Can Android 21 be our next villain?

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BlueBasilisk
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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by BlueBasilisk » Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:34 am

I'd rather have Good 21 around as a support character than having her back as a villain, I think. Evil 21 didn't do much for me as a big bad even in FighterZ.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Doctor. » Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:42 am

A21Fan wrote:
Doctor. wrote:God, no. Her entire character is shameless otaku pandering. There are good concepts that could be developed well but I'm sick of Earth-based villains at this point.
I can understand the first part but whats the problem with earth based villains?

Its unrealistic that there is forever peace on that planet, i wouldnt like that.

Lets make the Dragonballs important again and show what damage they can cause ... i can think of multiple wishes which can cause severe damage to our "heroes" and the whole universe.
It means it's counter-intuitive to keep opening up the scope of the series so much only to go back and focus on Earth. Z already made the same mistake when switching from the Freeza, an extraterrestrial threat on another planet, to Cell.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by PFM18 » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:01 pm

Doctor. wrote:
A21Fan wrote:
Doctor. wrote:God, no. Her entire character is shameless otaku pandering. There are good concepts that could be developed well but I'm sick of Earth-based villains at this point.
I can understand the first part but whats the problem with earth based villains?

Its unrealistic that there is forever peace on that planet, i wouldnt like that.

Lets make the Dragonballs important again and show what damage they can cause ... i can think of multiple wishes which can cause severe damage to our "heroes" and the whole universe.
It means it's counter-intuitive to keep opening up the scope of the series so much only to go back and focus on Earth. Z already made the same mistake when switching from the Freeza, an extraterrestrial threat on another planet, to Cell.
How is that a mistake? Once you leave to space you can't ever have an enemy on Earth?

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:17 pm

Please no. Making video game characters canon is something I've always been against.
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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by BrolyKale » Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:15 pm

Personally, I wouldn't mind, as long as it's entertaining and fun to watch. But I'd prefer we focus more on the demons now, especially Makaioshins... we haven't seen any Makaioshin, it'd be interesting if we could see one of them after the new movie.
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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Tai Lung » Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:22 pm

I really do not think that 21 is the right one to have the role of the main villain, maybe as an assistant to some antagonist, it's as if Harley Quinn is a main villain, Biting' off more than you can chew

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Doctor. » Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:29 pm

PFM18 wrote:
Doctor. wrote:
A21Fan wrote:
I can understand the first part but whats the problem with earth based villains?

Its unrealistic that there is forever peace on that planet, i wouldnt like that.

Lets make the Dragonballs important again and show what damage they can cause ... i can think of multiple wishes which can cause severe damage to our "heroes" and the whole universe.
It means it's counter-intuitive to keep opening up the scope of the series so much only to go back and focus on Earth. Z already made the same mistake when switching from the Freeza, an extraterrestrial threat on another planet, to Cell.
How is that a mistake? Once you leave to space you can't ever have an enemy on Earth?
It narrows the scope of the series and it just feels out of place, especially when the arc is sandwiched between two arcs that actually are larger in scale.

The series has long moved past Earth. Obviously an enemy can originate there, but if the entire threat stays confined to Earth, then it's not at all impactful.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Lord Beerus » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:56 am

No thanks. Keep the videogames characters in videogames.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Kurakaio » Sat Oct 20, 2018 1:42 pm

They would have to change the way they do it. Such a shame getting rid of the whole linking thing. I also think they shouldn't bring back 16, just because people would complain about it.

The arc would be a good opportunity to let some other characters get some shine.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Nokra » Sat Oct 20, 2018 1:53 pm

An arc involving Android 21 wouldn't work in anime format tbh. Even in DBFZ the story was pretty subpar since most of what you were doing was just killing generic clones of the super warriors. Plus they would have to bring back all of the old villains like cell, ginyu force, nappa and we already know how much people hate seeing old characters coming back. The only villain you'd be left with is 21 herself and I don't think she's strong enough (character or power wise) to be the main antagonist of an entire arc. Plus her reason for existing (wanting to eat people) is weak and wouldn't be a compelling enough story for an anime arc. So how about just keep her in the video games and away from the main series.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by A21Fan » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:57 pm

Doctor. wrote:
PFM18 wrote:
Doctor. wrote:
It means it's counter-intuitive to keep opening up the scope of the series so much only to go back and focus on Earth. Z already made the same mistake when switching from the Freeza, an extraterrestrial threat on another planet, to Cell.
How is that a mistake? Once you leave to space you can't ever have an enemy on Earth?
It narrows the scope of the series and it just feels out of place, especially when the arc is sandwiched between two arcs that actually are larger in scale.

The series has long moved past Earth. Obviously an enemy can originate there, but if the entire threat stays confined to Earth, then it's not at all impactful.
Yeah i know what you mean.

The next arc could be Planet Sadala after the Broly movie.
They could introduce one new villain from earth while Vegeta and Goku are in Universe 6. (Like: One evil man / women who manipulates people or can shapeshift ... thanks to the Dragonballs)

That way the others could also have their time to shine. (Yamcha, Krillin, Tien, Piccolo, Gohan etc ...)
Let the story end in either a good or a bad way.

Switching back and forth between both Universe 6 And 7 might be a bit annoying but i think it would be interesting to see how the earthlings would handle their own without the all powerful warriors.

And when both return, a multiversal threat arc should be the next thing. (Demon Realm ... or what else?)

