At first I didn't care, but now I really wish for Toei to animate Moro arc...

[Skar]

P.S. Toei will fix it.

I think the arc could be better but what do you feel Toei will fix? If it is going to be animated, I assume it'll just be a longer version of the original like the movie retellings. I don't expect a complete overhaul of the arc because Toei might not consider anything worth changing if Toriyama is supervising it and giving his approval each month.

[ZombieVito]

P.S. Toei will fix it.

I think the arc could be better but what do you feel Toei will fix? If it is going to be animated, I assume it'll just be a longer version of the original like the movie retellings. I don't expect a complete overhaul of the arc because Toei might not consider anything worth changing if Toriyama is supervising it and giving his approval each month.

Characterization would be a complete improvement. I already lost count of the times characters simply don't act like themselves in the manga.

Moro would also get a hella more interesting since Toei will surely give him some cool attacks like they did with Black and practically 90% of the fighters in the ToP.

The humans (with the exception of Kuririn) wouldn't get shit on like they did in the manga fighting the criminals.

[Skar]

Characterization would be a complete improvement. I already lost count of the times characters simply don't act like themselves in the manga.

Moro would also get a hella more interesting since Toei will surely give him some cool attacks like they did with Black and practically 90% of the fighters in the ToP.

The humans (with the exception of Kuririn) wouldn't get shit on like they did in the manga fighting the criminals.

I'm not sure if these would really fix the arc. The characterization seems like what we're used to in DBS so I don't know what the anime would change. I'm usually fine with characterization as long as there's no "redevelopment".

Moro having more magic-based abilities could be nice. The humans vs Moro's henchmen was mostly fan service and it's unlikely the outcome will change. One common complaint about the arc is that it's dragging on making the fights even longer and adding more fan service might not be considered a fix for these people. Toei can't please everyone so it really depends on what they believe needs to be fixed if they are change anything.

[Peach]

I'm for it, as long as they greatly expand the human stories. I want to see like 2-3 episodes of Yamcha fighting his battles against those characters he fought. Same with the other humans. They should have Android 17 and 18 fuse for an episode or two against Moro too.

[Magnificent Ponta]

...Seriously?

This is what would "fix" the Moro arc? More twinkly, 'in-your-face' magic and better Human showings against basically (and in some cases literally) faceless goons?

I mean, I agree that adding those things is very much in Toei's power to do, and it certainly fits their M.O. to add stuff like that. But this stuff is so superficial and inconsequential, I can't quite believe it's being proffered as making any difference one way or another.

I'm sure I'm not doing the take justice or whatever, but this is bizarre to me.

[JulieYBM]

They need to clearly define arcs and progress for Gokuu and Vegeta, trim the fat and give Moro more of a driving force. Any conversation he is in is instantly boring. This really isn't more than an eight episode story arc.

[LoganForkHands73]

...Seriously?

This is what would "fix" the Moro arc? More twinkly, 'in-your-face' magic and better Human showings against basically (and in some cases literally) faceless goons?

I mean, I agree that adding those things is very much in Toei's power to do, and it certainly fits their M.O. to add stuff like that. But this stuff is so superficial and inconsequential, I can't quite believe it's being proffered as making any difference one way or another.

I'm sure I'm not doing the take justice or whatever, but this is bizarre to me.

The trouble with the Earthling-focused stuff in the manga is that it already felt like pointless filler, which it has inevitably proven to be. It fucked with the manga's pacing irreparably, but it's the sort of thing that could conceivably be kept in a weekly anime. This might prove to be the first time in Dragon Ball history where filler is reduced in the transition between manga and anime adaptation.

Let's face it, most of the Earthlings just don't have any thematic purpose in this story. I liked the concept of a worldwide alien assault which has never really been done before, but it had way too much build-up for what turned out to be, as you said, a bunch of dull fights against faceless goons. I wish Toyotaro had spent some more time fleshing them out in the Tournament of Power, like just a little bit more, because it feels like he's trying to make up for lost ground.

Maybe Moro could be salvaged with charismatic voice acting. I wonder who would be up for the part?

[Matches Malone]

The trouble with the Earthling-focused stuff in the manga is that it already felt like pointless filler, which it has inevitably proven to be. It fucked with the manga's pacing irreparably, but it's the sort of thing that could conceivably be kept in a weekly anime.

I think the earthlings' part was extended on purpose to drag the arc's length into November/December for Jump Festa. I doubt it'll be bad in the anime, as sitting through 2 weeks of their fighting will be a lot easier than 2-3 months in the manga.

