When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by RecolorSaiyan » Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:28 pm

Oob can easily be made to work.


1.) say he’s got power on par with pure Boo without any training whatsoever

2.) Goku remembers how strong Freeza , Broly and Gohan got in such a quick time due to “potential”

3.) Goku trains him for a month and Oob comes stronger than jiren and based on previous precedence set in super, it would be accepted

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Jord » Mon May 06, 2019 1:20 am

What happens after Z is covered in GT. As far as I know between the EoZ and GT Goku is tied up training Buu but there is still a bit of room between EoZ and GT. A few years at least. For some reason I like EoZ's goten design so it would be nice to see some post EoZ and pre-GT stuff.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by PFM18 » Tue May 07, 2019 12:51 am

RecolorSaiyan wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:28 pm
Oob can easily be made to work.


1.) say he’s got power on par with pure Boo without any training whatsoever

2.) Goku remembers how strong Freeza , Broly and Gohan got in such a quick time due to “potential”

3.) Goku trains him for a month and Oob comes stronger than jiren and based on previous precedence set in super, it would be accepted
Yeahhh I don't know if I would like Oob training for a month and surpassing Jiren. That just seems strange to me, given how large the gap is. But yes, given the precedent that is set, it would be "acceptable."

Also, he doesn't necessarily have the power of Pure Boo without training, Goku seemed to think he needed training to draw that power out. Or at least, he needed to be angry to access it.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Xeztin » Wed May 08, 2019 10:54 pm

We're never going to past EoZ, Goten and Trunks are comic relief and are intended to appeal to the youngest of viewers in my opinion. It's not age anymore, they can simply not mention age and start saying "a little time has passed since moro" etc... They really don't want to age them... At all...

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by louisascommie » Thu May 09, 2019 10:33 pm

Make Pan the new main character

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by JulieYBM » Fri May 10, 2019 12:17 am

I'm not really in a rush since it hasn't prevented a ton of neat new characters from being made or cool storylines from being written.

Bah, bring back Raditz and Nappa!
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Anonymous Friend » Fri May 24, 2019 2:52 pm

MKCSTEALTH wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 11:14 am
I hope so. It's killing any tension for me with Super. Super has been more about "How will Goku and Vegeta defeat this foe" as opposed to "Will Goku and Vegeta survive this encounter" and it's really killed any tension for me.

When they announced the Tournament of Power and said that "the universes that lose will be erased", I was like "okay, cool. How will they win?" Granted, there were a lot of interesting developments with it. But those few things ultimately could not make up for the lack of any real tension or worry that our heroes would lose, which is what made Dragonball and Z so good in my opinion
Seriously?

Both Goku and Vegeta have died at least two times already and we have more than two sets of Dragon Balls.This series has always been about the "How" more than the "If". Beside villains, how many characters have stayed dead and completely unreachable? Even Frieza came back.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Super Murjin » Fri May 24, 2019 5:35 pm

Hopefully after the Moro arc we will finally move on past End of Z. Remember Toyotaro said in one of his interviews that the DBS story points to the End of Z, it comes down to Uub. If that is the case maybe the rumor about the next arc being fan servicy could be about that. I like the idea of Vegeta and Goku going off with Grand Priest to train for an extended period of time where they try to master Ultra Instinct and learn some new techniques as well. In the meantime, the Z Fighters can have an arc or two fighting some foes without Goku and Vegeta. That would be Uub, Gohan, Piccolo, etc , time to shine. The common complaint is that the main cast is getting older, however, the saiyans at least stay young longer. If not mistaken they are in their prime until age 80. So taking a break from Goku and Vegeta wouldn't be a bad idea.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Omori » Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:47 am

The thing is, with previous Dragon Ball series we were used that there always had to be a multi-year time skip to the next arc. Was is it the three years between the tournaments, 5 years to the start of Z, one year to the Saiyans, three years to the Androids or the seven years to Buu.

Personally I don't mind having multiple stories within this 10 year gap. Look at One Piece for example, the strawhats are actually lucky to get a few days break.

