is piccolo god level in the manga?

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Cipher » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:21 pm

dragonball0900 wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:17 pm I want to remind again that the Toppo and Dyspo team up example is invalid since Toppo, I repeat, was holding back since they were clearly fighting Goku and Vegeta in their mere SSJ/SSJ2 forms. Once Vegeta used CSSB, Dyspo was pushed aside with one hit and went on to fight Toppo.

Toppo and Dyspo in no way could fight as a team if Toppo uses his full power. And these are two fighters who had been in battles together for a good while as Pride Troopers.
Toppo and Dyspo continue to hang around one another late tournament, and we have the Pride Troopers' lower-powered members effectively taking on Kale together. (That's an example of evenly powered teamwork working against a stronger opponent, like Vegeta and Goku vs. Jiren near the end, but it stands to reason that lopsided pairs would still benefit. Though, yes, it is true that Dyspo and Toppo never fight together against an opponent around Toppo's full power.)

Zamasu takes Vegeta out with a sneak-attack kick at one point despite being weaker than SS3-level Trunks.

I don't know exactly how strong Piccolo is, but I don't see anything implying that he has to be in Gohan's realm in order to be part of (slightly, since they still lose) effective combination attacks against Saganbo, especially when that was the focus of their training, in order to beat Seven-Three.

Granted, the original run goes for "even if you team up, it won't make a difference" more often, but Super's worked to undo that idea in a couple of key places, and I think it stands as extra justification that the two had just trained in combination attacks.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by FrioPolar » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:35 pm

Cipher wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:13 pm
FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:06 pmTrunks and Zamasu are Blue level in the anime for doing nothing.
Is Trunks for-sure Blue level in the anime because he blocks one of Black's attacks in one scene, or is he for-sure not Blue level because later he gets another transformation that still has him below Goku and Vegeta, and that's a massive plot point?
Super Saiyan 2 Trunks survived a Kamehameha from Super Saiyan Rosé Black.

Trunks was Blue level in the anime even before his shitty transformation.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Cipher » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:37 pm

FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:35 pmTrunks was Blue level in the anime even before his shitty transformation.
Then what was he after?

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by dragonball0900 » Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:51 pm

Cipher wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:21 pm
dragonball0900 wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:17 pm I want to remind again that the Toppo and Dyspo team up example is invalid since Toppo, I repeat, was holding back since they were clearly fighting Goku and Vegeta in their mere SSJ/SSJ2 forms. Once Vegeta used CSSB, Dyspo was pushed aside with one hit and went on to fight Toppo.

Toppo and Dyspo in no way could fight as a team if Toppo uses his full power. And these are two fighters who had been in battles together for a good while as Pride Troopers.
Toppo and Dyspo continue to hang around one another late tournament, and we have the Pride Troopers' lower-powered members effectively taking on Kale together. (That's an example of evenly powered teamwork working against a stronger opponent, like Vegeta and Goku vs. Jiren near the end, but it stands to reason that lopsided pairs would still benefit. Though, yes, it is true that Dyspo and Toppo never fight together against an opponent around Toppo's full power.)

Zamasu takes Vegeta out with a sneak-attack kick at one point despite being weaker than SS3-level Trunks.

I don't know exactly how strong Piccolo is, but I don't see anything implying that he has to be in Gohan's realm in order to be part of (slightly, since they still lose) effective combination attacks against Saganbo, especially when that was the focus of their training, in order to beat Seven-Three.

Granted, the original run goes for "even if you team up, it won't make a difference" more often, but Super's worked to undo that idea in a couple of key places, and I think it stands as extra justification that the two had just trained in combination attacks.
Still, Toppo and Dyspo's fights together were all against mere SSJ/SSJ2s. We already saw what happened against CSSB Vegeta. Goku and Vegeta were fighting an already weakened Jiren, and both were both literally equals, which is why their teamwork could work. The Pride Troopers were also close to each other in strength, and another big factor regarding their teamwork was that Kale's movements were very easy to read (as Vegeta stated), and she was already getting weaker and weaker due to her crazy nature and excess of power.

