What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Fri Jun 04, 2021 7:23 am

Foreword: This is mostly a tongue-in-cheek post. This is not a serious criticism of Toriyama or Toyotaro's writing.

The Dragon Ball revival era has expanded the Dragon World in some unexpected ways, often expanding characters' abilities with new caveats and generally revising the established lore. Some of these are widely accepted by fans, others less so. Let's do a quick rundown of some prominent examples.

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  • The time limit for Potara fusion between mortals is introduced.
  • It's revealed that any Kaioshin apprentice, mortal or otherwise, gains the mystical healing powers of Kibito.
  • Bibidi didn't create Majin Buu, he merely woke him up -- Buu has actually existed since 'time immemorial'.
  • Pure Buu, and by extension Uub, inherited some of Dai Kaioshin's godly power even after Fat Buu was ripped out by Vegeta.
  • Goku busts out the Hakai technique out of nowhere.
  • Namekians are actually not from Planet Namek, but from a mysterious other realm they have long forgotten.
I had a thoroughly daft idea a while ago that Goku or Vegeta could potentially retain the power of a Fusion from muscle memory without actually having to perform the ritual, so they could bust out an unfused Gogeta or Vegetto independently, destroying the whole conceit of Fusion. The funny thing is, this isn't unheard of in the franchise -- in the 4-D Universal Studios ride, Super Tenkaichi Budokai, Goku inexplicably gains the fourth-wall-shattering ability to fuse with an entire human audience through the screen to become 'God Fusion Goku'. I like to imagine how they would incorporate this ability into any other medium -- would Vegeta just see Goku randomly start talking to himself and pointing his fingers at nothing, wondering if he's finally lost the plot?

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What strange, typically Tori-Toyo-esque development would you like to see?

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by JulieYBM » Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:30 am

We learn that Videl's mom was actually a devil queen and she has incredible power hidden away that she learns to control and becomes as strong as Gokuu and Vegeta.
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:01 am

JulieYBM wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:30 am We learn that Videl's mom was actually a devil queen and she has incredible power hidden away that she learns to control and becomes as strong as Gokuu and Vegeta.
Ha, very interesting! I can already see it happening. What was the mother's name, Miguel wasn't it? Perhaps she also put a hex on Mr. Satan, giving him his ridiculously good luck. Whatever the case, Videl definitely needs a bone thrown to her.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:50 am

Monaka is actually stronger than Beerus and Whis combined.
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Jun 04, 2021 12:27 pm

People who think Kid Buu is the strongest Buu, already think Goku retained the power he had when fused and improved on it (otherwise, how could he fight on par with someone stronger than Buuhan).
For Z is really dumb, yes, but I would like that to be the case in the future, Goku and Vegeta "turning" into Vegito/Gogeta on the spot... some youtube channel should try this out.

I would also like humans learning abilities like healing, IT, or stuff that could make them useful in fights without actually going the old, dumb HITTING HARDER THAN BEFORE road.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Peach » Fri Jun 04, 2021 2:33 pm

- Babidi and Moro knew each other. They were part of a wizard organization that had a schism when Bibidi died sealing Majin Buu.

- Pikkon was killed by Beerus. He asked Beerus to destroy him instead of his planet.

- Dr. Gero's son was actually killed by Goku off screen when he tore apart the base. Maybe a deflected bullet?

- Tien could use the fusion dance with his clones to multiple his power significantly for 30 minutes. ....He just needs to learn the fusion dance.

- Yamcha can use a Kaio Ken Wolf Fang Fist and a Spirit Ball/Spirit Bomb combo which explodes like a traditional spirit bomb after he's done smacking people with it.

- Piccolo could use the Kaio Ken at a much higher level than Goku, if he learned it.

- 7-3 was originally built by a machine mutant/tuffle.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Neo-Makaiōshin » Fri Jun 04, 2021 5:33 pm

JulieYBM wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:30 am We learn that Videl's mom was actually a devil queen and she has incredible power hidden away that she learns to control and becomes as strong as Gokuu and Vegeta.
Adding to that, Mr. Satan was actually a former degraded Angel and since then he was wandering the Earth aimlessly until he meet his devilish wife.
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Jack Bz » Fri Jun 04, 2021 5:56 pm

I'd love for a refugee from a previously destroyed universe to make their way into the story. Like an angel/GoD in hiding or something (though Merus has somewhat filled that role in a way).