[LoganForkHands73]

The trouble with the Earthling-focused stuff in the manga is that it already felt like pointless filler, which it has inevitably proven to be. It fucked with the manga's pacing irreparably, but it's the sort of thing that could conceivably be kept in a weekly anime.

I think the earthlings' part was extended on purpose to drag the arc's length into November/December for Jump Festa. I doubt it'll be bad in the anime, as sitting through 2 weeks of their fighting will be a lot easier than 2-3 months in the manga.

Possibly. It feels like a lot of the pacing issues boil down to corporate interest. Similarly, the Universe Survival arc was clearly rushed to make way for the Broly movie.

[Matches Malone]

The Universe Survival arc was clearly rushed to make way for the Broly movie.

Rushed ? that was the most dragged out thing I've ever seen.

[Magnificent Ponta]

I liked the concept of a worldwide alien assault which has never really been done before, but it had way too much build-up for what turned out to be, as you said, a bunch of dull fights against faceless goons. I wish Toyotaro had spent some more time fleshing them out in the Tournament of Power, like just a little bit more, because it feels like he's trying to make up for lost ground.

The way I see it, with the exception of OG73-I (who gets a bit of a build-up in Jaco's description), they're supposed to be faceless goons and mouthy nobodies, and it doesn't make much sense for them to be much of anything more than that; which is why takes like the one quoted below baffle me so much:

Like if they animate it give Moro some type of relationship with his goons.

Speaking of his goons, give them more character to, I haven't even seen fan art of them anywhere and I check out DBZ Reddit every day, which means nobody cares about them

No-one is supposed to care much about these guys.

They're not meant to be particularly interesting characters with a deeper relationship with Moro because they're supposed to be good-for-nothing scrubs who can't do a damn thing on their own. Like Vegeta says, even kid Trunks could take their boss Saganbo, no sweat. He feels weak, he frankly is weak, and his position under Moro makes him feel less so, and so he serves him. Moro doesn't care about Saganbo and his cohort at all; they're just instruments for cooking his food - Saganbo literally offers to do that for Moro on one occasion. How's your relationship with your frying pan, or your oven? I'm not on speaking terms with mine, personally; why would Moro treat them any better? These aren't the guys who deserve fanart (if that's even a measure of much of anything), any more than your gas ring does.

Really, the fact that they're nobodies actually emphasises the threat of Moro alone, because his ki-sharing magic can turn a sub-Trunks nonentity into a total powerhouse who can beast the whole gang (except Goku and Vegeta), even though said nonentity can't handle it in the end, and that's with just a few 'smidgens' of energy, from Moro's perspective. They're just devices to demonstrate Moro's threat and Goku and Vegeta's own individual progress at various points in the story, and speaking for myself, I'm fine with that. I don't see investing time and pages in developing these guys further really buys the story much of anything that's worth having. Put their points of 'interest' in a Guidebook in 10 years time, or something.

[LoganForkHands73]

I liked the concept of a worldwide alien assault which has never really been done before, but it had way too much build-up for what turned out to be, as you said, a bunch of dull fights against faceless goons. I wish Toyotaro had spent some more time fleshing them out in the Tournament of Power, like just a little bit more, because it feels like he's trying to make up for lost ground.

The way I see it, with the exception of OG73-I (who gets a bit of a build-up in Jaco's description), they're supposed to be faceless goons and mouthy nobodies, and it doesn't make much sense for them to be much of anything more than that; which is why takes like the one quoted below baffle me so much:

Like if they animate it give Moro some type of relationship with his goons.

Speaking of his goons, give them more character to, I haven't even seen fan art of them anywhere and I check out DBZ Reddit every day, which means nobody cares about them

No-one is supposed to care much about these guys.

They're not meant to be particularly interesting characters with a deeper relationship with Moro because they're supposed to be good-for-nothing scrubs who can't do a damn thing on their own. Like Vegeta says, even kid Trunks could take their boss Saganbo, no sweat. He feels weak, he frankly is weak, and his position under Moro makes him feel less so, and so he serves him. Moro doesn't care about Saganbo and his cohort at all; they're just instruments for cooking his food - Saganbo literally offers to do that for Moro on one occasion. How's your relationship with your frying pan, or your oven? I'm not on speaking terms with mine, personally; why would Moro treat them any better? These aren't the guys who deserve fanart (if that's even a measure of much of anything), any more than your gas ring does.