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by sunsetshimmer » Sat Oct 20, 2018 5:02 pm

I can't believe that after having only one new villain in 131 episodes + movie some people actually would like Android 21 to show up next :crazy:
How about coming with...NEW VILLAIN?
"I will concede that your feelings are worthy of the mightiest of Saiyans. However, there is more to my power than just this. Before you die, I will show it to you. This is the difference in power, between the primitive Saiyans and the evolved Tsufruians." ~Baby Vegeta

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by zarmack » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:55 pm

Nokra wrote:An arc involving Android 21 wouldn't work in anime format tbh. Even in DBFZ the story was pretty subpar since most of what you were doing was just killing generic clones of the super warriors. Plus they would have to bring back all of the old villains like cell, ginyu force, nappa and we already know how much people hate seeing old characters coming back. The only villain you'd be left with is 21 herself and I don't think she's strong enough (character or power wise) to be the main antagonist of an entire arc. Plus her reason for existing (wanting to eat people) is weak and wouldn't be a compelling enough story for an anime arc. So how about just keep her in the video games and away from the main series.
Evil 21's motivations isn't any different from Cell's and Buu's. Plus, you can always just rewrite her character motivation's like they are doing with Broly. The sub-plot of her reviving old villains could be removed, and there's plenty of ways narrative wise to make her strong enough to be a threat to Goku & Vegeta (like revealing that she has Beerus & Whis's DNA in addition the Z-fighters, Freeza, Cell and Buu).

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by zarmack » Sun Oct 21, 2018 8:58 pm

BlueBasilisk wrote:I'd rather have Good 21 around as a support character than having her back as a villain, I think. Evil 21 didn't do much for me as a big bad even in FighterZ.
Yeah. They could introduce Good 21 as a new Z-fighter, while only having her evil side temporarily take control whenever she gets enraged.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Toxin45 » Mon Oct 22, 2018 11:13 am

sunsetshimmer wrote:I can't believe that after having only one new villain in 131 episodes + movie some people actually would like Android 21 to show up next :crazy:
How about coming with...NEW VILLAIN?
Will you stop winning about new villains? What are your ideas of new villains? Zamasu being a new villain was recycled from fan fiction so what new original villain you want?

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by sunsetshimmer » Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:20 pm

Toxin45 wrote:
sunsetshimmer wrote:I can't believe that after having only one new villain in 131 episodes + movie some people actually would like Android 21 to show up next :crazy:
How about coming with...NEW VILLAIN?
Will you stop winning about new villains? What are your ideas of new villains? Zamasu being a new villain was recycled from fan fiction so what new original villain you want?
I don't like Zamasu at all and he was in fact mostly a mix of already used concepts. But he was still new villain that was never seen before Super. Not the most original one, but still new.
They can come with new villains for games, like Towa, #21, Demigra, Cumber so i don't see a single reason to not make a new villain for main series like Super.
Fans were thinking that Yamoshi is the villain for new DBS movie. But no. Of course it had to be Broly.
I don't expect new villain to be very original, or even very good, but let it be completely new character. Not someone that appeared in previous series or damn games or is total ripoff like Kale's transformation. Is it so wrong to have even minimal requirements and expectations for DB?
"I will concede that your feelings are worthy of the mightiest of Saiyans. However, there is more to my power than just this. Before you die, I will show it to you. This is the difference in power, between the primitive Saiyans and the evolved Tsufruians." ~Baby Vegeta

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by A21Fan » Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:17 pm

zarmack wrote:
BlueBasilisk wrote:I'd rather have Good 21 around as a support character than having her back as a villain, I think. Evil 21 didn't do much for me as a big bad even in FighterZ.
Yeah. They could introduce Good 21 as a new Z-fighter, while only having her evil side temporarily take control whenever she gets enraged.

Like Launch but with more personality switches without splitting into 2 beings.

That could be an interesting way to introduce her. :thumbup:

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by zarmack » Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:19 pm

sunsetshimmer wrote:
Toxin45 wrote:
sunsetshimmer wrote:I can't believe that after having only one new villain in 131 episodes + movie some people actually would like Android 21 to show up next :crazy:
How about coming with...NEW VILLAIN?
Will you stop winning about new villains? What are your ideas of new villains? Zamasu being a new villain was recycled from fan fiction so what new original villain you want?
I don't like Zamasu at all and he was in fact mostly a mix of already used concepts. But he was still new villain that was never seen before Super. Not the most original one, but still new.
They can come with new villains for games, like Towa, #21, Demigra, Cumber so i don't see a single reason to not make a new villain for main series like Super.
Fans were thinking that Yamoshi is the villain for new DBS movie. But no. Of course it had to be Broly.
I don't expect new villain to be very original, or even very good, but let it be completely new character. Not someone that appeared in previous series or damn games or is total ripoff like Kale's transformation. Is it so wrong to have even minimal requirements and expectations for DB?
Yamoshi being the villain of the new DB movie is a stupid idea, since the lore already made it clear that he is a good guy.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Lukmendes » Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:14 pm

It could work, execution is more important than the originality of a character, as we can clearly see with Boo working well despite being almost a Cell rip off in some ways (Some character's creation with really strong regeneration and powers up by absorving people), or Baby and Black (Steal someone's body, hates certain kinds of people with a passion), so again, execution matters more.

Though to better fit anime/manga setting some changes would need to be made on the story, like resurrecting villains, completely unnecessary, they don't even do much in DBFZ itself, and the Freeza route is just padding for the Androids route, so just dealing with her, the clones and the waves would be enough, though honestly the clones having no personality is rather lame so something could be done about that.

So again, just use her potential at least well and it'll work, that's all it really needs.

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Re: Can Android 21 be our next villain?

Post by Tai Lung » Sat Oct 27, 2018 11:06 pm

Toxin45 wrote: Will you stop winning about new villains? What are your ideas of new villains? Zamasu being a new villain was recycled from fan fiction so what new original villain you want?
zamasu was the author's idea lol, which as such has more objectives and motivations than the previous ones ...
in any case zamasu is from the universe 10 if one is going to look for new villains, it would be betterif they come from other universes taking advantage of the others that have been seen

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