"Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by superfan2024 » Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:14 pm

Could Kazuya Karasawa have boarded Base/SSJ Goku vs Broly? @Ajay

The whole scene just really gives me his vibes, especially the first person rotation stuff. Also, both of Onishi's scenes in the Tournament of Power (eps 109 and 117) were episodes under Karasawa's board/direction.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by supersaiyanZero » Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:16 pm

Shaddy wrote:I mean, while making something as constantly fluid as this obviously won't happen, I think in general when Super comes back or it'll compare more favorably on average when compared to this film than Super previously did compared to Battle of Gods and Resurrection F.
I really hope they bring in new writers to go along with the new style. If the writing is still garbage I'll be disappointed..but at least it'll be pretty.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Shaddy » Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:39 pm

I think it's a bit of a disservice to call the anime's writing staff entirely terrible (well, inso far as Dragon Ball has never been amazingly written), rather than they need better communication between their existing writers and more attention payed to past episode's continuity. Super's writing is more inconsistent than outright awful, like they didn't have enough coordination between the staff members. I think they should shift priorities around, make sure to figure out which writers have the best-recieved episodes (Tomiokaaaaaaaaaaa) and stronger directorial vision across the series (read: more Ishitani).

But that's not a discussion for the thread about the animation, so whatever.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by JazzMazz » Wed Dec 19, 2018 8:03 pm

supersaiyanZero wrote:
Shaddy wrote:I mean, while making something as constantly fluid as this obviously won't happen, I think in general when Super comes back or it'll compare more favorably on average when compared to this film than Super previously did compared to Battle of Gods and Resurrection F.
I really hope they bring in new writers to go along with the new style. If the writing is still garbage I'll be disappointed..but at least it'll be pretty.
I think the problem stemmed from the fact there was no really series composer(head writer) for the series that was officially instated. As such, it seemed that a lot of writers were simply going by the seat of the basic outline given to them, which would probably get approved by Toriyama with very little fight back(he was actively checking the scripts based on interviews, but he seemed to give the staff a lot of freedom).

To put this into perspective, even shows that basically were directly adapting from a source material, such as the prior Dragonball anime's, still had series composers to fill and drive the writing of the series outside of the inevitable Toriyama departures. Super's seeming complete lack of one(aside from Toriyama to a limited extent), kind of spoke to the troubled production over the actual skill of the script writers(some of which, who have been extremely successful in the industry).

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Marlowe89 » Thu Dec 20, 2018 4:58 pm

Are there HQ scans of the movie pamphlet floating around by any chance? Would love to get a hold of some of those expression sheets.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by emperior » Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:39 pm

JazzMazz wrote:
supersaiyanZero wrote:
Shaddy wrote:I mean, while making something as constantly fluid as this obviously won't happen, I think in general when Super comes back or it'll compare more favorably on average when compared to this film than Super previously did compared to Battle of Gods and Resurrection F.
I really hope they bring in new writers to go along with the new style. If the writing is still garbage I'll be disappointed..but at least it'll be pretty.
I think the problem stemmed from the fact there was no really series composer(head writer) for the series that was officially instated. As such, it seemed that a lot of writers were simply going by the seat of the basic outline given to them, which would probably get approved by Toriyama with very little fight back(he was actively checking the scripts based on interviews, but he seemed to give the staff a lot of freedom).

To put this into perspective, even shows that basically were directly adapting from a source material, such as the prior Dragonball anime's, still had series composers to fill and drive the writing of the series outside of the inevitable Toriyama departures. Super's seeming complete lack of one(aside from Toriyama to a limited extent), kind of spoke to the troubled production over the actual skill of the script writers(some of which, who have been extremely successful in the industry).
I agree that’s probably the reason why the writing is so inconsistent.
The bad schedule affected the show on every front, not just on the visual side.
If Super comes back on air, a good pre-production and overall better planning be essential to ensure that the show can look consistently good and have the story being consistent.
I think it would be good to give someone capable the head writer role, and also to have better communication with Toriyama with possibly more of his input on dialogues.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by UltraPrimus22 » Sat Dec 22, 2018 7:46 pm