Also I'd very much like to know what universe Beerus and Champa actually originate from. How on earth did they both become gods? Royal bloodline?? Maybe one of their parents was a GoD in a now destroyed universe and they are carrying on in their parent's footsteps but don't have a universe of their own, so both took over as GoDs for other universes.

Also I liked the idea that Dyspo is a member of Beerus' race that people thought was the case when he was first introduced.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Lionel » Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:22 pm

How about something involving the hysterical strength phenomenon? You could make the argument that it's rooted in reality and that the adrenaline applied during a fight-or-flight situation could be tapped into by characters, more specifically the humans. Imagine them combining such an ability with the Kaioken. It would likely shred their bodies afterwards but I don't see why the brief time where they're harnessing the simultaneous breakthrough in strength couldn't allow them to either match or even overcome the transformations of the Saiyans (barring god forms).

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by theherodjl » Fri Jun 04, 2021 7:26 pm

Goku's Nyoibo is merely a section of wood that was splintered off from Sun Wukong's staff and that the section of wood made it's way to Goku because he most resembled the Monkey King.

Broly's massive power is the result of the evil Saiyans slowly crafting their own answer to SSJG.

The energy absorbing ability that Moro displayed originated on a world that Beerus destroyed, Moro having stolen the knowledge & mastery of it's usage from the survivors.
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Fri Jun 04, 2021 8:47 pm

Tien knows the Kaioken up to x50.

Goten and Trunks actually have SSJ2.

And I kinda wanna see the tidbit about how Tao killed Mr. Satan's first master after an argument, which gave him that fear of martial artists with special abilities.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Xeogran » Sat Jun 05, 2021 2:21 am

All of Toei's properties are actually an extended part of the Dragon Universe.

Though I think they already confirmed it with Dr. Slump, One Piece and Toriko :lol:

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by Cipher » Sat Jun 05, 2021 11:00 am

I think the one commonly tossed-about fan request/bit of speculation I'm really on board with is the idea of the six universes previously destroyed by Zeno, and the notion that they might have been revived along with #17's wish. It's a juicy idea for future storylines that's completely on the table.

I think I really cotton onto that one because the idea that they were taken out due to some former multiversal threat provides an avenue for getting some more interactions and team-ups among the multiversal characters we already met at the ToP in response, and more interactions with newer characters is always good, plus it allows for more exploration/larger scope.

A lot of the other common requests--Sadla, various backstories, etc.--don't wind up doing anything for me because they're just bits of trivia without a real narrative premise attached.

Can't say I care about learning more about the Dragon Balls either, as the goofy backstory Zuno provides is enough on its own. Although were Zalama to show up in a conclusive storyline that centrally featured the Super DBs again, I wouldn't complain.

I guess, as one more I'm on board with, I do think Super should go out on a tease that there are more multiverses beyond the one we know overseen by Zeno.

EDIT -- ! Canonize Neko Majin.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Sat Jun 05, 2021 1:11 pm

Cipher wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 11:00 am I think the one commonly tossed-about fan request/bit of speculation I'm really on board with is the idea of the six universes previously destroyed by Zeno, and the notion that they might have been revived along with #17's wish. It's a juicy idea for future storylines that's completely on the table.

I think I really cotton onto that one because the idea that they were taken out due to some former multiversal threat provides an avenue for getting some more interactions and team-ups among the multiversal characters we already met at the ToP in response, and more interactions with newer characters is always good, plus it allows for more exploration/larger scope.

A lot of the other common requests--Sadla, various backstories, etc.--don't wind up doing anything for me because they're just bits of trivia without a real narrative premise attached.

Can't say I care about learning more about the Dragon Balls either, as the goofy backstory Zuno provides is enough on its own. Although were Zalama to show up in a conclusive storyline that centrally featured the Super DBs again, I wouldn't complain.

I guess, as one more I'm on board with, I do think Super should go out on a tease that there are more multiverses beyond the one we know overseen by Zeno.

EDIT -- ! Canonize Neko Majin.
The six destroyed universes have simply gotta come back. I've welcomed the recent arcs that've focused on Universe 7, but after Granola's finished, I think it's time to go cosmic again. I've speculated that the new Namekian lore is foreshadowing Zalama, or perhaps a new dragon-themed arc (not necessarily Shadow Dragons).

The reveal of the multiverse way back in Battle of Gods still evokes a visceral curiosity and excitement even though we've now had a tournament that showcases the best warriors in eight of them. In some ways, it may have been better to leave them unseen. While it may not recapture that exact magic, some powerful new enemy from outside the known multiverse showing up and leaving Goku with a message that there's even more stuff out there feels like a perfect note to end Super on!