I don't know in which part of the manga Zamasu sneaks attack Vegeta. Zamasu was only seen fighting Goku. And even if he did, it would just be a sneak attack since in DBS sneak attacks work more often. But Zamasu barely did any teaming ups with Black in the manga.

I also don't think Piccolo is Gohan level. But them working the way they did, taking the same punches, etc. he shouldn't be THAT far behind. Otherwise he would have been defeated way before Gohan. What we know for sure is that Piccolo is much stronger than both androids since they couldn't keep up in the fight, while Gohan and Piccolo were portrayed as the two strongest fighters on Earth. I'm pretty sure Piccolo should at least be far stronger than Dyspo, since the latter couldn't team up with a full power Toppo (and we know the Pride Troopers nearly always work as a team), while Piccolo could do it with a full power Gohan, who is logically stronger than Toppo (based on him being "barely recognizable" by Goku after training for 2 months). It makes sense since Android 17 was around Dyspo's level in the ToP or not that far above, and logically got somewhat stronger in the Moro Saga and was still outperformed by Piccolo.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Cipher » Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:00 pm

dragonball0900 wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:51 pm I don't know in which part of the manga Zamasu sneaks attack Vegeta. Zamasu was only seen fighting Goku. And even if he did, it would just be a sneak attack since in DBS sneak attacks work more often. But Zamasu barely did any teaming ups with Black in the manga.

I also don't think Piccolo is Gohan level. But them working the way they did, taking the same punches, etc. he shouldn't be THAT far behind. Otherwise he would have been defeated way before Gohan. What we know for sure is that Piccolo is much stronger than both androids since they couldn't keep up in the fight, while Gohan and Piccolo were portrayed as the two strongest fighters on Earth. I'm pretty sure Piccolo should at least be far stronger than Dyspo, since the latter couldn't team up with a full power Toppo (and we know the Pride Troopers nearly always work as a team), while Piccolo could do it with a full power Gohan, who is logically stronger than Toppo (based on him being "barely recognizable" by Goku after training for 2 months). It makes sense since Android 17 was around Dyspo's level in the ToP or not that far above, and logically got somewhat stronger in the Moro Saga and was still outperformed by Piccolo.
Zamasu catches Vegeta with a kick after SSG Vegeta has Black on the ropes, and knocks him flying. It's what prompts Goku to step in and begin fighting him to catch him with the Mafuba.

I personally don't see Piccolo being above No. 17 or there having been a major shift in strength order in the arc, when No. 17 was given multiple dialogue nods about how surprising his power was in the previous arc and everything for Piccolo outside a remark that he's stronger than he was before is down to interpreting specific attacks/panels in a teamwork fight. If there were anything to go on other than scrutinizing individual punches and kicks during the Gohan-partnered bout, I'd sing a different tune. But individual moments are always the least reliable for assessing strength, especially in DBS, which has highlighted other means of making up the gaps during moment-to-moment fighting. Could be teamwork, sneak attacks, technique, etc. Dialogue references are solid; panel-to-panel exchanges come with question marks.

I'm not even sure he's shown to be doing better than No. 17, who is tossed around like a ragdoll alongside unquestionably-the-strongest-there Gohan earlier in the fight, but to any extent that he is, as long as it's alongside Gohan and not on his own, it's easy to attribute to the two having honed their team-attacks during training.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by dragonball0900 » Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:35 pm

Cipher wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:00 pm
dragonball0900 wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:51 pm I don't know in which part of the manga Zamasu sneaks attack Vegeta. Zamasu was only seen fighting Goku. And even if he did, it would just be a sneak attack since in DBS sneak attacks work more often. But Zamasu barely did any teaming ups with Black in the manga.