Marlowe89 wrote:Are there HQ scans of the movie pamphlet floating around by any chance? Would love to get a hold of some of those expression sheets.
You're in luck, because Ajay managed to upload most of them on the Broli movie's Sakugabooru page.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Michsi » Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:37 am

mute_proxy wrote:
Michsi wrote: My fear is that this was only meant as a one-time event style-wise and not necessarily a test run to see if audiences would be receptive to this change.
If you think that they're not planning to put out a movie quality anime series, you're not wrong. Adjusting the drawing style on the other hand does not require extra funding.
I was strictly referring to Shintani's style becoming the norm. Of course you can't expect a series to have the same animation quality as a high budget movie. And since no new series has been announced, all we can do is look at promo material to see what they'll be going for: Yamamuro or Shintani.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Marlowe89 » Sun Dec 23, 2018 7:16 pm

UltraPrimus22 wrote:
Marlowe89 wrote:Are there HQ scans of the movie pamphlet floating around by any chance? Would love to get a hold of some of those expression sheets.
You're in luck, because Ajay managed to upload most of them on the Broli movie's Sakugabooru page.
Amazing. Just noticed that he added the rest of them this morning.

Huge thanks to Ajay for doing this.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by majinwarman » Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:31 am

Lord Beerus wrote:Seeing how huge that staff list is, and how much it is mostly composed of in-house talent from Toei, makes me hope that is/when Super 2.0 happens, there will be more animators available to share the load.
With information leaking about how Super 2.0 has been in production since October, I think that we are close to having an official announcement of its return.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Noah » Sat Jan 12, 2019 1:00 pm

You know, I've been thinking with my buttons recently and... What you guys Toei would ever grasp the idea of having DB as a released monthly anime?

Probably never, but I think it could be bring benefits for the animation and also worth to align within the story told on the manga.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by IM21 » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:00 pm

Noah wrote:You know, I've been thinking with my buttons recently and... What you guys Toei would ever grasp the idea of having DB as a released monthly anime?

Probably never, but I think it could be bring benefits for the animation and also worth to align within the story told on the manga.
It would be great if it was a seasonal anime with 20 or 24 episodes a season. The quality of that kind of a DB show would be amazing. Sucks that they'll probably never do it.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Doctor. » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:19 pm

Not the appropriate thread, but I feel it's more likely to get a response here: do we know who did the sound effects for this? Was it Arai?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Koitsukai » Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:33 am

I loved the animation but something bugged me. I'm talking about the art, the style, don't know how to call it. Seeing shirtless Goku, Vegeta and Broly with pretty much no body muscle seemed weird to me, like early DBS episodes. Especially after seeing Broly wear that black shirt that made him look like Mr. Olympia, and the armor looked like it didn't even fit him and he was gonna go through it. I'm in no way a MORE MUSCLE PLEASE guy, but it was really weird, Broly at the end looked thinner than the trucker that crashed on the gas station when Yamcha was fisted by A-20. Broly looked like old Broly throughout the movie but at the end he looked like a regular dude, what was that about?
The fusion part also did look like Goku and Vegeta were drawn in like 5 minutes. Am i the only one that was bugged by this?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Amir » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:01 am

Koitsukai wrote:I loved the animation but something bugged me. I'm talking about the art, the style, don't know how to call it. Seeing shirtless Goku, Vegeta and Broly with pretty much no body muscle seemed weird to me, like early DBS episodes. Especially after seeing Broly wear that black shirt that made him look like Mr. Olympia, and the armor looked like it didn't even fit him and he was gonna go through it. I'm in no way a MORE MUSCLE PLEASE guy, but it was really weird, Broly at the end looked thinner than the trucker that crashed on the gas station when Yamcha was fisted by A-20. Broly looked like old Broly throughout the movie but at the end he looked like a regular dude, what was that about?
The fusion part also did look like Goku and Vegeta were drawn in like 5 minutes. Am i the only one that was bugged by this?

It simply had less lines and shading, but the size and muscular built stayed the same.

