Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Thread: "Super Hero"

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Skar » Sun May 30, 2021 6:46 pm

Noah wrote: Sat May 29, 2021 4:27 pmMy thoughts exactly. I don't know why people has this foolish expectation that Toei will adapt Toyotaro stories. The anime and the manga are clearly different products, one is the main and the other started being promotional to then later being its own thing. I believe when the anime returns we might get a new story after Broly and not Moro or not even Granola.
I don't mean to derail the thread but I wanted to ask since I've seen this come up a lot. What makes you say the manga is its own thing if Toriyama is still involved? Is Toriyama going to provide different outlines for Toei to adapt and have them ignore the manga after Broly?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by HeroR » Mon May 31, 2021 12:37 am

Skar wrote: Sun May 30, 2021 6:46 pm
Noah wrote: Sat May 29, 2021 4:27 pmMy thoughts exactly. I don't know why people has this foolish expectation that Toei will adapt Toyotaro stories. The anime and the manga are clearly different products, one is the main and the other started being promotional to then later being its own thing. I believe when the anime returns we might get a new story after Broly and not Moro or not even Granola.
I don't mean to derail the thread but I wanted to ask since I've seen this come up a lot. What makes you say the manga is its own thing if Toriyama is still involved? Is Toriyama going to provide different outlines for Toei to adapt and have them ignore the manga after Broly?
The manga has been its own thing since the Future Trunks Saga. Character’s personalities are different between the manga and anime like Black, Fusion Zamasu, Toppo, and Jiren. Even manga Hit is not the same as anime Hit. That along with different events like how Fusion Zamasu’s immortality and how UI works and how Goku got it. Or the difference versions of Blue that don’t exists in the anime outside of SSBE. What the anime and manga have in common are broad strokes.

As for future, who knows. While Toriyama advised Toyo on the Moro stuff, it wasn’t his outline, it was more or less Toyo’s story, and even the new stuff is strange since Toriyama outlined it, but did literally no character designs and the current arc only gets the same advisement as Moro and isn’t treated as special despite being a Toriyama story.

So people shouldn’t say either way the anime will adapt the movie until we see what the movie is. And that’s assuming the anime comes back since that hasn’t been confirmed.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Skar » Mon May 31, 2021 12:05 pm

HeroR wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 12:37 amThe manga has been its own thing since the Future Trunks Saga. Character’s personalities are different between the manga and anime like Black, Fusion Zamasu, Toppo, and Jiren. Even manga Hit is not the same as anime Hit. That along with different events like how Fusion Zamasu’s immortality and how UI works and how Goku got it. Or the difference versions of Blue that don’t exists in the anime outside of SSBE. What the anime and manga have in common are broad strokes.

As for future, who knows. While Toriyama advised Toyo on the Moro stuff, it wasn’t his outline, it was more or less Toyo’s story, and even the new stuff is strange since Toriyama outlined it, but did literally no character designs and the current arc only gets the same advisement as Moro and isn’t treated as special despite being a Toriyama story.

So people shouldn’t say either way the anime will adapt the movie until we see what the movie is. And that’s assuming the anime comes back since that hasn’t been confirmed.
I'm aware they diverged but they still followed the same basic outline from Toriyama. I recall Toyotaro saying he would be ahead of the anime and working with them more after the ToP which wouldn't make sense if Toei was going to completely disregard the newer arcs in the manga. There are several mangas on V-Jump that sold far less than DBS and still had anime adaptations. It's unlikely Toei could continue on their own without Toriyama so that would mean they would have to ask him for new outlines. I don't see why they wouldn't just use what's available in the manga then do that.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by sangofe » Mon May 31, 2021 1:15 pm

Skar wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 12:05 pm
HeroR wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 12:37 amThe manga has been its own thing since the Future Trunks Saga. Character’s personalities are different between the manga and anime like Black, Fusion Zamasu, Toppo, and Jiren. Even manga Hit is not the same as anime Hit. That along with different events like how Fusion Zamasu’s immortality and how UI works and how Goku got it. Or the difference versions of Blue that don’t exists in the anime outside of SSBE. What the anime and manga have in common are broad strokes.

As for future, who knows. While Toriyama advised Toyo on the Moro stuff, it wasn’t his outline, it was more or less Toyo’s story, and even the new stuff is strange since Toriyama outlined it, but did literally no character designs and the current arc only gets the same advisement as Moro and isn’t treated as special despite being a Toriyama story.

