Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 87 - Official Discussion Thread

[Xeogran]

Now did they say, the strongest is just being born or was just born? Whis could mean that the strongest is a young. I suspect he is referring to Uub. I think that makes a ton of sense. Uub being the strongest in the universe.

Uub had already been hyped in Moro arc, no point in ending every arc with hyping him up to the audience, if they don't ever bother on going past EoZ. Also I think this fanbase is trying to make some kind of Saitama out of Uub from all these statements. How would you ever write villains around him then?

I mean why would Goku drop everything he does to train him.

He didn't, Goku continued training imself in the process too.

[Grimlock]

It may seem out of proportion, but if we factor in the information that there aren't many planets with life out there, and if we assume at least half of those are peoples who don't fight, being the strongest isn't really that difficult. Out of ten members in Universe 7 team, eight came from Earth.

As for the villains, it's easy to come up with new and stronger ones. Though we'd have to turn to Western comic books for that (which we are going to have to anyway, at some point in the very near future...).

[Berserker1921]

Now did they say, the strongest is just being born or was just born? Whis could mean that the strongest is a young. I suspect he is referring to Uub. I think that makes a ton of sense. Uub being the strongest in the universe.

Uub had already been hyped in Moro arc, no point in ending every arc with hyping him up to the audience, if they don't ever bother on going past EoZ. Also I think this fanbase is trying to make some kind of Saitama out of Uub from all these statements. How would you ever write villains around him then?

I mean why would Goku drop everything he does to train him.

He didn't, Goku continued training imself in the process too.

When Uub came to the scene. He literally left his family and went to train this mysterious kid he had never met before because he saw something in him. And it would refer to the Moro arc sure, but Uub, could be it. Make more sense then some random guy, we will never see again.

[pepd]

I could see this ending working without problem it wasn't because any hint or thematic was lost in the pacing diluted by the fake mystery hype Toyotaro (or the Dragon Room, who knows) seems to have adopted from the anime since it ended, and the fluff like Gas's protagonism and Burdack ('s... well, existence in the arc) stuffed in the middle that dilatates the story until it breaks the cohesive reading of what they were aiming for. That said, besides the execution of the previous chapters (we'll see this chapter's), I can totally see it working and being Dragonball.

Anyway, I'm having practice ignoring what I don't like, so I'm happy it finally unfolded and ended, that is what kept me reading since some chapters ago.

About Black Freeza... well, I'm glad it was another simple color redesign since they decided to give him another transformation, and black sounds fine but dude, slow it down with the new forms. And while I can't know until we see the colors, this doesn't seem yet like the final-final form given the visual complexity of the strong and abundant contrasts in it.

[jjbgood]

just love the fact that this arc ends with Goku and Vegeta not being able to defeat the villain, so another villain joins, kills the first villain and declares he is much stronger than everone else (wich the first villain also was) and then... leaves. I really loved the Moro Arc, but this is a complete shitshow from start to finish. They didnt even finish it, they just ended with an frieza ex machina. This might be the worst Dragon Ball Arc ever. And yes, I'm counting the Red Ribbon Army Arc in.

[Mr Baggins]

The most amusing thing about this is that all this speculation about the Heeters for the past year, particularly their relationship, ended up being worthless in the end. There really was nothing to them.

Arc review to come when the chapter's out.

[jjgp1112]

Jim Crow Frieza's a pretty damn abrupt twist...but this arc was already pretty worthless anyway, might as well end it.

[Xeogran]

The most amusing thing about this is that all this speculation about the Heeters for the past year, particularly their relationship, ended up being worthless in the end. There really was nothing to them.

Arc review to come when the chapter's out.

Elec started betraying everyone left and right (every villain needs to betray their close ones for effect, right ), Gas was loyal to the core despite all that, and Oil&Macki were the straight guys here.

Shame they didn't amount to anything, though Macki still knows all answers to the Zuno questions and she's still alive. Dunno if they'll ever touch on that.

[ssj3kakarot]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

[OLKv3]

It's funny how every time a manga arc ends and it's not how you wanted it, the default reasoning you guys use is always "someone forced Toyotaro to finish this arc quickly, he was rushed"
The entire arc kept building Freeza up as this big threat and nobody believed it, so him actually living up to the hype that Granolah and the Heeters thought he was is funny. The entire arc had Granolah, Gas, and Elec use shortcuts to be the strongest, while the biggest bastard of them all got to it through honest hard work. The irony is great

[Hellspawn28]

I give this saga 5/10. It has its moments, but it goes on for way too long with nothing happening. The Heaters are lame and they left too many plot points open for nothing. Freeza coming out of nowhere felt way too random and forced.

My DBS story rankings:

Future Tunks
Moro
Broly
Tournment of Power
Universe 6 Tournment
BOG
Granolah the Survivor
ROF

I will put Super Hero on the ranking later.

[Extreme_kai]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

I will never get this lame played-out joke. Saiyan's literally turn into giant space monkey's and Goku was known as a little monkey boy who is based on Sun Wukong(the monkey king). I don't get why people make a big issue of it and force real-world scenarios into it despite them not being applicable. I guess it's supposed to be funny? Haha...

Anyway, I feel like this whole black Frieza thing is just to remind the audience that Frieza is still training and keeping pace/exceeding with the protagonist. I see really no point in his cameo besides that and ending this god-forsaken arc, especially since Whis pretty much spoils that he's not in fact the most powerful warrior. Worthless pointless arc, with worthless pointless characters. So much for new "interesting" villains, they pretty much gave the finger to them in favor of an older villain. Toyotaro, how about instead of wasting our time with these one-note tag-along villains, giving us some time to see Frieza's growth? Oh, but would that spoil your lame "twist" that Frieza magically whist himself away and therefore was secretly the most powerful foe...Oh, wait! He isn't...so what's the point of that reveal? Just say you're gonna give us a whole lot of nothing instead of wasting years on it. I know the Granola arch sucked, but I don't know why people are expecting the same writer that gave us Granola to give us anything better at this point.

