How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

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How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by AvatarReiko » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:22 pm

Just wondering how strong his base and SSJ forms? Are they relative to Goku and Vegeta's blue forms or would he need to go SSJB to surpass them? Gogeta is the fusion of Goku and Vegeta, so logically his power should be their total power(plus some unknown multiplier). He should be stronger than their blue forms, no?

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by Hugo Boss » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:48 am

Not necessarily. The Fusion just needs to be stronger than the level they were when performing the poses. For what can be inferred from the movie, SS Gogeta is significantly stronger than SSB, so it could be inferred that Base Gogeta is stronger than SSG.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by Desassina » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:05 am

I'm not a candidate to discuss this because I haven't seen the movie, but animated fights aren't usually a good measure due to many moves without meaning - the manga has only a few panels to depict the flow of battle -, so we have to pick at the general idea of it and Gogeta is supposed to do well against Broly. In base before he transforms into SSJ to charge at him and in SSJB to make the fight one sided against his full power (as spoiled by a few reviews). What that means is that green is supposed to be less than blue (akin to the color spectrum), and since it was more or less even with SSJ that it took them to another dimension (again as spoiled by reviews), base Gogeta is not higher than SSJB Goku having a slight advantage that Broly's massive attack didn't beat him (the last spoilers). Broly's simply the fusion equal in this movie. Transformations made the difference. There's also fusion as depicted in other Dragon Ball media.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by MKCSTEALTH » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:26 am

Well, if we look at the supposed scaling of the movie:

Base Broly starts beneath Base/SSJ Vegeta
Gets amp, is able to fight on par with Goku and Vegeta in God
Then continues to hold his own against Blue Goku and Vegeta
Frieza does the thing, goes Super Saiyan. Now Goku and Vegeta feel they need to fuse
Enter Gogeta, as SSJ stomping SSJ Broly

So I would figure Base Gogeta should be relativistic to at least a tired out Blue Goku and Vegeta. Now if we were talking full power, from the start of battle, that might be closer to SSJ Gogeta

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Thu Jan 17, 2019 6:35 am

From a guy who saw the movie (me), I can tell you that fusion danice has probably been retcon to be insanely strong (hence the potara=Dance magazine).

Base Gogeta effortlessly dodge a danmaku like barrage of brolys ki blast effortlessly, as well as deflect 3 of them with equal effort. Ssj gogeta was quite a bit above ssj broly, even after powering up after gogeta danmaku'ed his ass. Lssj was needed to overwhelm ssj gogeta.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by Galan007 » Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:02 am

Imo,
SSB Gogeta >>> FPSSJ Broly > SSJ Gogeta >>> base Gogeta ~/> SSJ Broly >>> SSB Goku/Vegeta(individually.)

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by Dragon Wukong » Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:33 pm

From what I saw in the movie, SS Broly = SS Gogeta more or less, while Base did somewhat alright holding its own vs SS Broly, so I'd say base Gogeta > SSB Goku & SSB Vegeta. I'm not too surprised, since base Vegito in the manga damaged Zamasu, who was SSB tier.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by LimitbreakerKrillin » Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:34 pm

IMO SSJ Gogeta and SSJ Broly are pretty equal in terms of power. So I say that Base Gogeta is pretty much on par with Broly (wrathful) if we still go by SSJ is a x50 multiplyer.
Though SSB Gogeta is clearly above FPSSJ Broly

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PFM18 » Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:46 pm

LimitbreakerKrillin wrote:IMO SSJ Gogeta and SSJ Broly are pretty equal in terms of power. So I say that Base Gogeta is pretty much on par with Broly (wrathful) if we still go by SSJ is a x50 multiplyer.
Though SSB Gogeta is clearly above FPSSJ Broly
Base Broly /=/ Wrathful/Ikari Broly. By the end of the movie, Base Broly~Base Gogeta>SSB Goku/Vegeta. Broly's power grew by an obscene amount during this movie to the point of his Base pretty much has to be stronger than SSB Goku/Vegeta and his Ikari form is much stronger than that.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by dragon boss z » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:49 pm

From what I remember base Gogeta seemed around SSB level, and as a ssj he is quite a bit above that, being stronger than the ssj Broly that was beating SSB Goku and Vegeta, but weaker than full power ssj Broly.
PFM18 wrote:
LimitbreakerKrillin wrote:IMO SSJ Gogeta and SSJ Broly are pretty equal in terms of power. So I say that Base Gogeta is pretty much on par with Broly (wrathful) if we still go by SSJ is a x50 multiplyer.
Though SSB Gogeta is clearly above FPSSJ Broly
Base Broly /=/ Wrathful/Ikari Broly. By the end of the movie, Base Broly~Base Gogeta>SSB Goku/Vegeta. Broly's power grew by an obscene amount during this movie to the point of his Base pretty much has to be stronger than SSB Goku/Vegeta and his Ikari form is much stronger than that.

