Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Nero<>Akira » Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:08 am

TheSaiyanGod wrote:
TBMx wrote:
TheSaiyanGod wrote: No, in a later version of the last chapter, this talk of Vegeta does not exist. So in the end he does not want to overtake Goku

And 17 just managed to hold Toppo because of his infinite energy and barrier.
He could not do much more than that. So Vegeta only on SSB also would not be able to do anything against Toppo. This new transformation really made some sense at the end

But I agree that Vegeta is also training to get the UI, just like Goku.
In the manga, the Fish Oracle says that Vegeta and Goku will be great rivals for Beerus.
So why could not Vegeta at least get a prelude to the UI? Or surpass the power of Beerus in that last arc?
Toriyama changed it to "I'll surpass you someday", you're saying he changed it back? When?

And I'm not saying Vegeta has to do better against Jiren than 17. Because even now, with SSBluerer, he hasn't done better by any means. I'm saying all Vegeta needs to get his ass kicked and eliminated by Jiren, is regular SSB.

All he needed to beat god Toppo is regular SSB.

So all this talk about what Vegeta "needs" and "wants" is irrelevant. He's been through the same training as Goku, he actually trained with Whis longer, he's been pushed past his limits multiple times, he almost died in this tournament, at least three times, Why has he not broken through to his "Inner shell" yet? Meaning why hasn't he even got UI omen yet? For even a second? That's what makes me think it'll always be a Goku specific thing like Kaioken.

I would trade Vegeta's new transformation for UI omen in a split second. UI Omen actually lends itself to elaborate fight choreography making it a joy to watch (or it would if it wasn't Goku's), while Vegeta's new transformation fight Toppo was boring, slow and unentertaining.

And that's all that matters at the end of the day. Entertainment.
The 2014 Kanzenban version of the ending was included in the Dragon Ball Digest Edition, but the last chapter did not have those additional pages of Vegeta talking that would overtake Goku, just the goodbye message from Toriyama.

I'm just saying that with the regular SSB, Vegeta would not be able to defeat Toppo (who destroyed Golden Freeza) let alone give a decent fight to Jiren.
Because yes, with his new transformation, he is doing a lot better than before (after all, we are talking about Jiren who released his true power).

But yes, Vegeta has already been on the limit several times, enough to be able to unlock the UI (or at least the same transformation as Goku).
In the next EP it will be destroyed by Jiren, why would not that be enough?
Just fighting Kefla, Goku was able to activate UI.

I agree that UI would be better for Vegeta, mainly because of all his training to achieve this technique and also for having stayed on the limit several times in this tournament.
But it's not as if your '' new Blue '' was bad.
Nero<>Akira wrote:
TheSaiyanGod wrote: No, in a later version of the last chapter, this talk of Vegeta does not exist. So in the end he does not want to overtake Goku

And 17 just managed to hold Toppo because of his infinite energy and barrier.
He could not do much more than that. So Vegeta only on SSB also would not be able to do anything against Toppo. This new transformation really made some sense at the end

But I agree that Vegeta is also training to get the UI, just like Goku.
In the manga, the Fish Oracle says that Vegeta and Goku will be great rivals for Beerus.
So why could not Vegeta at least get a prelude to the UI? Or surpass the power of Beerus in that last arc?



Vegeta was also being defeated by Toppo, but after thinking about his family, he was able to defeat him. Why could not he at least give Jiren some work on EP 128 doing the same thing? It's your last battle

The '' he's tired '' argument does not make sense
Its.... Jiren..... JIREN. It doesn't matter if he is at full power lol don't even compare Toppo to him. Nothing suggests he is even on Jirens level. The only thing capable of besting Jiren or even fighting him is literally a technique Gods use.
No matter how strong Jiren is, emotions have always been a trigger for the Saiyans to grow stronger.

It would not be a problem if we had Vegeta's last decent fight against Jiren, where he would be able to fight with everything and use his motivations to confront him.
ZenkaiBoosts wrote:
TBMx wrote:If Vegeta doesn't get Ultra Instinct despite undergoing the same training, I think we can all agree that UI for Goku has nothing to do with Whis' training and is a complete asspull? Especially mastering it when there's no indication that Vegeta will ever get the UI Omen even. And considering millions of years old gods haven't mastered it.
This makes no sense

Goku didn't attain Omen through training.

