Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Cursed Lemon
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:18 am

...Let's recap how this dumb conversation got here.

Me: "Super is bad for reasons X, Y, and Z."

You: "I don't know why people don't like X when DB is full of them."

Me: "Not only are there too many in DB, there are too many in anime. They bore me now and I don't want to see them anymore."

You: "Okay but DB is full of X and you like it?"

Me: "DB helped make me sick of X. Also there are plenty of reasons to like DB besides X."

You: *visible confusion*

We are now here.
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Magnificent Ponta » Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:22 am

Cursed Lemon wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:18 am...Let's recap how this dumb conversation got here.
...So, you're not actually going to address the points I actually made, then; you're just going to continue to be rude.

I think we're done here, there's nothing further to be gained from this.

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Cursed Lemon
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:24 am

"Respond substantially to my points!"

"What points?"

"I don't have to do your job for you!"

Getting dumber.
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Jack Bz
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Jack Bz » Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:06 am

Cursed Lemon wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 10:24 am "Respond substantially to my points!"

"What points?"

"I don't have to do your job for you!"

Getting dumber.
Your style of arguing where you recap conversations by re-writing what people said in a way that makes you seem smart is needlessly hostile and just annoying to read quite frankly. If your stance is just that you hate all tournaments that exist across all anime, there's nowhere to go in that conversation and you just have a personal gripe with it. It's not something "wrong" with super.

Especially when the tournament of power has almost nothing in common with past tournaments in terms of structure, conclusion, stakes etc. Forgive Ponta for trying to engage in a deeper conversation.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:17 am

Surprisingly I actually found the Tournament of Power very intriguing, since it's not a classic tournament with 1v1 fights, but a battle royale with 80 fighters battling all at the same time. This makes the event feel so much more chaotic and ruthless. It's like a war. If you're fodder, you'll get destroyed in no time, you will never have spotlight, and no one will remember you. It's actually a very dark arc once you think about it.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Cursed Lemon » Sat Jan 16, 2021 3:05 pm

Jack Bz wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:06 amIf your stance is just that you hate all tournaments that exist across all anime, there's nowhere to go in that conversation and you just have a personal gripe with it. It's not something "wrong" with super.
We weren't having a conversation about the legitimacy of tournament arcs. We were, apparently, having a conversation about how my opinion on Dragon Ball is somehow invalidated by my not liking tournament arcs since Dragon Ball has a variety of them.

Someone needed be told how dumb that is.
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Jord » Tue Jan 19, 2021 12:15 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:17 am Surprisingly I actually found the Tournament of Power very intriguing, since it's not a classic tournament with 1v1 fights, but a battle royale with 80 fighters battling all at the same time. This makes the event feel so much more chaotic and ruthless. It's like a war. If you're fodder, you'll get destroyed in no time, you will never have spotlight, and no one will remember you. It's actually a very dark arc once you think about it.
I really like the idea of this huge war/Royal Rumble but in practice it was nowhere near as cool since they always focused on a few characters at a time with just some hazy void surrounding the fight. you never got the the idea that everyone was fighting at the same time.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by MasenkoHA » Tue Jan 19, 2021 7:56 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote: Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:17 am Surprisingly . It's actually a very dark arc once you think about it.
It’s really not though. Once someone falls off they just got transported to the spectator stand. Don’t know why you feel the need to make it sound darker than what it really was.


And yes there’s the whole “universe wiped from existence when all combatants representing their universe are defeated”’thing but we all know how that turned out.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by nhienphan2808 » Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:13 am

The anime : nothing wrong, it is ok.
The manga : It exists. RIP remotely in-character everyone.
ShadowWolf87 wrote:Freeza beat Goku, beat Vegeta, and destroyed the Earth. Even if no one else knows it, who does? Goku.
Who gets told it's his fault for being so careless? Goku.
Who has to live with that similar to how he wanted to make Freeza live with the fact he'd been beaten by what he considered trash, and have to live with that shame? Goku.
Freeza got the perfect revenge.

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super michael
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by super michael » Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:31 pm

How Goten and Trunks are treated in DBS Anime is just plain horrible, fans want to see them in action and not whatever weird forbidden role they are in. We like seeing characters motivated to do things, we don't want to see these character being stopped all the time.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by FPSSJ4_Goku » Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:16 pm

super michael wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:31 pm How Goten and Trunks are treated in DBS Anime is just plain horrible, fans want to see them in action and not whatever weird forbidden role they are in. We like seeing characters motivated to do things, we don't want to see these character being stopped all the time.
Then again, what the fuck are Goten and Trunks supposed to do besides age up? They ain't gonna do jack shit against Moro or Granolah. Goten doesn't have the guts to hurt Goku Black because he looks like his dad. They won't participate in the Universe 6 tournament because they're kids, for God's sake. And they won't be beating Golden Freeza or Beerus anytime soon.
So, you decided to read my signature, eh?

If you'd like, check out my YouTube channel, and maybe subscribe?