So people shouldn’t say either way the anime will adapt the movie until we see what the movie is. And that’s assuming the anime comes back since that hasn’t been confirmed.
I'm aware they diverged but they still followed the same basic outline from Toriyama. I recall Toyotaro saying he would be ahead of the anime and working with them more after the ToP which wouldn't make sense if Toei was going to completely disregard the newer arcs in the manga. There are several mangas on V-Jump that sold far less than DBS and still had anime adaptations. It's unlikely Toei could continue on their own without Toriyama so that would mean they would have to ask him for new outlines. I don't see why they wouldn't just use what's available in the manga then do that.
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lets talk about the movie here and a potential continuation elsewhere!

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by SupremeKai25 » Mon May 31, 2021 3:59 pm

Since Toriyama said that the returning character will be only "slightly" unexpected, then it won't be Zamasu, since I doubt he would be only "slightly" unexpected (since he was literally "erased from existence" in an alternate timeline, so he'd be very unexpected). And I'm fine with that, I thought Zamasu's conclusion was good and I am okay with it being the definitive/ultimate conclusion to his story.

So then the returning character might really just be someone like Hit or Caulifla or Toppo or why not Future Trunks, who all could serve as a supporting character. I really should apply Occam's Razor more and just keep my expectations low.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by PurestEvil » Mon May 31, 2021 5:23 pm

I find predicting this "slightly unexpected" character to be nerve-wracking. WTF does Toriyama mean by that? Was he being tongue in cheek or literal? If he is being serious, is it an old character or a modern one? It cannot be Broly or Freeza, that would be too obvious. I don't see what Future Trunks would do in the main timeline anymore. Caulifla and Kale are good picks, but I don't think they will come to U7 themselves. Hit seems to have outlived his usefulness. I don't see how he cares about the human warriors at this point, unfortunately, so I doubt Yamcha is making a Rogafufu Comeback.
If Toriyama said it with flippancy, I hope he doesn't bring a gag character like Tarble back. Goddamn I can see it already, fuck.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by SupremeKai25 » Mon May 31, 2021 6:12 pm

PurestEvil wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 5:23 pm I don't see what Future Trunks would do in the main timeline anymore.
Well he did say at the end of the Future Trunks arc "Until we meet again!", which would allude to a second return of this character:

Image

Plus people constantly bring up the whole Time Patrol/Time Breakers stuff from the videogames as interesting material that could be used in canon, and Trunks is naturally related to that storyline. A new threat might have appeared in his timeline after Zamasu's defeat.

But really Future Trunks is super popular so Toriyama might want to milk him some more, it wouldn't surprise me. I'm going for the easiest solution and honestly Future Trunks' return seems like a winning premise for a new movie.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Koitsukai » Mon May 31, 2021 6:45 pm

I'd be down for a movie about the Time Patrol.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Grimlock » Mon May 31, 2021 8:03 pm

PurestEvil wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 5:23 pmI don't see what Future Trunks would do in the main timeline anymore.
He would be a lot better than at least half of the actual members of the Tournament of Power, that's for sure.

With Trunks around you also have the opportunity to "alleviate" a bit that whole "Goku and Vegeta show" thing. Granted, Trunks is half Saiyan so you'd have more Saiyans in the spotlight but still, Trunks personality would probably "solve" that. Plus, Trunks doesn't have those ugly forms recolors, that's a bonus (now if only we could forget the existence of Super Saiyan Rage and stick only to the great Super Saiyan 2...).

With Trunks around it would also be possible for new fusions when needed instead of Gogeta and Vegetto all the time. Vegenks would be very welcome. And then there's the interactions and reactions (though this is something Future Trunks saga kind of dropped the ball on, you don't see him reacting to some stuff that would be interesting otherwise).
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by JulieYBM » Mon May 31, 2021 9:05 pm

I imagine that it's going to be Broli again. Doing a full-on sequel would technically break the norms of these last three films.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by PurestEvil » Tue Jun 01, 2021 4:45 am

Grimlock wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 8:03 pm
PurestEvil wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 5:23 pmI don't see what Future Trunks would do in the main timeline anymore.
He would be a lot better than at least half of the actual members of the Tournament of Power, that's for sure.
SupremeKai25 wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 6:12 pm Well he did say at the end of the Future Trunks arc "Until we meet again!", which would allude to a second return of this character:
I will admit that it would be cool to see Future Trunks come back (hopefully rectifying that sloppy conclusion), but again, I don't really see Future Trunks coming back to our timeline. I don't know how useful he would be there. Like what SupremeKai25 said, I am better off keeping my expectations low to prevent disappointment.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by ZeroNeonix » Tue Jun 01, 2021 7:45 am

I am not a fan of Super's version of Trunks. Everything about him irritates me, from the way they retroactively try to retcon the color of his hair, despite his younger self being right there, to the unexplained and pointless transformation they gave him in the anime version, to the way Super completely forgets Trunks' original moves (Burning Attack?) and just treat him like Vegeta Jr... If the next movie stars Future Trunks, I'm not going to be happy.