I disagree. Just becaues his ssj power was increasing doesn't mean his other forms were. His base form was only ever around ssj Vegeta level, then he went Ikari mode, which got beat by SSB Goku.
So by the end of the movie I would say base Broly<SSG Goku/Vegeta<Ikari Broly<=SSB Goku/Vegeta<<ssj Broly<<full power ssj Broly

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PFM18 » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:14 pm

dragon boss z wrote:Just becaues his ssj power was increasing doesn't mean his other forms were.
Actually that's exactly what that means. If one of your forms increases, then so do the rest, because their power are a function of each other. One is just giving another multiplier to your baseline value than another.
His base form was only ever around ssj Vegeta level, then he went Ikari mode, which got beat by SSB Goku.
So by the end of the movie I would say base Broly<SSG Goku/Vegeta<Ikari Broly<=SSB Goku/Vegeta<<ssj Broly<<full power ssj Broly
You just said Base Gogeta was around SSB Goku/Vegeta level did you not? We saw that SSJ Broly~SSJ Gogeta if not Gogeta having a decent edge, so by extension, Base Broly~Base Gogeta is also true. SSJ Gogeta and SSJ Broly were fighting at least relative to one another. And SSJ Broly vs Goku/Vegeta is much weaker than the one Gogeta fought because his power had been growing in that hour in between.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:28 pm

I'd say that Gogeta is equal to Broly in terms of raw strength in the same general forms. The Ikari base was as strong as SSB, so base Gogeta might as well be as strong as SSB.

The 2 were then shown to be equal in strength as Super Saiyans, though Gogeta had his wits about him and properly fight like a martial artist, meaning he always had the edge.

Actually, thinking about it, it could be that a perfect Fusion, where through Potara Earrings or Metamoran Dance Fusion, will have strength equal to the highest level of naturally achievable form by the 2 fusees. In the case of Goku and Vegeta, this is SSB.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by dragon boss z » Sun Jan 20, 2019 1:31 am

PFM18 wrote: Actually that's exactly what that means. If one of your forms increases, then so do the rest, because their power are a function of each other. One is just giving another multiplier to your baseline value than another.
No, because it wasn't just regular ssj, it was getting buffer and buffer, it's like saying Trunk's base got stronger when he went grade 3. Plus Broly clearly works different than other saiyans.
You just said Base Gogeta was around SSB Goku/Vegeta level did you not? We saw that SSJ Broly~SSJ Gogeta if not Gogeta having a decent edge, so by extension, Base Broly~Base Gogeta is also true. SSJ Gogeta and SSJ Broly were fighting at least relative to one another. And SSJ Broly vs Goku/Vegeta is much weaker than the one Gogeta fought because his power had been growing in that hour in between.
I don't think Broly or fussions follow regular multipliers. Heck even Goku and Vegeta seem to not to, considering base Goku fought a Broly who was stronger than SSG Vegeta and was doing fine. If I remember correctly you think SSG is like thousands of times stronger than base, so Goku shouldn't have been able to do anything, yet he was matching punches with him. Each form only seemed to give him a slight boost.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by TheOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:21 am

As strong as the plot requires.

Sounds like a dumb answer, but it’s true. 3 arcs from now, Jiren will probably be getting knocked out in 1 hit.
How i predict the tournament will end:

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by GodVegetto91 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:46 am

Yes. Base Gogeta is stronger than SSJ Blue Goku or Vegeta individually. As clearly demonstrated when he easily deflected SSJ Broly’s blasts. He avoided them easily aswell.

So here are my numbers:

SSJ Blue Goku and Ikari Broly: 1.

SSJ Broly: 50.

Base Gogeta: 20.

(SSJB Goku + SSJB Vegeta x 10 = Base Gogeta)
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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 9:57 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:Yes. Base Gogeta is stronger than SSJ Blue Goku or Vegeta individually. As clearly demonstrated when he easily deflected SSJ Broly’s blasts. He avoided them easily aswell.

So here are my numbers:

SSJ Blue Goku and Ikari Broly: 1.

SSJ Broly: 50.

Base Gogeta: 20.

(SSJB Goku + SSJB Vegeta x 10 = Base Gogeta)
I dunno, SS Gogeta seemed to be relatively even with SS Ikari Broly in terms of raw power, it's just that he wasn't mindless and actually had a handle on his martial arts skills. Plus, SSB Goku was also able to deflect SS Ikari Broly's blasts as well. Placing base Gogeta as exactly as strong as SSB Goku/Vegeta seems like the most sensible and least toe-stepping conclusion to make.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by GodVegetto91 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:12 am

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote:Yes. Base Gogeta is stronger than SSJ Blue Goku or Vegeta individually. As clearly demonstrated when he easily deflected SSJ Broly’s blasts. He avoided them easily aswell.

