Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by chitarra10 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:56 am

PurestEvil wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:42 am First, a few complaints:
-Why did we not see Bardock fight Gas? Surely it would have been interesting to see how a low class Saiyan beat someone who was stronger than him...
I think that's coming up next. What I think we're gonna see... or at least what I REALLY freaking wanna see... is Goku needing to ask Monaito how his father beat Gas the last time, Monaito finishing the story, and then Goku doing the same thing his father did to beat him this time. That would be freaking awesome!!
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by BWri » Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:57 am

Green Lantern Gas is quite cool! Ever since I saw Piccolo and Dabura conjure weapons, I've been wanting a fighter like this. Gas' shield play and Morningstar wielding was super dope -- love the choreography!

The ending with Vegeta and Granolah is some top notch stuff too. Vegeta continues to be one of the more interesting characters in Super. That's from someone who was never a Vegeta fan.

I'm still not a fan of how OP and spam-heavy these Dragon Balls are. I hope that's addressed meaningfully and not just by killing off Monaito. If Monaito's power's as a namekian are so allegedly weak, then why can he make such OP Dragon Balls? I guess the limits on the DBs are only imposed by their creators as safeguards and are not strictly imposed by their levels of power. That likely means the DBs on Namek and Earth could be remade to be easier to spam. I wonder if Monaito's DBs can also revive people.
PurestEvil wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:42 am First, a few complaints:
-Why did we not see Bardock fight Gas? Surely it would have been interesting to see how a low class Saiyan beat someone who was stronger than him...
I get the feeling that it's being kept a mystery. Monaito was interrupted before he got to say what happened so I believe that to be a tease.
-Isn't this the SECOND time Toyotarou has tried to keep the villain's DB wish secret for narrative effect? Seems a bit dull to have it merely be the same wish Granolah made except applied to Gas, considering the buildup.
It's probably just to conserve page count. Like you say, it's a redundant wish so there's no reason to show it again. On the flipside, if there's more to the wish, it'll probably be shown later.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by PurestEvil » Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:58 am

Also! That moment where Goku called Vegeta's UE "Freaky Face Mode" was probably the best joke in this arc!
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by batistabus » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:09 pm

Koitsukai wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:51 am Granny is mostly raw power and is not getting a zenkai either.
Neither is Vegeta (Chapter 20).

Granolah may be the strongest of the three at this point, but that's not even why Vegeta wants him to fight. As far as Vegeta is concerned, it's Granolah's revenge to take.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:11 pm

batistabus wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:09 pm
Koitsukai wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:51 am Granny is mostly raw power and is not getting a zenkai either.
Neither is Vegeta (Chapter 20).

Granolah may be the strongest of the three at this point, but that's not even why Vegeta wants him to fight. As far as Vegeta is concerned, it's Granolah's revenge to take.
I never implied he was getting a zenkai nor I said it wasn't Granny's revenge.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by TheSaiyanGod » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:13 pm

So Bardock defeated Gas, but Gas and Elec didn't discover that Granolah and Monaito were alive until years later. I think this may already be hinting at how their fight unfolded. It will likely be shown at some point later, but it is possible that Bardock has somehow tricked Gas, despite the fact that he was very strong, as Monaito said.

We still haven't seen Elec after the dragon appears and we don't know the details of the wish, so surely there must be some condition for Gas to obtain this power. I didn't think it was Heeters' style to sacrifice tbeir lives for power considering their reaction to Granolah's wish, but Elec ensure that this wish was essential for their plans to come to fruition, and Gas considers himself the powerhouse of the group, so there will probably also be more to this than we know so far. I also wouldn't doubt that Elec is somehow manipulating Gas, and even willing to sacrifice the life of a member of his family to reach the top.