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by BWri » Sat Jun 05, 2021 2:17 pm

You guys have some cool ideas! Loving all the creative stuff you posted regarding the Earthlings.

I'd like them to dive into Tien's alien forefathers. I speculated a few years back that they were another warlike race similar to the Saiyans but more destructive called the War Gods (Hindu inspired). Tien's odd techniques have an air of divinity to them as does his third eye which AT said represents spiritual enlightenment. I'd imagine Tien accesses more of his War God abilities as he delves into further life threatening techniques such as Kikoho, Shin-Kikoho, Mafuba, and Kaioken and pushes his body and spirit to its absolute limit, unlocking his full four-armed, red-skinned War God form.

Other than that, I would love to learn more about the Kami's of Earth. I have the feeling that long ago there were really strong Kami who passed down the spiritual principles we see from the Earthlings and eventually were wiped out in some big fight which left a void for the weaker Kami's to step in. I have a feeling that the universe was once inhabited by many beings with powers rivaling those of at least first form Freeza. I don't think the mega powers we see today came out of a vacuum. I think there were always beings this powerful but they eventually died out due to natural life spans or cataclysms.
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by PurestEvil » Sat Jun 05, 2021 3:08 pm

I would like to meet the father of Beerus and Champa just for shits and giggles.
Lionel wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:22 pm How about something involving the hysterical strength phenomenon? You could make the argument that it's rooted in reality and that the adrenaline applied during a fight-or-flight situation could be tapped into by characters, more specifically the humans. Imagine them combining such an ability with the Kaioken. It would likely shred their bodies afterwards but I don't see why the brief time where they're harnessing the simultaneous breakthrough in strength couldn't allow them to either match or even overcome the transformations of the Saiyans (barring god forms).
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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by UpFromTheSkies » Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:30 pm

There is an entire race of Zeno, each one creates their own multiverse. The highest being in Dragon Ball is actually Tori-bot.

And it's not really a new ability, but it's one that doesn't get used, and that's Buus ability to absorb people and gain their power and abilities. I'd like to see Buu with UI Goku and Hakai Vegeta absorbed, he would be insanely OP.

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by superfan2024 » Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:40 pm

Have it be that everyone who performed within the SSG ritual all have hidden g0d ki. But the catch is that those who weren't in the center of the ritual (those who weren't Goku in BoG), would have to actually train with others who have SSG in order to obtain, get used to, and master SSG for themselves. This would be a fun explanation as to how Vegeta was able to obtain SSG and SSB, with it being because he was training with Goku, with guidance from Whis simultaneously. It could also explain why Gohan was able to reach so close to Goku's level in the ToP, but never actually went SSG/SSB because he didn't train specifically with Goku at that point in time.

Imagine if Pan were to obtain SSG at such a young age, shocking everyone. It would be incredibly ridiculous, but at the same time, this is Dragon Ball, and remember when Goten and Trunks obtained SSJ like it was nothing? I'd feel like at the same time it'd be kinda humorous.

I think it would be cool for Goku to be Oob's mentor, helping him master his power, and then after training Oob, comes back and trains both Oob and Pan under his mantle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Re: What bizarre new ability, retcon or lore expansion would you actually like to see?

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:02 pm

superfan2024 wrote: Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:40 pm Have it be that everyone who performed within the SSG ritual all have hidden g0d ki. But the catch is that those who weren't in the center of the ritual (those who weren't Goku in BoG), would have to actually train with others who have SSG in order to obtain, get used to, and master SSG for themselves. This would be a fun explanation as to how Vegeta was able to obtain SSG and SSB, with it being because he was training with Goku, with guidance from Whis simultaneously. It could also explain why Gohan was able to reach so close to Goku's level in the ToP, but never actually went SSG/SSB because he didn't train specifically with Goku at that point in time.

Imagine if Pan were to obtain SSG at such a young age, shocking everyone. It would be incredibly ridiculous, but at the same time, this is Dragon Ball, and remember when Goten and Trunks obtained SSJ like it was nothing? I'd feel like at the same time it'd be kinda humorous.

I think it would be cool for Goku to be Oob's mentor, helping him master his power, and then after training Oob, comes back and trains both Oob and Pan under his mantle. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I like that idea! Seems kinda obvious now I think about it. I once had a similar theory that there's some kind of "god ki osmosis" which passively makes the friends who are closer to Goku and Vegeta stronger simply by being around them. But your idea makes far more sense, lol.

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