"Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - (Non) Announcement & Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Shaddy » Thu Jan 24, 2019 1:45 am

PFM18 wrote: No, it was explicitly Toriyama's script turned into a storyboard. The storyboard of Toriyama's script was 3 hours long. So yeah, it was Toei's "fleshed out" only in the sense that they storyboarded it, but that's not really what "fleshed out" normally refers to.
Parts of Toriyama's scripts for the movies (and even MORE of his notes for Super) just say "they fight", and those get expanded into potentially multiple episodes-long encounters. It's entirely possible this went the same way. We can't prove anything when we don't have the facts of what that content is, and that still doesn't mean it was wrong to cut it. A storyboard can contain tons of content not present in the script, and given the fast and loose way Toriyama writes these days, it is a huge mistake to assume it's all from him, and an even bigger mistake to assume it needs to be animated when we don't even know what it is.
PFM18 wrote: I don't see how expansion of an already good story can be a bad thing. The additions story wise don't have to be "amazingly poignant" in order to make a retelling worth it, only reason not to is impatience, really. The continuity with the anime, the pacing, and the incorporation of the other half of Toriyama's script makes a retelling more than worthwhile in and of itself, regardless of whether or not what was left out is some groundbreaking information.
Have you not heard of a thing called "bloat"? This is the entire reason Z used to be such a pain to watch. It still is the reason One Piece is a pain to watch. Bolstering a story with unnecessary asides and additions while keeping things in the same place narratively can cheapen what is seen and bore the audience in some cases. Hell, Super's version of Battle of Gods did exactly that (RoF was more of a general trainwreck, but it also was this). Besides the fact that there isn't necessarily another """half""" to Toriyama's script, the movie already inflated it's second half with constant action to the point of tiring out the viewers. The last thing we need in the series is more filler, and I guarantee that if there's not a ton to add from the film itself, Toei would either add more fighting without any real purpose, or meaningless asides that add as little as Chi-Chi and Yajirobe trying to fly to Namek. That's basically all they ever added before.
PFM18 wrote: The biggest problems were the pacing and the tension which both could easily be fixed in a retelling, and to some extent are intertwined with each other.
The biggest problems related to thematic storytelling, character interactions and tonal consistency. Toriyama was rarely ever good at those and I don't think Toei's staff have ever been. Unless you get an actually good writer to remake the whole thing themselves beforehand (something alien to this series, really), I have zero belief that the story's gonna get any better. Quality over quantity.

The things you previously suggested also don't help either the pacing or the tension.
PFM18 wrote: What I have been saying is that irrespective of how significant these Toriyama writing elements are, a retelling would be worth it. The story can only benefit from being expanded upon, and there's a plethora of scenes that are in desperate need of more time given how clearly rushed they were.
It cannot "only benefit" from being made longer and slower. Nine times out of ten Dragon Ball has always been completely ruined by the anime forcing unnecessary bullshit into it's adaptations to the point of boring the viewer to death.

PFM18 wrote:Bardock's rebellion for example, was obviously cut considering he randomly has damage on himself and his little "struggle" was extremely brief and insignificant.
You don't know that. You may feel like it was cut, but that does not actually mean it was cut, and it doesn't mean there's anything there that would actually make a meaningful addition to the story. Again, Bardock already sucked in Minus, seeing them try to force this not-Bardock into the original Bardock's scenes would only make the original versions of those scenes worse, which it did in the case of the rebellion we did see.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Spencer_23 » Thu Jan 24, 2019 3:10 am

Torturephile wrote:Two things that I hope for it: that it keeps the art style from Broly, and that it also retells said movie. They have extra material to add to it given Toriyama's long script wasn't fully utilized in the movie, more or less what they did at times with the Battle of Gods saga taking after deleted scenes from its movie counterpart in the original Super.

I agree I’d especially like them to expand on the backstory stuff with Bardock. Could have some really good material. Granted if it’s just going to be half assed I’d rather them just move passed the movie

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by mahakaishin1991 » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:02 am

Big Black Saiyan wrote:Here’s round two. Let’s hope it has a better start than super originally did . :thumbup:
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:45 am

I’m on the no-retelling boat. It makes no sense to expand upon the movie just to include... what? A longer fighter between Goku + Vegeta against Broly? They could have cut a few minutes of the stupidly long fight between Gogeta and Broly if they wanted that fight to be longer. Bardock’s rebellion? Hell yeah I want to see it, but would I want to sit through weeks of the same content the movie already told well, with worse animation and direction and possibly some stupid fan service thrown into the mix by Toei, just to see a rebellion I already saw plenty of times in the last 15 years or so?

