"Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by FlpShimizu » Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:44 am

I'm used to episodes not being visually consistent since it was already really frequent during DBZ's run, so I consider myself satisfied with scenes looking different as long as they all look good.

That said, I absolutely loved the trailer.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by majinwarman » Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:48 am

FlpShimizu wrote:I'm used to episodes not being visually consistent since it was already really frequent during DBZ's run, so I consider myself satisfied with scenes looking different as long as they all look good.

That said, I absolutely loved the trailer.
I think that they will start fixing up scenes if they look too different.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by jeffbr92 » Sun Jul 22, 2018 12:18 pm

I would love to have a new anime wtih this new movie artstyle
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:01 pm

emperior wrote:I have read some people complain about art inconsistency in the trailer, and while that is a fine complain I am actually happy animators have been given freedom to deviate a little from the models.
We are still getting the minimalistic shading, jet black hair and good colors so the new designs are still being showed. It’s just that the trailer was off-model, but wasn’t the point of this new simpler designs the flexibility they offer to animators?
And didn’t we criticise Yamamuro for his approach to movies, where he was correcting literally everything?
I wouldn’t be opposed to Shintani correcting a lot of drawings here and there to provide more visual consistency, but the approach he is seemingly taking is also fine.
Presumably they're still animating so Shintani may comb over things to make them a little more consistent. Things like that close up shot of SSGSS Goku, I expect will be corrected for the final film.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 14/07]

Post by cuartas » Sun Jul 22, 2018 2:09 pm

JazzMazz wrote:
cuartas wrote:
Hit!! wrote:
Hating for the sake of hating is not "thinking different".
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]

This is not hating for the sake of hating
Funny thing is, that abomination comes after this masterpiece (I assume it's Takahashi):

[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]

And this trailer just shows how the animators are throwing drawings on their own, without a minimal intent of consistency
There is nothing particularly wrong with that SSG shot. Its simply a transformation that has softer linework due to the nature of the transformation making the characters themselves softer. Not sure what your point at the nose for, its a half moon nose, something Tate did a lot on Super. The eye shape is certainly unique to the design on closer inspection, but I don't necessarily see the problem with it, and the softer lines under the eyes, are again, suited to the relaxed nature of the expression.
- The nose is the same we all hated on Yamamuro, the hole instead a nose, now is not bad, how convenient
- You don't see a problem, I do.
- The lines never were that way, not even on shintani SSJG design

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by jjgp1112 » Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:04 pm

emperior wrote:I have read some people complain about art inconsistency in the trailer, and while that is a fine complain I am actually happy animators have been given freedom to deviate a little from the models.
We are still getting the minimalistic shading, jet black hair and good colors so the new designs are still being showed. It’s just that the trailer was off-model, but wasn’t the point of this new simpler designs the flexibility they offer to animators?
And didn’t we criticise Yamamuro for his approach to movies, where he was correcting literally everything?
I wouldn’t be opposed to Shintani correcting a lot of drawings here and there to provide more visual consistency, but the approach he is seemingly taking is also fine.
It's not necessarily wanting everything to look uniform like it was all drawn by one person, but just consistency in all of the basic elements, and that can still be achieved even while retaining every animator's unique idiosyncrasies. Like in the Studio Junio episodes in Dragon Ball/Z, everything's consistent yet I can easily distinguish Takeo Ide and Maski Sato's work. Takeo Ide tends to draw everything very slim and angular, with thinner linework, more expressive animation, big & pointy ears, cartoony mouth movements - watch out for the circular mouths in particular, somewhat sloppy facial features, and huge, detailed teeth:

[spoiler]Image
Image
Image
Image
Image[/spoiler]

And then Masaki Sato's the class show off: super detailed drawings with varied linework, complex shading, and big eyes. Even in the 22nd TB, Piccolo, and 23rd TB arcs his style is easy to pick out as it most closely resembled the eventual "Z Style":
[spoiler]Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image[/spoiler]

But despite these differences, they're still prettyy consistent with each other, whereas Yuya Takahashi's stuff looks like a completely different era surrounded by Shintani's stuff (well, the style is, but you get what I mean :P ). That's fine from episode to episode but in one feature, it's pretty jarring to see a style shift at that level.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by AnimeNation101 » Sun Jul 22, 2018 8:46 pm

jjgp1112 wrote:
emperior wrote:I have read some people complain about art inconsistency in the trailer, and while that is a fine complain I am actually happy animators have been given freedom to deviate a little from the models.
We are still getting the minimalistic shading, jet black hair and good colors so the new designs are still being showed. It’s just that the trailer was off-model, but wasn’t the point of this new simpler designs the flexibility they offer to animators?
And didn’t we criticise Yamamuro for his approach to movies, where he was correcting literally everything?
I wouldn’t be opposed to Shintani correcting a lot of drawings here and there to provide more visual consistency, but the approach he is seemingly taking is also fine.
It's not necessarily wanting everything to look uniform like it was all drawn by one person, but just consistency in all of the basic elements, and that can still be achieved even while retaining every animator's unique idiosyncrasies. Like in the Studio Junio episodes in Dragon Ball/Z, everything's consistent yet I can easily distinguish Takeo Ide and Maski Sato's work. Takeo Ide tends to draw everything very slim and angular, with thinner linework, more expressive animation, big & pointy ears, cartoony mouth movements - watch out for the circular mouths in particular, somewhat sloppy facial features, and huge, detailed teeth:

