So is Vegeta the new Piccolo?

[GodPrince91]

Now that Goku had MUI he is leagues above anyone else and that includes his rival Vegeta. Where does Toyotaro take vegeta's character from here? Its looking like he will forever be on the sidelines with piccolo and gohan and the others while watching goku save the day again and again. I grew up a life long Vegeta fan because of his character development and the fact that he was always on par in power with Goku, it made for an interesting dynamic between two rivals always trying to outdo each other instead of just one Mary Sue character saving the day time and time again.

If MUI is the highest power a fighter can achieve and Vegeta said he doesn't want it, what can Toyotaro give vegeta to make him on par with or even surpass MUI? Quite frankly I cannot continue to support any dragon ball material or even be remotely interested if the story turns out to be a Goku slobfest at the expense of every other character.

[Psajdak]

No, Vegeta is new Gohan.

[Matches Malone]

He'll play a role in the climax next week by separating Moro from the earth, and will probably get some new form in the next arc. DB is now a corporate written story, and both Goku and Vegeta are the face of it, so the gap between them will never be too wide that it prevents one from not being front and center.

[GodPrince91]

He'll play a role in the climax next week by separating Moro from the earth, and will probably get some new form in the next arc. DB is now a corporate written story, and both Goku and Vegeta are the face of it, so the gap between them will never be too wide that it prevents one from not being front and center.

Lets hope you are correct. They have already made the other characters irrelevant I was hoping at least vegeta stays at the front lines.

[Matches Malone]

I was hoping at least vegeta stays at the front lines.

He's already on the front lines. He was the only one capable of fighting Moro before MUI, and is currently the only capable of separating him from the earth.

[UpFromTheSkies]

There is no way they're going to push Vegeta to the side lines for good, he makes them too much money. Let's wait and see what happens, the arc isn't over yet.

[MCDaveG]

I don't think so... Vegeta still holds his second in power to Goku since the Androids/Cell arc (or maybe Saiyan arc, as Piccolo got these momentary boosts in power, and Trunks...). He's what Sasuke is to Naruto, a rival. Piccolo ceased to be a long time ago
Also, isn't Vegeta's Enhanced SSJBlue close to MUI?

[Matches Malone]

Isn't Vegeta's Enhanced SSJBlue close to MUI?

It's not even close. Vegeta was one shotted by Moro 7-3, while MUI Goku wiped the floor with him.

[precita]

Piccolo had already been pushed to the sidelines during the Boo saga where he wasn't a main fighter anymore and was there to train Gotenks. Piccolo also barely did anything in Super but fight weak Freeza minions, lose easily to Frost in U6 tournament, and his role in the Top wasn't much more than any other character.

Vegeta is CONSTANTLY in the focus. I don't see how anyone can think he would be given Piccolo treatment.

As I said, Super has basically treated Gohan/Piccolo/Krillin as the way DBZ treated Yamcha/Tenshinhan/Chaoitzu. Now Gohan/Piccolo/Krillin have moved into the roles the other humans had in DBZ, and that's kinda sad for what were major characters.

[Lionel]

For all of his faults and inadequacies Vegeta continues to be a persistent staple of the franchise in his everlasting race to overtake Goku. It's still a focal point of who he is even if he's not offering up his soul and humanity on a silver platter to embolden himself. Chances are he'll once again make headway to regaining some momentum in the race against Goku.

Sadly, Piccolo has fallen to the wayside like everyone else. It's the nature of modern Dragon Ball which feels very formulaic in its treatment of everyone who isn't Vegeta. I really don't care for it myself. Oh, then again I doubt many fans would care for the idea of Gohan having become the protagonist which I personally support. It is what it is.

[Kagari]

Piccolo had already been pushed to the sidelines during the Boo saga where he wasn't a main fighter anymore and was there to train Gotenks. Piccolo also barely did anything in Super but fight weak Freeza minions, lose easily to Frost in U6 tournament, and his role in the Top wasn't much more than any other character.

Vegeta is CONSTANTLY in the focus. I don't see how anyone can think he would be given Piccolo treatment.

As I said, Super has basically treated Gohan/Piccolo/Krillin as the way DBZ treated Yamcha/Tenshinhan/Chaoitzu. Now Gohan/Piccolo/Krillin have moved into the roles the other humans had in DBZ, and that's kinda sad for what were major characters.

Eh, Gohan had a bigger role than Vegeta in the anime Universe Survival arc and Piccolo had a better role there than anything he did in the Boo arc, really. Same with Kuririn, who did nothing in the Boo arc and had been acting cowardly since Cell.

