragonball Super is the, "Star Wars: The Last Jedi" of Dragonball series. You need to let the past go, and let the writers change the lore and do new things with old characters.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by AnAverageJoe1998 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:43 pm

I think the writing in Super is inconsistent is as result of different writers at Toei giving their own takes on Toriyama outline. This isn't to that there are inherently bad writers (Toshio and Tomioka are pretty great in my book.), but their versions end up clashing a bit when put next to each other. However, the main reasons that I do really enjoy the show (characters, action, comedy.) are strong enough for me to overlook that issue for the most part.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:46 pm

That's like asking if Marvel or DC Comics are well-written. There are both awesome and terrible extremes.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by puar » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:00 pm

for dragon ball standarts yes it is.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Miracles » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:20 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote:
Not liking something does not inherently equal "bad writing". All the reasons you need, from the form itself up through his ending attack, were presented to you through ways other than verbal exposition from characters.
In that case, please show me the various reasons behind the form itself that were presented to me through ways other than verbal exposition from characters. I'm afraid Toei was so subtle and clever with their writing that i had overlooked them.

Actual valid reasons that clearly explain the origin of the transformation, what it precisely consists of, and how Trunks attained it. I would genuinely be interested to see them, so that i may finally understand what this so-called 'Super Saiyan Rage' exactly is.
It wasn't called "Super Saiyan Rage." It was stated that Trunks got the boost through rage.
Even in the manga, when Trunks trained with Kaioshin, battling Dabura, attained SSJ2 via rage.

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by MKCSTEALTH » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:24 pm

It has good moments, but I feel everything since the trunks arc has just been a mess from a writing standpoint. From things that just aren't explained to just complete lunacy (the 28 planets debacle, for example...)

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:34 pm

It wasn't called "Super Saiyan Rage."
Actually, the official name of the form is 'Super Saiyan Ikari', which stands for 'Super Saiyan Anger/Rage/Wrath'.
It was stated that Trunks got the boost through rage.
And how does that work, exactly? Why did Goku, Vegeta or even Black never attained Super Saiyan Anger when they were taken by rage? Why was this boost/transformation unique to Trunks? Furthermore, is it an actual transformation, a new form, or just a stronger version of Super Saiyan 2 (but not an entirely separate transformation)? Does this form have some kind of relationship with Super Saiyan Blue, given the blue/yellow aura?

'Trunks got the boost through rage' is a pretty vague and short explanation, don't you think? That's the premise of basically every other Super Saiyan transformations (bar the godly ones).
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by puar » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:46 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote:
It wasn't called "Super Saiyan Rage."
Actually, the official name of the form is 'Super Saiyan Ikari', which stands for 'Super Saiyan Anger/Rage/Wrath'.
It was stated that Trunks got the boost through rage.
And how does that work, exactly? Why did Goku, Vegeta or even Black never attained Super Saiyan Anger when they were taken by rage? Why was this boost/transformation unique to Trunks? Furthermore, is it an actual transformation, a new form, or just a stronger version of Super Saiyan 2 (but not an entirely separate transformation)? Does this form have some kind of relationship with Super Saiyan Blue, given the blue/yellow aura?

'Trunks got the boost through rage' is a pretty vague and short explanation, don't you think? That's the premise of basically every other Super Saiyan transformations (bar the godly ones).
maybe the super Saiyan rage isnt really a new form more like the super trunks ''transformation'' from z. the blue light inside the aura say nothing. its dosent mean its a new form just because you see a new color it could be just form of lighting. the way the pupils dissapear just like the super trunks transformation in z explain that its something only trunks has. that transformation in z was that rage transformation combined with the USSJ. and because trunks passed that stage now he got only the pupils dissapeared. or in short. its not a new form just trunks raging to extreme. if you watch it again closley youl see that trunks dident really beat black with it. black still beat him even in that form he just took some few hits by suprise but thats it

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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by sintzu » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:17 pm

I think the basic plots are good but the writing within each episode is mixed to say the least. A lot of times characters act out of character and other times things happen with 0 explanation like Trunks' "Rage" mode. On the other hand you've got great written episode and characters like Roshi's episode and Goku Black so if they can give us more of that then things would improve.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by BWri » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:24 am

Lord Beerus wrote:As a whole? No. It's far too inconsistent. But there are enough well written episodes (in my opinion) to give me the incentive to keep following the show under the pretense of, "They've shown they can give really good episode on several occasions, so I'll stick around for now."
Exactly this. My caveat to it is, as long as this doesn't constantly insult my intelligence I'm fanboy enough to watch it week to week.