Really, the fact that they're nobodies actually emphasises the threat of Moro alone, because his ki-sharing magic can turn a sub-Trunks nonentity into a total powerhouse who can beast the whole gang (except Goku and Vegeta), even though said nonentity can't handle it in the end, and that's with just a few 'smidgens' of energy, from Moro's perspective. They're just devices to demonstrate Moro's threat and Goku and Vegeta's own individual progress at various points in the story, and speaking for myself, I'm fine with that. I don't see investing time and pages in developing these guys further really buys the story much of anything that's worth having. Put their points of 'interest' in a Guidebook in 10 years time, or something.

(EDIT: I just realised I should have clarified, I meant I wished the Earthling fighters in Team Universe 7 got more panel-time in the US arc, not the minor mooks)
Agreed. They don't need any more screentime and their mostly recycled designs emphasise the fact that we're not supposed to individually care enough about them to make loads of fanart (though admittedly, I've made fanart of Seven-Three...) If an anime adaptation comes out, they might find some odd over-dedicated fans as many minor background players tend to, but right now, you can't blame people for not lovingly painting a large 4:3 portrait of our lord and saviour Shimorekka.

The Universe Survival arc was clearly rushed to make way for the Broly movie.

Rushed ? that was the most dragged out thing I've ever seen.

I mean the manga version.

[TheNingen]

Maybe Moro could be salvaged with charismatic voice acting. I wonder who would be up for the part?

Since people have been double down on the comparisons between Perfect Voro and Cell, I say they should put all their chips on the table and have Norio Wakamoto do it

[ZombieVito]

I'm not sure if these would really fix the arc. The characterization seems like what we're used to in DBS so I don't know what the anime would change. I'm usually fine with characterization as long as there's no "redevelopment".

Moro having more magic-based abilities could be nice. The humans vs Moro's henchmen was mostly fan service and it's unlikely the outcome will change. One common complaint about the arc is that it's dragging on making the fights even longer and adding more fan service might not be considered a fix for these people. Toei can't please everyone so it really depends on what they believe needs to be fixed if they are change anything.

Characters have been written very poorly in the whole manga not just in this arc.

Take Piccolo for example.

Manga Piccolo in the U6 arc is very summisive, he obeys Goku to the letter and never tries to win against Frost. He even says this stupidity:

I am not Namekian. I am the reincarnation of Demon King Piccolo.

Just... WHAT?

In the anime he actually tries to win and says no such nonsense.

During the recruitment chapter for the ToP, Goku has to actually beg Piccolo to participate. Piccolo is a martial artist, he would want to join and more importantly knows he needs to, exactly as the anime protrayed.

Now during the Moro arc Piccolo acts really stupid while talking about Vegeta with Goku. The guy literally gets amnesia in that chapter.

There's a reason these exist:

https://twitter.com/MatoiRisu/status/12 ... 95968?s=20

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UeHMOR ... e=youtu.be

And this is just Piccolo, other characters have bad portrayals like Tenshinhan not being able to trash talk that U7 Metalmen or Vegeta's whole "I don't need a master anymore" nonsense just to go and get trained by another person 2 arcs later.

[Skar]

Characters have been written very poorly in the whole manga not just in this arc.

True but I'm not sure the anime is going to change any of this because it had it's share of odd characterization. That's unfortunately going to happen whenever the original author isn't writing the whole story and dialogue. You're making it sound like Toei will share your vision of what needs to be fixed in the arc. Toei might only consider these issues minor details not worth changing and it's easier to adapt the arc as is.

[DevilKing99]

I'm not sure if these would really fix the arc. The characterization seems like what we're used to in DBS so I don't know what the anime would change. I'm usually fine with characterization as long as there's no "redevelopment".

Moro having more magic-based abilities could be nice. The humans vs Moro's henchmen was mostly fan service and it's unlikely the outcome will change. One common complaint about the arc is that it's dragging on making the fights even longer and adding more fan service might not be considered a fix for these people. Toei can't please everyone so it really depends on what they believe needs to be fixed if they are change anything.

Characters have been written very poorly in the whole manga not just in this arc.

Take Piccolo for example.

Manga Piccolo in the U6 arc is very summisive, he obeys Goku to the letter and never tries to win against Frost. He even says this stupidity:

I am not Namekian. I am the reincarnation of Demon King Piccolo.

Just... WHAT?

In the anime he actually tries to win and says no such nonsense.

During the recruitment chapter for the ToP, Goku has to actually beg Piccolo to participate. Piccolo is a martial artist, he would want to join and more importantly knows he needs to, exactly as the anime protrayed.