I also don't think Piccolo is Gohan level. But them working the way they did, taking the same punches, etc. he shouldn't be THAT far behind. Otherwise he would have been defeated way before Gohan. What we know for sure is that Piccolo is much stronger than both androids since they couldn't keep up in the fight, while Gohan and Piccolo were portrayed as the two strongest fighters on Earth. I'm pretty sure Piccolo should at least be far stronger than Dyspo, since the latter couldn't team up with a full power Toppo (and we know the Pride Troopers nearly always work as a team), while Piccolo could do it with a full power Gohan, who is logically stronger than Toppo (based on him being "barely recognizable" by Goku after training for 2 months). It makes sense since Android 17 was around Dyspo's level in the ToP or not that far above, and logically got somewhat stronger in the Moro Saga and was still outperformed by Piccolo.
Zamasu catches Vegeta with a kick after SSG Vegeta has Black on the ropes, and knocks him flying. It's what prompts Goku to step in and begin fighting him to catch him with the Mafuba.

I personally don't see Piccolo being above No. 17 or there having been a major shift in strength order in the arc, when No. 17 was given multiple dialogue nods about how surprising his power was in the previous arc and everything for Piccolo outside a remark that he's stronger than he was before is down to interpreting specific attacks/panels in a teamwork fight. If there were anything to go on other than scrutinizing individual punches and kicks during the Gohan-partnered bout, I'd sing a different tune.

I'm not even sure he's shown to be doing better than No. 17, who is tossed around like a ragdoll alongside unquestionably-the-strongest-there Gohan earlier in the fight, but to any extent that he is, as long as it's alongside Gohan and not on his own, it's easy to attribute to the two having honed their team-attacks during training.
Just checked, and yeah, he does kick him away. But Vegeta was unfazed. And Zamasu has the advantage of being inmortal, so he could obviously tank shots against someone much stronger.

There doesn't need to be statements regarding Piccolo's level, since the attention here is towards Goku and Vegeta. It wasn't like in the ToP when 17 was a key player, which is why there were statements regarding his power. Since Piccolo is not a key player in this arc, the story doesn't need to focus on his gains that much, but more to Goku and Vegeta's. That's why Piccolo and Gohan have this statement made by Goku that their levels were "barely recognizable", a simple statement that doesn't turn away from the focus of the story, to show that they had made big gains, and the most logical situation is that both had to be very strong to hype Saganbo's power, and in turn, to hype Goku's. It wouldn't make sense for Piccolo's strength to still be below 17 for him to be relevant in such statement, as well as the feats he had against Saganbo.

And he did perform better than 17, since 17 couldn't even fight anymore, as well as 18. All they could do is just watch while Gohan and Piccolo kept on fighting, and they even have infinite energy. If 17 was still stronger than Piccolo, he would have kept on fighting and last just as much as Gohan and Piccolo, since he also has infinite energy on top. Both androids were even amazed in one panel when Gohan and Piccolo were ki blasting Saganbo at their max. And there is no way Piccolo could keep up with a far stronger Gohan if he was still weaker than a guy who was also way weaker than Gohan. If the power gap was way too big, they simply wouldn't be able to team up in a fight to the death against someone far stronger than them.
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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Lionel » Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:18 am

As far as what we have to compare the team effort of Gohan and Piccolo with, there are past examples from the Saiyan up until Cell arcs. It's collaborations where the teammates having significant discrepancies that's harder to filter out from the array of fights where both or more teammates were comparable in strength. Far as I'm aware, those examples include Piccolo, Gohan, and Krillin clashing with Freeza and Vegeta, Trunks, Piccolo, and Tenshinhan engaging the cyborgs -- the latter being more of a co-belligerency than an outright team up.

In the first example, Freeza never outright returns attacks to any of his opponents. On a surface level the impression one might have is that the three are comparable with respect to their efforts against Freeza though it's more like they're all equally helpless as their enemy is just too powerful for individual strength to matter. The second is more nuanced as the twins actually fight back -- Trunks and Piccolo receiving two blows each before going down while Tenshinhan is chocked into submission.