The problem was at the start it did insult my intelligence, every damn week and my fanboy wasn't strong enough to endure with the action scenes & basic drawings also being subpar most of the time too. So I skipped the end of the Frieza arc and some eps of the U6 tournament arc. I'm not even talking about real life intelligence, I'm talking about my knowledge of in-universe events, "laws", and character traits. Trunks' blue hair being one of those things which felt like a big unaddressed middle finger. Back then the show was filled with such decisions but now, though inconsistent, I feel the show is at least much more enjoyably written. Super was also fairly boring at the start, but my interest picked up once Future Trunks, Goku Black, and Zamasu joined the fray. I think it's saying something that Super could get me so involved in such a generic fanfic-y idea as an evil Goku. They get points for that. They lose points for having two multiversal tournaments that are less interesting than the one from DBMV though.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by Hawk9211 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:43 am

It's a mixed bag.Most of time average,sometime extremely good or extremely bad.
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Re: Do you think Dragonball Super Anime is well written?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 7:59 am

puar wrote:
SupremeKai25 wrote:
It wasn't called "Super Saiyan Rage."
Actually, the official name of the form is 'Super Saiyan Ikari', which stands for 'Super Saiyan Anger/Rage/Wrath'.
It was stated that Trunks got the boost through rage.
And how does that work, exactly? Why did Goku, Vegeta or even Black never attained Super Saiyan Anger when they were taken by rage? Why was this boost/transformation unique to Trunks? Furthermore, is it an actual transformation, a new form, or just a stronger version of Super Saiyan 2 (but not an entirely separate transformation)? Does this form have some kind of relationship with Super Saiyan Blue, given the blue/yellow aura?

'Trunks got the boost through rage' is a pretty vague and short explanation, don't you think? That's the premise of basically every other Super Saiyan transformations (bar the godly ones).
maybe the super Saiyan rage isnt really a new form more like the super trunks ''transformation'' from z. the blue light inside the aura say nothing. its dosent mean its a new form just because you see a new color it could be just form of lighting. the way the pupils dissapear just like the super trunks transformation in z explain that its something only trunks has. that transformation in z was that rage transformation combined with the USSJ. and because trunks passed that stage now he got only the pupils dissapeared. or in short. its not a new form just trunks raging to extreme. if you watch it again closley youl see that trunks dident really beat black with it. black still beat him even in that form he just took some few hits by suprise but thats it
That is a theory, not an actual explanation that comes from clear elements and hints given by the show. I'm not surprised you started your reply using the word 'Maybe'.

You wouldn't have had to explain Super Saiyan Rage to me if the show had actually bothered to give a clear explanation and/or indication of the origins of the form, substance of the form, method to attain it, and relationship with other Super Saiyan forms. This is bad writing. There's nothing wrong, the Future Trunks arc was a fantastically-written arc, i dare say the best arc in the entire series from a story standpoint. But let's not try to justify Super Saiyan Rage by saying things like 'the show gives subtle hints...' or something like that. The show does not give an explanation, however subtle, of this form, nor does it attempt to. Just like there is no actual explanation behind the Spirit Bomb-like Sword that Trunks used to cleave Fused Zamasu in half, aside from 'Oh, Trunks somehow gathered the energy of the people around him to create a Spirit Bomb (even though he has never seen such a move before or heard of it, but let's not go over that), which he subsequently inbued into his own sword'. That is not a sufficient explanation.
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