[MCDaveG]

Isn't Vegeta's Enhanced SSJBlue close to MUI?

It's not even close. Vegeta was one shotted by Moro 7-3, while MUI Goku wiped the floor with him.

Aha, so it's more like Goku SSJB Kaioken

[Matches Malone]

Aha, so it's more like Goku SSJB Kaioken

At this point I'd say he's between that and Omen.

[BWri]

Now that Goku had MUI he is leagues above anyone else and that includes his rival Vegeta. Where does Toyotaro take vegeta's character from here? Its looking like he will forever be on the sidelines with piccolo and gohan and the others while watching goku save the day again and again.

I actually had a prediction that this would happen way back towards the start of Super. Thankfully I was wrong.

Spoiler:

"So after some thinking in the bathroom (the best place to think), it's become apparent to me that Vegeta has inherited Piccolo's former role in Dragon Ball Super, right down to his benevolent relationship with Goku. Piccolo has inherited Tien's former role, and Tien...well Tien's still Tien. "

More than anything, I never could have predicted Tien would become the Yamcha in all this ... or even worse than Yamcha in many respects.

Spoiler:

"Hmm...I wonder who used to always threaten to kill Goku once they were done beating the bad guy to then being his mellowed out close friend? Well, you can say that about a lot of Goku's friends but Piccolo was in that role not too long ago and look what happened to him. Vegeta has mellowed out a lot in Dragon Ball Super, just like Piccolo before him, and now that he's been defanged just like the Namek was, I fear that he is destined to follow the same route as Piccolo. Just look at the facts."

You can find the rest of that 2016 post by googling "Vegeta Fans, Be Afraid" My main point, was that as Goku's new training partner Vegeta was going to wind up in the role Piccolo once occupied and that newer, edgier rivals would come along and push Vegeta to the sidelines. Despite awesome new rivals for Goku such as Frieza, Hit, Broly, and Jiren -- Vegeta continues to endure and surpass them in power. It's clear with Frieza and Hit at any rate. Vegeta continues to surpass them and fight at Goku's level and occasionally surpass him.

Spoiler:

"Now this is what I fear, for you Vegeta fans. Taking into account Vegeta's drastic personality change, and his similar powerups over Goku, compared to Piccolo. I feel that he will soon be replaced by a character that will inhabit the role that he once did. It will be a character who is bloodthirsty but somewhat reformed like he used to be. It will be someone who's a fan favorite antihero, like he used to be. Someone who will be Goku's new rival. Yes, Vegeta isn't a proper rival for Goku anymore. Once you train with Goku, that's it, he's done with you as a rival. It happened with Piccolo. They lost that element of danger in their relationship, just like Vegeta has now lost."

I did manage to kind of save face with that prediction though:

Spoiler:

"What can save Vegeta is the fact that he has an easy reason in the story for himself to stay close to Goku's level. He's a saiyan, so he can easily remain at least one step behind Goku like he's been shown to be so far. "

If MUI is the highest power a fighter can achieve and Vegeta said he doesn't want it, what can Toyotaro give vegeta to make him on par with or even surpass MUI? Quite frankly I cannot continue to support any dragon ball material or even be remotely interested if the story turns out to be a Goku slobfest at the expense of every other character.

It was already a Goku AND Vegeta slobfest for most of its run and most of us got through it just fine, though I did drop off at several parts between the end of BoG and start of the Future Trunks arc. I feel your pain, but the thing is Vegeta's never lost his spot, even now. There have been several points in the anime and manga previously where it didn't seem like he would catch up and yet he continues to do so, even drastically surpassing Goku at least once or twice.

Vegeta is Goku's #2 and it doesn't seem like that will change any time soon. That's a good spot to be in for this franchise since Toriyama-san and co. don't seem to be able to spin multiple plates when it comes to characters. I'd love to finally have on-panel development of Z-Fighters other than G&V and learn about their quests to become better martial artists. Ultimately, despite the introduction of characters such as Beerus, Hit, Toppo and Jiren or even the reintroduction of powerhouses such as Frieza, Trunks, Android 17, or Gohan, the fact that Vegeta remains Goku's most enduring rival shows that he is likely not budging from his role as Goku's right hand man for a long time. Compare all the new techniques and forms he's gotten to all the other Z-fighters.

[ChronoTwigger]

People liked Vegeta as he was able to do what Goku wasn't: burst of violence.
And also by his different, complex origin as a prince of a near extincted race.
Now, does we need that again?

"The last prince of Sayan" doesn't matter anymore, as there are Sayan, half sayan, quarter sayan, sayan worlds, sayan happy merry go friends everywhere.
Burst of violence is no more, the plot is going toward lowering the tension degree. There's no need for him to do the dirty job: no dirty job to accomplish. The old plain Vegeta will have simply mincered Cabba and spit on him.