Gohan and Piccolo were portrayed and acknowledged as combative equals. It's not as though one served as an asset but was recognised as only being an auxiliary to a main fighter like Krillin and Gohan were for Vegeta in a potential match up against first form Freeza.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by ZombieVito » Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:51 am

FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:35 pm
Cipher wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:13 pm
FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:06 pmTrunks and Zamasu are Blue level in the anime for doing nothing.
Is Trunks for-sure Blue level in the anime because he blocks one of Black's attacks in one scene, or is he for-sure not Blue level because later he gets another transformation that still has him below Goku and Vegeta, and that's a massive plot point?
Super Saiyan 2 Trunks survived a Kamehameha from Super Saiyan Rosé Black.

Trunks was Blue level in the anime even before his shitty transformation.
I guess base Kid Trunks is Super Boo level since he survived a hit right to the face from him.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by FrioPolar » Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:55 am

ZombieVito wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:51 am
FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:35 pm
Cipher wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:13 pm
Is Trunks for-sure Blue level in the anime because he blocks one of Black's attacks in one scene, or is he for-sure not Blue level because later he gets another transformation that still has him below Goku and Vegeta, and that's a massive plot point?
Super Saiyan 2 Trunks survived a Kamehameha from Super Saiyan Rosé Black.

Trunks was Blue level in the anime even before his shitty transformation.
I guess base Kid Trunks is Super Boo level since he survived a hit right to the face from him.
Pointless argument.

Trunks survived a Kamehameha that knocked out Super Saiyan Blue Goku.

Super Saiyan 2 Trunks is Blue level.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Dragon Wukong » Tue Apr 06, 2021 9:19 am

ZombieVito wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 11:47 pm Goku straight up says 17 is almost as powerful as him.
He uses the "us" plurality, so I'd argue the dialogue is ambiguous if he's collectively referring to the other powerful Z fighters. 17 certainly doesn't have any notable feats implying it.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by BWri » Tue Apr 06, 2021 10:01 am

Koitsukai wrote: Sat Apr 03, 2021 6:42 pm I don't believe making a good team with a blue level character makes you blue level without a doubt
Dragon Ball doesn't really employ these team mechanics that some of you are mentioning especially with direct hand to hand combat. If Piccolo is outclassed as some people are saying, he'd simply be "in the way" or too weak to keep up with Gohan.

Piccolo downplay seems to bring out the strangest arguments in people. Base Saiyans and two base theory and now the teamup amp, how bizarre :wtf: .
Dyspo and Toppo were a pretty good team in the Manga and weren't even close.
So were the rest of the Pride Troopers but they lost to SSJ1 Goku 5v1. Dyspo and Toppo only exclusively fought SSJ2 Goku and Vegeta together which meant Toppo was greatly holding back (likely to pace himself). Goku went SSB to break away and go straight for Jiren. As soon as Vegeta went SSB, he swatted Dyspo away which again, proves our argument that Piccolo is closer to Gohan in power than Dyspo was to Toppo. Since Piccolo kept pace and took the same level of hits that Gohan did, while fighting longer than 2 fighters with infinite energy/stamina, 1 of which was said to be "about as strong as us" from Goku in reference to himself and Vegeta at the end of the previous arc. The writing is on the wall, Piccolo is a beast!
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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Tai Lung » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:32 pm

FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:06 pm Image

Trunks and Zamasu are Blue level in the anime for doing nothing.

Piccolo at least trained.

It is not the biggest nonsense that has been seen in Super.
Super series be demonstrated "Dai kaioshin" that The kaioshins can reach a god level
Image
who tells you that black and zamasu don't train together

It is logic, they are a race of gods while Zamasu is described as a prodigy

piccolo is not

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by FrioPolar » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:41 pm

Tai Lung wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:32 pm
FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:06 pm Image

Trunks and Zamasu are Blue level in the anime for doing nothing.

Piccolo at least trained.