So here are my numbers:

SSJ Blue Goku and Ikari Broly: 1.

SSJ Broly: 50.

Base Gogeta: 20.

(SSJB Goku + SSJB Vegeta x 10 = Base Gogeta)
I dunno, SS Gogeta seemed to be relatively even with SS Ikari Broly in terms of raw power, it's just that he wasn't mindless and actually had a handle on his martial arts skills. Plus, SSB Goku was also able to deflect SS Ikari Broly's blasts as well. Placing base Gogeta as exactly as strong as SSB Goku/Vegeta seems like the most sensible and least toe-stepping conclusion to make.
No he should at least be stronger. That’s the whole purpose of fusion. And his feats and performance alone already proves that. These numbers are fine. SSJ Gogeta was actually dominating SSJ Broly if you pay close enough attention to the movie.
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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:39 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote:Yes. Base Gogeta is stronger than SSJ Blue Goku or Vegeta individually. As clearly demonstrated when he easily deflected SSJ Broly’s blasts. He avoided them easily aswell.

So here are my numbers:

SSJ Blue Goku and Ikari Broly: 1.

SSJ Broly: 50.

Base Gogeta: 20.

(SSJB Goku + SSJB Vegeta x 10 = Base Gogeta)
I dunno, SS Gogeta seemed to be relatively even with SS Ikari Broly in terms of raw power, it's just that he wasn't mindless and actually had a handle on his martial arts skills. Plus, SSB Goku was also able to deflect SS Ikari Broly's blasts as well. Placing base Gogeta as exactly as strong as SSB Goku/Vegeta seems like the most sensible and least toe-stepping conclusion to make.
No he should at least be stronger. That’s the whole purpose of fusion. And his feats and performance alone already proves that. These numbers are fine. SSJ Gogeta was actually dominating SSJ Broly if you pay close enough attention to the movie.
I was paying attention, and it still seems more like a skill-based match where Gogeta had the exact same kind of raw power AND his wits and combat effectiveness to boot to me personally.

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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by GodVegetto91 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 10:52 am

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote:
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote: I dunno, SS Gogeta seemed to be relatively even with SS Ikari Broly in terms of raw power, it's just that he wasn't mindless and actually had a handle on his martial arts skills. Plus, SSB Goku was also able to deflect SS Ikari Broly's blasts as well. Placing base Gogeta as exactly as strong as SSB Goku/Vegeta seems like the most sensible and least toe-stepping conclusion to make.
No he should at least be stronger. That’s the whole purpose of fusion. And his feats and performance alone already proves that. These numbers are fine. SSJ Gogeta was actually dominating SSJ Broly if you pay close enough attention to the movie.
I was paying attention, and it still seems more like a skill-based match where Gogeta had the exact same kind of raw power AND his wits and combat effectiveness to boot to me personally.
When a Saiyan unlocks Super Saiyan for the first time, it’s a 50 times multiplier. So SSJ Broly should be 50 times Ikari Broly, which was the form he was in when he transformed into a Super Saiyan. I see no problem with Base Gogeta being at least 20 times as strong as SSJ Blue Goku/Ikari Broly who were about equal.
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Re: How strong is DBS Gogeta's base and SSJ forms?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:24 am

GodVegetto91 wrote:
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
GodVegetto91 wrote: No he should at least be stronger. That’s the whole purpose of fusion. And his feats and performance alone already proves that. These numbers are fine. SSJ Gogeta was actually dominating SSJ Broly if you pay close enough attention to the movie.
I was paying attention, and it still seems more like a skill-based match where Gogeta had the exact same kind of raw power AND his wits and combat effectiveness to boot to me personally.
When a Saiyan unlocks Super Saiyan for the first time, it’s a 50 times multiplier. So SSJ Broly should be 50 times Ikari Broly, which was the form he was in when he transformed into a Super Saiyan. I see no problem with Base Gogeta being at least 20 times as strong as SSJ Blue Goku/Ikari Broly who were about equal.
I do, since at no point do I think that Gogeta eclipsed Broly's power by a factor of 2.5 times when the 2 of them were Super Saiyans.

If SS Ikari Broly were really that much weaker than SS Gogeta, than when he became 10 times stronger by gaining another Great Ape boost in SS, Gogeta shouldn't have needed SSB; he could've gotten the job done with SSG in that case and still held a clear power advantage.

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