[spoiler]Image
Image
Image
Image
Image[/spoiler]

And then Masaki Sato's the class show off: super detailed drawings with varied linework, complex shading, and big eyes. Even in the 22nd TB, Piccolo, and 23rd TB arcs his style is easy to pick out as it most closely resembled the eventual "Z Style":
[spoiler]Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image[/spoiler]

But despite these differences, they're still prettyy consistent with each other, whereas Yuya Takahashi's stuff looks like a completely different era surrounded by Shintani's stuff (well, the style is, but you get what I mean :P ). That's fine from episode to episode but in one feature, it's pretty jarring to see a style shift at that level.
Agreed. It kind of ruins the immersion. Like for those people who were watching the trailer and then instantly noticed the brief shift to CG. It just overall feels more put together when everything has consistency. Its funny because Super’s problem was it’s lack consistency in writing but now that i think about it, it kinda had some consistency problems in art aswell.
I called it that Gogeta, Bardock, and something Broly related would be in the movie before it was even announced that it was a Broly movie. 8)

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Bullza » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:59 am

So they're using CGI again from the looks of it but it seems far better than the last two movies. Must have pumped more money into this one.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:23 am

Bullza wrote:So they're using CGI again from the looks of it but it seems far better than the last two movies. Must have pumped more money into this one.
Better sure, but watching it on the TV it sticks out even more and it was only in the trailer for a few seconds, very well could be in the film for a few minutes! That is the only worry I have.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by AnimeNation101 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:03 am

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
Bullza wrote:So they're using CGI again from the looks of it but it seems far better than the last two movies. Must have pumped more money into this one.
Better sure, but watching it on the TV it sticks out even more and it was only in the trailer for a few seconds, very well could be in the film for a few minutes! That is the only worry I have.
It makes me wonder why we even have CG. What’s the point?
I called it that Gogeta, Bardock, and something Broly related would be in the movie before it was even announced that it was a Broly movie. 8)

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:55 am

AnimeNation101 wrote:
Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
Bullza wrote:So they're using CGI again from the looks of it but it seems far better than the last two movies. Must have pumped more money into this one.
Better sure, but watching it on the TV it sticks out even more and it was only in the trailer for a few seconds, very well could be in the film for a few minutes! That is the only worry I have.
It makes me wonder why we even have CG. What’s the point?
CGI can blend extremely well with traditional 2D animation.

It just takes a lot of effort and talent

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by PsionicWarrior » Mon Jul 23, 2018 11:59 am

jeffbr92 wrote:I would love to have a new anime wtih this new movie artstyle
That would be fantastic

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Bullza » Mon Jul 23, 2018 1:25 pm

AnimeNation101 wrote:It makes me wonder why we even have CG. What’s the point?
It might just be easier or maybe the animators just aren't talented enough to do it properly like other movies.

It's not really a big deal.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by bleed0range » Mon Jul 23, 2018 1:36 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
AnimeNation101 wrote:
Baggie_Saiyan wrote: Better sure, but watching it on the TV it sticks out even more and it was only in the trailer for a few seconds, very well could be in the film for a few minutes! That is the only worry I have.
It makes me wonder why we even have CG. What’s the point?
CGI can blend extremely well with traditional 2D animation.

It just takes a lot of effort and talent
To be honest, I think they did a pretty good job this time as it fooled me numerous times watching the trailer until someone else pointed it out. Most of the people who see the movie will never even notice it becaue most people won’t be looking for it or have the knowledge of it like a lot of the hardcore animation fans on Kanzenshuu.

It looks way better than BOG or ROF.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by jjgp1112 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:21 pm

Of all the cuts I've seen so far I definitely like Onishi's the least. The faces just look...off. Especially the eyes and their placement.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by jeffbr92 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:57 pm

So no golden clothes as they turn SSJ right? Damn, I wish they returned with that
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Jackal puFF » Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:01 am

I love that Vegeta will have red hair finally! Looks so good on him.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Amir » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:20 am

I hope Shintani corrects some of Onishi's scenes, his characters looked too young with questionable placements and the bad Yamamuro nose.
Nothing really bad but could be better.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:52 pm

I don't like how they kept the eyes also changing in transformations for Goku. Base and SSG similar eyes yet SS/SSGSS have different but similar eyes to each other so going from Base to SS to SSG to SSGSS we'll have different eye shapes...

This was the one perfect opportunity to a get unified eye shape for Goku.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by emperior » Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:29 pm

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:I don't like how they kept the eyes also changing in transformations for Goku. Base and SSG similar eyes yet SS/SSGSS have different but similar eyes to each other so going from Base to SS to SSG to SSGSS we'll have different eye shapes...

This was the one perfect opportunity to a get unified eye shape for Goku.
Why? It was always like that. SSJ has outlined, aggressive eyes which are shared with Blue. SSG has outlined eyes, but calmer/more relaxed in a shape which fits in the middle between base eyes and SSJ’s.
I prefer this approach, as it makes the transformations a little more unique.
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