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Aizamasu » Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:49 am

nhienphan2808 wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:13 am The anime : nothing wrong, it is ok.
The manga : It exists. RIP remotely in-character everyone.
I think you got the anime and the manga mixed up.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by PurestEvil » Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:52 am

Aizamasu wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:49 am
nhienphan2808 wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:13 am The anime : nothing wrong, it is ok.
The manga : It exists. RIP remotely in-character everyone.
I think you got the anime and the manga mixed up.
Both are crap
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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by nhienphan2808 » Tue Aug 17, 2021 2:43 am

Aizamasu wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:49 am
nhienphan2808 wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:13 am The anime : nothing wrong, it is ok.
The manga : It exists. RIP remotely in-character everyone.
I think you got the anime and the manga mixed up.
The thing is i find it easier to accept the anime, if silly and hit and miss, as harmless fun fanservice filler with fun character interactions that i wasnt to see in Z, and i feel more comfortable knowing that it's set between the two past movies and the Broly movie. In the manga, those character moments were written in as well, but actively altered, tore down and destroyed by OOCness and nonsense development for both major characters by the Moro arc as they are both my favorite and dictate the battlefield, the mood for everyone else. I see anime Goku and Vegeta as Goku and Vegeta, if more derpy and over the top. I dont see Goku and Vegeta in the manga at all. That's just Toyotaro taking his characterization from American DBZ twitter with a little TFS sprinkled in.
Not to mention Toyotaro's presentation aka the art is abysmal.
ShadowWolf87 wrote:Freeza beat Goku, beat Vegeta, and destroyed the Earth. Even if no one else knows it, who does? Goku.
Who gets told it's his fault for being so careless? Goku.
Who has to live with that similar to how he wanted to make Freeza live with the fact he'd been beaten by what he considered trash, and have to live with that shame? Goku.
Freeza got the perfect revenge.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by super michael » Tue Aug 17, 2021 2:50 am

FPSSJ4_Goku wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:16 pm
super michael wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:31 pm How Goten and Trunks are treated in DBS Anime is just plain horrible, fans want to see them in action and not whatever weird forbidden role they are in. We like seeing characters motivated to do things, we don't want to see these character being stopped all the time.
Then again, what the fuck are Goten and Trunks supposed to do besides age up? They ain't gonna do jack shit against Moro or Granolah. Goten doesn't have the guts to hurt Goku Black because he looks like his dad. They won't participate in the Universe 6 tournament because they're kids, for God's sake. And they won't be beating Golden Freeza or Beerus anytime soon.
They had no problem returning the humans to fight even though they retired many years ago and were weakling.
Mr Satan a coward weakling got ordered to fight against Moro men, but Bulma didn't want to call her son to fight Moro men.
When Mr Satan becomes more reliable than Goten and Trunks, that is bad writing.

Character development exist, heck many of the Z fighters got that, even Vegeta who caused the danger in the first place.

They are not kids they are teenagers, they used the Dragon Balls and Super Dragon Balls a couple time, so a couple of years has passed.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Aizamasu » Tue Aug 17, 2021 4:32 am

nhienphan2808 wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 2:43 am
Aizamasu wrote: Tue Aug 17, 2021 1:49 am
nhienphan2808 wrote: Mon Aug 16, 2021 7:13 am The anime : nothing wrong, it is ok.
The manga : It exists. RIP remotely in-character everyone.
I think you got the anime and the manga mixed up.
The thing is i find it easier to accept the anime, if silly and hit and miss, as harmless fun fanservice filler with fun character interactions that i wasnt to see in Z, and i feel more comfortable knowing that it's set between the two past movies and the Broly movie. In the manga, those character moments were written in as well, but actively altered, tore down and destroyed by OOCness and nonsense development for both major characters by the Moro arc as they are both my favorite and dictate the battlefield, the mood for everyone else. I see anime Goku and Vegeta as Goku and Vegeta, if more derpy and over the top. I dont see Goku and Vegeta in the manga at all. That's just Toyotaro taking his characterization from American DBZ twitter with a little TFS sprinkled in.
Not to mention Toyotaro's presentation aka the art is abysmal.
I guess our opinions are simply completely opposite. I don’t even know what ”characterization from American DBZ twitter” means but I’ve enjoyed DBS manga as a continuation of the original manga as well as Goku and Vegeta’s characterization. And I don’t see any other DB artist doing the art better than Toyotaro (aside from Toriyama of course).

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Cipher » Tue Aug 17, 2021 6:40 pm

I love that this thread starts out with the ultimately over-generous “some of us” instead of the absolute gospel truth “all of us.” There’s nothing either version of Super offers or has ever pretended to offer but “more DB” for people who already know they enjoy it—much as I do genuinely enjoy the manga. It’s not a sequel you read/watch through the original to get to, and it’s not going to bring in anyone but child fans who caught it on TV on its own. (It did do that, but so could any flashy, fun serial.) It’s only ever been a matter of “If you like DB, you might find something more to enjoy here”—fun fluff! But optional fluff. It’s not the kind of thing you can earnestly recommend to a non-fan except in the sense of “Check it out after the original if you’re still hungry for more!”

Which is fine! But that’s what it is.

That isn’t really something “wrong” with it, to get at the thrust of the thread. Just something I found kind of funny coming off the opening post.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Nistarkail » Wed Aug 18, 2021 1:04 am

I still don't understand why Yamcha got a panel to confirm that he's one of the three strongest earthlings around. After those panels, we discovered that he and Tien together could not handle Moro's advisor, and the fight was not even showed.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Cipher » Wed Aug 18, 2021 3:12 am

Nistarkail wrote: Wed Aug 18, 2021 1:04 am I still don't understand why Yamcha got a panel to confirm that he's one of the three strongest earthlings around. After those panels, we discovered that he and Tien together could not handle Moro's advisor, and the fight was not even showed.
It’s important we know that Mr. Satan hasn’t surpassed him.

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Re: Everything Wrong with Dragon Ball Super

Post by Nistarkail » Wed Aug 18, 2021 4:05 pm

:D :D :D
Cipher wrote: Wed Aug 18, 2021 3:12 am
Nistarkail wrote: Wed Aug 18, 2021 1:04 am I still don't understand why Yamcha got a panel to confirm that he's one of the three strongest earthlings around. After those panels, we discovered that he and Tien together could not handle Moro's advisor, and the fight was not even showed.
It’s important we know that Mr. Satan hasn’t surpassed him.

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