The rebellion could easily fit into an extended version of the movie, which both BoG and RoF received, so I don’t see why Broly shouldn’t. Or they could put it in a new TV special about Bardock to show his battles, how he met Gine, how he got more and more suspicious about Freeza by the years. They could also incorporate a few elements from the special.
This way they could also show more of Saiyan culture, and Bardock being a low class warrior it’s quite probable that as a kid he was sent to another Planet to conquer it, so it could also be an occasion to finally show us a Saiyan kid conquering a planet through deception because of their looks etcetera.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by MCDaveG » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:03 am

So it was a HOAX after all :roll: :x
No DB Super any time soon.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by JazzMazz » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:13 am

MCDaveG wrote:So it was a HOAX after all :roll: :x
No DB Super any time soon.
Yes, we’re just selling these hypothetical episodes, nothing to see here. :lol:
Last edited by JazzMazz on Thu Jan 24, 2019 7:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Michsi » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:17 am

It's not a hoax. For now it's seen just as leaked information from an exclusive industry event that wasn't mean for the general public. If they're selling licencing rights for new episodes it's natural to assume that those episodes already exist or are currently in production.
Edit: too late!

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Kanassa » Thu Jan 24, 2019 7:48 am

Shaddy wrote:
PFM18 wrote:Bardock's rebellion for example, was obviously cut considering he randomly has damage on himself and his little "struggle" was extremely brief and insignificant.
You don't know that. You may feel like it was cut, but that does not actually mean it was cut, and it doesn't mean there's anything there that would actually make a meaningful addition to the story.
Hell, in this situation, I'd say that the flow of the story would be better if Bardock's involvement was mostly cut.
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by MKCSTEALTH » Thu Jan 24, 2019 9:39 am

So I just had this thought and I hope I'm not correct...

But is it possible this event mistook Super Dragonball Heroes for Dragonball Super? I do feel Toeis response is damage control, but also feel playing devil's advocate and saying it could be legitimate

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Fizzer » Thu Jan 24, 2019 10:12 am

Given how Super got off to such a bad start, suffering poor reviews which marred its reputation for long afterwards, largely due to half a year of retreading old material, I'd very much like to avoid the same mistake being made again, especially since Broly had such spectacular animation that the series can't hope to match.

Maybe they'll find a way to somehow do it better than before and it'll go well, but it's really hard to build hype and relaunch a series when fans have already seen the content.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by MCDaveG » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:14 pm

JazzMazz wrote:
MCDaveG wrote:So it was a HOAX after all :roll: :x
No DB Super any time soon.
Yes, we’re just selling these hypothetical episodes, nothing to see here. :lol:
I don’t know, if you follow the news, but ot was denied by TOEI themselves.
So what episodes are you talking about exactly? Those that TOEI doesn’t even plan to animate?
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Shaddy » Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:34 pm

He's saying Toei is lying to us as damage control because they didn't plan for Super 2.0 to be announced yet. This is incredibly common and taking their statements as face value is foolish when we knew the series existed before this licencor's thing even happened.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by The gr » Thu Jan 24, 2019 5:10 pm

I want another awesome intro like Limit break X survivor.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by PremiumSalt » Thu Jan 24, 2019 6:30 pm

Honestly, regardless of what Toei says or what the initial announcement says or whatever, the fact is that there is literally no way new episodes of Super won't be produced. The DBS brand is absurdly profitable, not a single higher up at Shueisha/Toei is sitting around going "Yeah, you know what, let's not make more money".
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by JazzMazz » Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:39 am

MCDaveG wrote:
JazzMazz wrote:
MCDaveG wrote:So it was a HOAX after all :roll: :x
No DB Super any time soon.
Yes, we’re just selling these hypothetical episodes, nothing to see here. :lol:
I don’t know, if you follow the news, but ot was denied by TOEI themselves.
So what episodes are you talking about exactly? Those that TOEI doesn’t even plan to animate?
So why were they selling episodes to licensors? :lol:

Anyway, this was the same way people discovered the existence of Kai from what I’ve heard, and this sort of thing isn’t uncommon in the industry, the anime FMA was discovered to be green lit early, and despite it being denied by the studio, it was announced a month later.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:46 pm

PremiumSalt wrote:Honestly, regardless of what Toei says or what the initial announcement says or whatever, the fact is that there is literally no way new episodes of Super won't be produced. The DBS brand is absurdly profitable, not a single higher up at Shueisha/Toei is sitting around going "Yeah, you know what, let's not make more money".
That’s what I have been saying too. We have to analyse this from a business standpoint: they will want to keep the momentum from the movie high to ensure the brand continues to profit even more.
In order to do so, they will want the show to be aired as soon as possible, which is why I’m quite sure Super will return in April. As for the announcement, now that the movie has aired everywhere the new show may be announced anytime.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:41 pm

emperior wrote:
PremiumSalt wrote:Honestly, regardless of what Toei says or what the initial announcement says or whatever, the fact is that there is literally no way new episodes of Super won't be produced. The DBS brand is absurdly profitable, not a single higher up at Shueisha/Toei is sitting around going "Yeah, you know what, let's not make more money".
That’s what I have been saying too. We have to analyse this from a business standpoint: they will want to keep the momentum from the movie high to ensure the brand continues to profit even more.
In order to do so, they will want the show to be aired as soon as possible, which is why I’m quite sure Super will return in April. As for the announcement, now that the movie has aired everywhere the new show may be announced anytime.
I don't think it's happening any earlier than July, for several reasons:

1. They are using the Post Movie gap (Feb - June) to finish ToP marketing, now when it came to DBS in 2017 when they bothered to actually market the show properly with frequent releases of merchandise they had to sacrifice the Champa arc because the U.S arc was about to start. Now if the show returns in April it doesn't make sense why they'd concentrate on marketing things that might not be relevant anymore ie Evolution Vegeta & UI "Omen" Goku. The finishing of ToP stuff goes on through to June, to me it doesn't make sense for them to do that if the show has returned in April.