For Dragon Ball it's just important to keep track and not forgetting in which age they are. As long as there are threats outside Earth it all works. They just need to make sure when they do the time skip towards the last tournament that there is a few years gap where Goku left training somewhere.

There is still some potential for a few years to continue in this time frame.
Stories past Z will happen at some point - no need to rush yet.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by sintzu » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:25 am

Omori wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:47 am
Personally I don't mind having multiple stories within this 10 year gap. Look at One Piece for example, the strawhats are actually lucky to get a few days break.
One Piece has been like that from the start. DB, like you pointed out, has always changed from one arc to another so it's part of what makes DB stand out. Now we can't even get them to change their clothes.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by emperior » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:21 am

sintzu wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:25 am
Omori wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:47 am
Personally I don't mind having multiple stories within this 10 year gap. Look at One Piece for example, the strawhats are actually lucky to get a few days break.
One Piece has been like that from the start. DB, like you pointed out, has always changed from one arc to another so it's part of what makes DB stand out. Now we can't even get them to change their clothes.
I hated how throughout all of the 131 episodes of Super they kept reusing the same designs over and over. Krillin was always wearing that stupid Taco t-shirt, Android 18 too was always in her BoG outfit, same for Chi-Chi, Goten... basically almost everyone except for Bulma who at least changed outfit from BoG and then had a lab coat during Future Trunks arc and a new outfit when she was pregnant and Gohan.
It’s actually funny how Broly’s movie alone almost had more outfit changes for the involved characters than 131 episodes of Super had, as we got jackets for Goku and Vegeta, a training outfit for Vegeta, 3 different outfits for Bulma, Broly too changed up a few times, same for Paragus and Lemo and Cheelye. And Kid Trunks at least got recoloured.
I hope that in the future they will keep designing more than a look for the various characters as it also helps making it feel like some time has passed, even if the status quo keeps being kept.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Alruneia » Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:36 am

sintzu wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:25 am
DB, like you pointed out, has always changed from one arc to another so it's part of what makes DB stand out. Now we can't even get them to change their clothes.
It's true, and it's part of why I've liked Dragon Ball so much. Progression, time passing. It makes the story feel more "real" in a way and it gives each arc more meaning. There's plenty of this in the original story... and then almost none in Super, which is one of its greatest flaws in my eyes. Though you can still divide Super into three different eras currently:
1. Before Pan (Battle of Gods)
2. After Pan but before Bulla (Resurrection F, Champa tournament arc, Zamasu arc)
3. After Bulla (Universe Survival arc, DBS: Broly, Moro arc)
Your observation of characters barely changing outside of these two births is valid, though. Hell, Goku and Vegeta even "regressed" in a way, going back to their old clothing after the Champa tournament. The end point of this kind of development, or rather lack of development, is a kind of "Dragon Ball Simpsons", where arcs don't actually matter anymore and whole stories can just be skipped if you want because they change nothing. The exact opposite of what made Dragon Ball so good for me anyway in the first place.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by sintzu » Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:43 am

Alruneia wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:36 am
The end point of this kind of development, or rather lack of development, is a kind of "Dragon Ball Simpsons", where arcs don't actually matter anymore and whole stories can just be skipped if you want because they change nothing.
RF and the Trunks arc can be skipped and very little will feel out of place. That's something you could never do with any of the original arcs.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by emperior » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:05 pm

sintzu wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:43 am
Alruneia wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:36 am
The end point of this kind of development, or rather lack of development, is a kind of "Dragon Ball Simpsons", where arcs don't actually matter anymore and whole stories can just be skipped if you want because they change nothing.
RF and the Trunks arc can be skipped and very little will feel out of place. That's something you could never do with any of the original arcs.
Before Freeza was revived RF was skippable, but is now important to understand later developments.
Trunks is definitely skippable. The only things it brought to the table were the potara retcon (useful to understand Kefla defusing) and Future Zeno. But it also introduced Grand Priest, the Zeno button and Gowasu so it’s not exactly 100% unimportant.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Kataphrut » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:19 pm