I also loved Vegeta here again. The parallel between his life and Granolah's was already kind of obvious, but the chapter made that pretty clear by showing Granolah's frustration at working all his life for those responsible for killing his people, not knowing anything. And seeing the way Vegeta acted throughout the fight, it makes sense that he wants Granolah to complete his revenge. Vegeta's character has been really great throughout the arc, and I hope his relationship with Granolah continues to develop

And yeah, Goku and Vegeta's banter and the joke about UE was top notch

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Mr Baggins » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:23 pm

If you asked me what my favorite Vegeta part this month is, I don't think I could pick just one. His reactions to being told there's a second strongest guy in the universe or Goku's description of Ultra Ego are pretty funny. Also liked the mirrored "don't die, Kakarot" dialogue and his moment with Granolah at the end. Good stuff.

But this also continues to show how much bearing Vegeta has on Granolah's story. Gas has none. At best, he's a mouthpiece for Elec, and at worst, he's a disposable goon with no depth of his own. He doesn't inherently matter, not to mention he's the blandest character in the arc. I don't give one iota about his fight against Bardock in the past because I find it more contrived than actually relevant or important, but I'm sure there will be some parallel drawn between Bardock and Goku when they inevitably beat him.

Overall, this chapter feels like a necessary setup for something more interesting later on. I think focusing on Gas too much will ultimately harm the story, though, since he's not a driving force in the same way that Granolah and Elec are. We'll see.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:31 pm

Gas is a Toei movie villain right now. He has nothing to him.

It's clear they're keeping the content of Bardock's fight with him a mystery, which is why Monaito got interrupted, but I think just laying that all out there this chapter could've really given Gas some pathos so that when he shows up to fight there's something for readers to latch on to. As it stands, he's just a strong guy swinging around weapons that mean nothing. It's empty.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by kemuri07 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:36 pm

Yeah...this was a much better chapter. Largely because of simple character moments that stood out. I'm not a fan of "Games as a Service" as a villain, however him being essentially evil Green Lantern is a cool visual gimmick. I am interested in seeing the next chapter, in which Granola is no longer the strongest person, and is forced to rely on his skills rather than on the wish. It's an interesting dynamic. And while it does cheapen the DBs--I think that has pretty much been the point of the last couple of arcs. Skill and technique will always dominate.

I am curious how Bardock defeats Gas, since it outright mentions that he was significantly weaker than Gas.


Good chapter. Still weary about where this all ultimately goes, but def bringing back some of that good faith.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by PurestEvil » Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:37 pm

TKA wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 12:31 pm Gas is a Toei movie villain right now. He has nothing to him.
Ugh, I HATE that this comparison is accurate. Toyotarou better have something in store for Gas, because, despite his fight scenes, I find him less interesting than Hit currently.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by FortuneSSJ » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:04 pm

-Chapter 78-

Props to Toyotaro for giving a cool moveset to Gas. It wasn't shown how Bardock defeated him yet, but I guess it will be shown later when they start wondering how to defeat him. I really want to see that.

I'm algo expecting some twist about Elec's wish since it wasn't shown what exactly he wished for. I would like the Heeters to remain a family until the end, but since it's Dragon Ball Elec may just go the generic route later and find them disposable.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:15 pm

Random and scattered thoughts of Chapter 78:

- The wish the Heeters made was quite anti-climatic. I don't care for Gas as a character as the story has done nothing to make me feel invested in anything to do with him personally. The wish for Gas has also made it more clear than ever just how absurd it would be to have more sets of Dragon Balls because all it does is provide a shortcut for physical growth and could potentially circumvent character development. Granolah dodged this issue because he had established legitimate personal stakes that were tied into his wish to become the strongest in the universe and was a decently well-written character in general. Gas is so underwritten that this wish changes nothing about him. Hopefully, he becomes a more fleshed-out character but I wouldn't put any stock into it

- Gas' Janemba/Green Lantern abilities were a visual treat.

- Goku calling Ultra Ego "Freaky Face Mode" was really funny.

- The character interaction between Vegeta and Granolah was the highlight of the chapter. Really, the dynamic between Vegeta and Granolah has been carrying this whole arc so far, and it wouldn't surprise me if by the end of the arc the two of them develop some form of friendship.

Overall thoughts... the story is picking up, and it's picking up (mostly) good.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Chuquita » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:40 pm

I liked the Goku and Vegeta interactions, and how there was creativity in the attacks Gas used, but that's about it.