It was through an internal struggle from WITHIN himself to resist being killed by his own spirit bomb.

It was through an unusual event

Where during his fight vs Jiren- Goku was being pushed well beyond his limits by Jiren.

Goku was already maxed out when Jiren sent that spirit bomb right back at Goku. That was it for Goku. It took every fiber of Goku's will, power, and soul to resist being engulged by his own spirit bomb.

That internal struggle from WITHIN himself to resist, is what allowed him to unlock the basics of Instinctual fighting i.e UI (Omen prelude)

In fact the way Goku got Omen was flawless writing by Toriyama/flawless execution by Toei.

Now this is going to lead in to the next point - ON WHY it actually DOES make perfect sense for Goku to unlock the UI mastered transformation

UI is a "technique" for angels "practiced" through training. (From what we know Berus is the only god who seems to have been taught any version of it)

UI was a transformation for Goku brought out during battle as a NEED.

How many of the angels (and Berus) actually had a life and death battle where they were pushed to their max and beyond - and HAD an instinctual NEED TO survive/master it, like Goku?

There sure isn't anyone to challenge the angels like how Jiren challenges Goku and like how Jiren has Goku continually pushing and pushing past his limits.

And Goku was the first one to ever even give Berus a good fight in ages.

Its like the angles simply train UI in their spare time to have fun. That's why it would simply take hundreds of years for them to master it through simply just training means.

Where as, Goku was in actual life and death battle, being pushed beyond his max limits by someone so much stronger.

Think of it as, the angels (and Berus) have always just been hitting punching bags. You can get good just by that - and always look good hitting the bag. But at the end of the day you need to actually put it to practice in a real live fight.

Goku doesnt hit bags to look pretty, Goku is not only sparring -but in actual chanpionship fights always pushing himself to the max and surpassing limits.

It makes sense that Goku would unlock the mastered UI transformation much faster due to Goku actually needing it in battle and being pushed well beyond his max etc

Berus has spent most of his life sleeping. How the heck is he going to master UI?

Plus have we forgotten how much of a prodigy and martial arts master Goku Is?

IF ANY "mortal" could unlock the UI perfect transformation that fast, it's the legendary Son Goku who's actually out there testing himself in live battles and surpassing his limits each time.

On the matter of Vegeta. Vegeta getting UI would not make any sense because Vegeta can NOT seperate his mind from his body no matter how hard he trains. Its simply Vegeta's personality. Whis even stated this. "Vegeta is always too tense" Goku is loose which fits UI far better.

We already saw the results of Vegeta's training with Whis via Vegeta learning how to control/master his god ki


Maybe....MAYBE in the NEXT version of Super (that comes back next year) we could see Vegeta get Omen but it would take Vegeta changing his perspective on life+an unusual event or circumstances. I see it as highly unlikely

At the end of the day, no matter what, Vegeta himself said he doesnt want UI.

And personally, I like it much better that way if Goku and Vegeta simply have their own paths. Vegeta continuing to go down the path of God ki control makes much more sense

Why does Vegeta always have to get everything Goku gets ? Because forced artificial "rival plot"....I'm sick of that aspect of Super. That would be giving Vegeta the asspulls too. Heck, I would say that the way Vegeta went SSB2 Is the real asspull
Vegeta has been at his limits several times in this tournament (as much as Goku), and this could be used for him to awaken the UI as well.
Goku just in his fight against Kefla managed to awaken the UI, because Vegeta could not do the same against Jiren?

In the next episode, Vegeta will be destroyed by Jiren, so this could be used to awaken the UI.

And this story that '' Vegeta's personality would prevent him from reaching the UI '' does not exist. The transformation that Goku obtained (to be able to access the UI) would already do the job of separating mind and body so that Vegeta moves without thinking.
And the fact that Vegeta is tense is only a weakness that can be overcome, Whis himself said he could train him to get this technique

And Vegeta is not following Goku, UI is a technique that exists a long time and that even the gods have difficulties in dominating, it is not something that Goku created or even that only it uses.
It doesn't matter if emotions are a staple. They have limits. If it was always about emotion they'd always win. This isn't fairy tail.
Zamasu is the best DB villain besides Freeza (and this is only the case because the current Super arc elevated Freeza to be that good).