emperior wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:05 pm
sintzu wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:43 am
Alruneia wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:36 am
The end point of this kind of development, or rather lack of development, is a kind of "Dragon Ball Simpsons", where arcs don't actually matter anymore and whole stories can just be skipped if you want because they change nothing.
RF and the Trunks arc can be skipped and very little will feel out of place. That's something you could never do with any of the original arcs.
Before Freeza was revived RF was skippable, but is now important to understand later developments.
Trunks is definitely skippable. The only things it brought to the table were the potara retcon (useful to understand Kefla defusing) and Future Zeno. But it also introduced Grand Priest, the Zeno button and Gowasu so it’s not exactly 100% unimportant.
That doesn't sound skippable to me at all then. That sounds like it introduces quite a bit.

I would argue Resurrection F is the least skippable of everything in Super since it established the formula every subsequent arc has followed. I don't have a problem with Super being set in that 10 year time gap, it's clearly the period Toriyama is most comfortable with. But I had this brainwave recently (inspired by this tweet of CIphers') that everything since Resurrection F has followed its same formula.

Goku and Vegeta are training with Whis (but crucially not learning anything new) while Beerus and maybe Bulma are in the background doing food jokes. They find out about a threat, they go to where it's happening, they take turns fighting, then things escalate. That's every DB story since Resurrection F with the exception of the Universe Survival Arc. Incidentally, that's why I like that arc so much- it felt the most like it was moving things forward, while Broly and Moro went back to the Res F formula. Of course plenty of people praise those stories for the new characters and concepts they introduced (plus Broly's amazing action) so I actually wonder if progression is as necessary as people make it out to be.

Would I like to see progression? Yes, I would. But as I said, so far the only time in Super where it felt like that was happening was the US arc, which seems to have been more Toei's doing than Toriyama or Toyo. When the man at the top of the heap and his protégé are the ones seemingly keeping the story spinning it's wheels, there's only so much you can hope for.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Bulma's Foot Masseur » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:03 pm

Like others have said, I'm ready to move past this rift so that things can actually happen to characters again. As is, any sort of transformation now has to be easily-disguisible/reversible which wasn't a barrier in DB, Z, or GT.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Xeztin » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:56 pm

I feel like they still make sales from GT especially with Heroes. Even taking into consideration of interviews, I don’t think we’ll ever see an alternate EoZ because it steps on GT’s toes. Aside from calling GT and the movies a side story, other than ignoring it, they’ve never closed the door on it’s existence either. GT is more of an alternate timeline where Super didn’t happen. Even future counterparts in Heroes have SSJ4 instead of God forms. Basically what i’m saying is that I don’t see them telling anything past EoZ that will step on GT’s toes. If anything we may get a GT retelling or Gt sequel, like how they did with Broly.

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by sintzu » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:29 am

Xeztin wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:56 pm
I feel like they still make sales from GT especially with Heroes. Even taking into consideration of interviews, I don’t think we’ll ever see an alternate EoZ because it steps on GT’s toes.
They were also making money from the original Broly, but that didn't stop them from rebooting him and throwing the original off a bridge. The reaosn they're not going past EOZ is for marketing, they believe the current cast is at its most profitable during this timeframe. In terms of GT, it will get the Broly treatment sooner or later, same goes for Cooler.
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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by Big Black Sayian » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:48 am

Only Toriyama knows :P

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Re: When Will We Ever Get Out of the Boo Fight - End of Z Rift?!

Post by AnimeNation101 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 7:13 pm

Welp. We now know that Uub has more potential than we originally thought thanks to the latest manga chapter of DBS’s Galactic Patrol Prisoner arc.

I’d also like to hope that Toyo and Toriyama making it a point that Kid Buu had the majority of the Daikaioshin’s god ki hidden inside him but was defeated by the spirit bomb (and by extension reincarnated into Uub) means that we’re will get to the End of Z sooner than later.
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