Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Jul 11, 2022 11:16 am

Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86

全力戦!
Zenryoku-sen!
Full-Power Battle!


-------------------------------

Release Information:

JAPAN:
Date: July 21, 2022
Publication: V-Jump, September 2022 Issue
Cost: ¥590

(V-Jump is forward-dated two months from its actual release window. Issues are generally released on the 21st of each month, barring a Sunday or a holiday, in which case the issue gets moved up a day appropriately.)

INTERNATIONAL:
Date: July 20, 2021 (timed to the JP midnight-on-July-21st release)
Publication: Digital (Viz/Shonen Jump + Manga Plus)
Cost: Free

STORYBOARDS/DRAFTS:
The first several pages of any given chapter's roughs/storyboards/drafts have been posted on the official Dragon Ball website for quite some time now (in all likelihood done in an attempt to combat piracy and control the narrative by releasing teases of specific information and context at their own discretion). The drafts for Dragon Ball Super manga chapter 86 were posted on July 14 (Japan time). As these specific articles are generally removed from the website upon the chapter's formal release, archived versions of these links (such as this) are generally shared by fandom.

Image

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THREAD/DISCUSSION INFORMATION

This is the "official" discussion thread for Dragon Ball Super manga chapter 86. All content regarding this specific chapter would be great to include here in this thread, rather than the dedicated / larger / all-encompassing ongoing thread. Posts that are specific to the individual chapter in the gigantic thread with no relevance to the larger series will be reported and/or removed.

Q: When will this thread open?

A: This thread will be opened by a Kanzenshuu moderator when the first official promotion of the respective chapter occurs. This may be when its storyboards are shared, or in some kind of formal news article leading up to that point. Please do not create a separate thread of your own to discuss this chapter.

Q: What is the history behind a [blank]-specific discussion thread?

A: We established episode-specific discussion threads beginning with Dragon Ball Kai in 2011, followed by the Dragon Ball Super television series in 2015. These episode-specific threads allowed people to discuss just that: those specific episodes, without being interrupted by other discussions regarding general production, promotion, etc. We didn't create corresponding Dragon Ball Super manga chapter threads at its debut due to the nature of its production: it was initially billed as a "comicalization" of the television series, and the first arc barely stood on its own as a unique production, rather than supplemental/incidental/disposable. We had kept the larger thread out of inertia from those earlier chapters, and have wavered for literal years over whether or not to separate them out.

Q: We've had worthwhile individual chapters since chapter five. This is absurd. Why are you just starting individual discussion threads so many years into the manga, when the TV series had it from the start?

A: All of that is correct. Maybe we will go back and pull out threads for past chapters. Maybe we won't. We should have done this a long time ago. Better late than never. This is the plan for now on and is not currently up for discussion or reconsideration. Thank you.

Q: OK, but... so what's the point?

A: At Kanzenshuu we believe in history and preservation. It is worthwhile to future versions of ourselves and entirely new future fans to be able to dig back and find real-time reactions to specific productions (such as a specific episode or chapter). It's much easier to do this when the discussions are separated into these unique threads.

Q: When will new threads be created?

A: Threads for new/upcoming manga chapters will be created by a Kanzenshuu administrator at an appropriate point in time following the release of a previous chapter, and ahead of that next chapter's release schedule (which itself includes the official drafts/storyboards).

Q: OK, so what do you expect us to actually discuss in a chapter thread, particularly ahead of its release?

A: For some time now, Shueisha (in all likelihood to combat "leaks" and illegal piracy) has released "draft" pages of upcoming chapters in the two weeks leading up to any given chapter's release. These are official pieces of information dissemination and absolutely up for discussion. We welcome questions about where and how to legally and officially consume the manga. We do not condone nor allow the discussion or encouragement of piracy. Following a chapter's release, of course anything relating to that chapter and its contents are up for discussion in a specific thread.

Q: What kinds of "sources" can we discuss?