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Mercenary » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:24 am

sintzu wrote:
Mercenary wrote:Spoilers just say :"Vegeta falls". It doesn't mean he is out at all.
Maybe he's "hiding" with Hit. :lol:

The last laugh shall be mine! :D

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by sintzu » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:46 am

Mercenary wrote:
sintzu wrote:
Mercenary wrote:Spoilers just say :"Vegeta falls". It doesn't mean he is out at all.
Maybe he's "hiding" with Hit. :lol:

The last laugh shall be mine! :D
We'll all be celebrating if you're right. :clap:
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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by MajinMan » Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:36 pm

This is one homage I’d be OK with. The recent constant homages are getting annoying, but this one, if it is one, I think has the most potential of being somewhat original. Maybe Vegeta gives Goku some pep talk before he gets knocked out, or he says some inspiring things to him. Maybe he doesn’t say anything to or about Goku, but still inspires him to the point where Goku transforms again. Who knows.
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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by TBMx » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:11 pm

WORST EPISODE EVER.

It was exactly as I feared. Jiren, for no reason at all, indulges base Vegeta's pointless attacks. With less than three minutes on the clock WITH HIS UNIVERSE AT STAKE, he doesn't just beat Goku and Vegeta in short order. He's an idiot.

Vegeta - Gives energy to Goku at the end when he could have done that from the start. Giving Goku more energy, potentially allowing Goku to defend him and possibly even return the favour, then he could have made his macho meathead ego driven charge at Jiren a tenth as long. Saving us the bad powerscaling and saving himself a lot of painful agony. Could have asked for the Potara. Idiot.

Goku - Includes FRIEZA in his sentimental pre-UI vision. Which would be like The Batman reflecting on the Joker with sentimentality, just because they had to be unwilling allies for a common goal. Offensive.
Includes Frieza over the likes of Chi Chi and Goten. His FAMILY.

Vegeta actually thinks of his family, and gets KTFO for his trouble, whereas Goku thinks of his team, including a genocidal arch enemy who wiped out his race's homeworld, blew up the earth and everyone on it, killed his best friend, attempted to kill his Son, and he's the one who ascends past the gods, to Ultra Instinct and mastered Ultra Instinct the VERY NEXT EPISODE, LITERALLY ONLY ONE MINUTE LATER.

So there's literally no reason to watch the next series then. Goku can dodge everything so what's left? Super Duperer Ultraerer Instincter? That should have been his ultimate transformation in all of dragonball. That should have been the golden fleece. The holy grail of martial arts. Goku's not a character, he's just a plot device.

What a crap show. What crap. Seriously. :roll:

I'm pissed.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:41 pm

TBMx wrote:So there's literally no reason to watch the next series then. Goku can dodge everything so what's left? Super Duperer Ultraerer Instincter? That should have been his ultimate transformation in all of dragonball. That should have been the golden fleece. The holy grail of martial arts. Goku's not a character, he's just a plot device.

What a crap show. What crap. Seriously. :roll:

I'm pissed.
See ya for the next episode.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Yomi » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:48 pm

TBMx wrote:WORST EPISODE EVER.

It was exactly as I feared. Jiren, for no reason at all, indulges base Vegeta's pointless attacks. With less than three minutes on the clock WITH HIS UNIVERSE AT STAKE, he doesn't just beat Goku and Vegeta in short order. He's an idiot.

Vegeta - Gives energy to Goku at the end when he could have done that from the start. Giving Goku more energy, potentially allowing Goku to defend him and possibly even return the favour, then he could have made his macho meathead ego driven charge at Jiren a tenth as long. Saving us the bad powerscaling and saving himself a lot of painful agony. Could have asked for the Potara. Idiot.