[Block88]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

I will never get this lame played-out joke. Saiyan's literally turn into giant space monkey's and Goku was known as a little monkey boy who is based on Sun Wukong(the monkey king). I don't get why people make a big issue of it and force real-world scenarios into it despite them not being applicable. I guess it's supposed to be funny? Haha...

Anyway, I feel like this whole black Frieza thing is just to remind the audience that Frieza is still training and keeping pace/exceeding with the protagonist. I see really no point in his cameo besides that and ending this god-forsaken arc, especially since Whis pretty much spoils that he's not in fact the most powerful warrior. Worthless pointless arc, with worthless pointless characters. So much for new "interesting" villains, they pretty much gave the finger to them in favor of an older villain. Toyotaro, how about instead of wasting our time with these one-note tag-along villains, giving us some time to see Frieza's growth? Oh, but would that spoil your lame "twist" that Frieza magically whist himself away and therefore was secretly the most powerful foe...Oh, wait! He isn't...so what's the point of that reveal? Just say you're gonna give us a whole lot of nothing instead of wasting years on it. I know the Granola arch sucked, but I don't know why people are expecting the same writer that gave us Granola to give us anything better at this point.

I highly doubt any fan at this point is expecting quality or even decent writing from this franchise at this point

[Hellspawn28]

Will Funimation dub Freeza's new form as Freeza Black in the new near future? Makes wonder.

[Grimlock]

while the biggest bastard of them all got to it through honest hard work. The irony is great

Yeah but it's the second time in a relative short period of time he gets a major power up and a transformation but we don't get to see it. And I don't know if this is better than the "shortcuts" that were actually seen.

Not knowing what Freeza does, and with whom he was "training" (if there was someone else helping him at all) for the second time is... something to question at least. Can't outright call it "honest hard work" if I don't see it.

[jjgp1112]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

I will never get this lame played-out joke. Saiyan's literally turn into giant space monkey's and Goku was known as a little monkey boy who is based on Sun Wukong(the monkey king). I don't get why people make a big issue of it and force real-world scenarios into it despite them not being applicable. I guess it's supposed to be funny? Haha...

It's just a joke, breh It just so happens to parallel a real-life racial epithet thrown at a different group of people so we find humor in it.

[Hellspawn28]

I doubt Freeza train in the Room of Spirit and Time. He probably found somewhere else to train that was similar to it. Otherwise, I don't know how he would find Kami's look out.

[Hugo Boss]

I doubt Freeza train in the Room of Spirit and Time. He probably found somewhere else to train that was similar to it. Otherwise, I don't know how he would find Kami's look out.

It’s not the same room from Earth. There are at least 3 different dimensions with that time-dilated trait: 1. The one at God’s temple on Earth; 2. The one that Wish used to send Goku and Vegeta to increase their god ki control level; 3. The one which Merus used to train Goku’s ultra instinct. This is presumably the fourth.

[Extreme_kai]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

I will never get this lame played-out joke. Saiyan's literally turn into giant space monkey's and Goku was known as a little monkey boy who is based on Sun Wukong(the monkey king). I don't get why people make a big issue of it and force real-world scenarios into it despite them not being applicable. I guess it's supposed to be funny? Haha...

It's just a joke, breh It just so happens to parallel a real-life racial epithet thrown at a different group of people so we find humor in it.

But it doesn't, as I explained before. Saiyans are literal space monkeys, earth has no parallel and to say as much is just... Well, it's just not good. Also, Saiyans weren't victims they were ruthless monsters, a bigger ruthless monster just stepped in and took over their "enterprise. Just saying if you're going to make a "funny" at least make it make sense.
Anyways, this Chapter was a terrible end to an equally terrible arc.

[Extreme_kai]

At least "Black Frieza" can now call Saiyans "Monkeys" and not get the #CancelCulture treatment.

I will never get this lame played-out joke. Saiyan's literally turn into giant space monkey's and Goku was known as a little monkey boy who is based on Sun Wukong(the monkey king). I don't get why people make a big issue of it and force real-world scenarios into it despite them not being applicable. I guess it's supposed to be funny? Haha...

Anyway, I feel like this whole black Frieza thing is just to remind the audience that Frieza is still training and keeping pace/exceeding with the protagonist. I see really no point in his cameo besides that and ending this god-forsaken arc, especially since Whis pretty much spoils that he's not in fact the most powerful warrior. Worthless pointless arc, with worthless pointless characters. So much for new "interesting" villains, they pretty much gave the finger to them in favor of an older villain. Toyotaro, how about instead of wasting our time with these one-note tag-along villains, giving us some time to see Frieza's growth? Oh, but would that spoil your lame "twist" that Frieza magically whist himself away and therefore was secretly the most powerful foe...Oh, wait! He isn't...so what's the point of that reveal? Just say you're gonna give us a whole lot of nothing instead of wasting years on it. I know the Granola arch sucked, but I don't know why people are expecting the same writer that gave us Granola to give us anything better at this point.

I highly doubt any fan at this point is expecting quality or even decent writing from this franchise at this point

I only say that because I see people around the internet having a collective sigh of relief that the Granolah bar arc is finally over and now DBS can move on to other things as if those "other things" will be any good. Honestly, the only reason I'm keeping up with it is to incorporate updated stuff in my fanworks, other than that It is nostalgia and love of these characters. I will give my time to some of this stuff, but not my money until I see something worthwhile.