That said, if Toriyama said the next villain is "slightly unexpected," that tells me a few things: 1) This is not a new villain. This is someone we've seen before. 2) This is probably not Moro, since the movie following the manga's story after where the anime left off would not be unexpected. It would surprise people who only watch the anime, and probably never heard of Moro. 3) There's a good chance this villain is another suggestion from TOEI. "Hey, Toriyama, X character is popular. Can you write a story about X?" Inb4 the movie title is announced to be "Dragon Ball Super: Cooler."

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Hugo Boss » Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:55 am

ZeroNeonix wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 7:45 am 3) There's a good chance this villain is another suggestion from TOEI. "Hey, Toriyama, X character is popular. Can you write a story about X?" Inb4 the movie title is announced to be "Dragon Ball Super: Cooler."
I get that Coola is popular (probably because of Freeza), but still I don’t see them repeating the same theme from Resurrection of Freeza. Aren’t there other popular antagonists besides Broly and Freeza’s acquaintances?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by ZeroNeonix » Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:42 am

Hugo Boss wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 8:55 am
ZeroNeonix wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 7:45 am 3) There's a good chance this villain is another suggestion from TOEI. "Hey, Toriyama, X character is popular. Can you write a story about X?" Inb4 the movie title is announced to be "Dragon Ball Super: Cooler."
I get that Coola is popular (probably because of Freeza), but still I don’t see them repeating the same theme from Resurrection of Freeza. Aren’t there other popular antagonists besides Broly and Freeza’s acquaintances?
Well, they did give us Kale as a canon stand in for Broly just before giving us the Broly movie. Super is full of unnecessary nostalgia bait, even when it makes no sense. I'm hoping for something a little more creative, that takes advantage of the multiverse the series has to play with now, but keeping my expectations low.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Yuji » Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:56 am

ZeroNeonix wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 7:45 am I am not a fan of Super's version of Trunks. Everything about him irritates me, from the way they retroactively try to retcon the color of his hair, despite his younger self being right there, to the unexplained and pointless transformation they gave him in the anime version, to the way Super completely forgets Trunks' original moves (Burning Attack?) and just treat him like Vegeta Jr... If the next movie stars Future Trunks, I'm not going to be happy.

That said, if Toriyama said the next villain is "slightly unexpected," that tells me a few things: 1) This is not a new villain. This is someone we've seen before. 2) This is probably not Moro, since the movie following the manga's story after where the anime left off would not be unexpected. It would surprise people who only watch the anime, and probably never heard of Moro. 3) There's a good chance this villain is another suggestion from TOEI. "Hey, Toriyama, X character is popular. Can you write a story about X?" Inb4 the movie title is announced to be "Dragon Ball Super: Cooler."
He didn't say anything about the villain. He said the film will feature an unexpected character. That could mean just about anything.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by ZeroNeonix » Tue Jun 01, 2021 12:06 pm

Yuji wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:56 am
ZeroNeonix wrote: Tue Jun 01, 2021 7:45 am I am not a fan of Super's version of Trunks. Everything about him irritates me, from the way they retroactively try to retcon the color of his hair, despite his younger self being right there, to the unexplained and pointless transformation they gave him in the anime version, to the way Super completely forgets Trunks' original moves (Burning Attack?) and just treat him like Vegeta Jr... If the next movie stars Future Trunks, I'm not going to be happy.

That said, if Toriyama said the next villain is "slightly unexpected," that tells me a few things: 1) This is not a new villain. This is someone we've seen before. 2) This is probably not Moro, since the movie following the manga's story after where the anime left off would not be unexpected. It would surprise people who only watch the anime, and probably never heard of Moro. 3) There's a good chance this villain is another suggestion from TOEI. "Hey, Toriyama, X character is popular. Can you write a story about X?" Inb4 the movie title is announced to be "Dragon Ball Super: Cooler."
He didn't say anything about the villain. He said the film will feature an unexpected character. That could mean just about anything.
Ah. Well, at this point, Gohan would be an unexpected character. Or Buu. Jesus Christ, are they ever going to let Buu do anything? I swear to God, if they use that "he fell asleep and won't wake up" plot point again, I'm going to lose it. That was only slightly amusing the first time.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by UpFromTheSkies » Wed Jun 02, 2021 7:59 am