So, there's need of the old plain Vegeta?
No.
But the character arc could be revamped, while Goku arc is dead 20 years ago.
Becoming a figure in Sadla planet is a thing. Vegeta hidden bad aptitude can be a future problem. Vegeta evolving into something else than a Big Bang Attack cannon is another road.

Vegeta have full potential to grow into something else, is probably the only character in DragonBall with some narrative value left.
(To note that I hate Vegeta, but those are facts).

[BWri]

People liked Vegeta as he was able to do what Goku wasn't: burst of violence.
And also by his different, complex origin as a prince of a near extincted race.
Now, does we need that again?

"The last prince of Sayan" doesn't matter anymore, as there are Sayan, half sayan, quarter sayan, sayan worlds, sayan happy merry go friends everywhere.
Burst of violence is no more, the plot is going toward lowering the tension degree. There's no need for him to do the dirty job: no dirty job to accomplish. The old plain Vegeta will have simply mincered Cabba and spit on him.

That's what I thought before. He's lost some of his edge, but its not completely gone. It's still there for Piccolo too, though not as much since fusing with Kami. But Vegeta hasn't been replaced yet, so I think he won't be even if some new edgy Saiyan or other rival character shows up.

Vegeta have full potential to grow into something else, is probably the only character in DragonBall with some narrative value left.
(To note that I hate Vegeta, but those are facts).

Not true. The fact is that most Dragon Ball characters are in fact underutilized, both narratively and combat-wise. None of them have lived out their full potential as characters. It's easy to see as you get glimpses of it with characters like Frieza, Roshi, and #17. We knew the bare minimum of each of these characters and Super expanded on them (only a little) and their abilities. Basically the whole cast has that potential and much more, as do the characters I listed. It was moreso prevalent before the ToP but its still there. It's up to the writers, Toriyama-san included to be more creative with them.

[Kinokima]

Goku doesn’t really have true rival characters because every time he meets a potential new one he far surpasses them almost shortly after they are introduced or the new villain antagonist comes along more powerful than the last.

This is also true for Vegeta who literally got surpassed the very next arc after he was introduced. The difference with Vegeta is unlike every other so called “rival” character he was never content on being the number two character and still tries to push past Goku.

Vegeta will of course never actually surpass Goku except for maybe brief moments where it doesn’t really matter but he also isn’t going to give up.

A lot of people say Vegeta isn’t really Goku’s rival and that’s true. The narrative never really treats him like something Goku has to surpass. Instead Goku is what pushes Vegeta forward in a way that is untrue for any of Goku’s other “rival characters.”

There are people who say he should move on from this but the fact he hasn’t is why Vegeta is still relevant in the story. Goku is so far above Vegeta now but I just don’t see Vegeta giving up and quitting. In a way it’s Vegeta who doesn’t want to be left behind in the story.

[Brettjr25]

No, Super clearly treats Vegeta like the co-protagonist like how Gohan was in Z. So Vegeta may not be the person who at the end is going to be the star but I do expect him to get is power up, whatever it may be.

Hell, I didn't post it in the theory thread yet but when Vegeta used spirit fission, he knocked the energy out and it gathered above him. From there Vegeta controlled it and sent it back. If Vegeta effectively splits the angelic energy from Moro, with no host to go to, he'll most likely absorb it and get some sort of angel power up because unlike Moro Vegeta has trained his body his whole life and trained with Whis.

[Matches Malone]

If Vegeta effectively splits the angelic energy from Moro, with no host to go to, he'll most likely absorb it and get some sort of angel power up because unlike Moro Vegeta has trained his body his whole life and trained with Whis.

Great theory, I never thought about that. It would definitely boost him up to MUI's level.

[UpFromTheSkies]

No, Super clearly treats Vegeta like the co-protagonist like how Gohan was in Z. So Vegeta may not be the person who at the end is going to be the star but I do expect him to get is power up, whatever it may be.

Hell, I didn't post it in the theory thread yet but when Vegeta used spirit fission, he knocked the energy out and it gathered above him. From there Vegeta controlled it and sent it back. If Vegeta effectively splits the angelic energy from Moro, with no host to go to, he'll most likely absorb it and get some sort of angel power up because unlike Moro Vegeta has trained his body his whole life and trained with Whis.

I like this idea of Vegeta getting UI, but it would be out of character for Vegeta to want to keep a stolen power that he didn't earn himself through training. I feel like if he does get it, he will later discard it and never use it again.