I could easily see this arc as another Toei movie from the 90's. It's not that ambitious, but gets the job done.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by pepd » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:50 pm

In a monthly 40 pages manga this unnecessary mystery leaves more disappointment than expectation, particularly the nature of the abilities (if it will even be explained) and the Burdack-Gas encounter, that even if the resolution is key to this encounter, it was given already so much unnecessarily focus that its just kinda tiring. The use of weapons is really cool, but the conjuration, as I read somewhere above, feels empty, it reminds of anime Zamasu's scythe.
The gags were great tho.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by The Monkey King » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:52 pm

Not a fan of the design for "Super Gas" but I do like his weapon conjuring gimmick.

The highlight for me was the final pages with Granolah and Vegeta, the dynamic these two have forged over their fight has grown on me.
chitarra10 wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:56 amI think that's coming up next. What I think we're gonna see... or at least what I REALLY freaking wanna see... is Goku needing to ask Monaito how his father beat Gas the last time, Monaito finishing the story, and then Goku doing the same thing his father did to beat him this time. That would be freaking awesome!!
I think something like this will happen but it will be Granolah who repeats what Bardock did.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by UpFromTheSkies » Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:56 pm

"GaS HaS nO ChArAcTeR DePtH"

It's Dragon Ball, people, none of the villians have depth. Vegeta was just a bad guy who wanted to rule the universe for no reason; his character wasn't given any depth until after his villian arc ended. Freeza was also a bad guy who wanted to rule the universe for no reason. Cell was only interested in defeating Goku because he was programmed to do so by a member of the Red Ribbon Army, who, yeah you guessed it, wanted to rule the world for no particular reason. Babidi was an evil wizard who wanted to rule the universe no reason, and Buu was chaotic evil with no motivation behind him at all; he didn't even want to rule the universe, he was just evil.

As for the chapter, I enjoyed it. I think they've given Gas an interesting technique that should make for some very cool looking fight scenes. I have a feeling the cost Gas will pay for those powers will be greater than Granolahs, though, and that's why they didn't show the wish being made. Elec probably doesn't care what happens to Gas later, all that matters is that he gets the job done.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Nistarkail » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:15 pm

Image

Basically I have the impression that Toyotaro knows Chrino Trigger, because this Granolah VS Gas reminds me a lot Frog (with the Masamune) VS Magus.

However nice chapter, but this left me some doubts because it's not clear if without wish the tally midget was able to be at par with SSJ Blue.

- If yes, I suppose that the Heaters race is really strong beyond imagination;
- If not, Gas was obviously strong but maybe not in the league of main villains of DBS.

We will see what happens next month, but I have the impression that this arc will conclude after 3 chapters with the death of Gas.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:23 pm

Shouldn't this arc last until the movie is released? I think we have around 10 more chapters to go.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by PurestEvil » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:24 pm

UpFromTheSkies wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 1:56 pm "GaS HaS nO ChArAcTeR DePtH"

It's Dragon Ball, people, none of the villians have depth. Vegeta was just a bad guy who wanted to rule the universe for no reason; his character wasn't given any depth until after his villian arc ended. Freeza was also a bad guy who wanted to rule the universe for no reason. Cell was only interested in defeating Goku because he was programmed to do so by a member of the Red Ribbon Army, who, yeah you guessed it, wanted to rule the world for no particular reason. Babidi was an evil wizard who wanted to rule the universe no reason, and Buu was chaotic evil with no motivation behind him at all; he didn't even want to rule the universe, he was just evil.
The issue with Gas isn't character depth, it's that he doesn't have a character trait that makes him interesting. Vegeta was cocky and abrasive, Freeza and Cell had charisma, and Buu was childish (fat), creepy (super), and chaotic (kid). Meanwhile, the only noteworthy thing about Gas is that he was a youngster who grew into an adult within seconds.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 78 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by omaro34 » Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:38 pm

One thing I really dislike is that anyone can wish to be the strongest if they know these Cerealian balls exist, and on top of that the no limitations on these balls is just plot convenience to me. Seems contrived.

Other than that, great chapter. I don't think I've seen a mallet used by a villain in Dragonball before, unless you include Arale (could be even wrong there).
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