However, saying they looked like they were drawn in 5 minutes is a bit preposterous. Less detail does not mean bad art.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by emperior » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:20 am

Koitsukai wrote:I loved the animation but something bugged me. I'm talking about the art, the style, don't know how to call it. Seeing shirtless Goku, Vegeta and Broly with pretty much no body muscle seemed weird to me, like early DBS episodes. Especially after seeing Broly wear that black shirt that made him look like Mr. Olympia, and the armor looked like it didn't even fit him and he was gonna go through it. I'm in no way a MORE MUSCLE PLEASE guy, but it was really weird, Broly at the end looked thinner than the trucker that crashed on the gas station when Yamcha was fisted by A-20. Broly looked like old Broly throughout the movie but at the end he looked like a regular dude, what was that about?
The fusion part also did look like Goku and Vegeta were drawn in like 5 minutes. Am i the only one that was bugged by this?
Yes. The art in those scenes looked good, Broly was big and so were Goku and Vegeta and most importantly things moved well, especially in the fusion part.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Akuma Johnson » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:47 am

Koitsukai wrote:I loved the animation but something bugged me. I'm talking about the art, the style, don't know how to call it. Seeing shirtless Goku, Vegeta and Broly with pretty much no body muscle seemed weird to me, like early DBS episodes. Especially after seeing Broly wear that black shirt that made him look like Mr. Olympia, and the armor looked like it didn't even fit him and he was gonna go through it. I'm in no way a MORE MUSCLE PLEASE guy, but it was really weird, Broly at the end looked thinner than the trucker that crashed on the gas station when Yamcha was fisted by A-20. Broly looked like old Broly throughout the movie but at the end he looked like a regular dude, what was that about?
The fusion part also did look like Goku and Vegeta were drawn in like 5 minutes. Am i the only one that was bugged by this?
That's your problem. The art is fine because it actually allows for character expressions to shine through and through.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by FortuneSSJ » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:30 pm

Koitsukai wrote:I loved the animation but something bugged me. I'm talking about the art, the style, don't know how to call it. Seeing shirtless Goku, Vegeta and Broly with pretty much no body muscle seemed weird to me, like early DBS episodes. Especially after seeing Broly wear that black shirt that made him look like Mr. Olympia, and the armor looked like it didn't even fit him and he was gonna go through it. I'm in no way a MORE MUSCLE PLEASE guy, but it was really weird, Broly at the end looked thinner than the trucker that crashed on the gas station when Yamcha was fisted by A-20. Broly looked like old Broly throughout the movie but at the end he looked like a regular dude, what was that about?
The fusion part also did look like Goku and Vegeta were drawn in like 5 minutes.Am i the only one that was bugged by this?
It's a different approach and it's ok for you to not like it, but you should try to ask that question in a less biased thread.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by Amir » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:41 pm

The thing that bothered me about the art was the somewhat inconsistent changes. Some of Onishi's stuff looked vastly different from EVERYTHING else in the movie, not just Takahashi's parts.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super: Broly" - Animation Hub [Updated: 20/07]

Post by cuartas » Sun Jan 13, 2019 7:11 pm

Watched the movie 2 days ago and It seems like the last 30-40 minutes was divided between Takahashi, Onishi, Tate and Shida.

Takahashi: I really liked it, it was a step up from the anime for sure, I liked the movements, the body poses and camera angles, and of course the incredible detail on the characters while keeping the fluid movement

Onishi: I liked it as well, the art is a let down compared to Takahashi, BUT, the jump on artstyles wasn't that noticeable as I thought except for those long shots, I have to rewatch it when the DVD or something is out to pause it, because at constant movement it wasn't that clear for me.
Other than that, I appreciate that he was the most creative on the fight elements and those new ki moves but I think the animation could be better to represent them.

Tate: Dissapointed, I really didn't see the difference between his section and any other participation he had on DBS, the hand to hand combat style is easily comparable to 17 vs Goku fight, almost like a copy of it, the humorous conversation seemed like the last portion of the filler episode where Goku fought against Hit, I mean, didn't see a boost on quality at all, couldn't tell if he was doing a movie or another DBS episode

Shida: His work oustanding as always but expected more, really, his portion was really confusing to me, I felt like watching a Michael Bay transformers fight where nothing made any sense in about 70% of his work, I couldn't figure out how they were throwing punches or kicks at each other and how they suddenly appeared at opposite sides of the screen, Idk, I think it would be better appreciated at lower speed, that's why I liked Takahashi more, because almost everything made sense on the screen for me and I could follow up the fight.

If I had to decide a ranking it would be Takahashi, Onishi, Shida and Tate.

Overall good movie in terms of animation, definitely way better than the other movies, dissapointed on the fact we couldn't see a bunch of transformations

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