Goku - Includes FRIEZA in his sentimental pre-UI vision. Which would be like The Batman reflecting on the Joker with sentimentality, just because they had to be unwilling allies for a common goal. Offensive.
Includes Frieza over the likes of Chi Chi and Goten. His FAMILY.

Vegeta actually thinks of his family, and gets KTFO for his trouble, whereas Goku thinks of his team, including a genocidal arch enemy who wiped out his race's homeworld, blew up the earth and everyone on it, killed his best friend, attempted to kill his Son, and he's the one who ascends past the gods, to Ultra Instinct and mastered Ultra Instinct the VERY NEXT EPISODE, LITERALLY ONLY ONE MINUTE LATER.

So there's literally no reason to watch the next series then. Goku can dodge everything so what's left? Super Duperer Ultraerer Instincter? That should have been his ultimate transformation in all of dragonball. That should have been the golden fleece. The holy grail of martial arts. Goku's not a character, he's just a plot device.

What a crap show. What crap. Seriously. :roll:

I'm pissed.
Maybe you shouldn't be watching sunday morning childrens cartoons if they make you this livid.
:clap:

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Diccolo-420 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:09 pm

TBMx wrote:WORST EPISODE EVER.

It was exactly as I feared. Jiren, for no reason at all, indulges base Vegeta's pointless attacks. With less than three minutes on the clock WITH HIS UNIVERSE AT STAKE, he doesn't just beat Goku and Vegeta in short order. He's an idiot.

Vegeta - Gives energy to Goku at the end when he could have done that from the start. Giving Goku more energy, potentially allowing Goku to defend him and possibly even return the favour, then he could have made his macho meathead ego driven charge at Jiren a tenth as long. Saving us the bad powerscaling and saving himself a lot of painful agony. Could have asked for the Potara. Idiot.

Goku - Includes FRIEZA in his sentimental pre-UI vision. Which would be like The Batman reflecting on the Joker with sentimentality, just because they had to be unwilling allies for a common goal. Offensive.
Includes Frieza over the likes of Chi Chi and Goten. His FAMILY.

Vegeta actually thinks of his family, and gets KTFO for his trouble, whereas Goku thinks of his team, including a genocidal arch enemy who wiped out his race's homeworld, blew up the earth and everyone on it, killed his best friend, attempted to kill his Son, and he's the one who ascends past the gods, to Ultra Instinct and mastered Ultra Instinct the VERY NEXT EPISODE, LITERALLY ONLY ONE MINUTE LATER.

So there's literally no reason to watch the next series then. Goku can dodge everything so what's left? Super Duperer Ultraerer Instincter? That should have been his ultimate transformation in all of dragonball. That should have been the golden fleece. The holy grail of martial arts. Goku's not a character, he's just a plot device.

What a crap show. What crap. Seriously. :roll:

I'm pissed.
Agreed whole-heartedly, the show has practically betrayed its message of "hard work, courage, and fighting to protect those you love will pay off" to where all you need to be is the main character and want to fight strong guys.

Episodes like this are exactly why I don't pay for a crunchyroll subscription, I just use my friend's login.

People already know my thoughts of the episode in the official thread, but at this point Toei's writing is just insulting. They force another goku saves the day at the last minute with an asspull power up coupled with everyone commenting "how amazing" he is like a bad sitcom needing a laugh track to remind its audience when to laugh. I genuinely think Toei believes their writing is genius for pulling this again, lmfao.

And people are going to say it's gonna be epic. Sure, the fight's gonna look great but there's no tension or suspense because we know how it will turn out. There's only so many times dragon ball can retread the same plot threads before it becomes stale and it's reached that point, I officially am just watching just to finish it up since there's only a handful of episodes left.
Yomi wrote:
Maybe you shouldn't be watching sunday morning childrens cartoons if they make you this livid.
He has every right to be. Saturday morning cartoon or no, they still have to have some level of quality to them and they generally are consistent with their message, which DB has officially thrown out the window. The entire reason why most of us watch dragonball (to see our characters work hard and see it pay off to beat the bad guys) has been thrown out for pointless fanservice of Goku.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Mercenary » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:37 pm

Diccolo-420 wrote:
TBMx wrote:WORST EPISODE EVER.