A: You can discuss whatever you want, so long as it lives up to the community guidelines. It is recommended that you link to / discuss actual sources of information, rather than second-hand accounts. Twitter and its users are not "sources" of information. Shueisha has its own official Dragon Ball website and weekly news broadcast on YouTube, which will in all likelihood be your actual primary sources of information leading up to a chapter's release.

Q: What if I have something to say about another chapter that's not this chapter?

A: Is what you have to say/ask/post even tangentially related to this chapter? That's fine. Does it have absolutely nothing to do with this chapter? Post it elsewhere. These chapter-specific threads do not automatically close after a new chapter comes out; you are free to keep discussing a specific chapter for as long as you all feel like talking about it.

Q: So what do we do with the big/main thread?

A: The dedicated / larger / all-encompassing ongoing thread is still perfect for overall/holistic discussion regarding the manga, its production, its promotion, its content relation to other parts of the franchise, etc.

Q: I want to learn more about what's going on with this manga's production!

A: Check out Episode #0489 of our podcast for an extreme deep-dive (with all the receipts you can eat!) into the production of the manga, including all of the ways that Toyotaro, Akira Toriyama, and Victory Uchida each individually contribute to it.
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Draconic » Thu Jul 14, 2022 2:25 am

Drafts look pretty cool. Gas actually looks like someone who had to pay a price for the power he possess. Hopefully the entire chapter is not just him pummeling on Goku, but we actually get closer to the ending, cause this arc took way too long and this battle took way too much out of this arc. I wish the climax will be good. Nothing is going to salvage this arc, but it should at least keep us entertained while we wait for info on the next story.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Xeogran » Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:03 am

What is Elec so calm about, he should be aware this is Gas' last battle and he has no means to strike on Frieza anymore.
If Toyotaro wanted to present him as smart, he should have tried collecting the Cerelean DBs again for a security wish.

He is my favorite part of the arc, but I'll be disappointed if he only amounts to being a support role for Gas.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by TobyS » Thu Jul 14, 2022 7:16 am

Xeogran wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:03 am What is Elec so calm about, he should be aware this is Gas' last battle and he has no means to strike on Frieza anymore.
If Toyotaro wanted to present him as smart, he should have tried collecting the Cerelean DBs again for a security wish.

He is my favorite part of the arc, but I'll be disappointed if he only amounts to being a support role for Gas.
I suspect his whole thing is maybe that he absorbs Gas power when he dies or something but with no lifespan cost to himself, otherwise your point is an issue.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Thu Jul 14, 2022 8:59 am

Please just let this story go to bed. I can't stand another chapter ending with a hint to yet another battle. Gas stomps Goku and he has to go beyond with his resolution... of course in august.

There's still some things unaddressed:

- Gas' wish (hopefully, the chapter will be about it)
- Elecc's confidence, rooted where? his ace is about to get consumed, is his Freeza plan over?
- The fuck are those broken DBs that shift the balance of the universe?
- Who is the one and how will the balance of the universe be shifted? (probably in september)
- Granola is still part of the story?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Zephyr » Thu Jul 14, 2022 11:14 am

Xeogran wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:03 amWhat is Elec so calm about, he should be aware this is Gas' last battle and he has no means to strike on Frieza anymore.
If Toyotaro wanted to present him as smart, he should have tried collecting the Cerelean DBs again for a security wish.
Koitsukai wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 8:59 amThere's still some things unaddressed:

- Elecc's confidence, rooted where? his ace is about to get consumed, is his Freeza plan over?
My guess would be, either he's going to sic 73 on Freeza, or maybe he has been collecting the DBs again to make himself the strongest. Could he wish to make Gas immortal? How would that interact with the wish to become the strongest at the expense of life-expectancy?

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Nistarkail » Thu Jul 14, 2022 1:57 pm

Koitsukai wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 8:59 am Please just let this story go to bed. I can't stand another chapter ending with a hint to yet another battle. Gas stomps Goku and he has to go beyond with his resolution... of course in august.