It is not the biggest nonsense that has been seen in Super.
Super series be demonstrated "Dai kaioshin" that The kaioshins can reach a god level
Image
who tells you that black and zamasu don't train together

It is logic, they are a race of gods while Zamasu is described as a prodigy

piccolo is not
When was it explained that Future Zamasu trained to reach Blue level?

I didn't see Zamasu training with Black and Zamasu doesn't say he did.

If it doesn't show or say then it didn't happen.
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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:50 pm

Goku literally said upon engaging Future Zamasu that he felt "different" compared to Present Zamasu.

That's the only explanation that is needed to form a coherent story.

No, we don't need 10 episodes of Zamasu and Black training to form a coherent story. One simple statement that Zamasu feels "different" after 20 years is enough.

And by the way it was already said that Zamasu was a fighting PRODIGY and GENIUS and he was already able to match SS2 Goku in battle. If Frieza can go from Fodder tier to SSB tier in 4 months, then there's no problem whatsoever with Zamasu going from post-BoG SS2 tier to SSB tier in 20 years. Especially since Zamasu was a prodigy of his kind, as I was saying.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by FrioPolar » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:56 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:50 pm Goku literally said upon engaging Future Zamasu that he felt "different" compared to Present Zamasu.

That's the only explanation that is needed to form a coherent story.

No, we don't need 10 episodes of Zamasu and Black training to form a coherent story. One simple statement that Zamasu feels "different" after 20 years is enough.

And by the way it was already said that Zamasu was a fighting PRODIGY and GENIUS and he was already able to match SS2 Goku in battle. If Frieza can go from Fodder tier to SSB tier in 4 months, then there's no problem whatsoever with Zamasu going from post-BoG SS2 tier to SSB tier in 20 years. Especially since Zamasu was a prodigy of his kind, as I was saying.
It was never said that Future Zamasu trained to reach Blue Level, therefore he did not, your theories and interpretations are useless.
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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:57 pm

Tai Lung wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:58 pm
Vados yes, because she had already seen toppo and goku fight and the only exception is jiren
with whis, his silence is because he feels doubts otherwise he would have affirmed it
Vados is clearly not aware of the power of ALL the warriors in the tournament because she claims that Kefla is unmatched, which she is not since Gohan is able to match her.

The narrative is very straightforward if we are talking about statements, you don't have to take the Vados' line as gospel or as something absolute because it is explicitly proven wrong. Unless you want to argue that Gohan is superior to Goku, Vegeta, Toppo and Jiren (who in his suppressed state was able to resist without a scratch to a point blank Kamehameha from CSSB Goku).

And on top of that, we have Gohan explicitly telling Goku to go face the stronger Jiren, while he faced the weaker Kefla, which also reinforces the fact that he was weaker
Tai Lung wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:58 pm not that shows that gohan is stronger and is capable of defeating someone who humiliated golden frieza ... FACTS!!
Not only is it Vados ... champa too and even kahseral agrees
basically the author is clarifying it several times
Freeza stated that he would be able to defeat Kale if he took her seriously, period. If Kefla is not placed as someone stronger than SSB tier characters, then the weaker Kale obviously would not be either

Tai Lung wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:58 pm again ... keeping silence is not the same as agreeing
Krillin does not know the power of goku because he stopped accompanying him in his battles a long time ago different from the angels who know his current power ...

krillin does not know the power of gohan in cell games and he was sure that goku was stronger and he was wrong
No one knew Gohan's true power in CG because he literally hadn't shown it. During the ToP Krillin implies that Gohan is weaker than Goku DURING his fight against Kefla (that is, after witnessing his power), and after seeing Goku use all of his power against Jiren earlier. So he actually HAS a parameter to affirm that, and again, this notion is not disputed by any character nor by the manga itself, since there is no statement implying that Gohan was stronger than an SSB level character
Tai Lung wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:58 pm this is clear ... all those characters who are capable of feeling the power of goku .. they are sure of it
and this is stated several times is basically a clarification of the author ... and again it only shows that gohan is god level
Gohan can be God level and still be weaker than SSB Goku (you seem to be implying the opposite)

I am almost certain that he is at least as strong as ToP SSG Goku (if not more), but my point is that he is weaker than CSSB Goku and other characters of the same level because that is stated in the tournament

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:58 pm

FrioPolar wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:56 pm
SupremeKai25 wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:50 pm Goku literally said upon engaging Future Zamasu that he felt "different" compared to Present Zamasu.