Now during the Moro arc Piccolo acts really stupid while talking about Vegeta with Goku. The guy literally gets amnesia in that chapter.

There's a reason these exist:

https://twitter.com/MatoiRisu/status/12 ... 95968?s=20

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UeHMOR ... e=youtu.be

And this is just Piccolo, other characters have bad portrayals like Tenshinhan not being able to trash talk that U7 Metalmen or Vegeta's whole "I don't need a master anymore" nonsense just to go and get trained by another person 2 arcs later.

Plus, how much the characters greatly lack moments, personalities and notable scenes in the manga.

Goku Black and Hit wound't even have a fanbase if we went with the manga version, neither would Zamasu, I still find it hilarious when Zamasu fused in the manga the only noteworthy thing he did was throw cubes at people.

Moro is the shining example of Toyo's character problem, been the main villain since 2018 and it's almost 2021, and he has no character to speak of at all outside of being evil. This is pretty much Toyo's set in stone way of writing stories now.

People Toyo is 42 years old, and Tite Kubo is 43, Kishimoto and Oda are 45, Toyo is not some aspring mangaka that just got hired, he's been around for a while.

[DevilKing99]

...Seriously?

This is what would "fix" the Moro arc? More twinkly, 'in-your-face' magic and better Human showings against basically (and in some cases literally) faceless goons?

I mean, I agree that adding those things is very much in Toei's power to do, and it certainly fits their M.O. to add stuff like that. But this stuff is so superficial and inconsequential, I can't quite believe it's being proffered as making any difference one way or another.

I'm sure I'm not doing the take justice or whatever, but this is bizarre to me.

The trouble with the Earthling-focused stuff in the manga is that it already felt like pointless filler, which it has inevitably proven to be. It fucked with the manga's pacing irreparably, but it's the sort of thing that could conceivably be kept in a weekly anime. This might prove to be the first time in Dragon Ball history where filler is reduced in the transition between manga and anime adaptation.

Let's face it, most of the Earthlings just don't have any thematic purpose in this story. I liked the concept of a worldwide alien assault which has never really been done before, but it had way too much build-up for what turned out to be, as you said, a bunch of dull fights against faceless goons. I wish Toyotaro had spent some more time fleshing them out in the Tournament of Power, like just a little bit more, because it feels like he's trying to make up for lost ground.

Maybe Moro could be salvaged with charismatic voice acting. I wonder who would be up for the part?

Even as a Tien fan, the Earthlings are done, showcasing them is pointless because most of them competed for arcs in the 80s and early 90s, even in the Saiyan arc they were just used as to hype fodder for villains.

The story is greatly being held back by staying on Earth.

And I'm pretty sure the next arc is just going to take place mostly on Earth and besides briefing going to another planet in U7.

[ShaggyBlanco]

I think the problem is the way DB fights are structured, the Z warriors role is always just to fight minions while the main antagonist (who could beat them at any time) waits for Goku/Vegeta.
Now let's say this, the main villain is fighting Goku/Vegeta but he has a machine that's absorbing the Universe's energy or something, then the Z warriors go there to stop it and along the way fight some guys, in my opinion that would give their fights more meaning since them winning or not would have some effect on the story.
Also, they REALLY need new moves.

[Kataphrut]

Maybe Moro could be salvaged with charismatic voice acting. I wonder who would be up for the part?

Since people have been double down on the comparisons between Perfect Voro and Cell, I say they should put all their chips on the table and have Norio Wakamoto do it

I was gonna say, even before the fusion happened that I know what Moro will sound like in the anime before he ever gets cast. There's a certain "voice type" that anime tends to go with for that type of villain, usually old and gravelly. I was straining for an example and then I realised it was exactly like how Norio Wakamoto sounds.

It won't be him because he's too old and already has a big part in DB (though from what I've heard, apparently he's gotten really unenthusiastic about voicing Cell lately) but it'll be someone who sounds like him.

[ZombieVito]

Characters have been written very poorly in the whole manga not just in this arc.

True but I'm not sure the anime is going to change any of this because it had it's share of odd characterization. That's unfortunately going to happen whenever the original author isn't writing the whole story and dialogue. You're making it sound like Toei will share your vision of what needs to be fixed in the arc. Toei might only consider these issues minor details not worth changing and it's easier to adapt the arc as is.

I don't remember characters being off in the anime.

And DevilKing is right. Characters in the manga barely get to shine if at all. Kuririn and Tenshinhan were an embarrassment in the manga ToP.