It was exactly as I feared. Jiren, for no reason at all, indulges base Vegeta's pointless attacks. With less than three minutes on the clock WITH HIS UNIVERSE AT STAKE, he doesn't just beat Goku and Vegeta in short order. He's an idiot.

Vegeta - Gives energy to Goku at the end when he could have done that from the start. Giving Goku more energy, potentially allowing Goku to defend him and possibly even return the favour, then he could have made his macho meathead ego driven charge at Jiren a tenth as long. Saving us the bad powerscaling and saving himself a lot of painful agony. Could have asked for the Potara. Idiot.

Goku - Includes FRIEZA in his sentimental pre-UI vision. Which would be like The Batman reflecting on the Joker with sentimentality, just because they had to be unwilling allies for a common goal. Offensive.
Includes Frieza over the likes of Chi Chi and Goten. His FAMILY.

Vegeta actually thinks of his family, and gets KTFO for his trouble, whereas Goku thinks of his team, including a genocidal arch enemy who wiped out his race's homeworld, blew up the earth and everyone on it, killed his best friend, attempted to kill his Son, and he's the one who ascends past the gods, to Ultra Instinct and mastered Ultra Instinct the VERY NEXT EPISODE, LITERALLY ONLY ONE MINUTE LATER.

So there's literally no reason to watch the next series then. Goku can dodge everything so what's left? Super Duperer Ultraerer Instincter? That should have been his ultimate transformation in all of dragonball. That should have been the golden fleece. The holy grail of martial arts. Goku's not a character, he's just a plot device.

What a crap show. What crap. Seriously. :roll:

I'm pissed.
Agreed whole-heartedly, the show has practically betrayed its message of "hard work, courage, and fighting to protect those you love will pay off" to where all you need to be is the main character and want to fight strong guys.

Episodes like this are exactly why I don't pay for a crunchyroll subscription, I just use my friend's login.

People already know my thoughts of the episode in the official thread, but at this point Toei's writing is just insulting. They force another goku saves the day at the last minute with an asspull power up coupled with everyone commenting "how amazing" he is like a bad sitcom needing a laugh track to remind its audience when to laugh. I genuinely think Toei believes their writing is genius for pulling this again, lmfao.

And people are going to say it's gonna be epic. Sure, the fight's gonna look great but there's no tension or suspense because we know how it will turn out. There's only so many times dragon ball can retread the same plot threads before it becomes stale and it's reached that point, I officially am just watching just to finish it up since there's only a handful of episodes left.
Yomi wrote:
Maybe you shouldn't be watching sunday morning childrens cartoons if they make you this livid.
He has every right to be. Saturday morning cartoon or no, they still have to have some level of quality to them and they generally are consistent with their message, which DB has officially thrown out the window. The entire reason why most of us watch dragonball (to see our characters work hard and see it pay off to beat the bad guys) has been thrown out for pointless fanservice of Goku.
I know that not praising Goku is very unpopular on this board but....I guess I agree with you.


Promises and true love lost.....to the plot armor. What a shame :D.


However, I am cheering for Goku. Time to beat the crap out of Jiren.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Diccolo-420 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:40 pm

Keep in mind I was all for Goku v Frieza in DBZ with SSJ because he *worked* for it and it made sense in the story, here it's just poorly executed.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Boku no Hitto » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:59 pm

Diccolo-420 wrote:Keep in mind I was all for Goku v Frieza in DBZ with SSJ because he *worked* for it and it made sense in the story, here it's just poorly executed.
No the hell goku didn't and you know it! He got ssj randomly and was NOT training for it. He didn't even know about it until vegeta to him, just randomly asks him about some saiyan legend Goku would have no reason to knoe about. at least UI was something he actually had specific training to get it.

The episode Hit killed him is an example of him training for it without going through Whis against a character designed around you needing the best possible reflexes to withstand and hella power to beat.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:41 pm

Boku no Hitto wrote:
Diccolo-420 wrote:Keep in mind I was all for Goku v Frieza in DBZ with SSJ because he *worked* for it and it made sense in the story, here it's just poorly executed.
No the hell goku didn't and you know it! He got ssj randomly and was NOT training for it. He didn't even know about it until vegeta to him, just randomly asks him about some saiyan legend Goku would have no reason to knoe about. at least UI was something he actually had specific training to get it.