That's the only explanation that is needed to form a coherent story.

No, we don't need 10 episodes of Zamasu and Black training to form a coherent story. One simple statement that Zamasu feels "different" after 20 years is enough.

And by the way it was already said that Zamasu was a fighting PRODIGY and GENIUS and he was already able to match SS2 Goku in battle. If Frieza can go from Fodder tier to SSB tier in 4 months, then there's no problem whatsoever with Zamasu going from post-BoG SS2 tier to SSB tier in 20 years. Especially since Zamasu was a prodigy of his kind, as I was saying.
It was never said that Future Zamasu trained, therefore he did not, your theories and interpretations are useless.
It doesn't matter. It was already said that Future Zamasu felt "different", the story acknowledges this as a fact. Your disbelief is useless.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by Tai Lung » Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:00 pm

FrioPolar wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:41 pm
Tai Lung wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:32 pm
FrioPolar wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:06 pm Image

Trunks and Zamasu are Blue level in the anime for doing nothing.

Piccolo at least trained.

It is not the biggest nonsense that has been seen in Super.
Super series be demonstrated "Dai kaioshin" that The kaioshins can reach a god level
Image
who tells you that black and zamasu don't train together

It is logic, they are a race of gods while Zamasu is described as a prodigy

piccolo is not
When was it explained that Future Zamasu trained to reach Blue level?

I didn't see Zamasu training with Black and Zamasu doesn't say he did.
The fact that it is not explained does not mean that it is not is true especially because black had to reach that level fighting obviously not only with trunks ... having zamasu as a partner
also goku says that future zamasu is stronger than the present
Image
and daikaio too ... the same kaioshin south one of the strongest

also surviving a blast attack is not a "mistake"
Image
beacuse at least they survive without being able to move

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by FrioPolar » Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:05 pm

SupremeKai25 wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:58 pm
FrioPolar wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:56 pm
SupremeKai25 wrote: Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:50 pm Goku literally said upon engaging Future Zamasu that he felt "different" compared to Present Zamasu.

That's the only explanation that is needed to form a coherent story.

No, we don't need 10 episodes of Zamasu and Black training to form a coherent story. One simple statement that Zamasu feels "different" after 20 years is enough.

And by the way it was already said that Zamasu was a fighting PRODIGY and GENIUS and he was already able to match SS2 Goku in battle. If Frieza can go from Fodder tier to SSB tier in 4 months, then there's no problem whatsoever with Zamasu going from post-BoG SS2 tier to SSB tier in 20 years. Especially since Zamasu was a prodigy of his kind, as I was saying.
It was never said that Future Zamasu trained, therefore he did not, your theories and interpretations are useless.
It was already said that Future Zamasu felt "different", the story acknowledges this as a fact. Your disbelief is useless.
Nope.

What is a fact is that Zamasu is Blue Level for doing nothing.

It was never explained that Future Zamasu trained to reach Blue Level.

Your theories are worthless.

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Re: is piccolo god level in the manga?

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:12 pm

The problem with Future Zamasu's power is that even assuming that he trained all these years, his strength is not consistently shown to be SSB level

At the beginning of the episode he is able to exchange punches and even press SSB Goku, but in the final portion when he faces Trunks he is completely overwhelmed by him and survives only because of his immortality. Considering what happened in that same episode with Trunks (who also landed some hits on Black), it is safe to assume that Zamasu is not necessarily SSB level just like Trunks wasn't either

In the later fights, Black is the one who always takes the lead and directly faces oku / Vegeta, Future Zamasu acts more as a support.

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