There's still some things unaddressed:

- Gas' wish (hopefully, the chapter will be about it)
- Elecc's confidence, rooted where? his ace is about to get consumed, is his Freeza plan over?
- The fuck are those broken DBs that shift the balance of the universe?
- Who is the one and how will the balance of the universe be shifted? (probably in september)
- Granola is still part of the story?
Gas will consume himself during these lasts attacks and then Elec will activate his main plan. Don't you think that each of his moves is a part of a precise scheme?

He sent his brothers to Zuno in order to get some answers from his 10 questions. Most probably some of them are related to Toronbo's power, like:

1) "How does the wish of the strongest work?"
2) "Can Gas lose after the realisation of the wish?"
4) "Limits of the wish?"
4) "How to use OG-73 in the most efficient way?"

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by chitarra10 » Thu Jul 14, 2022 5:28 pm

TobyS wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 7:16 am
Xeogran wrote: Thu Jul 14, 2022 6:03 am What is Elec so calm about, he should be aware this is Gas' last battle and he has no means to strike on Frieza anymore.
If Toyotaro wanted to present him as smart, he should have tried collecting the Cerelean DBs again for a security wish.

He is my favorite part of the arc, but I'll be disappointed if he only amounts to being a support role for Gas.
I suspect his whole thing is maybe that he absorbs Gas power when he dies or something but with no lifespan cost to himself, otherwise your point is an issue.
It's because Elec doesn't value Gas as a brother, or hardly even as a person. He's always seen Gas as an expendable weapon in his arsenal to be used for his benefit, so if Gas dies, he doesn't really have a whole lot of emotional attachment to Gas the way Gas has with him. Elec is using, abusing, manipulating, and brainwashing Gas the same way King Vegeta and Frieza did to Vegeta for the first 28 years of his life, but Gas isn't nearly the confident, prideful, haughty person that Vegeta was, so the brainwashing worked a lot better on him than it did on Vegeta. Gas is actually very insecure and never really thought a whole lot of himself, and all he ever wanted was Elec's approval, and all the while, he was watching Elec give his approval to Granolah, and it made him feel like he had no worth. So for Gas, Elec isn't just his brother, he's his god, and right now, for just that tiny little bit of approval he got when Elec gave him this assignment, he's willing to die for his god. Only a brainwashed person says, "I seek power for Elec's sake alone, I follow his commands in order to make the Heeters the supreme organization in the universe!!" and "I would do anything for him... Elec's will is absolute!!" And then because Elec got up in Gas's face and pushed him to die for the cause, that's exactly what he's gonna try to do. I really hope he doesn't. I really hope this fight ends with Gas realizing what Elec has been doing to him and he doesn't give his life for a brother/god who doesn't even love him. I really wanna see Gas rescued, not dead.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by batistabus » Thu Jul 14, 2022 7:26 pm

I'm really enjoying this side of Gas.

As for Elec, I'm still not sure. Gas has obviously been manipulated this entire time, but being the muscle for Heata is what he cares about most. He's happy Elec pushed him this far.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by redon » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:51 am

Dragon Ball Super chapter 86 summary that I can share with you :D

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Xeogran » Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:43 am

redon wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:51 am Dragon Ball Super chapter 86 summary that I can share with you :D
Woah that was fast, time for READING! Thanks Redon!

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by OLKv3 » Fri Jul 15, 2022 8:45 am

Xeogran wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:43 am
redon wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:51 am Dragon Ball Super chapter 86 summary that I can share with you :D
Woah that was fast, time for READING! Thanks Redon!
The fight sounds nuts

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Alruneia » Fri Jul 15, 2022 9:15 am

That's nice and early, wow. Anyway, I'm very happy to hear that
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by FortuneSSJ » Fri Jul 15, 2022 11:42 am

Seems like it's gonna be a cool chapter.
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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Shorty GZ2 » Fri Jul 15, 2022 1:27 pm