The episode Hit killed him is an example of him training for it without going through Whis against a character designed around you needing the best possible reflexes to withstand and hella power to beat.
So I am not the only that brings that up too! He honed his skills well there to the point he even dodged Bulma instinctively both Gohan and Goten said it was odd as he lets Bulma hit him all the time.

And yes you right Goku wasn't fighting Freeza for SS it just happened in the course of events just like now he is fighting for his universe.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by HeroR » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:50 pm

Diccolo-420 wrote:
Agreed whole-heartedly, the show has practically betrayed its message of "hard work, courage, and fighting to protect those you love will pay off" to where all you need to be is the main character and want to fight strong guys.

Episodes like this are exactly why I don't pay for a crunchyroll subscription, I just use my friend's login.

People already know my thoughts of the episode in the official thread, but at this point Toei's writing is just insulting. They force another goku saves the day at the last minute with an asspull power up coupled with everyone commenting "how amazing" he is like a bad sitcom needing a laugh track to remind its audience when to laugh. I genuinely think Toei believes their writing is genius for pulling this again, lmfao.

And people are going to say it's gonna be epic. Sure, the fight's gonna look great but there's no tension or suspense because we know how it will turn out. There's only so many times dragon ball can retread the same plot threads before it becomes stale and it's reached that point, I officially am just watching just to finish it up since there's only a handful of episodes left.
Yomi wrote:
Maybe you shouldn't be watching sunday morning childrens cartoons if they make you this livid.
He has every right to be. Saturday morning cartoon or no, they still have to have some level of quality to them and they generally are consistent with their message, which DB has officially thrown out the window. The entire reason why most of us watch dragonball (to see our characters work hard and see it pay off to beat the bad guys) has been thrown out for pointless fanservice of Goku.
That has never been the message of Dragon Ball, otherwise Future Trunks' timeline wouldn't have been nuked despite all of Trunks' hard work and love. Even in Dragon Ball, all of Vegeta love to save his family from Buu amounted to shit. And "another goku saves the day at the last minute with an asspull power up", what do you mean another? When has Goku won with a power-up since Namek?

And the humans trained just as hard as the Saiyans, with Tien and Piccolo being the standout, and they got left behind by brats.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Kinokima » Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:28 pm

Am I disappointed that Vegeta dropped out? Of course I was hoping for a Vegeta and Goku ending lol

Is the episode bad because Vegeta dropped out, absolutely not! I guess the only scene I could have done without was the “Ill take you arm scene” because that was just depressing

Vegeta was in my opinion treated great in the TOP and all of Super. So he doesn’t get to beat the main bad guy. He still went out as a hero and gave his all the entire tournament. He got to beat a God of Destruction. I mean would Goku have been able to take on both Jiren & Toppo (and no one else could beat Toppo either)

More importantly Vegeta has tons of great character moments throughout Super where he showed how much he now cares about and now fights for others. To me Vegeta crying because he couldn’t keep his promise was such a beautiful character moment. Yeah it was sad that he couldn’t keep that promise but the fact that he would cry because he failed others (even though I don’t see that he failed he gave his all & what he did was not for nothing) really shows how diffferent he is from who he was in Z.

And personally I love Vegeta as a character because of moments like the above not because he is the ultimate winner.

Honestly I am a bit meh on a Goku/Freeza ending which I am 99% sure this arc is headed but that’s life you can’t always get what you want.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:37 pm

And it seems that this episode was much worse than I thought

Vegeta's farewell was simply disappointing. He did not even have half the episode dedicated to him. He did not get any kind of temporary boost after thinking of his family, something like a last effort or attempt before falling, he was simply defeated by Jiren without doing anything.
And he still gives his energy to Goku (who can turn into SSB) which does not make sense because Vegeta could not even turn into normal SSJ.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:52 pm

Well, if it would make vegeta fans feel any better, even UI omen goku is getting his ass kicked next episode. So there’s that. Can’t say the same for Mastered UI tho. That form should be at least on par with full power jiren.