2. There is now new found emphasis on overseas and many countries I am sure haven't finished DBS 1.0 yet so July would also be a good buffer and allow better chance of simultaneous airings.

3. July allows time for things to breathe. We just had a massive event movie that was no doubt propelled due to no new weekly content on the air, and so a summer return for DBS allows folks to digest the movie and get their tastebuds tingling again, Toei can then slowly build up hype again for a new series. This would also allow the movie to make as much as it can with no focus anywhere but on that, especially for home video. Perhaps big of all doesn't overwhelm people with too much content.

4. Potential retelling. If the show has a retelling of Broly then April definitely feels too soon, ResF at least had the benefit of BoG being told first with Broly taking place almost immediately after the ToP there wouldn't be much buffer time for it. After 7/8 months people may also be more open to a retelling.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Fri Jan 25, 2019 3:15 pm

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
emperior wrote:
PremiumSalt wrote:Honestly, regardless of what Toei says or what the initial announcement says or whatever, the fact is that there is literally no way new episodes of Super won't be produced. The DBS brand is absurdly profitable, not a single higher up at Shueisha/Toei is sitting around going "Yeah, you know what, let's not make more money".
That’s what I have been saying too. We have to analyse this from a business standpoint: they will want to keep the momentum from the movie high to ensure the brand continues to profit even more.
In order to do so, they will want the show to be aired as soon as possible, which is why I’m quite sure Super will return in April. As for the announcement, now that the movie has aired everywhere the new show may be announced anytime.
I don't think it's happening any earlier than July, for several reasons:

1. They are using the Post Movie gap (Feb - June) to finish ToP marketing, now when it came to DBS in 2017 when they bothered to actually market the show properly with frequent releases of merchandise they had to sacrifice the Champa arc because the U.S arc was about to start. Now if the show returns in April it doesn't make sense why they'd concentrate on marketing things that might not be relevant anymore ie Evolution Vegeta & UI "Omen" Goku. The finishing of ToP stuff goes on through to June, to me it doesn't make sense for them to do that if the show has returned in April.

2. There is now new found emphasis on overseas and many countries I am sure haven't finished DBS 1.0 yet so July would also be a good buffer and allow better chance of simultaneous airings.

3. July allows time for things to breathe. We just had a massive event movie that was no doubt propelled due to no new weekly content on the air, and so a summer return for DBS allows folks to digest the movie and get their tastebuds tingling again, Toei can then slowly build up hype again for a new series. This would also allow the movie to make as much as it can with no focus anywhere but on that, especially for home video. Perhaps big of all doesn't overwhelm people with too much content.

4. Potential retelling. If the show has a retelling of Broly then April definitely feels too soon, ResF at least had the benefit of BoG being told first with Broly taking place almost immediately after the ToP there wouldn't be much buffer time for it. After 7/8 months people may also be more open to a retelling.
1-2. Your first two points are very solid. I may argue that they didn’t want to market new toys which may potentially spoil a new show, because they need to keep the movie hype at full swing at least until it finishes airing in the US. A new show leaking would mean that fans may stop talking about the movie and to talk about the new show, and that wouldn’t be a good thing. Which is why they were so fast to deny the NATPE article about new Super episodes.

3. I don’t really agree with this: I don’t think they should give people time “to breathe”. If giving people time to breathe would be more profitable, they would make a seasonal show but it’s a better strategy to have people on the edge of their seat every week with full hype for a new episode, and Bandai’s projected earnings agree with me considering how they projected less earnings for 2018 ever since Super was over.
And the sooner Super comes back, the more exposure it gets and the more the brand grows bigger.

4. I doubt they will want to retell the movie, though, especially if they wait all these months to ensure everyone gets to see it or buy its home release.
Be Super coming back in April, July or later, retelling the movie doesn’t seem like the optimal choice in any circumstance. April would be too soon, July or later would mean that they waited for everyone to see the movie thus fans would be angry at yet another retelling.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Super Saiyan God » Fri Jan 25, 2019 4:27 pm

Guys, could someone for the god sake guess me that if broly movie adapted into series or not?
On the other hand, is this Super 2.0 would start on april or something?

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super" CONTINUATION - Announcement & Discussion Thread

Post by Shaddy » Fri Jan 25, 2019 5:07 pm

Are you putting all your posts through google translate or something?

The answer to both your questions (I think) is "We don't know". It might adapt the movie, it might not (it shouldn't, though). It might start in April, maybe later. All we really know is that it is a show that exists.
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