I've read the summary and seen some images of the fight, I'm pretty satisfied with this chapter/the fight/how things turned out. I'm sure some will say it ended anti-climactically or was rushed after being dragged out, and to a degree it is - I think Granolah deciding to give up on his revenge whilst being blinded/KO'd for 5 chapters is in the realm of the latter - and I can understand that feeling (at the very least, more shocked if anything that Toyo finished a fight in 1 chapter rather than 2 for each fight as he's done this whole arc). Though considering unlike some, I was still invested in the arc throughout/keeping things from the very beginning in mind over the months (well, almost 2 years, actually somehow shorter than Moro arc), so that isn't something that bothers me as much & I'm still overall positive about this, while still preferring Moro overall.

At the very least, Gas seems finally down for good after in total 9 months of fighting (1st Gas showing up to squash everyone, Gas vs Granolah for 2 chapters (latter having Gas unlock his new horns form after going berserker form), Gas vs SSB Goku for 2 chapters, Kid Gas vs Bardock for 1 chapter, Gas vs UI/UI Sign Goku + UE Vegeta for 2 chapters, and now this climactic chapter of shriveled up old max-power Gas vs UI Goku, UE Vegeta and Granolah (with latter getting the 'kill' (sorta, since Gas isn't dead & is just KO'd) after Vegeta and Goku help get Gas in position + Oatmeel helps Granolah aim since he's like half-blind now lol)
(and Monaito does help hypnotise Macki and Oil to sleep to prevent them from interfering, though Elec is conspicuously absent...)

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Nistarkail » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:36 pm

Well, something stinky is coming... I don't know why but the absence of Elec and this situation makes suitable for his plan.

And about Elec and Maki, honestly are they really so strong? Because a old buddy with a super low power level cannot hypnotize foes like Oil and Maki. But yes, in the world of DB after Frieza's saga doesn't follow a proper logic.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Xeogran » Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:39 pm

Ok next month should be very good, with Elec finally being on the frontlines :twisted:
I can't wait already.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Shorty GZ2 » Fri Jul 15, 2022 3:31 pm

Nistarkail wrote: Fri Jul 15, 2022 2:36 pm Well, something stinky is coming... I don't know why but the absence of Elec and this situation makes suitable for his plan.

And about Elec and Maki, honestly are they really so strong? Because a old buddy with a super low power level cannot hypnotize foes like Oil and Maki. But yes, in the world of DB after Frieza's saga doesn't follow a proper logic.
Well, (assuming you meant Oil instead of Elec) not strong enough for Elec to think they (with their instincts unleashed) would make a difference against the heroes. Monaito presumably too did level up in the past 45 years as he at least sufficiently healed Granolah enough from near-death for him to regain consciousness when before he too weak to heal Muezli when she was near-death/killed. Also, I guess hypnotism works on anyone at every level (Monaito used it to put young Granolah to sleep in the flashback).

As for Elec, I don't know what his plan is by this point lol. We do know from this chapter & prev chapters that he's capable of jumping high/flying & that he personally trained Gas to be the strongest muscle of the Heeters. We've never seen him fight beyond using his gun to shoot 3 people, but he does have 6-pack abs so presumably he does train lmao

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by nineko » Fri Jul 15, 2022 5:20 pm

Who is this Granolah guy you're all talking about? Have we seen him before? I mean, it's not like he has an arc named after him or something, right?

</sarcasm>

Yeah, as much as I want this boring arc to be over, it's good that we get to see Granolah again, I hope they can find a way to restore his lifespan because he's not actually a bad guy.

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Re: Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 86 - Official Discussion Thread

Post by Geraldo » Fri Jul 15, 2022 7:08 pm

Next chapter will have Elec wishing to merge with 7-3 on a cellular level; he will manage to copy the fainted Gas' power level and will draw out Merus' copied strength - which kept the android alive after moro exploded and died - to add to Gas' power. Thus, forcing Granolah, Goku and Vegeta to fight him till November. To buy time for another saga to begin in the twilight of the next year to come (as was with moro and this arc).

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