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TheSaiyanGod
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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:23 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:Well, if it would make vegeta fans feel any better, even UI omen goku is getting his ass kicked next episode. So there’s that. Can’t say the same for Mastered UI tho. That form should be at least on par with full power jiren.
Actually, that does not help ...

Even though Jiren is stronger than UI Omen Goku, Goku in this state is able to rival Jiren. And he even received another form, which will probably be at the same level as Full power Jiren or above that...

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:29 pm

I mean, if jiren can overwhelm UI omen goku, without releasing his full power, does it count as rivaling?. Although mastered UI is a different story. And it’s not another form, it is the same form, but perfected. Why does it change color, cause dragon ball, that’s why.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Kaiosama » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:33 am

Kinokima wrote:Am I disappointed that Vegeta dropped out? Of course I was hoping for a Vegeta and Goku ending lol

Is the episode bad because Vegeta dropped out, absolutely not! I guess the only scene I could have done without was the “Ill take you arm scene” because that was just depressing

Vegeta was in my opinion treated great in the TOP and all of Super. So he doesn’t get to beat the main bad guy. He still went out as a hero and gave his all the entire tournament. He got to beat a God of Destruction. I mean would Goku have been able to take on both Jiren & Toppo (and no one else could beat Toppo either)

More importantly Vegeta has tons of great character moments throughout Super where he showed how much he now cares about and now fights for others. To me Vegeta crying because he couldn’t keep his promise was such a beautiful character moment. Yeah it was sad that he couldn’t keep that promise but the fact that he would cry because he failed others (even though I don’t see that he failed he gave his all & what he did was not for nothing) really shows how diffferent he is from who he was in Z.

And personally I love Vegeta as a character because of moments like the above not because he is the ultimate winner.

Honestly I am a bit meh on a Goku/Freeza ending which I am 99% sure this arc is headed but that’s life you can’t always get what you want.
Sort of off topic, but I'm pretty sure UI Omen Goku would have beaten Toppo quite easily. Remember that Vegeta was able to beat him and it's heavily implied that Beyond Super Saiyan Blue<UI Omen(3rd awakening). I think Toppo would have been a good choice for forcing Goku to enter UI Omen again and then have Jiren be the one that triggers Mastered UI.

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Re: Vegeta will receive the Kid Boo treatment again... very original

Post by Kinokima » Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:56 am

Kaiosama wrote:
Kinokima wrote:Am I disappointed that Vegeta dropped out? Of course I was hoping for a Vegeta and Goku ending lol

Is the episode bad because Vegeta dropped out, absolutely not! I guess the only scene I could have done without was the “Ill take you arm scene” because that was just depressing

Vegeta was in my opinion treated great in the TOP and all of Super. So he doesn’t get to beat the main bad guy. He still went out as a hero and gave his all the entire tournament. He got to beat a God of Destruction. I mean would Goku have been able to take on both Jiren & Toppo (and no one else could beat Toppo either)

More importantly Vegeta has tons of great character moments throughout Super where he showed how much he now cares about and now fights for others. To me Vegeta crying because he couldn’t keep his promise was such a beautiful character moment. Yeah it was sad that he couldn’t keep that promise but the fact that he would cry because he failed others (even though I don’t see that he failed he gave his all & what he did was not for nothing) really shows how diffferent he is from who he was in Z.

And personally I love Vegeta as a character because of moments like the above not because he is the ultimate winner.

Honestly I am a bit meh on a Goku/Freeza ending which I am 99% sure this arc is headed but that’s life you can’t always get what you want.
Sort of off topic, but I'm pretty sure UI Omen Goku would have beaten Toppo quite easily. Remember that Vegeta was able to beat him and it's heavily implied that Beyond Super Saiyan Blue<UI Omen(3rd awakening). I think Toppo would have been a good choice for forcing Goku to enter UI Omen again and then have Jiren be the one that triggers Mastered UI.

I think it would have been pretty awful writing to have Goku beat both Toppo and Jiren.

He also beat Kefla too who was also an extremely strong character.

Goku is the strongest but to think he can do everything is also extremely unrealistic.

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