Your thoughts on the Tournament of Power compared to the Dragon World's other arcs

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Your thoughts on the Tournament of Power compared to the Dragon World's other arcs

Post by julianix » Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:49 pm

I honestlt feel like the TOP is the worst saga we've ever had.

Honestly besides android 17 what else have they handled well? The selection of characters, their development, the fights, the tension, the drama, the execution of major moments have for the most part been bad.

The decision to make an anti/hero the antagonist was smart, but Jiren is not that guy. He's beyond saving imo. What can he honestly do now to make his character interesting?

The way they mishandled two major characters was also a huge let down. Vegeta and Gohan were botched and in a very bad way.

They couldn't figure out how to use majin Buu ok I give them that. And up until the last couple episodes they handled frieza very well. But now it seems he's going down the drain again.

Gokus ultra instinct? I guess.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Vegeta_Sama » Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:52 pm

Naaah, we have Resurrection of F for that :D . Jokes aside, I don't think the ToP is THAT bad, sure, it has its problems, but it brought us a lot of epic character moments and fights. That's what this saga is at the end of the day since there's no actual plot besides "fight to survive".
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Asura » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:07 pm

And people thought I was joking when I said there are people on this forum who think the Super 17 arc is better than the ToP.

Delusional, if you ask me.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Xeogran » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:14 pm

Asura wrote:And people thought I was joking when I said there are people on this forum who think the Super 17 arc is better than the ToP.

Delusional, if you ask me.
Super 17 is just a mini-arc, I don't think it's fair to compare something that lasted 6 episodes to something that did for 30+

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Torturephile » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:19 pm

For all the flaws that it has, it has some good moments and even entire episodes. It wasn't like the Freeza resurrection saga, where it was mostly bad on all fronts.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by sintzu » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:23 pm

No because for every bad moment there are 2 good ones. Also keep in mind that watching it week to week makes it hard to give a clear opinion as there's too much time between each episode so I'd like to see it fully dubbed to rank it fairly. As things stand now I'd say it's Super's 2nd best arc after Black's.
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by ToshioWrites » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:39 pm

Story wise, you could make that argument. I wouldn't say its the worst cause its entertaining and had some epic fights/moments

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by precita » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:39 pm

In Super:

Zamasu > TOP > Fillers > U6 tournament >>>>>>>>>>>>> Beerus adaptions (movie was good though) >>>>>>>>>>>>> Return of F >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Purple Vegeta copy arc.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:41 pm

sintzu wrote:No because for every bad moment there are 2 good ones. Also keep in mind that watching it week to week makes it hard to give a clear opinion as there's too much time between each episode so I'd like to see it fully dubbed to rank it fairly. As things stand now I'd say it's Super's 2nd best arc after Black's.
I'd agree with this. Easily better than the U6 tournament and in a binge mode I think it'll flow a lot better. For me the one thing this arc excelled at is the characters, for example the way Roshi was treated in the ToP was just great nobody expected that did they? Beerus got so much development by just sitting on the sidelines, we've had so much emotion from him.

For me DB is less about plot and more about characters and that's why I love this arc so much.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Yomi » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:50 pm

There's just too many good things in this tournament to write it off as the worst of Dragon Ball the week Vegeta falls.
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by MKCSTEALTH » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:55 pm

Lol no. In a world where the Ressurection F and Garlic Jr arcs exist, the ToP is light-years ahead of them.

I understand a lot of the criticism, but I feel some people are just so harsh on this arc and I cant understand it. It's like they're doing a critical analysis of every single detail and I'm just here to enjoy something entertaining. Now when it does do stuff that doesn't make sense, I'll be one of the first people on the scene to call it out. But otherwise I enjoy the show and I don't take it so seriously.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Professor Freeza » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:56 pm

NO.
Story wise its weaker than Black arc.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Diccolo-420 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:10 pm

I wouldn't say it's the worst, but it's definitely getting weaker every episode and has been spiraling down since Goku vs Kefla.

There have been some amazing moments, but sadly it's become really bad at a time where I can't afford to and that's gonna distract from it.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:17 pm

I wouldn't define it 'the worst'. Certainly, it would've been more enjoyable if it had been more complex. Many people were speculating that the Grand Priest might have had ulterior motives, or that the spirit of Zamasu had lingered inside Future Zen-Oh's body, and so the Tournament would have been interrupted to pave the way for a grander fight against an ancient and powerful evil... whereas it's just a Tournament... there's no catch, no deceit, no intrigue... it will probably end with Goku defeating Jiren and restoring the erased Universes. All those theories about the Grand Priest, about Zamasu, about Zalama... all for nothing. Big missed opportunity, this arc was a let-down from a story perspective. But, hey, not all arcs can be as complex and elaborate as the Future Trunks arc.

I still think this arc is better than the Golden Frieza arc... that was just embarassing and insulting.
In Super:

Zamasu > TOP > Fillers > U6 tournament >>>>>>>>>>>>> Beerus adaptions (movie was good though) >>>>>>>>>>>>> Return of F >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Purple Vegeta copy arc.

Agreed. Personally, the Zamasu arc has the edge. First and foremost, it's an actual story-driven arc, not a monotonous tournament.
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by GreatSaiyaJeff » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:20 pm

Worst..no, I think in Super the worst is RoF(movie was fine). Personally I think it's pretty great, does it have some weakness, yeah like the pacing and the use of Tien have been valid complaints. The strength is the fights and use of characters. Roshi was well handled and developed, he really shined like he did in og Dragon Ball. Vegeta and Gohan's arc in this tournament has been stellar and 17 coming back was a delight. Heck bringing back Freeza who I was against has great moments with the cast.
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Grimlock » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:22 pm

I think not. Even though it has no plot at all, it at least gave some other characters their moment to shine in a decent way, I think it's on par with some sagas that have some plot but ignore the rest of the main cast.

But it is one of the worst sagas in general, probably tying with or being less bad than the retellings.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Lord Frieza » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:28 pm

Asura wrote:And people thought I was joking when I said there are people on this forum who think the Super 17 arc is better than the ToP.

Delusional, if you ask me.
Nothing is worse then the Super 17 Arc. I love vertually everything from Dragon Ball to a greater or lesser digree, arcs, characters, abilities etc. So with a personal bar that low you can see just how awful the S17 arc has to be for me to hate it.
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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by Kataphrut » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:34 pm

Not even close, not when compared to the likes of Garlic Jr, RoF or Super 17. It has some definite issues, especially with the pacing, but just remember most of us never had to watch the Namek saga as it was airing week by week. I think being able to binge it in future will highlight it's strengths better.

Add into the fact that it has some of the best supporting character treatment since the original series (arguably better in some cases), easily the best action and OST in Super, and the ToP arc comes away looking pretty decent.

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by precita » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:00 pm

Garlic Jr. saga wasn't that bad. :lol:

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Re: Is theTOP the worst saga in the db universe?

Post by buutenks » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:22 pm

No way, i love the ToP. It is what u6 should have also been, challenging fighters for uni7. ToP is better than u6 because in u6, only Hit was a threat, tho Magetta was pretty cool. Actually i think the Hit 2 ep mini arc is better than u6 lol.

I would say:

ToP>Black Goku arc>Hit mini arc>U6>BoG arc>RoF arc>Copy arc.

And GT, i think Baby arc rivals the u6 arc, but the last fight of u6 arc is way better than anything seen in the Baby arc. Rest of GT is around RoF level in my eyes, some even going as low as the Copy arc.

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