HeroR wrote: Mon May 31, 2021 12:37 am
Skar wrote: Sun May 30, 2021 6:46 pm
Noah wrote: Sat May 29, 2021 4:27 pmMy thoughts exactly. I don't know why people has this foolish expectation that Toei will adapt Toyotaro stories. The anime and the manga are clearly different products, one is the main and the other started being promotional to then later being its own thing. I believe when the anime returns we might get a new story after Broly and not Moro or not even Granola.
I don't mean to derail the thread but I wanted to ask since I've seen this come up a lot. What makes you say the manga is its own thing if Toriyama is still involved? Is Toriyama going to provide different outlines for Toei to adapt and have them ignore the manga after Broly?
The manga has been its own thing since the Future Trunks Saga. Character’s personalities are different between the manga and anime like Black, Fusion Zamasu, Toppo, and Jiren. Even manga Hit is not the same as anime Hit. That along with different events like how Fusion Zamasu’s immortality and how UI works and how Goku got it. Or the difference versions of Blue that don’t exists in the anime outside of SSBE. What the anime and manga have in common are broad strokes.
I think they are different because they were both interpreting Toriyamas outlines at the same time but independently. Unlike the anime, though, the manga was sent to Toriyama for approval, so I personally consider it more canon than the anime.
As for future, who knows. While Toriyama advised Toyo on the Moro stuff, it wasn’t his outline, it was more or less Toyo’s story, and even the new stuff is strange since Toriyama outlined it, but did literally no character designs and the current arc only gets the same advisement as Moro and isn’t treated as special despite being a Toriyama story.
That's interesting, I didn't know that. Did Toyo reveal that in an interview?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by jd55513 » Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:59 am

Guys, after rewatching the Broly Movie, and rereading the Moro and Granolah arc.
I can almost guarantee you, the movie will be set AFTER the Granolah arc...
The "slightly unexpected character" from Toriyamas statement of the movie, matches up with Frieza imo.

While there could be another mascot villian to carry the movie, I truly think it's another Resurrection F movie, but a sorta final stand for Freeza's character.

We know from the DBS volume 13 extra pages, that Frieza was aware of the Moro fight and likely had drones still on Earth monitoring any developments.
It's possible Frieza was aware of Moro fusing with 73 and the copied abilities of Merus.

Now with the Granolah arc we have a literal plot point of the story with Frieza and the Cerealieans.

I think If he gets Ultra Instinct or Hakai, Frieza will truly be relavent again. That's why it makes so much sense.
The Granolah arc is a perfect "setup arc" for Frieza to be reintroduced in the manga and do something that ties into the movie (making the wish or having 73s copied abilities)

Ever since the Tournament of Power and witnessing the Ultra Instinct technique, and it's reaction with the gods. Frieza knew Goku was stronger than him. However he also realized that having a technique like that would be the bridge to him continuing his plans for universal conquest and controlling the gods.

Same with Hakai. He witnessed first hand, the power of a destroyer.

Then in the Broly Movie he wanted to make a wish to be taller(a gag of course) but it would lead to a power increase I imagine.
Then in the Moro arc we knew he had spy drones that witnessed the battle with Moro. It's possible Frieza saw Moro and the 73 copy abilities and Ultra Instinct Moro.

Now in the Granolah arc, we have had Frieza name drops for awhile now. It's all leading to something, and why not, that "something" be a movie?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by UpFromTheSkies » Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:45 am

jd55513 wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:59 am Guys, after rewatching the Broly Movie, and rereading the Moro and Granolah arc.
I can almost guarantee you, the movie will be set AFTER the Granolah arc...
The "slightly unexpected character" from Toriyamas statement of the movie, matches up with Frieza imo.
Toriyama said the unexpected character is to be featured in one of the battles, that doesn't sound like he's referring to the movies main villian, and Freeza has been pretty active in Dragon Ball Super, so he wouldn't really be unexpected. I'd absolutely expect him to appear in the new movie unless he gets killed in the Granolah arc, although I'm half expecting Goku to save him from getting killed by Granolah

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Re: Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Coming 2022! (Toriyama Scripting!)

Post by Koitsukai » Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:00 pm

It could be Broly, though. An extra help for the fight, but not a decisive factor, considering how behind he is from the boys by now... or zenkais + training from time to time with Goku, puts him above everybody and he'll come in to win the fight.
I mean, Broly would be unexpected if he shows up just to fight, just like Jiren would've been if he showed up to help them against Broly, or when Beerus tried to do the same against Moro.

I guess it depends on where the franchise is at the time the movie comes out, maybe Broly shows up in the following manga chapter, so he wouldn't be unexpected in the movie if he has already shown up.

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